Absolutely agree with that and I think that applies to any team who won the season the year before. It's a new era and also a phase of transition, but I find it unacceptable a team to go from champions to Europa League football (or worse) in the space of a season and be accepting of that, regardless of the circumstances.
Moyes So Far!
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Absolutely agree with that and I think that applies to any team who won the season the year before. It's a new era and also a phase of transition, but I find it unacceptable a team to go from champions to Europa League football (or worse) in the space of a season and be accepting of that, regardless of the circumstances.
Feels surreal doesn't it?
The last couple of matches have made me realize I've actually written this season off.
If we were competing for a title I'd be fecking mad losing at home to both Everton and Newcastle.
Now I can't see us get into the top four I'm not really that bothered. I'm resigned. Perhaps Moyes's defeatist attitude has gotten to me too...
Kone is the best striker Martinez signed at Wigan which doesn't say much. Everton didn't look scoring many goals until they signed Lukaku
I seem to remember Wigan doing decently under Bruce. I bet their supporters were happy when they got Martinez. Won them the FA cup that's true though I'd say they rather be in the PL. A quality manager like Martinez should've been able to keep them in the PL surely?
He's doing great now, lots of teams have had good starts over the years in the PL. He'll have a tight budget, he'll have to rebuild eventually. Lot's of things could go wrong.
I'm just saying let's not proclaim Martinez god and Moyes a joke so early.
It spreads like a disease.
Peterstorey must be laughing his bollocks off.
Fergie always proved his predictions wrong.
Now Moyes will make him into Psychic Meg.
Fergie always proved his predictions wrong.
Now Moyes will make him into Psychic Meg.
They did, but Bruce was only there for a while. Wigan were a small team on a relatively small budget and were bound to go down eventually. Martinez' refreshing football, however, meant they could go down with an FA Cup, as opposed to Moyes who despite finishing consistently with Everton was often incredibly pragmatic and uninspiring, which he's shown here.
Don't get me wrong, I thought people were overrating him massively off of the back of that FA Cup win, but he's clearly a very good manager and only a ridiculously shite one would manage to take Everton down at the moment. I personally think we'll scrape top 4 by the skin of our teeth and finish ahead of Everton, but the fact we're even having to contemplate whether we'll finish ahead of them or not, with all due respect since they are a good team, kind of shows how poor we've been so far, and by the same token shows how poor a job Moyes has done so far.
Doesn't always work that way, Martinez's style was always more suited to a top team.
Wenger has been relegated before too.
It's not that Fergie doesn't make mistakes though. If you have read his book, on the Barcelona chapter he said that he signed Ashley Young in order to catch up with Barca for example.
I think that SAF saw something on Moyes, and also them being from the same city helped a lot. Sir Alex never was the most revolutionary one too, so a traditional manager maybe looked ok to him.
The media then wonder why big clubs go for foreign managers.
Has the Leverkusen result been forgotten?
No he doesn't! He is facing a defender but has the space to run into as Welbeck looks to be taking his defender away..But as you see it's all about interpretation and trying to guess what happened as the picture only tells you so much (i.e. it's pretty useless).
..hm..
Doesn't mean he thought Ashley Young was good enough in himself to make us overtake Barca, though. Besides, this book of his consists of musings jotted down by the bloke who "wrote" it, some are in full context, others clearly aren't. He also proclaimed Bebe a 20 goal a season striker - which could be regarded as anything between lunacy and a highly interesting point of view.
Played down, as per usual. Bayer were weak, bla bla bla, they've just beaten Dortmund but were weak when they played us twice and so on.
Considering ppl say he is not experienced at the top, he has done well in the CL in a hard group.
No, I don't believe so . His record in Europe is the one thing that's saving him at the moment. However the PL results is his bread and butter and he has failed miserably.
He has been praised for his results in Europe, therefore he is rightly criticised for his poor performance in the League.
But how long do we give him? I've not really seen anything from him that makes me think "lets give him time" sure you can look at some good results in the UCL here and there and make a case but in the PS hes been shown up big time and that's with his experience in this league! This excuse that our team has over performed is wearing pretty thin too, at the end of the day these players have a lot to give and if our manager cant get the best out of them surely we cant pin it all on them.
Take Pellegrini at City, his away form is questionable but at home they've shown a lot, they comfortably took us apart and battered Tottenham - two, supposedly, top teams in the PS. Had Moyes had the same impact as Pellegrini I don't think you'd see much cause for concern here as you could see some light at the end of the tunnel but we're 15 games in with 22 points to our name... Moyes through his buys and management of the team hasn't filled me with a shred of confidence and giving him time to build a team scares me more because SAF was great at knowing what we needed to stay successful but Moyes has never won anything in his life, how does he know what a title winning side needs?!
