Bit weird that since I remember him being quite loving of Mourinho and praised his football management abilities. With Moyes it was all about him as a person.
Moyes So Far!
- Thread starter RedTillI'mDead
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Based on what?
One conspiracy was that Fergie purposely hired someone much worse than him so his achievements would live on as incredible for longer. In hiring Mourinho he might have continued the success.
That's one of the worst for sure.
On another note, did Fergie not say that Moyes's real challenge would be to do something like 3 titles in a row or something? How ridiculous that looks now.
That's one of the worst for sure.
On another note, did Fergie not say that Moyes's real challenge would be to do something like 3 titles in a row or something? How ridiculous that looks now.
Great unbiased post tbf.
Worst part for me thus far is he seems to be trying too hard to be a very poor mans SAF.
You are misunderstanding what Fergie was trying to convey. Fergie won't delve to deep into the tactics that Moyes would set out .etc because Fergie knows that Moyes will not set out like Everton and telling the reader about how good Everton's tactics were would be redundant as Moyes would make united play differently.
On what you said about him being Scottish, Fergie is trying to imply that Moyes has characteristics of which deem to be a qualities in Fergie eyes. Moyes has a toughness about him and the cause is because Moyes was brought up in a similar environment as Fergie ( it was not because Moyes was scottish that Fergie used as point to hire him, it was the effect of mental toughness). People get confused on that aspect.
Would it hurt to try and formulate a game plan? He's been here long enough...
I'm not sure to be honest. If by 'being friends' you are implying Ferguson showed him favouritism, then I would say no - simply because I have more faith in Ferguson than that. But if you mean that being friends with Ferguson created a situation in which Moyes demonstrated certain qualities that Ferguson liked, then yeah I would agree - if they hadn't met and did not know each other on any type of personal level then he probably would not have been hired.
That is not necessarily a bad thing though, it just means Moyes was judged more on his personality and less obvious aspects of football - for example his views on certain elements, like youth development - as opposed to simply results. If anything I could quite easily envisage a situation in which knowing a manager on a personal level leads to a better decision in terms of their employment suitability. Outside of football in general working life I think this is true.
Things are going to boil over completely if we lose against City, Liverpool and go out of the CL.....
I am not looking forward to the fall out if it does happen
I am not looking forward to the fall out if it does happen
It's quite likely he didn't want to say anything substantial or insightful about why Moyes was chosen as it would play a big part in shaping the narrative surrounding Moyes. What's that old adage about only a fool tells all he knows? Sir Alex rarely said anything substantial or insightful to the media and that has nothing to do with him lacking insight and everything to do with control, I imagine. So what he said in there could be a red herring to divert attention and mislead those intent on picking apart Moyes' every move. That may well be nonsense and what he said is a true reflection of his thoughts, but it's not stretching the truth in any way to say Sir Alex withheld important information all the time and was very careful and thoughtful about what he said in public.
Sure. But from there you still have to reach to explain why he preferred him to better managers.
I feel he is being to soft. He is wanting to continue the traditions in the club whilst not wanting to create any bad feelings with anyone with the club. He is not being ruthless enough. He needs to show the qualities that Fergie chose him for.
What are you basing this on, apart from your feelings.
Surely he won't survive should that happen? It really is impossible to call though...
You didn't say that when we won against then the second best team in Germany (according to league position) 5-0.
No, but I did find myself questioning why he continued to chop and change the side both tactically and individually on the back of our best performance and result this season. And don't flatter Leverkusen, they're shite.
This is it!
What was it the one thing about Moyes? Was it the fact he wouldn't leave United after 4 or 5 years? I'd love to know the one thing that got him the job above everyone else.
There is no way he survives it. Calling it now. When the full time whistle goes against City, and we're already out of the CL and Liverpool have taken all three points the week before, frustration and anger is going to fully take over inside the ground.
The papers will throw huge pressure on him, the fans will completely turn on him, players will get even more trigger happy with their comments in the media....There is no way he'll survive it. I just cannot see it
One of the best posts in the thread. And a completely unbiased view as well.
Thanks for posting this.
If Moyes was English he wouldn't have got the job. It's completely true. Otherwise Alan Curbishley would have been in with a shot at the "longevity" element of it as he did a very similar job with Charlton for many, many years.
It's gotten to the point where I no longer feel any hate towards Moyes. He's just hopelessly out of his depth and you can see it in his eyes he's scared; he's not up for it. That celebration at Fulham was the turning point for me - just how happy he was made me happy and then it slipped away from him courtesy of Darren feckin Bent'
The job is too big for him, it's not like he could refuse the United job though, and resigning would be just as bad imo. It's been a disaster from the beginning and has ruined both United and Moyes. You know it's bad when you start feeling for the manager of Man United! I feel anger towards the board though for a lack of ambition. Whether that's Charlton and Fergie included, I just can't comprehend how they thought that hiring a manager that's won nothing would be a good idea. I'm also unhappy they didn't take the majority of United fans' views on who they should appoint.
