Nicolas Otamendi | City Player

Status
Not open for further replies.
I was a firm believer that we need an experienced head at the back, someone who can lead the defense. However I am starting to change my mind a little. In the past we used to have two attacking minded fullbacks (Valencia/Rafael and Evra) who left the defense pretty exposed. Such defense required two exceptional CBs with virtually no weaknesses. LVG sorted that by adding Shaw and Darmian to the mix who may not be as attacking minded as Rafael and Evra were but provide better cover). We're now defending as an entire defense now, similar to when we had Gaz and Irwin at the back + the midfield is now shielded with guys like Carrick, Bastian and Schneiderlin.

Under such circumstances I wonder if we can get away with someone younger who will, in time, develop a long term partnership with Smalling or Jones. I was thinking of Stones however a CB like Laporte would do well
 
NoLogo said:
I'm not quite sure they are selling him at all and if they do only at a very high price. Remember Valencia is one of the newly rich clubs now as well after Peter Lim became their new owner.
Click to expand...

It's about him having a release clause, Valencia don't have much choice if it's activated as the player wants out.
 
Varun said:
It's about him having a release clause, Valencia don't have much choice if it's activated as the player wants out.
Click to expand...

Every player in Spain has a release clause there is just the little problem that as a foreign club you don't only have to meet the release clause but pay the taxes on top of it which would make him a very expensive signing.
 
devilish said:
I was a firm believer that we need an experienced head at the back, someone who can lead the defense. However I am starting to change my mind a little. In the past we used to have two attacking minded fullbacks (Valencia/Rafael and Evra) who left the defense pretty exposed. Such defense required two exceptional CBs with virtually no weaknesses. LVG sorted that by adding Shaw and Darmian to the mix who may not be as attacking minded as Rafael and Evra were but provide better cover). We're now defending as an entire defense now, similar to when we had Gaz and Irwin at the back + the midfield is now shielded with guys like Carrick, Bastian and Schneiderlin.

Under such circumstances I wonder if we can get away with someone younger who will, in time, develop a long term partnership with Smalling or Jones. I was thinking of Stones however a CB like Laporte would do well
Click to expand...
Laporte would be excellent, and he is left footed as well. The only problem would be dealing with Bilbao again, which is known to be a nightmare. Personally I feel that he is the perfect option for us.
 
devilish said:
I was a firm believer that we need an experienced head at the back, someone who can lead the defense. However I am starting to change my mind a little. In the past we used to have two attacking minded fullbacks (Valencia/Rafael and Evra) who left the defense pretty exposed. Such defense required two exceptional CBs with virtually no weaknesses. LVG sorted that by adding Shaw and Darmian to the mix who may not be as attacking minded as Rafael and Evra were but provide better cover). We're now defending as an entire defense now, similar to when we had Gaz and Irwin at the back + the midfield is now shielded with guys like Carrick, Bastian and Schneiderlin.

Under such circumstances I wonder if we can get away with someone younger who will, in time, develop a long term partnership with Smalling or Jones. I was thinking of Stones however a CB like Laporte would do well
Click to expand...
I was thinking the same. We have a lot tougher mid through which teams wont go with ease, the whole team will defend not just the defense and we wont or should not panic every time opposing forwards come close to our defense like it was happening last year. Our midfield will deal with that a lot firmer giving a defense a chance to settle itself and wait for the attack.
 
NoLogo said:
Every player in Spain has a release clause there is just the little problem that as a foreign club you don't only have to meet the release clause but pay the taxes on top of it which would make him a very expensive signing.
Click to expand...

Ofcourse. Any buying club has to pay up though because they have been firm about being open to selling him but only if the clause is met.
 
devilish said:
I was a firm believer that we need an experienced head at the back, someone who can lead the defense. However I am starting to change my mind a little. In the past we used to have two attacking minded fullbacks (Valencia/Rafael and Evra) who left the defense pretty exposed. Such defense required two exceptional CBs with virtually no weaknesses. LVG sorted that by adding Shaw and Darmian to the mix who may not be as attacking minded as Rafael and Evra were but provide better cover). We're now defending as an entire defense now, similar to when we had Gaz and Irwin at the back + the midfield is now shielded with guys like Carrick, Bastian and Schneiderlin.

Under such circumstances I wonder if we can get away with someone younger who will, in time, develop a long term partnership with Smalling or Jones. I was thinking of Stones however a CB like Laporte would do well
Click to expand...