Sorry but I get the sentiment of giving a manager time to build but I think the days of Fergie will never be seen again, in modern football its about get results and getting the best manager available if only for a few seasons.
In fairness they are the worst team we've played this season
Wrong. You may disagree with the message the poster is trying to convey through it but to disregard images as a tool to showcase positioning and make a point regarding that, in general is completlely illogical.
In two games he has done well in the CL.
We were shit against Shaktar and Sociedad....Lets call it as it is, go back and look at our performances against them two. We were average and Shaktar really should have beaten us
No, they are not the worst team we've played against this season but we've got the best results against them.
So far that seems to be the exception rather than the rule...
In my book only Crystal Palace come close.
We've scored 9 in the 2 games against them and could have scored about 4 or 5 more. They were inept
The Leverkusen result was an anomaly. He only picked that lineup due to injuries and suspensions. He generally a negative manager.
Do you honestly trust him to overhaul the squad and get it right?
No harm to him but I dread to think what a united team built in David Moyes image would look like.
Bought a United sledge today....I've never gone downhill so fast before in my life...
If you don't laugh, you cry
If you don't laugh, you cry
How's it wrong?! i've just illustrated that you can interpret it completely differently and that you can show selective bias! You're weird.
Apologies if so, but has anybody already posted this?:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/25282245
David Moyes: Manchester United can still win Premier League title
By Chris Bevan BBC Sport at Old Trafford
Manchester United manager David Moyes insists his side are still in the Premier League title race despite two home defeats in the space of four days.
After losing to Everton and Newcastle, United are 12 points behind leaders Arsenal, who play Everton on Sunday.
Moyes said: "I stand firm we will be very close to it. I hope we are in it at the end of the season."
When asked why he was so confident, he said: "The players - because I am working with the champions."
Saturday saw Newcastle clinch their first win at Old Trafford for 41 years as United slipped to their third home defeat in the league this season.
Moyes's side struggled to respond after going behind against the Magpies and they have already dropped 13 out of 24 points at Old Trafford, four more than in the whole of the last campaign.
They have also suffered back-to-back league defeats for the first time since the 2001-02 season but Moyes, who replaced Sir Alex Ferguson as manager in the summer, is adamant that there is no reason to panic.
"I think the game against Everton was very similar to the one against Newcastle," he explained. "If we had come out on top in both games I don't think anybody would have said an awful lot about it.
"Because we have not, and because we are Manchester United, we have to do better.
"We have to play better, pass it better, make more chances and take more opportunities when they came, because they have done. But we have just not been able to do that in the last couple of games.
"We were needing something to go for us, to give us a bit of confidence.
"Their goal was a little bit unfortunate. Patrice Evra hits the ball against the back of Moussa Sissoko's head and he goes through to cut it back for Yoan Guffran to score."
Moyes received a mixed reaction from United fans at the final whistle - there were some boos and some supporters had already left, but the Stretford End applauded him and sang his name as he made his way towards the tunnel.
"The United fans have been great," Moyes added. "Great to me, and great to the club.
"They understand there is a big transition going on here. I don't think they, or me, expected us to have lost five games at this time of the season, but I think they understand totally that there is a change going on.
"How big a test is this for me? It's the same test I have done ever since I have started as a manager. The good thing is that I am more experienced now and hopefully I will be able to handle it much better."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/25282245
David Moyes: Manchester United can still win Premier League title
By Chris Bevan BBC Sport at Old Trafford
Manchester United manager David Moyes insists his side are still in the Premier League title race despite two home defeats in the space of four days.
After losing to Everton and Newcastle, United are 12 points behind leaders Arsenal, who play Everton on Sunday.
Moyes said: "I stand firm we will be very close to it. I hope we are in it at the end of the season."
When asked why he was so confident, he said: "The players - because I am working with the champions."
Saturday saw Newcastle clinch their first win at Old Trafford for 41 years as United slipped to their third home defeat in the league this season.
Moyes's side struggled to respond after going behind against the Magpies and they have already dropped 13 out of 24 points at Old Trafford, four more than in the whole of the last campaign.
They have also suffered back-to-back league defeats for the first time since the 2001-02 season but Moyes, who replaced Sir Alex Ferguson as manager in the summer, is adamant that there is no reason to panic.
