Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance

[Deleted member 101472]

You choose

Well the one about me seeing him live then referencing the poll as a determining factor.

The first relates to MY opinion and when I made the comment I specifically asked if anyone else had seen them both live. My opinions based on that were my own, and for me a much clearer way that I could see the gap between the players.

But I’m not one to say that that’s the only way people should be able to decide once and for all whos better, that’s BS. I referenced the poll because when it’s a wide margin of victory for one party, it’s usually a clear indication as to who’s the best. That’s the whole point of them, to find a winner. In almost every poll concerning the two messi has a clear enough margin of victory that you just hold your hands up and say he’s the winner. Doesn’t need to change who you like more.

 

[Deleted member 101472]

Ronaldo did exist before 2015 you know.

I know. I was at Old Trafford for his debut.

 

[Peyroteo]

Well the one about me seeing him live then referencing the poll as a determining factor.

The first relates to MY opinion and when I made the comment I specifically asked if anyone else had seen them both live. My opinions based on that were my own, and for me a much clearer way that I could see the gap between the players.

But I’m not one to say that that’s the only way people should be able to decide once and for all whos better, that’s BS. I referenced the poll because when it’s a wide margin of victory for one party, it’s usually a clear indication as to who’s the best. That’s the whole point of them, to find a winner. In almost every poll concerning the two messi has a clear enough margin of victory that you just hold your hands up and say he’s the winner. Doesn’t need to change who you like more.

Fair enough on the watching them live part, I've been watching football for 20 years live and I've never rated players any differently after watching them on the stadium than through my TV but if you do then it's fine. As for the poll, no, that's not how polls work. This one's unbalanced but most aren't. A 60-40 split is nothing especially when one is Cristiano Ronaldo and the other is Lionel Messi. How often has the caf been wrong about players? How often has the caf or football fans in general been wrong about Cristiano Ronaldo? Just choose a random page and see it for yourself. Just because I'm in the minority doesn't mean I'm wrong.

 

[Deleted member 101472]

Fair enough on the watching them live part, I've been watching football for 20 years live and I've never rated players any differently after watching them on the stadium than through my TV but if you do then it's fine. As for the poll, no, that's not how polls work. This one's unbalanced but most aren't. A 60-40 split is nothing especially when one is Cristiano Ronaldo and the other is Lionel Messi. How often has the caf been wrong about players? How often has the caf or football fans in general been wrong about Cristiano Ronaldo? Just choose a random page and see it for yourself. Just because I'm in the minority doesn't mean I'm wrong.

It absolutely means that you’re less likely to be right.

 

[Peyroteo]

It absolutely means that you’re less likely to be right.

With this place's track record on judging football players I wouldn't be so sure about that

 

[Moonred]

What an inane and obtuse poster. Bloody hell. The poll was supposed to make things easy.

 

[Deleted member 101472]

With this place's record on judging football players I wouldn't be so sure about that

I’m surprised that you don’t see the difference between seeing a player live and on tv. It’s night and day for me. There are so many times I’ve seen a player do something on the pitch that you just don’t recognize watching on tv. For me it’s an incredibly better and much more educational experience.

 

[Peyroteo]

What an inane and obtuse poster. Bloody hell. The poll was supposed to make things easy.

Sorry to disagree with the majority and giving my opinion on a football forum. If you disagree with me, you can argue with me and we'll talk about football.

It's getting tiring to answer to these sorts of posts just attacking me instead of what I'm saying. If you don't like my posts, there's an ignore function and you won't have to see them. Everyone knew what the results on the poll would be before the poll even started, so why would it have made things easier?

 

[Deleted member 101472]

Sorry to disagree with the majority and giving my opinion on a football forum. If you disagree with me, you can argue with me and we'll talk about football.

It's getting tiring to answer to these sorts of posts just attacking me instead of what I'm saying. If you don't like my posts, there's an ignore function and you won't have to see them. Everyone knew what the results on the poll would be before the poll even started, so why would it have made things easier?

EXACTLY

 

[Daysleeper]

@Peyroteo there is nothing wrong with your posts, keep going what you’re doing my man

 

[Moonred]

Sorry to disagree with the majority and giving my opinion on a football forum. If you disagree with me, you can argue with me and we'll talk about football.

