Do fans want Ole to go full Mourinho?
Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion
- Thread starter Samid
- Start date
- Status
They'll sacrifice him that's for sure, but not a chance in hell will this just be brushed under the carpet like the others were, the media, fans, ex players, etc, will not let it happen, the heat will be cranked up to white hot for the Glazers and Ed, not that I expect it to ultimately change anything.
Not really a fair comparison is it?
Ole was only in the job a few months and hadn't even started putting his own stamp on the team!
The last line is perfect.
LVG was over bearing and a control freak from all reports. Add to that his ideals were never going to last for the 3 years.
Jose is a drama queen and the minute you dare tell him no out go the toys from the pram.
As supporters we've completely excused our managers from coaching / improving the players at the club.
The last thing we need now is more drama and scandal around the club.
I’d rather have a team that works their socks off, is young, exciting, a side filled with speed and tenacity and finishes 6th vs. a group of malcontents like Pogba, Sanchez and Martial (at times) who dishonor the badge finish 4th.
Ole will have my support, at least through this first full season, assuming he stays in the top 6 and makes a decent run in Europa and the domestic cups. Keeping fingers crossed that he can pip 4th and get us back in the CL.
Ole will have my support, at least through this first full season, assuming he stays in the top 6 and makes a decent run in Europa and the domestic cups. Keeping fingers crossed that he can pip 4th and get us back in the CL.
Just look at Molde analysis under him. It's pretty clear, and it's a great way of playing, a lot of will to score goals, sacrifices a bit the defense so he needs better defenders, but even the 6 is allowed to score. His fundamental ides about high press and ball control are close to Pep but he does use some of the counter attacking work Klopp also uses, but I think that's more his United experience talking. Anyway, it's been said he has a record of taking youth players and improving their scoring and playing abilities, especially strikers. So this should be valued as that's an area where we lack quality right now, not in potential, but in term if finishing.
That's just your opinion, and you have no idea how people who favor Brexit think. They won't care, and will think it's a side effect of Europe again. So no exception for EPL. I don't hope it, but you have no way to guess, and the worst case scenario is that English players become even more rare and valuable.
Moyes and Ole don't even play in the same tactical shape, so how is that even comparable?
To compare Ole and Moyes is as dumb as saying since Mourinho didn’t work out we should never get Pep.
Neither do you or anyone in fact. There might be a flood of epic proportions next year, yet you don’t see arc being build do you ?
we’re talking about credentials here. Tactics and shapes don’t really matter.
Excellent post.
To add to this, except anyone believes in a conspiracy or that Woodward is a total idiot will this current situation not affect the owners.
Hence, the question that needs to be answered is "Can Ed not see the link between a successful United Club on the pitch and a successful United at the Board Room level?" Reading through the Ed Woodward thread and the answers provided by posters such as @Keefy18 and the likes, the question is "If truly Ed has a master-plan in place prior to the sacking of Mourinho (there are some people who believes he was undeservedly sacked), then Ed should have implemented those/that (pick any one appropriate) plan.
The lack of/slow implementation of that plan and apathy towards providing a united playing squad does not point to a coherent strategy in place.
Thus, synthesizing the whole points the question is "What should the fans expect in the new season considering all things?"
Good points but on the 'speaking out', maybe he just isn't 'concerned' in the way as many fans are getting hysterical about transfers. He can't force Madrid or Inter to pay the the money we want to get things moving with Pogba and Lukaku or any other players not in his plans. If he is being informed of what is happening with transfers and what the options will be depending on who leaves there is nothing to complain about publicly.
By most accounts we have made a bid for Maguire that was rejected, this is at least progress from Ed turning down Mourinho's suggestions last summer.
It is very similar, which is why I don't put any stock in our progression against PSG.
Yes we showed great mental fight and all, but the performance wasn't good. It was fluke-like similar to Chelsea's progression against Barcelona and then subsequent win vs Bayern in the final.
You can not say that we have already tried a manager the same as Ole in Moyes.
