Morgan Schneiderlin | BBC: Morgan Schneiderlin is currently having a medical at Manchester United.

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Only just seen this, would be absolutely delighted if we signed him. It's less about his actual quality (he's very good but definitely not top tier) and more about how perfectly he would suit our needs. He would be such a smart buy.....

Easily worth £25m.
 
Moriarty said:
It's still mind-boggling, at least to me.
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People who deal with millions in their work daily are the ones making these deals. They've got a pretty decent sense of where the bar is. It doesn't really matter what the individual costs. What matters is how much you spend in total in a year.

For us normal people that don't think in millions I don't think we'll ever come to terms with these fees.
 
pocco said:
Manages to get his foot in a few times which probably got him man of the match. Other than that, bang average. His passing isn't that great and he looks rushed under pressure. Plays a few long balls out wide to his fullback that has them running towards their own byline, which isnt ideal.

I've never been massively impressed by him. He's looked ok for France a few times, but I never judge on international performances. He's a bit of a Cabaye type figure on here for me - most think he's the bee's knees but I don't really see anything special.
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Since when did managing to get your foot in a few times equal 10 tackles, 9 interceptions and 5 clearances?

Not to mention the most touches and passes for Southampton, 4th overall in both and had the best passing accuracy out of anyone who started the match.
 
Devil may care said:
I partially agree, he is not a Carrick replacement in the passing and controlling department, we'd still need another CM brought in for that. I do think he can sit deeper though with someone like Gundogan next him as a double pivot to play that part in the team, while he focuses on winning the ball and protecting the back 4.
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To be honest I'd prefer it if we could sign someone who can multitask, has the ability to marry both roles and performs at a high level, rather than dedicated specialists with relatively specific roles. Granted - it's a very rare type of player to find, we basically struck gold with Carrick, but scouting for them is well worth the trouble because it essentially adds another element to the team from the pseudo defensive midfield/ deep lying play-maker position. If we can get that type of Carrick/ Alonso player, then it opens a whole gamut of opportunities for the 3rd midfielder choice because then you don't have to look specifically for passers like Gundogan as a form of compensation, and could even prioritize a dribbling threat from central areas - maybe even shove Di maria in there.

Someone like Xhaka for example has a much superior passing range and is only a tad weaker defensively. That might be someone who has the potential to be a more effective replacement for Carrick in the medium-long term. Again, not opposed to Schneiderlin, he has a lot of qualities, it's just that in degrees from 1-10, I'd probably prefer a couple others from an overall perspective. In saying that if van Gaal wants to build a mid 2000s Milan/ current Juventus tye midfield and needs a relentless Matuidi type box-to-box enforcer who is proven in the league and can recycle possession effectively then Schneiderlin would be an appropriate choice.
 
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pocco said:
Manages to get his foot in a few times which probably got him man of the match. Other than that, bang average. His passing isn't that great and he looks rushed under pressure. Plays a few long balls out wide to his fullback that has them running towards their own byline, which isnt ideal.

I've never been massively impressed by him. He's looked ok for France a few times, but I never judge on international performances. He's a bit of a Cabaye type figure on here for me - most think he's the bee's knees but I don't really see anything special.
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I was dead against the idea of us signing Cabaye too as I thought we could (and should) do better. Schneiderlin is a clear step above Cabaye though and would be a much better signing for a club of our stature.
 
Really hope this goes through, he's improving constantly and young, would be a good signing, are the sources just general gossip? We never get linked with him
 
pocco said:
Manages to get his foot in a few times which probably got him man of the match. Other than that, bang average. His passing isn't that great and he looks rushed under pressure. Plays a few long balls out wide to his fullback that has them running towards their own byline, which isnt ideal.

I've never been massively impressed by him. He's looked ok for France a few times, but I never judge on international performances. He's a bit of a Cabaye type figure on here for me - most think he's the bee's knees but I don't really see anything special.
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Someone as busy and as capable of one-touch passing as Herrera would make Schneiderlin better.
Southampton haven't maintained the compactness they displayed under Pochettino. They were always very close to each other, whereas they stretch the pitch more now. Herrera, in particular, would always be buzzing in and around him.
 
