Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance

[Bebestation]

What I love most about Ronaldo is his mindset.

It's a different level. He is a God amongst men due to just how he thinks.

People here are crying about players like Rashford's, Shaw's or Maguire's mindset - it just proves to me that Ronaldo's mindset is important yet unique. I've not seen anything like it in football and how it directly effects a players ability, physical growth and even things like adaptability and success.

Technique is a beautiful aspect of football; almost like a beautiful woman it's very eye catching.

But I always feel like if you had the choice of picking your wife - do you pick the most beautiful woman in the world? Or do you pick a slightly less beautiful woman that is still stunning too but has the mindset to grow and adapt to any problem of yours at any time or anywhere and come out clean and successfully?

I guess there is 2 types of a man and what they would prefer to pick in someone - pure beauty vs less beauty + mindset.

It's probably why Messi vs Ronaldo won't ever get sorted.
Unless if Ronaldo goes to PSG

 

[RedRonaldo]

Yeah, definitely, goal scoring records have generated the same amount of attention as Ballon D'or)). as if posting news outlet links is proves a point showing football world cares.. A simple of injury of a famous player or an interesting event in his private life will generate higher coverage.. I can post much higher number of links, what does that prove? You are acting as if football world cares about this more than Ballon D'ors, Golden Shoes etc. which is ridiculous.. Nobody cares, go back and check the previous Ballon D'or threads only on this forum to see what football fans care about most when it comes to awards not to mention Ballon D'or being the ultimate dream award for every single player even Ronaldo himself. I have no idea what exactly you are trying to prove here, all people see here is you creating an artificial narrow category to fit your narrative while excluding the records in top awards in the football world, playmaking etc. Nobody buys that (probably not even you), not even great Eusebio. You're probably from Portugal..

As I have mentioned before:

"I know, you know, everybody knows here that had Ronaldo had the lead in Ballon D'ors, Golden Shoes as the record holder, had he won WC MVP awards, you would be the first one emphasizing those and create categories for each of those for Ronaldo.. Imagine Ronaldo having lead in those and Messi only on "total goals scored" playing tons of more games, and I am sure you will design the records category the same way.. Imagine Ronaldo being a GOAT level playmaker like Maradona, Messi, Cruyff, I am sure you will exclude a category with the focus on playmaking as you are doing now.."

The fact that nobody mentions Messi breaking Pele's record with Messi fans paying almost zero attention while "some" Ronaldo fans are trying to hype up goal scoring records playing hundred more games stadpadding against minnows more than anyone else by far in football history shows the level of their desperation.

In the previous era, there were no lithuanias, latvias, armenias, kazakhstans etc., defenses could get away with murder, there were much less number of minnows therefore much less games. It was much harder to qualify for ECs, WCs due to number of team limitations.

Let me create my own categories as below:

Talent: Messi, Pele, Maradona
Playmaking: Messi, Maradona
Goalscoring: Messi, Pele, Ronaldo
Ballon D'ors: Messi, Pele
International Tournament Best Player: Messi, Pele, Maradona
No of trophies: Messi

Do you have any objection?

I never said the world cares more about his scoring records more than Ballon D’ors or Golden Shoes. In fact, I value them all the same, as they are all historically significance records/recognition, as I’ve already mentioned my very first post.

What I am saying is, those other records you have mentioned, such as “most playmaker awards”, “most league top scorer awards”, “most mvp” etc aren’t as significance as those major ones I have mentioned, as they don’t generate anywhere near the same worldwide attention at all. Hence shouldn’t be compared under the same weight.

And to be honest, I am not here to argue who is the best player. I always think Messi is the best footballer I’ve seen and is more talented player. But what I am saying is, if we comparing the achievements of both players, and the greatness of both players, Ronaldo will always have a claim to be greatest (or one of greatest), due to his unmatched success in CL (highest level of football) and all the major records and individual honours he has held.

And I do somewhat agree with your criteria, but I would also add a few more to bring more perspectives (and choosing best 3 from each category), for what I think is more related to “best/greatest” in football.

Talent: Maradona, Messi, Pele
Playmaking: Maradona, Messi, Cruyff
Goalscoring: Ronaldo, Pele, Messi
Big game impact: Ronaldo, Pele, Maradona
Ballon D'ors/individual honours: Messi, Pele, Ronaldo
Trophies success: Pele, Ronaldo, Messi
Records: Ronaldo, Messi, Pele
Legacy: Pele, Maradona, Ronaldo
Peak: Maradona, Messi, L.Ronaldo
Consistency/longevity: Ronaldo, Messi, Di Stefano

Well I am happy to argue from above, if you disagree.