"I think the game against Everton was very similar to the one against Newcastle," he explained. "If we had come out on top in both games I don't think anybody would have said an awful lot about it.
"Because we have not, and because we are Manchester United, we have to do better.
"We have to play better, pass it better, make more chances and take more opportunities when they came, because they have done. But we have just not been able to do that in the last couple of games.
"We were needing something to go for us, to give us a bit of confidence.
"Their goal was a little bit unfortunate. Patrice Evra hits the ball against the back of Moussa Sissoko's head and he goes through to cut it back for Yoan Guffran to score."
Moyes received a mixed reaction from United fans at the final whistle - there were some boos and some supporters had already left, but the Stretford End applauded him and sang his name as he made his way towards the tunnel.
"The United fans have been great," Moyes added. "Great to me, and great to the club.
"They understand there is a big transition going on here. I don't think they, or me, expected us to have lost five games at this time of the season, but I think they understand totally that there is a change going on.
"How big a test is this for me? It's the same test I have done ever since I have started as a manager. The good thing is that I am more experienced now and hopefully I will be able to handle it much better."
...at least he stopped short of directly quoting the Black Knight from the Holy Grail, as far as I can spot.
I second this. It's an awful idea to let him build a team when he cannot get into top 4 with this side.
I see a lot of people are waiting for January and hoping for big things in the transfer market... I don't believe it will be enough even if we do some good stuff. We can bring half of Dortmund and Messi to this team and it still wouldn't look good enough. We're not even getting anywhere near the best of what we have. What on earth are they working on during the week? All they know is to try and get a winger\full back clear on the wing and get a cross in. That's that, our one and true idea. That's why you're supposed to have a manager for. I thought the team selection today was fine, enough players with the quality to get something to happen in the final third. And nothing. That's why bringing new players won't be enough. We're not playing like a team, just a bunch of individuals.
It's not a popular thing to say, but I think we should cut our losses and let Moyes go. There's a not too fine line between a new manager learning a new, bigger job, and, well, this. It's been an absolute disaster so far and Moyes looks out of his depth. I feel sorry for him because I liked him when he was at Everton, but the vibe has been all wrong from the first moment. Yes, it feels like Hodgson and Liverpool. He's just not got the mentality, and possibly skills as well. Will he, eventually, if he stays? Maybe, just maybe. Do we have years to let him learn?
I just hope that nothing will be done on the basis of pride - even Fergie's pride - or 'because we don't do that at United'. Yeah, we haven't sacked a manager in 27 years. For most of that time, we haven't had a reason to even think about it. If we realise we got the appointment wrong, we need to act quickly. Not let him continue at the job. Even if the team needs a bit of a rebuild, do we want Moyes to do it?
It's not a popular thing to say, but I think we should cut our losses and let Moyes go. There's a not too fine line between a new manager learning a new, bigger job, and, well, this. It's been an absolute disaster so far and Moyes looks out of his depth. I feel sorry for him because I liked him when he was at Everton, but the vibe has been all wrong from the first moment. Yes, it feels like Hodgson and Liverpool. He's just not got the mentality, and possibly skills as well. Will he, eventually, if he stays? Maybe, just maybe. Do we have years to let him learn?
I just hope that nothing will be done on the basis of pride - even Fergie's pride - or 'because we don't do that at United'. Yeah, we haven't sacked a manager in 27 years. For most of that time, we haven't had a reason to even think about it. If we realise we got the appointment wrong, we need to act quickly. Not let him continue at the job. Even if the team needs a bit of a rebuild, do we want Moyes to do it?
Yup, the only thing we know from the summer was that we spent 27.5m on a player we should have never went for in the first place and have been trying hard to get Baines. Baines would improve us but he is what, 29 right now? He's not got many years left at the top level really, and we'd probably have to spend 20m to buy him. Who knows who else he'll be chasing but I can't say that I have complete confidence in letting him rebuild the squad. Do people on here really want Uniteds future to be a squad built in the image of David Moyes, playing long balls and crossing it from deep non-stop? Because that is what we seem to have been doing more and more since he took over.
Kone was signed for a squad player, but yeah, he isn't good.
Why he should get stick for McCarthy? A very good player, who is running their midfield and who costed less than half of what they get for Fellaini.
FFS just looked at the table and we only have 9 points more than Crystal Palace, that's terrible after almost half a season.
Deulofeu would play if Lukaku get injured. And he seems to be highly rated.
Read the book if you don't believe me.
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