I don't see Schneiderlin ever lifting a CL trophy. We should look at players who would actually improve our squad.
 
Invictus said:
To be honest I'd prefer it if we could sign someone who can multitask, has the ability to marry both roles and performs at a high level, rather than dedicated specialists with relatively specific roles. Granted - it's a very rare type of player to find, we basically struck gold with Carrick, but scouting for them is well worth the trouble because it essentially adds another element to the team from the pseudo defensive midfield/ deep lying play-maker position. If we can get that type of Carrick/ Alonso player, then it opens a whole gamut of opportunities for the 3rd midfielder choice because then you don't have to look specifically for passers like Gundogan as a form of compensation, and could even prioritize a dribbling threat from central areas - maybe even shove Di maria in there.

Someone like Xhaka for example has a much superior passing range and is only a tad weaker defensively. That might be someone who has the potential to be a more effective replacement for Carrick in the medium-long term. Again, not opposed to Schneiderlin, he has a lot of qualities, it's just that in degrees from 1-10, I'd probably prefer a couple others from an overall perspective. In saying that if van Gaal wants to build a mid 2000s Milan/ current Juventus tye midfield and needs a relentless Matuidi type box-to-box enforcer who is proven in the league and can recycle possession effectively then Schneiderlin would be an appropriate choice.
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I can see your point and I read your other posts detailing how you'd like to set the midfield up, but I think LvG is looking at what he can do with ready made options right now, and Xhaka is the only one kinda touching the point where you could say he's potentially ready to step in and be that #6/DM hybrid within 18 months IMO.

I imagine you're wondering about the effect it might have on Herrera and it's a fair point, will switching him to the role Fellaini is in have a negative effect on his game? Do we just leave him where he is and play Schneiderlin as DM and move Rooney or Mata into the #10 role and hope they create enough? It's a tricky one I agree as without Carrick our team looks so disjointed and I don't think Schneiderlin solves the issue if Carrick is out for double figures like he was last season.
 
Pentame said:
I don't see Schneiderlin ever lifting a CL trophy. We should look at players who would actually improve our squad.
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He will improve our squad a lot. We need a defensive midfielder with decent distribution. Carrick cannot play 3 games a week. Also we are nowhere near winning the CL throphy at the moment. First we need to build a title winning team.
 
iBoss said:
And not worry about how we are going to replace Carrick?
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If the club decides to replace Carrick with Schneiderlin, I'll kill myself.

Swine's Tiger, Blind, Matuidi, De Rossi, Verratti, Illarramendi, Khedira, Xhaka, Luiz Gustavo, Nüri Sahin would all be better solutions than Schneiderlin.
 
Hostekule said:
He will improve our squad a lot. We need a defensive midfielder with decent distribution. Carrick cannot play 3 games a week. Also we are nowhere near winning the CL throphy at the moment. First we need to build a title winning team.
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No, Schneiderlin's distribution isn't anywhere near Carrick's. Not even close.
 
Pentame said:
If the club decides to replace Carrick with Schneiderlin, I'll kill myself.

Swine's Tiger, Blind, Matuidi, De Rossi, Verratti, Illarramendi, Khedira, Xhaka, Luiz Gustavo, Nüri Sahin would all be better solutions than Schneiderlin.
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Of those only Swine and Xhaka would be potentially better in my opinion. Blind, Veratti, Illarramendi and Sahin doesn't offer much in terms of strength. Khedira is not as good defensively. Matuidi and De Rossi seems unlikely.
 
Pentame said:
No, Schneiderlin's distribution isn't anywhere near Carrick's. Not even close.
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Of course not, I never said it was. There are no players with Carricks qualities available therefore you look at players that can offer other attributes, such as mobiity, strength and even better tackling.
 
Pentame said:
If the club decides to replace Carrick with Schneiderlin, I'll kill myself.

Swine's Tiger, Blind, Matuidi, De Rossi, Verratti, Illarramendi, Khedira, Xhaka, Luiz Gustavo, Nüri Sahin would all be better solutions than Schneiderlin.
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None of those are better than Schneiderlin, and :lol: at putting Blind on there.
 