Ole is NOT a clone of Moyes for the following reasons:
1. Ole spent about ten years of his playing career at united often on the bench analysing games with SAF
2. Ole worked for Ferguson at Old Trafford, coaching the first team strikers 2007-08 season
3. Ole managed the united reserve team on a full time basis during 2007-08 (end part of season), 2008-09, 2009-10 and won the following
- Premier Reserve League North 2009-10
- Premier Reserve league 2009-10 (after play off against South winners Aston Villa)
- Lancashire Senior Cup 2008-09
- Manchester Senior Cup 2009
- Norway top league 2011 - won in Ole's first season in charge
- Norway top league 2012
- Norway Football Cup 2013
You missed the point.
We were discussing appointing managers with and without credentials. LvG and Jose had the resume and have managed top clubs before - Moyes and Ole didn't.
Some said in this thread that Ole was a new approach - appointing someone without credentials, which actually isn't. We appointed someone who managed lesser club - Moyes and who was in management for 10+ years.
Of course their approach, tactics and personality would be different, but here we're discussing credentials and no - neither Moyes or Ole had those to manage a top club prior being appointed.
Depends how you define new approach and what attributes qualify as new?
If you define new approach as appointing someone who has been at the club for over a decade as a player, coach and reserve tem manager then by that definition it is a new approach.
If you say it is not a new approach then by my definition you miss the point sir.
I so much hope Ole blows the water in the first 20 games of the season and we are leading the league. At this point, it drives me crazy to see him being disrespected like that. Maybe he's not a tactical genius, although a lot of the analysis done by many show that his sides have a very pragmatic approach of the game, but he does have an ideal and when players can deliver it, it is very attacking minded and effective at scoring. There are stories of Ole having improved a young lad striker at Molde who was having finishing issues. You don't think this kind of stuff is going to help some of our players, namely Martial, Rashford, Lingard (yes, Lingard with his movement but improved finishing could be something!), even Lukaku, who is a more natural finisher and his "problems" seem to be a bit different?
I think Ole's slump is comparable to the slump Klopp routinely endures every winter period.
I browse Liverpool forums at times and I've seen similar moods there every season where they're getting draws and losses against weaker sides in January-March, the players look knackered, and quite a few fans are vehemently questioning Klopp's management. The only time it was (slightly) different was this past season due to Klopp being more conservative, as well as them being in a title race.
If the slump was mostly down to fitness, which the coaching staff might suspect, it may explain why we're renewing contracts. As much as everyone would love a clearout, it would make sense to prepare for the effects of a long season of high-intensity football by securing backups who will play in case of injuries and not complain about being on the bench.
I browse Liverpool forums at times and I've seen similar moods there every season where they're getting draws and losses against weaker sides in January-March, the players look knackered, and quite a few fans are vehemently questioning Klopp's management. The only time it was (slightly) different was this past season due to Klopp being more conservative, as well as them being in a title race.
If the slump was mostly down to fitness, which the coaching staff might suspect, it may explain why we're renewing contracts. As much as everyone would love a clearout, it would make sense to prepare for the effects of a long season of high-intensity football by securing backups who will play in case of injuries and not complain about being on the bench.
That slump has been a big issue at Dortmund too, but how do we counter it? Ole needs to counter it by being a little smarter on the physical intensity then.
I believe Ole knows what he is doing, seriously. We may not be perfect at first, but creating a proper modern style of football takes time.
I'd be worried only if we don't have a recognisable system of playing football by the 3rd quarter of next season at the latest, but if things go well, it might be a lot earlier.
Last edited:
Klopp's strategy at Liverpool was to endure it for the first two seasons, so that his squad could learn the press and counter-press by heart. Then, this past season he reduced his manic high pressing to a more pragmatic mid-block, but with his players having ingrained the knowledge of how to press so they could use it when needed. It was a smart move which, combined with their improved possession play, allowed them to have control of games through various means, as well as a rock solid defence.
In our case, I reckon we'll have to bite the bullet and expect the injuries to come; that's how it works. It might take a season or two but slowly, as we get used to the intensity and patterns of the high press, we'll be able to vary it so that we're not going all out 100% of the time. From there we can transition to improving our possession play and aiming for the lion's share of possession in every game like most big clubs do, so when we do press we're doing it in our half, and we're doing it sparingly. That sounds like a good strategy to me.
The issue is, these things obviously take time and judging by the mood of the fanbase currently, I'm not sure if they're willing to afford Ole very much of that. He'll be expected to produce miracles sharpish and if he takes too long, the pressure will pile on. Not an enviable position but I really hope he can pull through, or at least show good things early on to buy him more and more time and patience.