 

[Gehrman]

Yeah, definitely, goal scoring records have generated the same amount of attention as Ballon D'or)). as if posting news outlet links is proves a point showing football world cares.. A simple of injury of a famous player or an interesting event in his private life will generate higher coverage.. I can post much higher number of links, what does that prove? You are acting as if football world cares about this more than Ballon D'ors, Golden Shoes etc. which is ridiculous.. Nobody cares, go back and check the previous Ballon D'or threads only on this forum to see what football fans care about most when it comes to awards not to mention Ballon D'or being the ultimate dream award for every single player even Ronaldo himself. I have no idea what exactly you are trying to prove here, all people see here is you creating an artificial narrow category to fit your narrative while excluding the records in top awards in the football world, playmaking etc. Nobody buys that (probably not even you), not even great Eusebio. You're probably another Ronaldo fan from Portugal..

As I have mentioned before:

"I know, you know, everybody knows here that had Ronaldo had the lead in Ballon D'ors, Golden Shoes as the record holder, had he won WC MVP awards, you would be the first one emphasizing those and create categories for each of those for Ronaldo.. Imagine Ronaldo having lead in those and Messi only on "total goals scored" playing tons of more games, and I am sure you will design the records category the same way.. Imagine Ronaldo being a GOAT level playmaker like Maradona, Messi, Cruyff, I am sure you will exclude a category with the focus on playmaking as you are doing now.."

The fact that nobody mentions Messi breaking Pele's record with Messi fans paying almost zero attention while "some" Ronaldo fans are trying to hype up goal scoring records playing hundred more games stadpadding against minnows more than anyone else by far in football history shows the level of their desperation.

In the previous era, there were no lithuanias, latvias, armenias, kazakhstans etc., defenses could get away with murder, there were much less number of minnows therefore much less games. It was much harder to qualify for ECs, WCs due to number of team limitations.

Let me create my own categories as below:

Talent: Messi, Pele, Maradona
Playmaking: Messi, Maradona
Goalscoring: Messi, Pele, Ronaldo
Ballon D'ors: Messi, Pele
International Tournament Best Player: Messi, Pele, Maradona
No of trophies: Messi

let me know if you have any objection..

Pele didn't win any ballon d'ors.

 

[Cal?]

Yes, imagine Schilacci, Forlan, Donnarumma winning those carrying their teams, and Ronaldo not in 9 EC+WC tournaments, that's how weak he is in international tournaments

correction, that's Muller's record against WC winning nations, 7 goals in 13 games vs Ronaldo 7 goals (including 3 penalties) in 30 games, the ultimate statpadder with 48 goals in 28 games against minnows.. Eusebio had 10 in 16 games against those major teams..

Other than the fact many players who won the MVP awards failed to win any MVP awards and Ronaldo in fact was topscorer when his nation won the Euro.
Those MVP awards are more often awarded to players who failed to win than anyone who actually won the competition.

How convenient to stat pick "WC winning nations", conveniently excluding the likes of Belgium & Netherlands who Ronaldo has a great record against, do you seriously want to argue these 2 are weaker sides than Uruguay?

 

[Cal?]

That Eusebio scored 2 more goals playing 11 less games in WC exposing Ronaldo's well known "secret" that his per game goal ratio is weak especially against major rivals, that he has to play tons more games to have a similar number of goals and that newly emerged European minnows in 90s are his savior

Read below again the quotes by Eusebio..

"The comparisons make me sad. It's easier now. I never played against Liechtenstein and Azerbaijan".
"It's wrong. There is no comparison. I scored my 41 goals in 60 games. It's easier now because you play more games against weak teams."

https://www.marca.com/2013/09/11/en/football/international_football/1378917585.html

That would almost make sense if the European topscorer wasn't held by a player back from the post-war era for decades until Ronaldo.

By your logic there should be many many European names near the top of international goalscoring charts due to the new minnows, but the closest anyone has come to Ronaldo in the modern era is over 40 goals behind him.

 

[Cal?]

The gap between Eusebio and Ronaldo as footballing talents isn't as big as the gap between Messi and Klose. So it is a silly analogy reply.

Just pointing out the ridiculousness of using WC goals alone as the bar.

 

[Bebestation]

Argentina have won the Copa America 15 Times. Messi being the GOAT only won that once for his team, a team outside of his Spain National team.

Portugal only won the Euro Cup and any major trophy once. Ronaldo was involved in that one international trophy win.

Some Argentina fans don't even rate him that much compared to the players they have seen play for Argentina; whilst this cannot be copied on to Ronaldo’s career as a Portugal national team player.

Another team outside of Barcelona where Ronaldo ousted Messi.

 

[Gehrman]

Argentina have won the Copa America 15 Times. Messi being the GOAT only won that once for his team, a team outside of his Spain National team.

