While he was managing CR7, yes. No bias at all there.
Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance
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He doesn’t have an answer for why no neutral expert has ever claimed ronaldo as the best ever.
It's called having an opinion. Also the so called experts can never be unbiased.
Ronaldo played for Manchester United and Real Madrid, 2 of the best supported clubs in the world yet at the same time 2 of the most hated.
There are more ABU/anti-RM people in the world than anti-Barca people.
He changed his answer after they fell out, surprise surprise...
God yes, I’m all for revising my opinion when new reasons to present themself. And if he were to win it another twice even, youd probably get a lot more people coming out and proclaiming him as the best ever. People that actually matter, that is.
Again, people that actually matter voted Ronaldo ahead of Messi more times than the other way round.
Care to explain how Messi is better if 'people that matter' prefer Ronaldo more often?
Do you not see the distinction between judging a player on a season and making a decision, versus judging a player over their whole career and making a decision?
Rooney voted ronaldo 1st place for a ballon d’or yet calls messi the best ever. It doesn’t work like that mate.
So now we're just haggling with the number of awards. I say 5-6, you say 15 Ballon's for the GOAT.
I don’t understand the response
That works if you have a player who had 1 or 2 seasons of form but doesn't play at that level ever again.
However, for more than a decade, Ronaldo and Messi has completely dominated the football world and Ronaldo has come out on top according to your favored "experts" on more occasions.
As I've been saying all along, footballers and managers say whatever they feel like and their so called opinions are not really set in stone.
Voting however, leaves a record that can never be changed.
Anyway, until later...
Their opinions mean more than ours, and they don’t say ronaldo is the best ever because he’s not in anyone’s eyes.
You said that 5 Ballon is not enough as a prove for GOAT. Then I asked, how about another 10? And you agreed.
So we're here just haggling over numbers then, as you agreed that individual award does count toward being GOAT. Isn't it?
This discussion will never end because we are comparing 2 totally different players with the added factor that i suspect a lot of people who post here only judge Cristiano by how he plays today and not how he developed during his carrer.
I’m not sure if this is a good example. But if you and I play scrabble 12 times, and you win 7 and I win 5, but my 5 wins I scored 2000 points and in your 7 you scored 1600 who would the better player be?
The ballon d’or usually goes to the player who’s team win the most important stuff. But it’s also based on a season. I obviously can’t be certain, but I’m pretty confident that if everyone who has ever cast a vote for ronaldo as number 1 for a ballon d’or had to cast a vote for best ever player, then at least 71.2% would opt for Messi.
Also,I would say that the level of football messi played during his 4 years in a row winning the award was so far ahead of anything ronaldo has done. If you prefer the style of football that ronaldo has deployed the last 3 seasons to that 08-12 period in messis career, then you just have a completely different view of what’s beautiful about football than the vast majority of people. Which is cool. Weird, but cool.
Voting for Ronaldo in the Ballon d'Or isn't the same as thinking he is better than Messi. It generally goes to whoever's team has been better that season. There's way too many variables in play to make it as simplistic as that.
I mean, you just need to look at the amount of votes Buffon got at the last Ballon d'Or awards to see that a) it doesn't say all that much and b) that such votes don't necessarily mean they think that player is the best.
Or maybe you're right and Gareth Southgate thinks Modric and Kroos are better than Messi, Chris Coleman thinks the 3 best players in the world are Sergio Ramos, Luka Modric and Harry Kane, Gordon Strachan thinks Modric, Kante and Messi are the best and Michael O'Neill thinks Hazard and Kante are better than Messi.
Either there's something in the water in Britain or Ballon d'Or votes are a totally useless way of gauging who is better.
Edit: I can't be bothered to check but I'd be stunned if either of these guys won the Ballon d'Or in a season where the other's team won the CL. I would suspect not.
Was Cannavaro the best player in the world in 2006?
Back come the Messi brigade who are so sure of themselves.
I'm sorry but are you being serious here or is that supposed to be a joke? I honestly can't tell.
Antonio Rattin - Argentina nt in the world cup 1966 - said Pele was better than Maradona.