Hostekule said:
Of those only Swine and Xhaka would be potentially better in my opinion. Blind, Veratti, Illarramendi and Sahin doesn't offer much in terms of strenght. Khedira is not as good defensively.
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We're talking about replacing Carrick who isn't a very physical player. His main assets are his passing and defensive positioning and awareness. Schneiderlin doesn't offer anywhere near the same passing, and a trio consisting of Schneiderlin, Herrera and Rooney/Fellaini would have a serious lack of passing range and precision and we'd have to bring in a pure playmaker, someone similar to Fabregas. If we are going for a Schneiderlin type of defensive midfielder, Luiz Gustavo is without a doubt a level above him.

If we're replacing Carrick with someone who can play the same role, Swine would obviously be the most ideal player, but Xhaka and Sahin would be two very good solutions as well. They are extremly good at all sorts of passing, especially Sahin.
 
SonnyTheHaloPro said:
None of those are better than Schneiderlin, and :lol: at putting Blind on there.
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:lol: at you failing to see how important Blind was for us in the first half of the season and another :lol: at you for failing to see that he got tired in the end of the season due to a very long world cup as well as other reasons.

And yes they are all better than Schneiderlin.
 
Pentame said:
We're talking about replacing Carrick who isn't a very physical player. His main assets are his passing and defensive positioning and awareness. Schneiderlin doesn't offer anywhere near the same passing, and a trio consisting of Schneiderlin, Herrera and Rooney/Fellaini would have a serious lack of passing range and precision and we'd have to bring in a pure playmaker, someone similar to Fabregas. If we are going for a Schneiderlin type of defensive midfielder, Luiz Gustavo is without a doubt a level above him.

If we're replacing Carrick with someone who can play the same role, Swine would obviously be the most ideal player, but Xhaka and Sahin would be two very good solutions as well. They are extremly good at all sorts of passing, especially Sahin.
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When is ever the perfect match available when you need it? You have to look at the players currently in the squad, and buy players to fit to that as well. Mata, Di Maria and Herrera will most likely figure in midfield for us next season, and we desperatly need a player that can offer a lot defensively, also in terms of strength. Luis Gustavo isn't PL proven.

Xhaka sounds interesting. I've seen very little of him, but people on the forum are saying he's very good.

Ideally we'd sign Vidal or someone of his quality, but I'm not sure how realistic that is. We'll see after the CL final I guess.
 
Pentame said:
:lol: at you failing to see how important Blind was for us in the first half of the season and another :lol: at you for failing to see that he got tired in the end of the season due to a very long world cup as well as other reasons.

And yes they are all better than Schneiderlin.
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Ok, Blind is not better than Scheiderlin, but let's pretend he is. How would a midfield of Blind-Herrera fare in the PL? Besides I don't see Blind's passing as much better than Schneiderlin's, and certainly no where near Carrick's level at the moment.
 
Not complaining about this. At worst, he'll be a pretty decent Premier League player for us.
 
Hostekule said:
When is ever the perfect match available when you need it? You have to look at the players currently in the squad, and buy players to fit to that as well. Mata, Di Maria and Herrera will most likely figure in midfield for us next season, and we desperatly need a player that can offer a lot defensively, also in terms of strength. Luis Gustavo isn't PL proven.
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Listen, Van Gaal never fields a side where only one of the midfielders are defensively orientated. He requires two in order to achieve proper balance, so you'll never (or very rarely) see a combination of Mata - Herrera, Mata - Di Maria or Di Maria - Herrera in the central midfield.

We already have Herrera who is our best midfielder, and Rooney will probably play the majority of his games in the midfield next season if we buy a proper striker. Those two will be our regulars at CM, and we seriously need a good passing foot behind them. Therefore, Schneiderlin would be a disaster in terms of build-up play.
 
Pentame said:
:lol: at you failing to see how important Blind was for us in the first half of the season and another :lol: at you for failing to see that he got tired in the end of the season due to a very long world cup as well as other reasons.

And yes they are all better than Schneiderlin.
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Wow the good old World cup excuse, do you realise the World Cup was played in June/July? He has no excuse for being tired especially when he was injured for 2 months half way through the season too.

As for your "failing to see how important Blind was for us in the first half of the season" you must be having a laugh surely? We was absolutely awful during the 1st half of the season and spent a good chunk of it in mid table.