Agree with all of this. Especially the Laporte bit. But he would probably cost every bit as much as Otamendi, and the media is already using our spending as a stick to beat the club and every player we bring in
 
NoLogo said:
Every player in Spain has a release clause there is just the little problem that as a foreign club you don't only have to meet the release clause but pay the taxes on top of it which would make him a very expensive signing.
Click to expand...
This legend needs to die after it was proven that this isn't the case with the Herrera's signing.
 
devilish said:
I was a firm believer that we need an experienced head at the back, someone who can lead the defense. However I am starting to change my mind a little. In the past we used to have two attacking minded fullbacks (Valencia/Rafael and Evra) who left the defense pretty exposed. Such defense required two exceptional CBs with virtually no weaknesses. LVG sorted that by adding Shaw and Darmian to the mix who may not be as attacking minded as Rafael and Evra were but provide better cover). We're now defending as an entire defense now, similar to when we had Gaz and Irwin at the back + the midfield is now shielded with guys like Carrick, Bastian and Schneiderlin.

Under such circumstances I wonder if we can get away with someone younger who will, in time, develop a long term partnership with Smalling or Jones. I was thinking of Stones however a CB like Laporte would do well
Click to expand...

I can confirm that he forms an amazing partnership with Jones in FM.
 
This is a strange one, apparently we're not interested in him according to the British media yet we're still linked with him. Is this just a case of Valencia trying to stir up interest or is there actually something in it.
 
British Media insistent we're not interested, is he City bound?

I'd be pissed if he ended up there tbh.
 
My only hope is that he is now available, and that Valencia want to negotiate with us because of Garay. I know there is this tax issue? where they can put us a few milions more if they want to or something like that. So if they agree, it will only be his release clause or something like that.

He is available now and hope we want him. I would be pretty pissed if he goes to City and we go for no one. Lets be honest Stones isnt what we need and who knows how much he will cost anyway.
 
'only his release clause'

Which is €50m. Nobody's paying that.
 
Lewis.no.9 said:
what £35 million? Why not?. La ligas best CB last season
Click to expand...
I guess the reasons would be that he's 27/28 and that he's only had one year unlike Godin who has proven himself for many years now. I'm sure Otamendi was good before too but it wasn't in a top 3 league. So understandably a few doubts as to whether he really is that good or if it was a one off season.
 
prarek said:
I guess the reasons would be that he's 27/28 and that he's only had one year unlike Godin who has proven himself for many years now. I'm sure Otamendi was good before too but it wasn't in a top 3 league. So understandably a few doubts as to whether he really is that good or if it was a one off season.
Click to expand...
Wasn't Mangala better than him for Porto? Not sure, someone like @Arruda or @Sly can tell us. Anyway, Mangala is shit, so just wanted to point that out.

Otamendi was one of the best CB in the world last season, but considering that he wasn't that good before, is a bit worrying to spend that much on him. He is likely a very late bloomer though.
 
Revan said:
Wasn't Mangala better than him for Porto? Not sure, someone like @Arruda or @Sly can tell us. Anyway, Mangala is shit, so just wanted to point that out.

Otamendi was one of the best CB in the world last season, but considering that he wasn't that good before, is a bit worrying to spend that much on him. He is likely a very late bloomer though.
Click to expand...
I don't know. I think a Porto fan probably Arruda posted in here that he was good apart from the last season.
 
Revan said:
This legend needs to die after it was proven that this isn't the case with the Herrera's signing.
Click to expand...

Don't think it's a legend, got any source on that. Everything I can find on the topic essentially says the following.

The tax issues arise as the money technically must come from the player, resulting in the "buying club" having to transfer money to the player, who then has to pass it on to the "selling club".
Click to expand...

So I'm not quite sure why you think the Herrera deal proved otherwise. If anything the first attempt to buy him proved that it's not a straight forward thing with these buy-out clauses in Spain.
 
NoLogo said:
Don't think it's a legend, got any source on that. Everything I can find on the topic essentially says the following.

So I'm not quite sure why you think the Herrera deal proved otherwise. If anything the first attempt to buy him proved that it's not a straight forward thing with these buy-out clauses in Spain.
Click to expand...
Because we didn't pay 60m for Herrera, but 30 or so. The only extra thing to pay is that 5% of the transfer which goes to the club who has trained the player.
 
Lewis.no.9 said:
what £35 million? Why not?. La ligas best CB last season
Click to expand...

A very high fee for a player his age. I am not sure you will find such universal agreement that he is top class either. Was not so long ago he could not displace Fernandez in the Argentina team.

Does not even vaguely stack up against other fees paid this window either.
 
Valencia look to me like they're itching to move him on for a big fee. I agree with @sincher, both in terms of value and ability, there are question marks there.
 
Revan said:
Because we didn't pay 60m for Herrera, but 30 or so. The only extra thing to pay is that 5% of the transfer which goes to the club who has trained the player.
Click to expand...

