Having City, Chelsea and Liverpool in your leagues top.5 does make it harder than other leagues. Basically three of the best (if not the best) teams in Europe
(just a comment…)
Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance
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(just a comment…)
bayern are better than all those teams.
Is that why Messi scored 27 goals against the (classic) top 6, in only UCL? Thats 1 goal less than CR while not having played in the EPL. Pretty crazy.
Not sure what you’re trying to say or what the point is. Something about the Champions League? (I was talking about domestic league opponents… and this year)
It is also stupid to conveniently forget about head to head just because CR7 got owned there. Sorry mate.
The truth is, he has won the most CL, but every time he faced Messi in a high stake game, he loses and get outperformed(and not only in a goal scoring sense). Hence it is not that “undisputed” as what CR7 acolytes wanted it to be. He is also not that “clutch” as the CR7 50cents army paint him to be. Because if he was that clutch, then I will not be able to make that H2H argument that you lot conveniently want to ignore
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Oh, Muller is definitely the clutch, Pele too.
Those guys also clutched big time in the World Cup, unlike the “undisputed” most dominant CL player who always disappeared against his main rival, the “king of clutch” and “titan of mental strength” who did jack in World Cups.
I have no idea about the rest of your post because it doesn't concern me. I've said what I had to say. No point in repeating myself about the pertinence of H2H between 2 players in a team's game. It will never make sense to me.
is this even a debate anymore?
Hows Ronaldo supposed to score against the top 5 when Ole was playing park the bus football and Ronaldo had no service
Beat me to it
It is incredible though, before him the record was three. Seven is insane. The fact that the general feeling towards him winning seven is indifference, says alot. Its like "'meh' lewandowski was robbed"
Nice one gotta admit
I'm in Ronaldo camp, but I like having some perspective with me all the time. I always thought 4 to 1 was very harsh on Ronnie, not that Messi didn't deserve those 4, but by that time in 2012 I was a sad dude sometimes because I loved his passion, hardwork, and thought he was gonna end up completely forgotten/erased by Messi, and felt he deserved a bit more recognition. Of course, I also back then put him at the same level as Messi on footballing terms, or very close, and didn't like people seemingly mocked him all the time like he didn't play incredibly well.As it stands, they're 7 to 5, and it's a much more fair assessment of both, and they have both cemented their place in history, and Ronnie has gotten all the love he wasn't getting 10 years ago, so as a Ronaldo fan, can't say this bothers me one bit. They have both deserved every bit of recognition they have gotten, and props to Messi for thr 7th.
I do feel a bit for Lewa though.
That will probably seal it as who is remembered as the better player. No one will look back and say so and so was robbed, it’ll just come down to statistics of 7 v 5. Both goats though, don’t care what side people lean on. We should just appreciate how brilliant they’ve been. We may not see it ever again.
Both Goats. Like Messi more, but that's me.
Ronaldo’s biggest mistake in this debate was leaving Real Madrid. His career choices from 2018 have been questionable to say the least. If he doesn’t leave the summer of that year, he very likely wins the 2018 BDOR. He was clear front runner and bookies favourite up until the autumn when the Modric campaign really began to gain traction.
He probably would have gone on to have strong seasons with Madrid and possibly added another CL title.
Instead, he laboured playing with mediocre Juventus teams and now with us where he’ll likely not win anything or go very far in the CL to put him in the conversation again even if he somewhat maintains his numbers.
He probably would have gone on to have strong seasons with Madrid and possibly added another CL title.
Instead, he laboured playing with mediocre Juventus teams and now with us where he’ll likely not win anything or go very far in the CL to put him in the conversation again even if he somewhat maintains his numbers.
Messi has more moments that stick in the memory. In 20 years, nobody will be googling videos of Ronaldos stats.
You're right they'll be watching his match winning goals in big games instead...
Not many people will be googling Messi's stats either I'd imagine.
That's not to say your opinion of Messi having 'more moments' is wrong; just lazy to disregard Ronaldo like that, and that's fundamentally why I hate this debate.
Still the worst thread on this board.
The F1 thread is a surprisingly fierce rival I noticed since taking a passing interest in the sport.
Spoken like a true fanboy
It’s soooo weird people can’t just be you know, like the above.
I’m unsure currently, I’ve gone back and to over their careers. Both absolutely mindblowingly incredible.