Portugal only won the Euro Cup and any major trophy once. Ronaldo was involved in that one international trophy win.

Some Argentina fans don't even rate him that much compared to the players they have seen play for Argentina; whilst this cannot be copied on to Ronaldo’s career as a Portugal national team player.

Another team outside of Barcelona where Ronaldo ousted Messi.

I don't remember expectations of Ronaldo carrying Portugal to a world cup. Messi is compared to Maradonna while Ronaldo at the end of the day isn't really being compared to Figo or at best Eusobio.

 

[Pretzels81]

Pele didn't win any ballon d'ors.

Yes, he did, several times: check out the "international reevaluation".

 

[Gehrman]

Yes, he did, several times: check out the "international reevaluation".

No it's what he would have won if it included non Europeans. He didn't win any.

 

[RedRonaldo]

Yes, he did, several times: check out the "international reevaluation".

Those are not Ballon D’ors, but rather a reevaluation of awards to include those non-eligible players before 1995. Still worth a mention though, but reevaluation itself isn’t really official Ballon D’ors awards, it is only a retrospective recognition of players worthy of winning the awards before 1995.

 

[genardk]

Other than the fact many players who won the MVP awards failed to win any MVP awards and Ronaldo in fact was topscorer when his nation won the Euro.
Those MVP awards are more often awarded to players who failed to win than anyone who actually won the competition.

How convenient to stat pick "WC winning nations", conveniently excluding the likes of Belgium & Netherlands who Ronaldo has a great record against, do you seriously want to argue these 2 are weaker sides than Uruguay?

Yeah, that's exactly why Ronaldo did not win any best player awards.. as if he won all tournaments he joined and therefore was not given any MVP award
4 EC+5 WC, 8 times elimination, yet zero award

 

[Bebestation]

Wonder if Lewandowski gets reevaluation in to Balon D'or like Pele did.

 

[RacingClub]

I don't remember expectations of Ronaldo carrying Portugal to a world cup. Messi is compared to Maradonna while Ronaldo at the end of the day isn't really being compared to Figo or at best Eusobio.

Exactly.

Plus if you pay attention to Argentine international football it's been obvious that Messi has finally been forgiven for "Not being Maradona" and is getting the appreciation for his talent on the way out the door.

 

[genardk]

That would almost make sense if the European topscorer wasn't held by a player back from the post-war era for decades until Ronaldo.

By your logic there should be many many European names near the top of international goalscoring charts due to the new minnows, but the closest anyone has come to Ronaldo in the modern era is over 40 goals behind him.

Even Lukaku has a better goal ratio than him.. did you check the number of games Ronaldo played and how many he played against minnows?

The guy played 124 more games than Muller, 100 more than Puskas, 84 more than Lukaku.. imagine thinking Ronaldo could break this record playing the same number of games as these guys that's why no one cares..

Also Ronaldo has played 25 games against those, no one comes close, ultimate stat padding machine..

 

[youmeletsfly]

Even Lukaku has a better goal ratio than him.. did you check the number of games Ronaldo played and how many he played against minnows?

The guy played 124 more games than Muller, 100 more than Puskas, 84 more than Lukaku.. imagine thinking Ronaldo could break this record playing the same number of games as these guys that's why no one cares..

Also Ronaldo has played 25 games against those, no one comes close, ultimate stat padding machine..

I don't care about Messi and Ronaldo, I just couldn't give a single feck on who's the "better player".
I just want to mention that, in order to compare who's "better", you need to have them playing in the same exact scenario, otherwise it's square pegs in round holes.

Also, did you just try to use an imaginary argument above? =))

 

[Cal?]

Yeah, that's exactly why Ronaldo did not win any best player awards.. as if he won all tournaments he joined and therefore was not given any MVP award
4 EC+5 WC, 8 times elimination, yet zero award

MVP awards being taken seriously only by the Messi brigade.

 

[Cal?]

Even Lukaku has a better goal ratio than him.. did you check the number of games Ronaldo played and how many he played against minnows?

The guy played 124 more games than Muller, 100 more than Puskas, 84 more than Lukaku.. imagine thinking Ronaldo could break this record playing the same number of games as these guys that's why no one cares..

Also Ronaldo has played 25 games against those, no one comes close, ultimate stat padding machine..

Some guy called Nando Có has the best international goal ratio of 9 goals in 6 matches for Guinea-Bissau.

Also talking about goal ratio, Messi has the worst ratio out of anyone in the top 20.

 

[GinobiliTheGOAT]

Ronaldo wasn’t very good today but bizarre that “penaldo” is trending on Twitter after the match

 

[Rojow]

Once again his team carried him. But hey, he just do all by himself.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Once again his team carried him. But hey, he just do all by himself.