It's getting tiring to answer to these sorts of posts just attacking me instead of what I'm saying. If you don't like my posts, there's an ignore function and you won't have to see them. Everyone knew what the results on the poll would be before the poll even started, so why would it have made things easier?

It should have made it easier for you. Your arguments aren’t breathtaking new found knowledge that is going to change the opinions of people who are capable themselves to form an opinion by watching these said footballer for years. This isn’t a close contest between two obscure talents. This is arguably two of the best ever footballers. There is nothing new to learn from your posts. It’s an incessant effort to justify something which is not. You are free to favour whoever you want to. For every one of you, there are three others who thinks the opposite. There is a chance that Ronaldo becomes a more successful footballer stats wise but he won’t for the majority be a better one.

 

[SCP]

I think everyone should respect the fact @Peyroteo genuinely believing Cristiano is better than Messi, for instance I know Messi is better but I like more Cristiano, as in the past I knew Maradona was the best but I liked more Laudrup, I don't have to like Messi to see what he is but I can like more Cristiano even if he doesn't have the same amount of atributes Messi has imo.

 

[Ishdalar]

Messi is the player who can get the ball and improve the level of everyone around him... what the actual feck happens in Argentina then? Or do those magical powers only apply to players in a Barcelona shirt? If you think Messi has that power, shouldn't he be blamed when his teammates play like crap then?

You say that when Messi doesn't score or he doesn't assist, he's the focal point of the team but that's only true sometimes. What happened last year? He was average both against PSG and against Juve so you pretending that's always true... doesn't make it true. He's had plenty of big moments in the Champions League, Ronaldo's had plenty of big moments in the Champions League, they've both gone missing a few times. One just does it way less often than the other in the big CL games which is why one assists, scores and performs way more often than the other at that stage of the competition.

If you can't even grasp how some people consider Ronaldo the better CL player of the two then I really don't know what to say and I'm sure there is nothing I can say to convince you otherwise. We must be watching different sports.

Well, now resort to "superpower" analogies and point at specific games where Messi wasn't on fire, like Ronaldo did something in the finals vs Atleti amongst a bunch of other games where his team bailed him, as Barcelona has bailed Messi, that's only normal.

Bolded, for someone that has repeated a lot "is not just about output", you just keep bringing that, while not mentioning any Ronaldo moment where he single-handedly won a leg beyond an ok play or just positional awareness, just "he does it more often", yeah.

We're watching the same sport, I watch every 90 minutes of it, from Goalkeepers to Strikers, and talk about all of that, you talk about numbers and "feats", disregarding everything behind that. I can understand how some people could consider Ronaldo as the best UCL player ever due to stats right now, but you're defending him beyond that without anything to prove otherwise.

And if you don't know what happens when Leo puts on the Albiceleste, as I said to you days ago on his thread you might want to start watching that team, you're the one who said they were a solid defensive team, not 2 games went by since your post and they took a 6-1 spanking in one of the worst defensive performances at international level lately. Or like when you said that Neymar scores for fun in South America compared to Messi, when he scored 3 official goals against South American teams from 2010 to 2016, and still ended behind Messi in the WC qualifier.

You just have an agenda to bring down Messi as much as you can while looking "reasonable", throwing any argument you come by just to see if any of them sticks. I cant' convince anyone of something they don't want to believe, I'd rather play in the kick-my-nuts World Cup. I'm just defending the other side from your attacks, and having a little fun talking about something I enjoy.

 

[Peyroteo]

It should have made it easier for you. Your arguments aren’t breathtaking new found knowledge that is going to change the opinions of people who are capable themselves to form an opinion by watching these said footballer for years. This isn’t a close contest between two obscure talents. This is arguably two of the best ever footballers. There is nothing new to learn from your posts. It’s an incessant effort to justify something which is not. You are free to favour whoever you want to. For every one of you, there are three others who thinks the opposite. There is a chance that Ronaldo becomes a more successful footballer stats wise but he won’t for the majority be a better one.

No, it's me disagreeing with you. Treating your opinion as a fact does not make it true. For every one of me there aren't 3 that think the opposite, that's true for this place, not in general. Is everyone who thinks Brexit was the wrong decision an inate and obtuse poster too then? They were in the minority, therefore they can't argue against it? Are only the people agreeing with the majority allowed to give their opinions?