It's true, feck Homer! Or Horton, or w/e that red bull guy's name is.
I think by end of their career, in terms of individual achievements, Messi would end up winning more Ballon D’ors and individual awards, and Ronaldo would end up scoring more goals and having more all time records.
Major individual achievements:
Messi
- most Ballon D’ors
- most career assists
- most Golden shoe
- most goals in single season
Ronaldo
- most career goals
- most CL goals
- most international goals
- most Euro goals
I think those are the majors ones where people would be talking for years to come.
Major individual achievements:
Messi
- most Ballon D’ors
- most career assists
- most Golden shoe
- most goals in single season
Ronaldo
- most career goals
- most CL goals
- most international goals
- most Euro goals
I think those are the majors ones where people would be talking for years to come.
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So odd to see a Fiorentina fan that obviously ties Messi's status in the game to his own personal success to such an extent. He doesn't even play for your club ffs and never has. The level of obsession is so weird. Also...50centnt army? And 'owned'? You post like a 14 year old with ADHD.
It is odd to see someone getting attacked personally because they hold some different opinion than you.
I think Xavi and Iniesta deserve at least one Ballon d'Or each. They won everything with Barca, and then proceeded to win Euro and World Cup with Spain (no Messi there). Obviously at the those years, Messi won less than them. I mean they dominated the midfield like no others before; zero Ballon d'Or between those two is... criminal.
So in my opinion, Messi deserves like 5 Ballon d'Or, but not 7.
So in my opinion, Messi deserves like 5 Ballon d'Or, but not 7.
That's not the reason I'm having a go...I just get tired of the way that particular poster posts. It's the relentless '50centsarmy' nonsense and a total lack of willingness to engage in reasoned debate. It's posters like this that are the reason this thread is such a toxic mess.
O
Once again, 0 counter arguments from your camp except personal insults.
There are similar type of posters in the cr7 camp, dont see you getting that tired of them.
I'm not in a camp, mate. I like Ronnie because he plays for us but I've said time and again that I see the two on a par and think that it's a case of preference. Interesting to see you and Lord Sinister tag teaming that post though...
Not sure any of them post nonsense like 50centsarmy. And I have to say, yes, to me the CR7 'side' seems more open to reasonable debate and less rabid in their opinions. But I agree that whichever side of the fence you fall, to have a preference over an individual player that's that strong is odd.
So you find the cr7 side more reasonable and less rabid although you have posters like Cal?
Actually it is simple, you have a personal issue with my style of posting and/or you just agree more with the cr7 fanboys. However, you also resorted to insults which says a lot about yourself.
That is fine, put me on ignore, I dont care.
Buddy, take a look at your post history. It's just pages and pages of Ronaldo Vs Messi posts, interspersed with a few posts in the Ronaldo thread. Come on, you have to say that's a little weird for someone that doesn't even support PSG or Barca?
Seems so ridiculous to me to give Messi the Ballon Dor this year. He’s a shadow of the player he used to be.
And it matter to you because I like to come into this topic? Who are you to tell me what to do, what I should discuss on and how I should post? Some shining light of virtue that you think you are?
Buddy, you bought nothing to my argument except for insults, and you still pretend to be some saint?
Since you are not doing us both a favor by blocking me, I will block you instead then. It is tiresome to waste my time, post count and energy to read and reply to some pretentious shining beacon of virtue.
Ok mate!!
Just tells how good he is. Even though he is a shadow of the player he used to be he still produced the much he did just like CR7. People used to berate him for not winning any international tournament despite coming close few times but when he now does it, people now berate the international tournament they were requesting him to win. Let’s put bias away for a moment please.
I think it’s more about Messi having some “underwhelming periods” over the year, vs Lewandowski who has been excellent throughout.
I personally don’t find this as big issue though. It’s just the way it is, which happens couple of times before - such as Modric in 18, who has been excellent in WC but abit average elsewhere. It’s always more about who has the best narrative of the year, rather than overall excellence and consistency throughout, to win these awards.
Not for me, it might tell how good he was, but this current version is nowhere near the best player in the world. He barely moves. It’s not about winning the Copa America for me as it’s a team sport….but it’s being the best individual in that team sport and my eyes tell me he’s miles from that now.
As a Messi fan I agree. There is no merit whatsoever in not being dynamic in terms of making yourself available or doing a bit of closing down. I wonder whether he will speed up or keep on like this.
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