Someone else nailed it earlier in the thread. Could be a sensational talent but there's a question mark about how useful he'll be in tight spaces
Mykhailo Mudryk / signs 8.5yr deal at Chelsea
- Thread starter cesc's_mullet
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They are entitled to ask whatever they want. I just don't think both clubs can do the deal in the end. The difference is just too big at the moment. Arsenal won't pay anywhere close to 100m, not even 80m.
I'm pretty sure you'll end up paying 80m euros, large chunk in bonuses. You've supposedly bid 60m - not exactly far away is it.
We are really experiencing a strange time in history aren't we.
Sad reality, can only hope it is extremely short lived.
He probably doesn't watch the Ukranian league every week. From the eye test he looks a good player.
Looks like he's made a goodbye post. I still won't believe it until he's in our shirt.
He looked very good in few games I watched in CL, looked very direct. Should be very good addition for them.
Before Jesus got injured, I'd have said a CM as cover for Partey was our top priority. Now, however, I think another forward player is just as important as Jesus is expected to be out for 2-3 months.
Martinelli and Saka often switch places on the wings and I expect Arteta would want to employ Mudryk with the same sort of versatility. The CF market is too hard esp in Jan. Mudryk will give us some much-needed depth in our front 3. At the moment, we don't have any cover for Martinelli, Nketiah or Saka except for Vieira, who hasn't quite set the place alight and also covers for Odegaard. Smith-Rowe is due to return soon but who knows how he'll be after a long time out. Nelson is currently injured and Marquinhos has only made 1 appearance in the league. I don't think he'll be redundant at all.
Yeah it seems like he does all his (best) work running at opponents out in the open, or running in behind them. Players are already on the back foot at that point.
Has to be a depth issue - of course the worst case scenario is that either Saka and/or Martinelli are unlikely to sign extensions. But I don't think that's the case.
We have Saka, Martinelli and ESR as proven wide options, and the latter has been injured all season.
After those three - Nelson will likely be moved on, and is depth currently. Marquinhos and Vieira will both need more time to adapt (on and off the pitch), maybe less so the latter, though he's much less physically developed compared to the former.
I expect Vieira and ESR will play other more central roles too. Martinelli could play up top as well.
Seems Arteta has bought fully into the City "multiple guns" in all positions.
Seems like Arsenal are going to spend big on him. Surely he would not be content with a place on the bench, given the price tag? Reckon we try and pry martinelli away before they offer him a new contract. The pull of playing under a world class elite coach such as Ten Hag should be enough rather than sticking with that fraud Arteta.
He's already playing for a better team under a better manager, why would he want to make such a move and regress?
This season sure - United will be the better option in the future. Let’s not kid ourselves.
Arsenal are currently a better side than us at the present moment, but he's certainly not playing under the better manager.
Yeah you're just guessing. We've all been hearing about how United will be heading back to the top for years now, ever since SAF left. Let's not kid ourselves, it hasn't happened yet.
No one saw Liverpool's resurgence coming. As it stands both teams are seemingly on the right path, under managers that want to rebuild. But that's risky too, so who knows where these sides will be in a year's time, never mind beyond that?
And how do you support that claim?
Surely you can't deny that ten Hag has achieved more as a manager than Arteta?
Ten Hag has achieved more in his career from winning a number of trophies in the Netherlands to an astonishing UCL Semi-final run. Arteta has won one FA cup and has not yet finished inside the top 4 after 3 years (that streak will be broken this season).
For me there's reason to think Arteta is the better coach at this present moment unless the only thing you look at is the league table for this season.
Yep. Plus, Shakhtar are just one of those clubs -- tend to get big fees for their players. Fred, Fernandinho, Teixeira, Willian, Costa, Mkhitaryan... all in that £50-30m price bracket. And most of those were in the mid/late 2010's - price of the brick only gone up since then.
Nah, I wasn't arguing that. ETH has shown in Holland that he was a winning manager.