If you disagree with my points then either ignore me or argue them, don't tell me I shouldn't think the way I do because I'm in the minority, that's just crap.

 

[Deleted member 101472]

Jesus stop using the brexit argument. It’s a little easier to tell the difference between footballing ability and the impacts of a decision to leave the European Union FFS

 

[Skills]

Messi's been the best ever since 2012. At that point Ronaldo wasn't even in the same discussion, but since them Ronaldo on the back of his entire career is an all-time 3-5 player. All in my opinion of course.

 

[Ishdalar]

I think everyone should respect the fact @Peyroteo genuinely believing Cristiano is better than Messi, for instance I know Messi is better but I like more Cristiano, as in the past I knew Maradona was the best but I liked more Laudrup, I don't have to like Messi to see what he is but I can like more Cristiano even if he doesn't have the same amount of atributes Messi has imo.

I can totally get your point, this may sound as a sacrilege, but even as a Barcelona fan I always enjoyed more watching Guti play than Xavi, just a question of style, same could be said about some of the current generations (Marcelo over Alba and Modric over Rakitic are another examples)

However, I couldn't defend Guti as a superior player, and certainly (even more obvious being Barcelona my favourite team) I'd never downplay Xavi's achievements to put both players in the same bracket to say "Man, maybe is just a point of view question", "what if Guti played with Messi in Pep's Barça", "Guti was a superior goalscorer, he had that edge". Kind of the things that bother me and make me start arguing back in this debate.

 

[SirAF]

Messi's been the best ever since 2012. At that point Ronaldo wasn't even in the same discussion, but since them Ronaldo on the back of his entire career is an all-time 3-5 player. All in my opinion of course.

Since 2012 Ronaldo is 4-1 in Ballon d'Ors.

Ugh, why did I go in here again.

Edit:

Whatever happened to Snake Piss? He was very active in this thread some years ago.

 

[SCP]

I can totally get your point, this may sound as a sacrilege, but even as a Barcelona fan I always enjoyed more watching Guti play than Xavi, just a question of style, same could be said about some of the current generations (Marcelo over Alba and Modric over Rakitic are another examples)

However, I couldn't defend Guti as a superior player, and certainly (even more obvious being Barcelona my favourite team) I'd never downplay Xavi's achievements to put both players in the same bracket to say "Man, maybe is just a point of view question", "what if Guti played with Messi in Pep's Barça", "Guti was a superior goalscorer, he had that edge". Kind of the things that bother me and make me start arguing back in this debate.

Tbf I don't think Peyroteo argues Messi is the better footballer from the 2, I hope

 

[Moonred]

No, it's me disagreeing with you. Treating your opinion as a fact does not make it true. For every one of me there aren't 3 that think the opposite, that's true for this place, not in general. Is everyone who thinks Brexit was the wrong decision an inate and obtuse poster too then? They were in the minority, therefore they can't argue against it? Are only the people agreeing with the majority allowed to give their opinions?

If you disagree with my points then either ignore me or argue them, don't tell me I shouldn't think the way I do because I'm in the minority, that's just crap.

Who asked you to not think the way you want to? Go on. Keep making everyone laugh. I was only saying for your own sake. Comparing it to Brexit. Another attempt at latching onto something on a different paradigm and drawing a stupid parallel. Argue as much as you want, people will keep calling out bullshit as they see fit. Or you can make a little clique of your own and feel good about it. Good luck. And you are not in some debatable minority, it’s a landslide.

 

[Peyroteo]

Well, now resort to "superpower" analogies and point at specific games where Messi wasn't on fire, like Ronaldo did something in the finals vs Atleti amongst a bunch of other games where his team bailed him, as Barcelona has bailed Messi, that's only normal.

No, not an analogy. You didn't answer my question. You said Messi has the ability of making everyone around him better, I'm geniunely asking if that ability doesn't translate to international football, shouldn't he be blamed for his teammates performances then? Or does that ability of influencing everyone around him only work when they're playing well?

Bolded, for someone that has repeated a lot "is not just about output", you just keep bringing that, while not mentioning any Ronaldo moment where he single-handedly won a leg beyond an ok play or just positional awareness, just "he does it more often", yeah.

