The smart money would be us absolutely not finishing in the top 4 this season...on a brighter note...jones will be back for the next game
Moyes So Far!
- Thread starter RedTillI'mDead
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Yes our midfield is dire. Has been for last 2 seasons IMO. But even with that, there is absolutely no excuse not to be in top 4 with this squad.
I could accept the players need to take most of the blame if we hadn't had an embarrasing summer transfer window, Moyes could have strengthened but decided Fellaini was all we needed.
He has to take a look at some of his team selections. Januzaj and Nani looked more interesting immediately than Valencia and Welbeck on the wings. If the roles were reversed and they started, what might have happened? At the very least this time he made subs much earlier and you could see it was making a difference to our play. But so far this season there's been such a strong sensation of too little, too late.
I'm wondering what's going on in our training these days. We don't seem to be doing the things we've known to be good at anywhere near well enough. Moyes has found himself under serious pressure again, and it's partly of his own doing. We had a glimpse at a recovery but that's long gone now. It's a big task for him to save our season and get us back in the top 4. The competition seem to be playing with an assurance that we're sorely lacking right now. Shocking to see how far we've fallen from last year.
I'm wondering what's going on in our training these days. We don't seem to be doing the things we've known to be good at anywhere near well enough. Moyes has found himself under serious pressure again, and it's partly of his own doing. We had a glimpse at a recovery but that's long gone now. It's a big task for him to save our season and get us back in the top 4. The competition seem to be playing with an assurance that we're sorely lacking right now. Shocking to see how far we've fallen from last year.
Just seems destined to fail. Poor, poor goal to concede. Hope he turns it around.
How anyone can defend moyes so far is beyond me. This team is so off the pace its scary.
People have been saying on here its improving!? What team are some watching
People have been saying on here its improving!? What team are some watching
Most disheartening thing about this is we have gone 12 unbeaten, including a win over the top of the table side, and still are further behind than before that run.
It's pointless calling for Moyes's head as he won't get sacked this early but I would be quite happy if he left United.
The guy's not go the background to be United manager and I really don't care if he was Fergie's recommendation.
It's pointless calling for Moyes's head as he won't get sacked this early but I would be quite happy if he left United.
The guy's not go the background to be United manager and I really don't care if he was Fergie's recommendation.
Nani, Januzay were subs, we start the match with Welbeck of all people. That is some shocking coaching, yes the team isn't as good it led us to believe with the title won last season but Moyes has kept on making mistakes after mistakes. He likes to feck up with the team's formation too much during the game, take one player, put him here, get another, play in this other position ... It's affecting the team's cohesion of these all ingame changes.
I shudder to think what "his squad" might look like. A team full of Fellaini-type players would be an insult to the history of the club. No creativity, no spark, no fire.
We're 3 points above Villa, 5 points above Hull. 'kin hell.
Its a squad with 73 Pl winners medals. It should be easily good enough to get into the top 4. Not struggling around 9th.
Its not as if the rest of the PL(bar maybe Arsenal) has played to a great level either which is the big worry.
Exactly. A squad like Uniteds shouldnt be struggling so much.
I think with that midfield there is no guarantees of a top 4 finish. I honestly think it's that poor. We just don't dominate teams whether it's City or Cardiff. When there is just one spot left for grabs there are no guarantees.
If he doesn't make top 4 we should get rid. This is simply not good enough.
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We are back in year 2001.9th, 12 points off the top
It's a really tough one, today he gambled and it almost came off but we didn't take our chance but they ended up getting one where I think Valencia fell asleep when a proper defender might not have. I'm glad he's taking the chance as on another day it will come off.
However he should take some stick for the last two games for a couple of reasons. Firstly I don't know at all what the thinking with Welbeck is. He's not putting in a shift and he's not provided a clear attacking threat so why has he come straight back in the team. Additionally why does he swap him and kagawa when it clearly subdues kagawa, for me reduces our play through the middle and forces Rooney deeper who's been shining as the lone man, where he almost becomes a spare player.
I still think it's part of him being cautious but it simply isn't working. I can appreciate he's concerned about the middle and so maybe wants work rate but as I said we don't seem to be getting it and personally I really don't think Nani's tracking is significantly worse. However he does have a much greater attacking threat. Additionally we do seem to give the ball away a lot, I mean I've never seen Rafael hit so many long passes, it felt tactical to me.
Ultimately the problems are not new, they've been there for a while and now we're finally feeling them in full. These were there under Fergie. Without a proper passer in there we lack any drive. If you're gonna favour the harder working and more simple players in the wide spot then you need someone in the middle to drive the attack and if you want to play as wide as we do then you need two players in the middle who can either cover the ground or read the game defensively well. We've only got two players who can do that Carrick and Fletcher who has been absent for ages.
I don't know if we can sign the right player in January but it's clear that in the summer we have to get it right. I still don't think there's a huge amount wrong, we don't need an overhaul but we need 2 new midfielders and one if not both need to be genuine quality.
However he should take some stick for the last two games for a couple of reasons. Firstly I don't know at all what the thinking with Welbeck is. He's not putting in a shift and he's not provided a clear attacking threat so why has he come straight back in the team. Additionally why does he swap him and kagawa when it clearly subdues kagawa, for me reduces our play through the middle and forces Rooney deeper who's been shining as the lone man, where he almost becomes a spare player.
I still think it's part of him being cautious but it simply isn't working. I can appreciate he's concerned about the middle and so maybe wants work rate but as I said we don't seem to be getting it and personally I really don't think Nani's tracking is significantly worse. However he does have a much greater attacking threat. Additionally we do seem to give the ball away a lot, I mean I've never seen Rafael hit so many long passes, it felt tactical to me.