I think is not absurd to claim Messi is the best in the history but i dont think he is. The goat needs to prove himself in the World Cup. People will say the Champions League is the highest level of football these days, but the fact is, when you play for Barca or Madrid you know you will be in the Champions in the next year. The level of pressure and the drama in the World Cup is much more intense. There is no such thing as the best ever if your country is always one of the favorites and you never win it.
If in 20 years i see the kids saying that CR7 is the best player ever i will not try prove them wrong because i dont think he needs to win the World Cup with Portugal; but Messi needs to lead Argentina to a wc tittle or he should never be mentioned ahead of Maradona and Pele.
Combined goals against Top 6 opponents in la liga (Barcelona, Real, Atletico, Valencia, Sevilla, Bilbao and Villareal) Chose the bolded teams because they are the only team in la liga who when the big two visit their away ground, theres a legitimate chance of an upset. (On average over the course of both their careers)
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Combined goals against any european opponent who would be considered a big club. Consistently in Europe, does well in their league and has some historical sense of success about them.
Messi- 184 goals total versus the 6 top La liga teams and Arsenal, AC Milan, Manchester City, Bayern Munich, PSG, Chelsea, Roma, Man Utd, Juventus.
Ronaldo- 169 goals versus the top 6 la liga teams and Spurs, Bayern Munich, Juventus, Dortmund, Arsenal, Roma, Man City, PSG, Liverpool, Man Utd, Ac Milan, Chelsea, Inter Milan (includes goals from ronaldo's time in PL)
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Combined goals against any european opponent who would be considered a big club. Consistently in Europe, does well in their league and has some historical sense of success about them.
Messi- 184 goals total versus the 6 top La liga teams and Arsenal, AC Milan, Manchester City, Bayern Munich, PSG, Chelsea, Roma, Man Utd, Juventus.
Ronaldo- 169 goals versus the top 6 la liga teams and Spurs, Bayern Munich, Juventus, Dortmund, Arsenal, Roma, Man City, PSG, Liverpool, Man Utd, Ac Milan, Chelsea, Inter Milan (includes goals from ronaldo's time in PL)
So, if I didn’t watch Jimi Hendrix live (an eternal regret but I was a few years late), I can’t rate him as one of the greatest virtuoso musicians of all time, even though every other brilliant musician (as well as millions of others) at the time said the same?
Can those arguing this with regards Pele, Di Stefano, Bobby Charlton, Garrincha, Eusebio, Cruyff et al see the slight flaw in their novel interpretation of an ‘objective assessment’? No? As Peter Green sang...
Don’t worry, these are rhetorical questions; some keep believing Stevie Ray Vaughan is the man...*
By the way, before I have the Lone Star state after my blood, I love SRV (he always acknowledged Jimi was god, but I’ve had some interesting debates with some of his fanatics over the years!). Don’t forget there are many ways to play the guitar brilliantly and here’s another that’s massively underrated, although I’m sure he won a few Ballon d’ors (apologies):
Can those arguing this with regards Pele, Di Stefano, Bobby Charlton, Garrincha, Eusebio, Cruyff et al see the slight flaw in their novel interpretation of an ‘objective assessment’? No? As Peter Green sang...
Don’t worry, these are rhetorical questions; some keep believing Stevie Ray Vaughan is the man...*
By the way, before I have the Lone Star state after my blood, I love SRV (he always acknowledged Jimi was god, but I’ve had some interesting debates with some of his fanatics over the years!). Don’t forget there are many ways to play the guitar brilliantly and here’s another that’s massively underrated, although I’m sure he won a few Ballon d’ors (apologies):
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No, he’s had a better season arguably, but they’re even on ballon d’ors.
90% of the experts thought ronaldo had the better season yet not ONE of them would say ronaldo is the greatest of all time.
If you pulled them all today and say who is better all time Messi would win in a landslide like he is in this poll
Time to close that poll, you guys want to win your argument so be it.
This is a hard thing to quantify.