How do you come up with 60m? Spanish income taxes range between 20-47% according to another article. That's a max of €14M on top and of course they aren't mentioned as part of the transfer sum, wasn't mentioned in the Martinez deal as well despite Bayern paying it, his official transfer sum is €40M. The problem is that technically the club doesn't pay anything for the player. The player buys himself out of the contract, naturally this money is provided by the interested club. The Herrera deal didn't prove anything to the contrary as far as I can tell.
 
I think Valencia are bluffing massively and they would be very happy with 40m euro for a player who clearly wants out.
 
NoLogo said:
How do you come up with 60m? Spanish income taxes range between 20-47% according to another article. That's a max of €14M on top and of course they aren't mentioned as part of the transfer sum, wasn't mentioned in the Martinez deal as well despite Bayern paying it, his official transfer sum is €40M. The problem is that technically the club doesn't pay anything for the player. The player buys himself out of the contract, naturally this money is provided by the interested club. The Herrera deal didn't prove anything to the contrary as far as I can tell.
Click to expand...
Even 20% (the minimum mentioned) would have raised the Herrera transfer for 6m pounds (8-10m euros). That didn't happen, right?
 
Revan said:
Even 20% (the minimum mentioned) would have raised the Herrera transfer for 6m pounds (8-10m euros). That didn't happen, right?
Click to expand...

I explained already that there was no transfer money involved in this deal. We gave the player money to buy himself out of the contract and I'm pretty sure apart from the player, the club and the Spanish tax office no one really knows how much money changed sides. The papers in the end report a transfer fee that is the same as his buyout clause. So unless you have a source that is showing that there is a loophole through which the player can avoid paying income taxes for the money he got from us, to buy himself out of the contract, we have to assume that the tax had to be payed, if we did it or the player did it himself in the end we don't know. In the case of Martinez we at least know he was willing to take a wage cut to make up for the additional money Bayern had to spent.
 
NoLogo said:
I explained already that there was no transfer money involved in this deal. We gave the player money to buy himself out of the contract and I'm pretty sure apart from the player, the club and the Spanish tax office no one really knows how much money changed sides. The papers in the end report a transfer fee that is the same as his buyout clause. So unless you have a source that is showing that there is a loophole through which the player can avoid paying income taxes for the money he got from us, to buy himself out of the contract, we have to assume that the tax had to be payed, if we did it or the player did it himself in the end we don't know. In the case of Martinez we at least know he was willing to take a wage cut to make up for the additional money Bayern had to spent.
Click to expand...
No, we don't. There would have been multiple reports that we payed an extra 10m for Herrera.

In fact, we didn't give money to Herrera, at all. It was more complicated than it. I think Herrera authorized some of our lawyers to do so.

@jojojo explained it well multiple times, but definitely we didn't pay extra taxes (bar the 5% tax) although the transfer isn't exactly closed (I think that tax officers can review it in the next 4 years).
 
Revan said:
No, we don't. There would have been multiple reports that we payed an extra 10m for Herrera.

In fact, we didn't give money to Herrera, at all. It was more complicated than it. I think Herrera authorized some of our lawyers to do so.

@jojojo explained it well multiple times, but definitely we didn't pay extra taxes (bar the 5% tax) although the transfer isn't exactly closed (I think that tax officers can review it in the next 4 years).
Click to expand...

See that would have been a helpful thing to mention from the start, that there is a way to avoid the money having to go through the player.

It sounded like you head read in a news paper that we payed 30M for him and concluded that there were no taxes to be payed. That's why I asked you for a source on why we didn't have to account for the income tax that Herrera would have had to pay. Referring to jojojo from the start would have been a good idea.
 
I much prefer Smalling to him. He wouldn't compliment Smalling as he isn't the passed LVG l craves, he'd be bought to replace our Mike.
 


Otamendi: Valencia considering offers from City and United. None reaches €50m of buy out clause. Spanish club resigned he will go to the PL
 
Looks like we're battling with City for Pedro and Otamendi. Interesting days ahead.
 
Honest answers here, how would people feel if in this head to head with City, we lose and they land Pedro, Otamendi and finish their De Bruyne transfer?
 
Lewis.no.9 said:
Honest answers here, how would people feel if in this head to head with City, we lose and they land Pedro, Otamendi and finish their De Bruyne transfer?
Click to expand...
I think that's a pretty obvious question mate. They won't get both Pedro and KDB, though I think they'll get Otamendi.
 
I remember the tension when we were battling City for Berbatov. We havent seen nailbiting with City over a target since that I can remember. I really hope they dont land their targets but..... why havent we got things closed up yet?.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.