Mesut Özil

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RonaldoVII said:
I think the point is that if we want him, we'd buy him when he is able to play in the CL. What's the point in buying him after he has been cup tied?
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Because if we are buying him now - it's not for one season, it's for the long haul. That if we don't buy him before he becomes a free agent, there are teams like Madrid, City, Barca, Chelsea that may not do that great this season and then decide to make him really lucrative offers that we cannot match.

Our most important competition is the PL most would agree - he isn't going to be ineligible for that - so he can still contribute to that and the other cups and then once he is integrated properly, be a force for us in the CL the seasons after.

We more than likely will continue to play Scholes, Giggs, Park in a lot of the CL games - Ozil's chances of playing that many CL games won't be that high this season.
 
Longsden_7 said:
Cause he will be available for the knock outs? Not a bad thing not having him for the group stages.
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Unless completely mistaken - he will be CL tied for the whole competition. You don't get untied during knockout stages but, you can name other players to your squad of 25 when that phase starts.
 
RonaldoVII said:
I think the point is that if we want him, we'd buy him when he is able to play in the CL. What's the point in buying him after he has been cup tied?
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Cus he could be a top player for us for years due to his age and imense talent. I actually do think he is the missing piece we need.
 
The only issue I can see with being CL cup tied is if Werder qualify.

If he plays against Sampdoria and they lose, he loses nothing by moving and Werder get some money. If he plays and they qualify, by moving he forfeits his chance to play in the group stages and possibly beyond, this year. It all depends.

Like everything in this saga, it is impossible to predict what will happen.
 
Is it me or is this Ozil talk dying the death. I wish the club would make a clear statement once and for all that they have no interest in signing the player and bring an end to it, that is of course if that is the situation. SAF didnt clear it up well enough at the weekend
 
Longsden_7 said:
Well the squad selection starts again no? Surely the rules would apply to a cup tied transfer.
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You are allowed to name new players to your squad of 25 but, they can't be cup tied i.e. having played in any phase of the competition before.

A player having played in the CL group stages though can go and play in the Europa League.
 
Is Ozil really that good to be worth all the hype, I have my doubt?
 
Crerand Legend said:
Is it me or is this Ozil talk dying the death. I wish the club would make a clear statement once and for all that they have no interest in signing the player and bring an end to it, that is of course if that is the situation. SAF didnt clear it up well enough at the weekend
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For the fans benefit? For negotiation purposes, it doesn't serve the club in anyway.
 
Shimo said:
Unless completely mistaken - he will be CL tied for the whole competition. You don't get untied during knockout stages but, you can name other players to your squad of 25 when that phase starts.
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wr8_utd said:
Is that true that he'll be only cup tied for group stages?
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Didn't some player play for 2 clubs in the CL last season? Can't, for the life of me, remember who it was, or which clubs.
 
Shimo said:
For the fans benefit? For negotiation purposes, it doesn't serve the club in anyway.
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For everybodys benefit, in all seriousness and I could be wrong do you think that we are in negotiations at all. I personally very much doubt it
 
Shimo said:
You are allowed to name new players to your squad of 25 but, they can't be cup tied i.e. having played in any phase of the competition before.

A player having played in the CL group stages though can go and play in the Europa League.
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Cheers wasn't clear.
 
Can we sort this out and sign him today for my birthday? It'd be nice to get this thread over with and to see him come to United.
 
EricaNo7 said:
i have a horrible feeling this thread is going to end like benzema's last summer
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In that he signs for one for one of the big Spanish teams instead of us, and then we all get disappointed, and then turns out he was just one big flop anyways and we should be glad we never got him?


What's so horrible about that ;)
 
radd said:
Didn't some player play for 2 clubs in the CL last season? Can't, for the life of me, remember who it was, or which clubs.
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Not that I can remember. Even naming new players to the squad of 25 for knockout stages is limited. Remember when Real got Huntelaar, Diarra and someone else - they could only name 2 of them.

Am sure someone can dig up the actual verbiage (I may look for it in a bit myself) but, if Ozil plays next week against Sampdoria, he won't be able to play at any stage in the CL for any other club.

Maybe you are thinking of that a player can't play for more than 2 clubs in a single season. However, certain leagues (Russia) start their seasons at different times than most and as such a player coming from there then moving to 2 other clubs is permissible.

Edit: Just found a perfect example: Arshavin was cup tied for Arsenal having played in the group stages when he moved in January and couldn't play in the knockout stages for Arsenal.
 
Ok I may be wrong - not having seen some new rule changes as of May 24th. I just found this googling around

Champions League - UEFA relax rules on cup-tied players - Yahoo! Eurosport

UEFA has relaxed its rules on players appearing for two teams in one season in the Champions and Europa Leagues.

The executive committee has agreed that a player who appears for a club in any of the preliminary rounds of the Champions League or Europa League can play for another team in the competition proper, so long as his original team is eliminated in the preliminary competition.

"The rules have been relaxed regarding what the English call 'cup-tied' players, that is players who have already played for one team in a competition in a season," said UEFA general secretary Gianni Infantino.
"From next season, if a player's club is eliminated and he signs for a new club by the end of the summer transfer window on September 1 he can play for his new club in either competition.

"If he is not signed by the end of the summer window, he can move in the January window."

The one stipulation that remains is that clubs can add up to three new players in January, only one of whom will be eligible if they have previously played in the qualifying rounds.
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So by the new rules - if Ozil plays next week for Werder but, they don't make it to the group stages and we sign him by Sept 1st - he can still play for us.

Also sounds like if he plays in the group stages and comes in January - he can play for us in the knockout stages if Werder don't make the knockout stages.