Scheiderlin made Blind look like a fpol at Old Trafford.
 
Hostekule said:
Ok, Blind is not better than Scheiderlin, but let's pretend he is. How would a midfield of Blind-Herrera fare in the PL? Besides I don't see Blind's passing as much better than Schneiderlin's, and certainly no where near Carrick's level at the moment.
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Oh my god. I never said I wanted us to replace Carrick with Blind. I said I'd prefer Blind over Schneiderlin.
 
Pentame said:
Listen, Van Gaal never fields a side where only one of the midfielders are defensively orientated. He requires two in order to achieve proper balance, so you'll never (or very rarely) see a combination of Mata - Herrera, Mata - Di Maria or Di Maria - Herrera in the central midfield.

We already have Herrera who is our best midfielder, and Rooney will probably play the majority of his games in the midfield next season if we buy a proper striker. Those two will be our regulars at CM, and we seriously need a good passing foot behind them. Therefore, Schneiderlin would be a disaster in terms of build-up play.
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That's not what I meant. Of course Mata will play the #10 role. Look I'm trying to have a positive outlook on things. Hopefully Rooney will not play in our midfield next season. In that case Mata will play #10 and Herrera will be paired with another CM. In that scenario I would be happy if we signed Schneiderlin. Just the thought of another season with Rooney in midfield makes me...
 
SonnyTheHaloPro said:
Wow the good old World cup excuse, do you realise the World Cup was played in June/July? He has no excuse for being tired especially when he was injured for 2 months half way through the season too.

As for your "failing to see how important Blind was for us in the first half of the season" you must be having a laugh surely? We was absolutely awful during the 1st half of the season and spent a good chunk of it in mid table.

Scheiderlin made Blind look like a fpol at Old Trafford.
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:lol: Are you a WUM? The fact that you don't rate Blind in the first half of the season is baffling. Are you serious? I have no words.

Van Gaal (or was it Blind?) said that Blind got tired and we could see it in the performances. I don't know why but I assume it is related to a long world cup. Hopefully he won't get tired in the end of the next season.
 
Hostekule said:
Ok, Blind is not better than Scheiderlin, but let's pretend he is. How would a midfield of Blind-Herrera fare in the PL? Besides I don't see Blind's passing as much better than Schneiderlin's, and certainly no where near Carrick's level at the moment.
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Blind is flat-footed and doesn't have an incredible passing range or the vision to compensate. A double negative, despite his generally good awareness. It would just increase the load on Herrera. Schneiderlin's passing is less secure, but he's got that extra spring, and the ability to turn much quicker.
 
Hostekule said:
That's not what I meant. Of course Mata will play the #10 role. Look I'm trying to have a positive outlook on things. Hopefully Rooney will not play in our midfield next season. In that case Mata will play #10 and Herrera will be paired with another CM. In that scenario I would be happy if we signed Schneiderlin.
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You know Rooney is our captain? You know Van Gaals captains are playing every game? We have two options, either to play Rooney as a striker, or to play Rooney as a #10 (in the Fellaini position in the midfield 3). If we are going to rely on Rooney as a striker scoring most of our goals, we'll not have a very good season.
 
Pentame said:
You know Rooney is our captain? You know Van Gaals captains are playing every game? We have two options, either to play Rooney as a striker, or to play Rooney as a #10 (in the Fellaini position in the midfield 3). If we are going to rely on Rooney scoring most of our goals, we'll not have a very good season.
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Forget about Rooney. You clearly don't rate Schneiderlin. Fine. The fact is we need a midfielder with his main strengths defensively. If we are lucky we can get a player that can offer a lot going both ways, until that player is available Schneiderlin is a very safe and smart option.
 
Herrera-Schneiderlin looks a potentially very good midfield pair for a 4-2-3-1:

---------Rooney--------
Memphis-Mata-DiMaria
-Herrera-Schneiderlin-

Likely too risky for Van Gaal, but I think we'd be tough to deal with once the players got comfortable.
 
There are too many people on here wanting us to sign Schneiderlin (@Hostekule @SonnyTheHaloPro ) so I have decided to bother making a long post on why he doesn't fit in at all.