It is not just about output but output matters. Obviously.

Just an ok play and positional awareness Just. If other players could do those ok plays more often, then they might have won more than they did. Is winning a CL tie by scoring the Puskas a good enough example or was that an ok play too?

We're watching the same sport, I watch every 90 minutes of it, from Goalkeepers to Strikers, and talk about all of that, you talk about numbers and "feats", disregarding everything behind that.

No, I absolutely don't. Again, you pretending I do something does not mean I did that thing. You keep doing that, pretending I said something and then arguing against it. They're forwards, their impact on goals is by far the most important thing about what they do and it is what has separated them from any other player in this generation. Therefore goals and assists are very important, despite not being everything. Ronaldo scoring and assisting a lot more often than Messi in the big CL games is a big point in his favour when you're arguing who the better CL player is. That is what I said, now can you stop pretending I said something different?

You just have an agenda to bring down Messi as much as you can while looking "reasonable", throwing any argument you come by just to see if any of them sticks.

My argument's been the very same since forever and it has nothing to do with these two, that's how I judge every other player too.

Champions League and international football are a lot more important than league football, so you judge their performances accordingly to the competition they're in. That's literally my argument, a few years ago Messi was above Ronaldo for me too, now he isn't, if he goes on to dominate tje CL and the WC he'll be there again.

 

[PuyolC]

No, it's me disagreeing with you. Treating your opinion as a fact does not make it true. For every one of me there aren't 3 that think the opposite, that's true for this place, not in general. Is everyone who thinks Brexit was the wrong decision an inate and obtuse poster too then? They were in the minority, therefore they can't argue against it? Are only the people agreeing with the majority allowed to give their opinions?

If you disagree with my points then either ignore me or argue them, don't tell me I shouldn't think the way I do because I'm in the minority, that's just crap.

Maybe if you tried to respect other people's opinions instead of just saying "everyone who thinks Messi is better is wrong, the arguments don't make any sense" I'm sure people would respect you much more.

You keep repeating that for you it's fine if other people think that Messi is better but everytime they present their arguments you just keep saying that they're wrong, that the "Messi scores the same but creates more" argument doesn't make any sense and that everyone should consider Ronaldo the better footballer because he outperformed Messi in CL and internationally.

 

[Peyroteo]

Maybe if you tried to respect other people's opinions instead of just saying "everyone who thinks Messi is better is wrong, the arguments don't make any sense" I'm sure people would respect you much more.

You keep repeating that for you it's fine if other people think that Messi is better but everytime they present their arguments you just keep saying that they're wrong, that the "Messi scores the same but creates more" argument doesn't make any sense and that everyone should consider Ronaldo the better footballer because he outperformed Messi in CL and internationally.

It's the fourth time you make this exact comment. Yes, I say that they're wrong because I believe they're wrong. What's the fecking problem?

Their argument makes absolutely no sense, I'm pointing it out. I have no problem if someone thinks Messi is better because I believe it to be very close, if it's a disagreement on how people view their performances on the pitch that's one thing. If their argument makes absolutely no sense, then that's another.

The majority keeps saying Messi's the better player because they score about the same and Messi creates more which is an argument that makes absolutely no sense if you understand how the different competitions in this sport work.

 

[Henrik Larsson]

Don't know what you guys are on about, but Maldini is the best player of the last 30 years. Not Messi, and definitely not Cristiano.

 

[PuyolC]

It's the fourth time you make this exact comment. Yes, I say that they're wrong because I believe they're wrong. What's the fecking problem?

Their argument makes absolutely no sense, I'm pointing it out. I have no problem if someone thinks Messi is better because I believe it to be very close, if it's a disagreement on how people view their performances on the pitch that's one thing. If their argument makes absolutely no sense, then that's another.

The majority keeps saying Messi's the better player because they score about the same and Messi creates more which is an argument that makes absolutely no sense if you understand how the different competitions in this sport work.

So why people should consider Messi to be the better player if the argument "Messi score about the same but creates much more" for you is rubbish?

You just can't repeat it's fine if people think Messi is better and then just say that this argument doesn't make any sense.