I think all the candidates have a few things in common;
Lots of goals
Lots of trophies (team and individuak)
The best player on their club and national team for an extended period
Once you establish that, it comes down to feeling for me. I’ve seen Zidane, both Ronaldo’s, Kaka, Ronaldinho all live and to my eyes, they don’t compare to seeing what messi does on the field. It’s not even close in that respect for me and it’s what I base my decision off. I’ve met Cristiano Ronaldo (well, shook his hand at Barcelona airport after an el Classico) and as an absolute die hard United fan who was In his late teens and had several ronaldo 7 shirts, it wouldn’t even be hard for me to be biased and say I’ve shook the hand of the greatest to ever do it and have the pleasure of watching him play. He just doesn’t encapsulate the magic of everything that makes this sport so special the way messi does.
You are expressing what you feel based on your emotions, for example with 34 years old I saw Zinedine Zidane doing to Brazil in a WC what Messi never did in his prime, but I am not even going to say nothing more about this because its impossible to say who is the best ever.
This is the jersey from the locker room that he didn’t wear. I paid good $ for it. That was a 10/10 performance of which Zidane had many and Messi has had many, and will have many more.
I can fully see messi replicating that Zidane performance in 2022 against a big name
This is the jersey from the locker room that he didn’t wear. I paid good $ for it. That was a 10/10 performance of which Zidane had many and Messi has had many, and will have many more.
I can fully see messi replicating that Zidane performance in 2022 against a big name
Fantastic shirt - keep it safe!!
And let’s hope there’s more efforts to concentrate on the subjective joys all these artists have brought to us over the years, even if your favourite isn’t the same as mine...
In the WC in his prime Messi never replicated that kind of performance Zidane had, for Barcelona maybe, but sometimes people tend to forget some incredible performances Zidane had for Real Madrid or even Juventus, so I have to say sorry to everyone here I don't agree Messi or Cristiano can be labeled the best ever.Now if Messi pulls something similar this Summer we can comeback to this kind of discussion.
Now if Messi pulls something similar this Summer we can comeback to this kind of discussion.
Yeah but the issue with some of this is someone like James Rodriguez has had a better World Cup than Messi ever has. You Have to draw the line somewhere.
This is the jersey from the locker room that he didn’t wear. I paid good $ for it. That was a 10/10 performance of which Zidane had many and Messi has had many, and will have many more.
I can fully see messi replicating that Zidane performance in 2022 against a big name
Wow that is quite the incredible piece! Very jealous of that
@SCP
Also, Zidane won the ballon d’or in 2002, and was probably at his peak in the early 2000s, yet France at the World Cup in 2002 didn’t score a single goal and recorded 1 point.
Also, Zidane won the ballon d’or in 2002, and was probably at his peak in the early 2000s, yet France at the World Cup in 2002 didn’t score a single goal and recorded 1 point.
Wow that is quite the incredible piece! Very jealous of that
I’ve worn it to play in
Maybe in 40 years if I still have it I will be able to sell it for more than I paid for it!
Small difference Zidane did it with 34, already had scored 2 goals in the WC final vs the same Brazil in 98, scored a goal only a small number of genius could score in the Champions League final vs Leverkusen in 2002.
There is a World and a entire football Ocean between James and Zidane, they don't live on the same football planet.
Now if Messi pulls something similar this Summer we can comeback to this kind of discussion.
Are you suggesting that Zidane is better than Messi?
The only thing Zidane is better at is absolutely pointless skill when the opponent is 10 yards away from him.
Iniesta is better.
@Arbitrium Zidane was injured in 2002 he only played his last match for France and he even wasn't fit, judge him for what he did vs Leverkusen in the final, not the WC.
I had forgotten about Him being injured. Apologies.
The insecurity of Messi lovers is so much that when someone mentions Zidane they start shaking and sweating just with the small sin of anyone trying to say Zidane is better than Messi.
I like more Zidane than Messi yes, not saying he is better, just feel he was more elegant than him @Pink Moon
I like more Zidane than Messi yes, not saying he is better, just feel he was more elegant than him @Pink Moon
Why do the pro Ronaldo guys keep saying ‘Messi Lovers’ and ‘Cult’ etc? Kinda undermines all of your arguments tbh
Not you, but someone here with Pink thoughts dares to suggest Iniesta is better than Zidane I have to go ballistic on them.Has anyone actually done this?
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