Ultimately the problems are not new, they've been there for a while and now we're finally feeling them in full. These were there under Fergie. Without a proper passer in there we lack any drive. If you're gonna favour the harder working and more simple players in the wide spot then you need someone in the middle to drive the attack and if you want to play as wide as we do then you need two players in the middle who can either cover the ground or read the game defensively well. We've only got two players who can do that Carrick and Fletcher who has been absent for ages.
I don't know if we can sign the right player in January but it's clear that in the summer we have to get it right. I still don't think there's a huge amount wrong, we don't need an overhaul but we need 2 new midfielders and one if not both need to be genuine quality.
We have to aim for 4th place and hope for a good run in Europe. Moyes is not bad in cups so we might sneak in some silverware.
The subs he brought on were bang on. The players he took off couldn't have been worse. Welbeck was having one of his worst games ever, and was on the left in the first half, and we had Kagawa playing very well behind Rooney, and then we change them up again in the second half and then take off Kagawa. Rafael was excellent in the first half and linking up really well with Valencia, yet he takes him off and puts Valencia at right back, Nani and Januzaj on the wings. It's amateur mistakes. You don't go for broke like that 50 minutes into a game that we're dominating. We lost control there, and by the time we took off Welbeck it was pretty much too late already. We should have won the game with the chances we had but the subs lost the game.
Martinez, Solkjaer both better than Moyes.
The Glazers arent going to hang around. If they think that he wont get us in the top 4 at whatever stage they will act. They are ruthless.
I don't understand why some people say he need a long time to adjust, if he is a top class manager, he would have fitted right in and learnt from his mistakes. Martinez didn't need time with Everton and as a result they are doing so much better.
When SAF left we needed a manager who could fill the vacuum that he left, and for me the only man who would have the ego to fill that role was Jose. Moyes looks like that fat little school boy who got picked first at football and is just happy for it, Jose would have come in and known he deserved to be there.
We will stick with Moyes but some of our play this season has made me think what he must have them doing in the training pitch. It makes me even more angry when I think he was so eager to stamp his own foot on the club he sacked all the background staff that could be helping him right now. The current lot are probably as clueless as him
We will stick with Moyes but some of our play this season has made me think what he must have them doing in the training pitch. It makes me even more angry when I think he was so eager to stamp his own foot on the club he sacked all the background staff that could be helping him right now. The current lot are probably as clueless as him
playing Welbeck wasnt an absolute shitter before the game started, RVP is injured and Everton are quite a physical team. The players themselves looked poor at times tonight, especially in the second half, but people seem to ignore this and think that it must all come down to Moyes playing Welbeck.
We are the new Liverpool.
It's not just about individuals. We have brilliant individuals and one of the best squads in England. But the way football they tend to play together isn't what it could be. That can be improved only through coaching which is one of Moyes main responsibilities.
It wasn't a bad overall performance. We created enough chances to win the game comfortably. What I don't understand is why Welbeck stayed so long on the pitch. He should have gone off early instead of Kagawa. Also the Rafael substitution was poor. He was never the best choice for the job. His decision making is poor.
Those that thought SAF didn't select players based on nationality need to take a good look at themselves because this is what he has selected as a manager, oh wait that happens to be Scottish!
Moyes does not escape complete responsibility for the state of the MF. He did buy a 28m player who is supposed to be a midfielder.
Whilst I am disappointed with the result tonight, the reaction to it by our fans has left me fecking fuming.
His subs were awful though. For a start he shouldn't have started Welbeck and Valencia, it was never going to work and you could see loads of people in the matchday thread predicting exactly what happened. Then he brings on Nani and Januzaj, but takes off Kagawa and Rafael??? Keeping both on and taking Valencia/Welbeck off would've been the right thing to do, as both offered absolutely feck all all night.
The squad is good enough for top 4, it easily is, and we should be beating Everton at home. Moyes is not to blame for Welbeck's inexplicable miss of an open goal or Rooney missing a simple tap-in, but he is making it very hard for anyone to defend him. We are playing crap football, we are all over the place defensively and his team selections and substitutions are baffling.
Ya, but Rooney will be suspended. Welbz up top from the start. Gonna be fecking fantastic.
It is little decision such as keeping Welbeck on for 80 minutes when he did not offer any goal threat and then taking Kagawa off and allowing poor Hernandez 10 minutes to change the game.
It really was Rob, maybe you didn't watch him at the week end where he was also rather rubbish and besides Danny isn't exactly a strong player, he has zero balance and falls on the ground at almost every contact. It was stupid to start him, stupid to keep changing him positions (LW and then CF) and even more stupid to let him play for so long.
Obviously I soo hope he does well, blah blah blah.
But to be honest if I was Glazer I'd be on the blower to OT in the morning to call an emergency meeting and debrief...
But to be honest if I was Glazer I'd be on the blower to OT in the morning to call an emergency meeting and debrief...
But, but... This squad isn't capable of anything more!
Yeah fans who are questioning whether we'll make the top four after months of poor performances with virtually no improvement... Those pesky glory hunting fans...
I felt for him a bit tonight, everything that could go wrong just about did. Made good offensive subs, but I have to admit I sighed when I saw Kagawa coming off and Welbeck staying on. He's completely ineffective from a wide area.
We all know it should have been Jose. He had earned the job through his success and has managed huge clubs around the world. Moyes earned it by being Scottish I think.
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