 

[thelittlestelf]

Its funny listening to a certain person on this thread, not okay when you disagree with his opinion even when he states it is. Becoming a bit of a laughing stock now. With Cal you can have a debate and while he may not agree he still respects that. This user however decides his opinion is final

 

[Pink Moon]

The majority keeps saying Messi's the better player because they score about the same and Messi creates more which is an argument that makes absolutely no sense if you understand how the different competitions in this sport work.

So they both score an insane amount of goals and one is clearly a better footballer than the other (even you admitted that) yet saying that makes him better than the other one is nonsense?

I think Messi is the better player because I have eyes. Deep down I think you know it too but simply prefer Ronaldo.

 

[Peyroteo]

So they both score an insane amount of goals and one is clearly a better footballer than the other (even you admitted that) yet saying that makes him better than the other one is nonsense?

What? Where the hell did I say that?

I think Messi is the better player because I have eyes. Deep down I think you know it too but simply prefer Ronaldo.

I think Ronaldo's better because I have eyes and a brain. Deep down I think you know it too but simply prefer Messi. I mean.. come on.

 

[Deleted member 101472]

Do you actually have mind powers to know that everyone is laughing at me or are you that upset about my opinion you're trying to make me feel bad about having it?




No, it's absolutely the exact same thing. You're telling me I'm wrong and shouldn't say my opinion because I'm in the minority. Which is a stupid thing to say.



0.5 million people vote. 60-40... that's a landslide alright. People can disagree with me, you haven't.

Right mate enoughs enough. There’s not much to be gained from participating in this thread for anyone, but for you it’s clearly at an all time low. Stop bringing such sadness into your life and move on. I hope if you argue this way in real life someone properly pulls you up on it and clips you around the ear.

 

[Peyroteo]

So why people should consider Messi to be the better player if the argument "Messi score about the same but creates much more" for you is rubbish?

You just can't repeat it's fine if people think Messi is better and then just say that this argument doesn't make any sense.

If they think Messi's better because he's performed better taking into account the importance of the different competitions they've played in then that's fine.

If they think Ronaldo's the better CL player, they've done about the same internationally, Messi's been better in the league and they think it's not even close... then they're thinking about it the wrong way.

 

[SCP]

@Peyroteo keep calm, if you don't accept their version then they will not listen to your arguments. Its just that simple, this is only a football thread Christ, even Dona Dolores would laugh with these arguments

 

[Cal?]

Imagine for an instance the scenario that PSG won the CL with Cavani scoring that many goals being the player thsr he ist - would anybody have thought he was the best in the world or even the best player of his team before Neymar? No because he simply contributes nothing besides his goals.

Suarez did score more than Messi that one season, did anyone make that argument? It was clear that Messi was the KEY player for Barca even when Suarez scored more.

However, with Cristiano, you know, he's absolutely KEY to how Real play, earlier this season, he doesn't perform, Real doesn't perform; this calendar year, he finds his form, Real find their form.

 

[Cal?]

True indeed. Another interesting tidbit (doesn’t move the needle either way). We are often told by Cristiano fans is that one of his advantages over Messi is his long shots. Facts: Messi has 98 goals outside the box, compared to Cristianos 99 goals in 901. Messi is indeed better at long shots outside the box.

Long shots, not from 18-20 yards.

 

[Cal?]

I just... don't get where this idea that Ronaldo has done better overall than Messi in their UCL career, sorry but I can't grasp it.

Like some others had said, even when he doesn't score, or when he loses, he's the focal point of the team. He's been clutch for his team at least as many times as Ronaldo for Real Madrid/United, and as you've been saying, is not just about output, he's left some of the most iconic plays in the last decade of the competition, like his leg deciding moments in SF vs Bayern and Real Madrid all by himself, the goal vs Arsenal, his performance in 2011 final vs United, the comeback vs Milan or him saving the leg vs PSG in 2013, coming in at 61', injured, and taking over the game.

Ronaldo also wins games, but he can't take them over with that "ok, give me the ball, I'm bossing this one" and improve the level of evertyone playing around him, that's something only a midfielder/10 can do, not usually a winger, and definitely not a scoring-focused winger.

Seriously, if you're going to talk UCL alone, Ronaldo wins by quite some margin.