Though winning the league in what is generally a two-horse race also shouldn't be overstated. Since 1999/2000 only three teams not named Ajax or PSV have won the title.
All that goes out the window once he's come to the EPL. Those achievements helped him get this United job, but now he (they, including Arteta) need to prove it in England before anyone can make such adamant claims like Nick. did.
Were any of those Brazillian players part of the dodgy Kia Group?
Exactly, mentioned those in my post above. I don't even think that's a bad price when you think of the going rate of attackers. A 16 year old from Brazil just went for 60m euros - we spent a fortune on Anthony, Sancho, list goes on. If Arsenal don't need him that much, that's their problem, not Shaktar's.
By that logic everyone should just go to Spurs and play for Conte (except Klopp/Pep)
I'm not understanding what point you're making. I'm not talking about players I'm talking about managers.
He has proven and won more than ETH has, and he's done it in the EPL too. That's the point, and that was your point to begin with - as apparently past achievements simply mean they're a better manager.
Overrated. Incredible speed and a good shot. But technique, first touch and pass are average (not bad, but neither very good). Also his dribbling is thanks his speed and not his tecnichal skills. Good player, but not word class and for me not better than Martinelli.
Arsenal need a cover for Partey and possibly an upgrate for Xhaka. Not spend crazy money for Mudryk.
Arsenal need a cover for Partey and possibly an upgrate for Xhaka. Not spend crazy money for Mudryk.
The point is players dont just choose which manager they are signing for by looking at their past achievements, they choose a project. While manager is a good part of it, he is not the only part. There is the club structure and their future plans to consider (Tuchel got sacked as soon as the new owners arrived and got Potter, who is to say that wont happen to ETH).
Now when it come to manager aswell there are many things to consider
How much sway the manager has in the club also matters. I am pretty sure if ETH had it his way Gapko would have been in ManUtd today.
Also the style in which the manager wants to play. The brand of Football.
And how does the manager sees the player in his plans.
Although I agree that ETH has proved himself in Netherlands but in THIS job he has everything to prove. Managing team in England is tricky and many great managers have failed.
So CURRENTLY it would not be obvious to choose ETH at ManUtd vs Arteta at Arsenal. Not as one sided a contest as you portray.
This seems to be a common misconception born from watching a selective sample mainly consisting of his CL matches, when Shskhtar plays largely on the break.
Mudryk actually has a great skill set for playing against low blocks. He is really impressive with his weak foot, including the ability to play accurate cutbacks and a variety of chipped or curled crosses. He plays with his head up, sees the field well, and is a clever passer that has often played as a 10 for Shakhtar. He can dribble effectively, with elite acceleration over short distances. And he can strike a ball with clean technique with either foot.
There are huge question marks about level of competition, how he adapts to the PL, how he integrates into a team where he isn’t the main man, etc. It’s a risky move for sure. But his skill set is very impressive and ceiling is really high.
For that very reason. I forgot to implement proof reading 101.
You have to love Arsenal fans
Is he like a faster Arshavin? Never seen him play except for a highlights video in which he looks absolutely world class
Almost a pointless purchase by Arsenal.
Arsenal already have too many midfielders but lack centre forward. They can just recall pepe back if they really need more midfielders.
Arsenal already have too many midfielders but lack centre forward. They can just recall pepe back if they really need more midfielders.
Left winger is the one position in the squad we're well stocked in. Martinelli wouldn't be an automatic starter for us either - not that Arsenal would entertain anything of the sort. We actually had him on trial before he joined Arsenal when Mourinho was in charge and chose not to pursue it.
I think we'll go down the route of ESR transitioning to an 8. In reality with Zinchenko playing, he slots into midfield next to Partey, so ESRs role would be more attacking than a traditional 8, so it could work. The issue is when Tierney plays it doesn't quite work, but Xhaka is clever enough to adapt. I think we'll train Patino up to suit Xhakas role and flexibility so that if Zinchenko isn't playing, Patino becomes an option long term in midfield.