Just to make a couple of things clear; Van Gaal requires two defensive orientated midfielders in his team in order to achieve balance, it is a known fact. Last season, we saw a trio of Carrick, Herrera and Fellaini functioning well. I assume Carrick and Fellaini were the two defensive orientated midfielders (although Fellaini played in a very advanced position, but his immense work rate compensated for it). He could switch Fellaini with Rooney because Rooney tracks back and works a lot defensively too. Herrera did a good defensive effort too, so it was balanced even though Rooney and Fellaini (at times) were only partially defensively orientated. The midfield was balanced.

What happened when Carrick got injuried? Our performances got a lot worse. Why? Because he brought the vital passing skills into the midfield trio. If we were to replace Carrick with Schneiderlin (something that will never happen), we need the creativity and passing skills from elsewhere. Herrera is arguably our best midfielder so he'll have one of the three spots. Some say that Mata or Di Maria or whoever will get the third spot so the trio will consist of Schneiderlin, Herrera and Mata/Di Maria. There are two problems with this trio. Firstly, it isn't balanced enough. There are only one and a half defensively orientated players. Secondly, it forces Rooney away from the midfield. Why is this a bad thing you ask? Because if we are going to rely on Rooney playing striker for the majority of the games next season, we are going to struggle. Why? Keep on reading.

Van Gaal had a conversation with Rooney before this season. He told Rooney how his strikers (mentioning Ivica Olic) used to only have 10-12 touches a game. Rooney was like woot? He then said that Olic used to score two goals a game. It was obviously an exaggeration, but he made it clear for Rooney how he wants his strikers to always roam around the oppositions centre backs, looking to make runs into space and not dropping deep. Rooney isn't a LVG-poacher at all. He needs to be involved and that's why it won't work out playing him as our regular striker next season. Notice that Rooney actually played as a LVG-poacher in his games as a striker earlier this season. He was barely involved and got a lot of (undeserved) stick here on the caf because of that. Him not being involved wasn't (or won't going to be) the problem. The problem is that he isn't as consistent in his goal scoring as he was in his earlier years (mainly because he has lost some acceleration in my opinion). We need a top class poacher like Lacazette.

Therefore, Rooney has to play as the advanced midfielder in the trio next season. He'll be partnered with Herrera. If we were to play Schneiderlin behind them, we'd struggle even more creating chances next season than we did this season.
 
Pentame said:
There are too many people on here wanting us to sign Schneiderlin (@Hostekule @SonnyTheHaloPro ) so I have decided to bother making a long post on why he doesn't fit in at all.

Just to make a couple of things clear; Van Gaal requires two defensive orientated midfielders in his team in order to achieve balance, it is a known fact. Last season, we saw a trio of Carrick, Herrera and Fellaini functioning well. I assume Carrick and Fellaini were the two defensive orientated midfielders (although Fellaini played in a very advanced position, but his immense work rate compensated for it). He could switch Fellaini with Rooney because Rooney tracks back and works a lot defensively too. Herrera did a good defensive effort too, so it was balanced even though Rooney and Fellaini (at times) were only partially defensively orientated. The midfield was balanced.

What happened when Carrick got injuried? Our performances got a lot worse. Why? Because he brought the vital passing skills into the midfield trio. If we were to replace Carrick with Schneiderlin (something that will never happen), we need the creativity and passing skills from elsewhere. Herrera is arguably our best midfielder so he'll have one of the three spots. Some say that Mata or Di Maria or whoever will get the third spot so the trio will consist of Schneiderlin, Herrera and Mata/Di Maria. There are two problems with this trio. Firstly, it isn't balanced enough. There are only one and a half defensively orientated players. Secondly, it forces Rooney away from the midfield. Why is this a bad thing you ask? Because if we are going to rely on Rooney playing striker for the majority of the games next season, we are going to struggle. Why? Keep on reading.