The job is too big for him, it's not like he could refuse the United job though, and resigning would be just as bad imo. It's been a disaster from the beginning and has ruined both United and Moyes. You know it's bad when you start feeling for the manager of Man United! I feel anger towards the board though for a lack of ambition. Whether that's Charlton and Fergie included, I just can't comprehend how they thought that hiring a manager that's won nothing would be a good idea. I'm also unhappy they didn't take the majority of United fans' views on who they should appoint.
I hope you're right.
Well that's one thing to hold onto as we have only won 3 matches (ignoring the sunderland match as that felt like a defeat) in 2014 so far.
I am and I did. I still think it's possible that Sir Alex picked him partly based on that and if so it's incredibly irresponsible. I'm just open to other possibilities too whereas it seemed like BR was certain that was the genuine reason. That's my issue with this discussion. People who want Moyes gone now are latching onto any negative slant and acting like they are undeniable truths. There's so little room for uncertainty and that to me is bizarre because we know so little.
You can't see why he wouldn't want to speak frankly and openly and in depth about Moyes at this early stage in his United career? Really?
That is completely and utterly absurd. Some of you lot really do think you should be involved in the decision-making of the club...bizarre.
The biggest reason you destroyed Leverkusen was, that the latter did not exploit your clear flaws (in difference to most EPL sides) in your set up. They did not press you at all and left you way too much space to combine. Your obvious lack of movement was thus not really an issue, because you did not need to work for space. It was given to you.
Leverkusen has and had for quite some time now a serious deep rooted mentality problem on the international stage vs. big clubs. They show way too much respect and are scared to their bones. They were simply not playing like the 2nd best German team, which they also obviously aren´t. It was their worst performance of the season until that point, something that any regulare follower of the Bundesliga I know confirmed.
You are right. Moyes has made a big mistake of having an average of 3.5 changes after every game. This breads instability.
Moyes has over done rotation aspect of the game by either trying to give players chances in the the first 3-4 months and resting players so other players can have the turn. He also had to take players off because of their bad performances. .But, we also had a lot of injuries.
There was a lot of reasons as you can see for the changes that are right/wrong
I think both camps are clutching on to anything that makes their opinions appear valid to be honest.
I called him a prat on here for the way he legged it down the tunnel after the penalty shootout against Sunderland. I was getting my hands on anything negative throw at him.
Now, I'm more realistic and can see both sides of the argument...Unfortunately Moyes has done nothing to change my mind about him. If anything, he's given me more things to be annoyed about
I think not. Moyes is a nobody in the football world when it's up to manage a big club and compete for silverware. And if you look at his European record with Everton you can only cry...
I doubt a Spanish manager doing the exact same work at Everton would have gotten the job.
And we lost 4-1 to City and 3-1 to Chelsea and 8 more teams, what is your point?
Besides PSG just spanked Leverkusen 4-0 in the knockout stage. Goes to show how competitive was our group..
He probably thought that, we all did, but as of now Moyes seems intent on having us play like Everton did. My scottish comment was tongue in cheek obviously as well, although I don't think Moyes would be our manager right now if he was english or any other nationality.
I'd agree with this. You can look at it both ways I guess, with Fergie thinking he knows him better then the others so he'd trust him and believe in him. My only issue is that I think his nationality had too big of a role to play, and that we'd be better off if we just looked 100% at the football side of things, which manager would be most likely to give us success both short term and keep us at the top long term.
Thing is though, those who want Moyes out don't need to 'clutch on to anything that makes their opinion appear valid'.
Those who think he's wildly out of his depth certainly don't need to clutch onto anything.
The entire season (and even pre-season/transfer window) has just been an endless string of incidents showing a manager deeply out of his depth.
Yeah, that's true. I didn't say if it was right or wrong what he said, I just found it a bit weird and funny really. He started by like saying the reasons why he hired him but then only listed things that aren't related to football. I mean I don't like Moyes but he did do a good job at Everton, and if we're looking at qualities that suit United he could have mentioned stuff about his youth development.
I wanted to appear less biased towards throwing him out but, no point. It seems everyone has joined my crusade
I do feel that Moyes is incredibly lucky to have 2 weeks off to improve the team. Now the fixtures are not going against the team as opposed to the start of the season.
If we don't improve against West Brom (which I find very hard to believe), then I will be joining the dark side.
If we don't improve against West Brom (which I find very hard to believe), then I will be joining the dark side.
I'll get a welcome pack organised for you.
I am, if that fallout is Moyes losing his job.
Yeah, it's just something that shouldn't have even come into the argument IMO. They should have looked at stuff like playing style first and foremost, as United have always been an attacking club, then willingness to promote youth, and then come past results, trophies/experience, etc. Moyes had the youth players part but he's always been a more negative manager which is the main reason why I never wanted him. Even if he turned out to be successful, I always felt we probably wouldn't be too great to watch. As it is, we don't have results or playing style, so he's got to change one of them, preferably style, because the results will come with it I feel.
Come to the dark side, we have cookies!
No. You'll be walking into into the kingdom of light and rationale.
EDIT : And also what post # 24361 says.
What happened to giving him time like you said earlier? The Caf is turning you!
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