Hmm… I could’ve sworn I saw him assist the opener.

 

[GinobiliTheGOAT]

Hmm… I could’ve sworn I saw him assist the opener.

honestly, he was the worst of the forwards but he’s 37, it is what it is

 

[Pocho]

honestly, he was the worst of the forwards but he’s 37, it is what it is

he is done. Great goalscorer in his time though.

 

[MrEleson]

Once again his team carried him. But hey, he just do all by himself.

Once again? Think about what you just wrote. I’m assuming it was a joke.

 

[Gehrman]

Some guy called Nando Có has the best international goal ratio of 9 goals in 6 matches for Guinea-Bissau.

Also talking about goal ratio, Messi has the worst ratio out of anyone in the top 20.

He's also not a striker unlike most on that list.

 

[Bebestation]

Payet's Ligue 1 stats are so much better than Messi's whilst being older than him too and playing for Marseille

 

[Green_Red]

"I think every player bar Lionel Messi is jealous of Cristiano.” - Wayne Rooney

Shots fired!

 

[Rojow]

That's just reality. In factos, Ronaldo is jealous of Messi. It is known.

 

[RedRonaldo]

That's just reality. In factos, Ronaldo is jealous of Messi. It is known.

Well its clear Ronaldo is jealous of Messi 7 Ballon D'ors. But I think Messi is also jealous of Ronaldo's success in CL, given that he has openly talked it few times in the past, and his team hasn't been progressing well in this competitions for so many years.

 

[GinobiliTheGOAT]

Ronaldo has been absolutely shocking this season. He's old now, but for the highest paid player in EPL history this was a huge mistake by United getting caught up with nostalgia. Money should have been spent elsewhere. I don't think he'll be playing CL football for anyone next season.

But it's also sad to see, because he's had a wonderful career but even his confidence looks so shot.

 

[GinobiliTheGOAT]

Lionel Messi is the first Ligue 1 player to provide three assists in two different games in the same season since Opta analysed the competition (2006/07)

@Bebestation

He's been doing much better lately

 

[Rojow]

But, but, but.. he didn't score so he must be bad.

 

[DaGOAT]

Well its clear Ronaldo is jealous of Messi 7 Ballon D'ors. But I think Messi is also jealous of Ronaldo's success in CL, given that he has openly talked it few times in the past, and his team hasn't been progressing well in this competitions for so many years.

Messi has both more Ballon D’Ors AND more European Golden Shoes. Both which Ronaldo yearns for but will never match or surpass. That’s gotta sting.

Messi is okay with having one less CL title, considering he has more league titles than Ronaldo of which many in won directly vs Ronaldo’s Madrid.

 

[RedRonaldo]

Messi has both more Ballon D’Ors AND more European Golden Shoes. Both which Ronaldo yearns for but will never match or surpass. That’s gotta sting.

Messi is okay with having one less CL title, considering he has more league titles than Ronaldo of which many in won directly vs Ronaldo’s Madrid.

Having 2 less actually, unless you also count the one with him sitting on the bench as nobody throughout all the knockout stage for months watching Ronaldinho & Co winning it, in the same way Jordi Cruyff won 99 CL for us from the bench for majority of tournament.

 

[The holy trinity 68]

Having 2 less actually, unless you also count the one with him sitting on the bench as nobody throughout all the knockout stage for months watching Ronaldinho & Co winning it, in the same way Jordi Cruyff won 99 CL for us from the bench for majority of tournament.

He played 4 of the 6 group games, then the 2 Chelsea games in the 2nd round, he actually was not even on the bench from the quarter final onwards because he was injured. It is not exactly his fault he missed them games.

 

[RedRonaldo]

He played 4 of the 6 group games, then the 2 Chelsea games in the 2nd round, he actually was not even on the bench from the quarter final onwards because he was injured. It is not exactly his fault he missed them games.

That’s true, but not exactly his credits either on winning CL over that season, as his main involvement is during group stage and the only goal he scored is in meaningless 5-0 win against Panathinaikos over the whole tournament.

 

[GinobiliTheGOAT]

Wow, so much for Messi being finished. His finishing is off this season but his playmaking is still good:

https://i.redd.it/olquqzxt1xs81.jpg

 

[Gehrman]

Wow, so much for Messi being finished. His finishing is off this season but his playmaking is still good:

https://i.redd.it/olquqzxt1xs81.jpg

It's all he does now. Walks around pinging passes. He's an advanced pirlo.

 

[Pocho]

It's all he does now. Walks around pinging passes. He's an advanced pirlo.

i'd take him over Ronaldo everyday.

 

[Reapersoul20]

anyone posting in this thread rn is misled as a football fan