Van Gaal had a conversation with Rooney before this season. He told Rooney how his strikers (mentioning Ivica Olic) used to only have 10-12 touches a game. Rooney was like woot? He then said that Olic used to score two goals a game. It was obviously an exaggeration, but he made it clear for Rooney how he wants his strikers to always roam around the oppositions centre backs, looking to make runs into space and not dropping deep. Rooney isn't a LVG-poacher at all. He needs to be involved and that's why it won't work out playing him as our regular striker next season. Notice that Rooney actually played as a LVG-poacher in his games as a striker earlier this season. He was barely involved and got a lot of (undeserved) stick here on the caf because of that. Him not being involved wasn't (or won't going to be) the problem. The problem is that he isn't as consistent in his goal scoring as he was in his earlier years (mainly because he has lost some acceleration in my opinion). We need a top class poacher like Lacazette.

Therefore, Rooney has to play as the advanced midfielder in the trio next season. He'll be partnered with Herrera. If we were to play Schneiderlin behind them, we'd struggle even more creating chances next season than we did this season.
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Who says Schneiderlin is going to replace Carrick? He can easily take Fellaini's place, he is perfect for that role with his physicality and technical ability as well as his work rate. However if Carrick is injured again then I'm sure Scheiderlin can do a job in his absence in the number 6 role which he has done well in for Southampton before.

We need to midfielders anyway, and most people agree with that.

Also Herrera is not our best midfielder, Carrick is.
 
SonnyTheHaloPro said:
Who says Schneiderlin is going to replace Carrick? He can easily take Fellaini's place, he is perfect for that role with his physicality and technical ability as well as his work rate. However if Carrick is injured again then I'm sure Scheiderlin can do a job in his absence in the number 6 role which he has done well in for Southampton before.

We need to midfielders anyway, and most people agree with that.

Also Herrera is not our best midfielder, Carrick is.
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Are you daft? You want Schneiderlin to take Fellaini's place? First of all, Fellaini works out great there because he functions as a target-man binding a lot of players up, creating havoc, drawing attention, making space for other players (especially Young, I believe Young's great season is heavily related to him playing close to Fellaini). Now, how does Fellaini do this? He's 6ft4 and jumps like a kangaroo on stereoids. Also, he can score goals. Schneiderlin is no goal threat, nor does he bring anywhere near the same aerial threat as Fellaini.

Also, placing Schneiderlin in the Fellaini position (where I hope Rooney will play next season) forces Rooney out of the midfield up to the striker position. Please read my long post on why this isn't ideal at all.
 
Pentame said:
Are you daft? You want Schneiderlin to take Fellaini's place? First of all, Fellaini works out great there because he functions as a target-man binding a lot of players up, creating havoc, drawing attention, making space for other players (especially Young, I believe Young's great season is heavily related to him playing close to Fellaini). Now, how does Fellaini do this? He's 6ft4 and jumps like a kangaroo on stereoids. Also, he can score goals. Schneiderlin is no goal threat, nor does he bring anywhere near the same aerial threat as Fellaini.

Also, placing Schneiderlin in the Fellaini position (where I hope Rooney will play next season) forces Rooney out of the midfield up to the striker position. Please read my long post on why this isn't ideal at all.
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:lol: Ffs you're so clueless. You actually think Fellaini is a better option for us in midfield rather than Scheiderlin?

Nah hopefully LVG doesn't plan on doing that stupid long ball tactic to Fellaini ever again, considering every time the other team man marks Fellaini he becomes utterly useless and we are then playing with 10 men. We need more guys with technical ability like Herrera in the team not one trick pony's.

If we don't upgrade Fellaini then we are not getting anywhere near the title.
 
limerickcitykid said:
I'm not going to trust the opinion of anyone who thinks Blind, Illaramendi and Khedira are better than Schneiderlin.
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Maybe I went a bit too far, I needed to name many players to make a point.

Anyway, I think Illarramendi has a higher potential than Schneiderlin. I don't think he'll develop enough in RM though. Khedira is a better player than Schneiderlin in my opinion. I don't judge players based on one season like too many people do. Schneiderlin has only been very good in one season. Khedira has achieved a lot in his career and has proved himself for several clubs and his country for a long time now. That's why I think he's a "better" player although it hasn't been the case this season. It's the same reason why I think Rooney is a better player than Harry Kane.

Blind isn't a better player but I'd rather have him in the squad because of his versatility and the fact that he understands LVG's style and performs it well.
 
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