These are new rules. Honestly hadn't heard about it but, it also sounds like a lot of people haven't realized because a lot of the stories talk about the CL game next week being key.

Edit:

This is the rule how it was before. Huntelaar or Lass could play for Real in the knockout stages but, only 1 of them could be used as both and played in Europa League. Neither could have been registered if they had played in the same competition. Real could still register 2 new players for the 25 but, neither of those could have played in any European competition. This rule still applies with the above rule change.


FIFA.com - Real to choose between cup-tied pair

Real Madrid must choose between new signings Klaas-Jan Huntelaar and Lassana Diarra to play in the knock-out stages of the UEFA Champions League, UEFA spokesman William Gaillard said on Spanish radio.

"I am very sorry, but the rules are what they are and they cannot be changed in the middle of a season," he said on Onda Cero radio. "That means that only one of the two players can play in the Champions League. They can include either Huntelaar or Diarra."

The Spanish champions, plagued by injuries and poor form this season, signed Dutch striker Huntelaar and French midfielder Diarra this month from Ajax and English side Portsmouth respectively. But under UEFA rules only one of them can play in the Champions League as both have have already represented their former clubs in Europe this season.

Real had hoped to convince European football's governing body to agree to a different interpretation of the rule so that both players could take part.

The club has been drawn against Liverpool in the Champions League first knockout round on 25 February and 10 March. The club, who are fifth in the Spanish title race some 12 points adrift of Barcelona, have suffered season-ending injuries to key players Dutch striker Ruud van Nistelrooy and Malian midfielder Mahamadou Diarra.

UEFA rules for the 2008-09 season state that a club may register up to three new players for the knockout stage of the Champions League. But only one of these can be a player who has represented his former club in Europe, and provided it was in another European competition. Both Ajax and Portsmouth were competing in the UEFA Cup this season.
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Ferguson said:
With regard to the Cleverley vs. Ozil debate:

1. Why not both? They are players who can play in the hole or on the wings, so why not play them together?

2. Let's look at the stats, and before the usual replies with the old chestnut about "Stats don't tell you everything" - at least stats represent something more substantive than naked opinions based on subjective impressions. I wonder how many of us have actually watched either Watford, Werder Bremen or Schalke's matches.

Ozil has produced 12 assists in each of the last two seasons for his club, while improving his goal tally to 9 after moving into the hole last season.

Cleverley scored 11 goals and had 5 assists while with Watford last season.

Nani and Valencia combined produced 13 assists in the Premier League last season. Giggs led United with 9 assists.

We all rave about Valencia's crosses and Nani's improvement. We are astonished at Giggs' production, but when it comes to Ozil who has consistently delivered 12 assists a season can we seriously say he's not worth going for?

The comparison with Cleverley is a fair one because Cleverley is 20 and Ozil is 21. There is only one year difference between the two, but one player has starred in the World Cup and in the Champions League, the other for Watford and against the MLS All-Stars. As to which is better football the Bundesliga or the Championship, I'll leave that for you to decide for yourself. Personally I think the German top flight edges it.

Both Cleverley and Ozil have a brilliant future, both could play together, and both offer different strengths.

When Cristiano was still with United, Giggs played more often at CM. With Ronaldo's departure Giggs has popped up on the wing again. I actually think that if Ozil comes to United we'll see him used on the wings with Giggs in an attacking midfield role. Ozil has that special quality of having a cultured left foot - something which United will lack when Giggs can no longer do it in three or four years. Ozil should be thought of more as a long-term replacement for Giggs, than a replacement for Scholes IMO.

United should have three top-class wingers for any season. In Nani, Valencia, Giggs and Park we would seem to have more than enough. Do we need Ozil? No. But if he is available then I think his quality and his ability to fill any spot from the wing to AM to a support striker combine to make him worth going for.
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I would agree with you 100% - if it's hypothetically only Cleverley and Ozil to compete for that AMC spot. But, I would really, really like to see Obertan on that position, behind striker(s), on some occasions.
 
So if he plays for Werder and they get knocked out, he has even more reason to move as he could play in the CL at another club.
 
Untied said:
So if he plays for Werder and they get knocked out, he has even more reason to move as he could play in the CL at another club.
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It seems so yes per the new rules. It also might make Werder more likely to sell as they won't get any money out of playing in CL and selling him would mean they can at least fund a replacement.
 
Stojan Stamenic said:
I would agree with you 100% - if it's hypothetically only Cleverley and Ozil to compete for that AMC spot. But, I would really, really like to see Obertan on that position, behind striker(s), on some occasions.
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Obertan's finishing is a bit weak. I think he has more chance of making it as a winger then as an AMC.
 
We might not sign anyone else but Chicharito is well worth it. What a signing. Goal against Spain now :D
 
Now Iniesta is talking about Ozil....

La Liga - Iniesta 'didn't know' Ozil before World Cup - Yahoo! Eurosport

Andres Iniesta has said he would welcome Mesut Ozil at the Nou Camp despite admitting he had never heard of the Werder Bremen man before the World Cup.

Ozil, who starred for Germany at the World Cup, has been strongly linked with a move to Barcelona after his performances in South Africa.

Iniesta, who scored the winning goal for Spain in the final against Netherlands, admits he was impressed by what he saw of the 21-year-old Ozil at the tournament.

"I did not know him before the World Cup," admitted the diminutive Barca midfielder.

"However, I watched him playing at the World Cup and was very impressed with his quality and personality especially as he is so young.

"If he comes to the club or not is an issue that is out of my control but if he does arrive, we will welcome him, and if not we will roll forward regardless."

Iniesta also said he wished Cesc Fabregas "all the luck in the world" despite his good friend's decision to stay at Arsenal.
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This is only going to go one way!!!
 
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