Last edited:
Why the third quarter though? Shouldn't there be a discernable pattern evolving in our play within the 1st and 2nd quarter. Even if crude the framework would start developing at some point before
I should have added the word "consistently", which is what my point actually revolved around.
Of course you are correct, we should be able to identify early on what the idea for our style is but I don't think it's reasonable to expect everything to click right away from the start. Hope my point is clearer now, sorry for the earlier confusion.
Other teams don't always allow you to play the way you want to play. You have to be confident and well drilled so that it becomes second nature to play that way, until then players under pressure, when no time to think, play by instinct which is the way they know best. Just depends how quickly, different players can make the style their first natural reaction - if that makes sense?
Brilliant post and I completely agree.
If you look at that instant improvement when he arrived and even in some of the latter games there was still signs of a pattern emerging, sadly in the latter games with zero intensity due to fitness levels being woeful. We struggled at that point and couldn't keep the pace of his demands.
Solid pre season should see an improvement but I'm calling it now I can see a slump in winter / new year like Klopp does as well and fans having a meltdown.
I think we'll start quite well and be in top 4 going into Nov but drop off a bit but to have enough in us to nab 3rd or 4th.
This is like Louis Van Gaal's first season again. I'd take that, though. Beggars can't be choosers...
There is one thing I'm worried about Solskjaer. I think he's solid tactically and his man management seems good as well. But how well can he handle drops in form? Last season... well it speaks for itself doesn't it. A top manager is always able to handle drops in form in some way. I wonder if this is something Ole has yet to have learned.
True. That is main thing that separates okay managers from good managers.I hope for Ole to have a good start . If they continue with the form they finished last season, It will be a very tough season.
I think whoever is in charge of United in 24 months time will be in charge of a VERY exciting team. As I have said Before, the key for Solskjaer is surviving this season because I am convinced we will get better next season. There are so many talents at this club that will develop - but this season might be 12 months too early.
And with our fans ? There are lots of people here who want him gone before the season has started.
And with our fans ? There are lots of people here who want him gone before the season has started.
We will only be further into the wilderness in 24 months time.
There is no coherent plan to build the team and the "exciting" players we have, in truth, always flatter to deceive.
We have been an absolute fecking disaster post-Ferguson.
We will finish 6th to 10th this coming season.
Fair comparison alright.
It's absolutely vital though that both Rashford and Martial deliver this year to achieve that.
Exactly. I personally expect to see a distinct style of play from the beginning of the season. Not a perfect version of it, but a version of it non the less.
Brendan fecking Rodgers had Leicester playing the way he wanted after about two weeks.
I'm still waiting for this supposed "cull" that's he said is coming.
When did he say there would be a 'cull'? Can he force other teams to buy the dross we don't want?
Ofcc not when they getting new contracts under him.
Pretty sure Young, Jones, and Smalling would get offers from clubs if they weren’t on long term £120k plus contracts.
It's pretty obvious those players wouldn't be part of any so called cull (which Solskjaer hasn't said would happen). Rojo, Bailly, Darmian on the other hand, why would anyone buy them, and probably have to make them one of their highest paid players?
Pretty sure after an embarrassing defeat (can’t remember against who) he said there was some of these players that were finished at united.
Meanwhile young, Matic, lingard, Jones, smalling, Rojo are all on tour and still playing.
Everyone keeps holding him to do that but I think he said it in a moment of self-preservation when the interviewer pushed for it. He seemed to catch himself in subsequent interviews and returned to championing the squad as being good enough
After Everton (4-0) he said "We have to stick together as a team. We can't change the whole squad but it's one step at a time. I'm going to be successful here and there are players there that won't be part of that successful team, but there are many of them that do have it.
After Huddersfield (1-1) he said “I can’t talk about individuals now, but there is the chance you have seen the last of players".
These quotes have become 'Solskjaer promised us a clear out'.
Herrera has already gone. I expect he'd gladly see the back of Darmian, Rojo, Bailly and Sanchez, unfortunately nobody wants to buy them and who could blame them. Pogba and Lukaku will go if someone pays up.
The other one you see on here is that Solskjaer said that all our signings would be in for pre season. His words were (first press conference after becoming permanent): "There are so many players that have been written about that we're interested in and I'm sure when we decide what we have to do, hopefully we'll get them by pre-season."
- Status