I love that squad though, very exciting and balanced and finally some quality depth if the CB and DM signings are good. One issue is the lack of cover for Saka.. again.. but if we loan out Marquinhos this window which we should maybe 6 months of consistent games would help. We also have mini Saka in the academy and Jesus could play there with Martinelli up top if needed.
The reality is Mudryk will still get lots of games. We need to not burn out Martinelli.
Ramsdale
White - Saliba - Gabriel - Zinchenko
Partey
Saka - Odegaard - Xhaka - Martinelli
Jesus
Turner
Tomiyasu - Holding - LCB - Tierney
DM
Marquinhos - Vieira - ESR - Mudryk
Nketiah
Hein
Patino
Balogun
White - Saliba - Gabriel - Zinchenko
Partey
Saka - Odegaard - Xhaka - Martinelli
Jesus
Turner
Tomiyasu - Holding - LCB - Tierney
DM
Marquinhos - Vieira - ESR - Mudryk
Nketiah
Hein
Patino
Balogun
I love that squad though, very exciting and balanced and finally some quality depth if the CB and DM signings are good. One issue is the lack of cover for Saka.. again.. but if we loan out Marquinhos this window which we should maybe 6 months of consistent games would help. We also have mini Saka in the academy and Jesus could play there with Martinelli up top if needed.
The reality is Mudryk will still get lots of games. We need to not burn out Martinelli.
For Mudryk himself, need to trust the scouting. He seems physical and that he wants to play for Arsenal desperately and will put a shift in, which are important factors for us.
He really isn't a pointless signing, but i'd prefer a left footed winger who plays on the right personally. But.. again need to trust the club has a plan really. And, I think that plan is for ESR to transition to midfield which Mikel has tried before a bit.
Think people underestimate his technique, I watched a few summary videos of him from last year and they highlighted how he actually has very good technique. But he needs to learn to play against low blocks better which is an issue. Equally, it's useful to have a player who is different incase we need it, and also need to think Arteta can help develop him and his weaknesses.
He really isn't a pointless signing, but i'd prefer a left footed winger who plays on the right personally. But.. again need to trust the club has a plan really. And, I think that plan is for ESR to transition to midfield which Mikel has tried before a bit.
Think people underestimate his technique, I watched a few summary videos of him from last year and they highlighted how he actually has very good technique. But he needs to learn to play against low blocks better which is an issue. Equally, it's useful to have a player who is different incase we need it, and also need to think Arteta can help develop him and his weaknesses.
Can see this guy scoring against us when we play them.
I'm really confused by your stance on this. How has Arteta won more than ten Hag has? Ten Hag has 3 domestic titles, 2 FA Cup equivalents and a Dutch Super Cup. Arteta has an FA Cup and a Community Shield. By what metric has Arteta won more? Has Arteta even finished in the top 4 yet? Or done anything as impressive as ten Hag's champions league run? Arteta has a really good 5 months to draw from from this season, but there were very loud calls for him to be sacked not that long ago. Ten Hag was in a shootout with Nagelsmann to be named Bayern Munich manager. I just don't see how Arteta has won or achieved more.
He's talking about Conte in that post, not Ten Hag.
As for Mudryk, I'm very excited by him, and hope he signs. People talking about he's only a pace merchant are wong in my opinion, look at the video enclosed to see the vision and technique he has in addition to that pace.
What I like best is that unlike Pepe (laughable comparison really) this lad isn't shy at using his weaker left foot to pass, cross or shoot, whereas as someone like Pepe was was too easy to read as he only wanted to use his left side.
And speaking of pace, in this league especially, pace is a major weapon. I honestly think he's not far off Mbappe pace, im sure hes been recorded as having top speed in the Champions League this season.
Of course hes still raw, but if you can harness that speed so he knows when to slow his game down and speed it up, then he becomes a very exciting player.
As for the fact people say we don't need him, these are probably the same people that probably think our squad is too weak on one hand then have a go when you go about strengthening it on the other. I hope we can get a deal done as I'd hate to see him sign for Chelsea now after all the legwork.
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