Bolded part = not true, where was he against PSG both times last season? It was Neymar and the ref who mastered the 6-1 comeback. Where was he against Juve?

His deciding moment against RM all by himself? You mean the game where the ref decided when he sent off Pepe for NOT TOUCHING Alves?

 

[VorZakone]

@Peyroteo , what is your main argument for why you think Ronaldo is better?

 

[Cal?]

Fair enough on the watching them live part, I've been watching football for 20 years live and I've never rated players any differently after watching them on the stadium than through my TV but if you do then it's fine. As for the poll, no, that's not how polls work. This one's unbalanced but most aren't. A 60-40 split is nothing especially when one is Cristiano Ronaldo and the other is Lionel Messi. How often has the caf been wrong about players? How often has the caf or football fans in general been wrong about Cristiano Ronaldo? Just choose a random page and see it for yourself. Just because I'm in the minority doesn't mean I'm wrong.

Funny how absolutely spot on I was in that random page.

 

[Deleted member 101472]

I remember an article where Thiago Silva, undoubtedly one of the best defenders of the messi Ronaldo era, said it’s much harder to defend against messi. I’ll always value the opinions of neutral opponents. I remember a poll of 9 people working with the telegraph/ITV and it finished 6-3 to messi. The votes were

Ferdinand-Ronaldo
Hargreaves-Ronaldo
Owen- ronaldo

Two former teammates and a dud.

Then you had 5 players and 1 pundit who had never played with either all pick messi. Says a lot.

And then this From Javier Chica, of Barcelona’s closest geographical rival,Espanyol

“Leo Messi is more complete than Cristiano Ronaldo and harder to stop. He is harder to stop because it is not just about him. Ronaldo is a more individual player who looks to go one-on-one against you and that makes him predictable, up to a point. Messi is different: he looks to run at you, or play the one-two, or simply keep the move going. He is harder to second-guess. And if he does go at you, the combination of speed and control is astonishing. Ronaldo runs at you and plays very physically. Messi will avoid the contact if he can; he will evade you. There are players who pick up more fouls than Messi, like Ronaldo, but that is not because no one tries to foul Messi; it is because their characteristics invite fouls more. You can't foul Messi! Two touches and he's gone. Better is to try to make sure that he only receives the ball with his back to goal and unable to turn; if he turns and faces you, if he can see all his options clearly, he is very dangerous. Messi can employ any option that presents itself to him … and if not, invent something totally new. He is different from all the rest.”

I just wish they’d get on with asking the other 18 La Liga clubs to get every one of their players to vote who is better, and settle this debate once and for all.

 

[SCP]

I remember an article where Thiago Silva, undoubtedly one of the best defenders of the messi Ronaldo era, said it’s much harder to defend against messi. I’ll always value the opinions of neutral opponents. I remember a poll of 9 people working with the telegraph/ITV and it finished 6-3 to messi. The votes were

Ferdinand-messi
Hargreaves-messi
Owen- messi

Two former teammates and a dud.

Then you had 5 players and 1 pundit who had never played with either all pick messi. Says a lot.

And then this From Javier Chica, of Barcelona’s closest geographical rival,Espanyol

“Leo Messi is more complete than Cristiano Ronaldo and harder to stop. He is harder to stop because it is not just about him. Ronaldo is a more individual player who looks to go one-on-one against you and that makes him predictable, up to a point. Messi is different: he looks to run at you, or play the one-two, or simply keep the move going. He is harder to second-guess. And if he does go at you, the combination of speed and control is astonishing. Ronaldo runs at you and plays very physically. Messi will avoid the contact if he can; he will evade you. There are players who pick up more fouls than Messi, like Ronaldo, but that is not because no one tries to foul Messi; it is because their characteristics invite fouls more. You can't foul Messi! Two touches and he's gone. Better is to try to make sure that he only receives the ball with his back to goal and unable to turn; if he turns and faces you, if he can see all his options clearly, he is very dangerous. Messi can employ any option that presents itself to him … and if not, invent something totally new. He is different from all the rest.”

I just wish they’d get on with asking the other 18 La Liga clubs to get every one of their players to vote who is better, and settle this debate once and for all.

Ant then a few weeks later Thiago Silva played against Ronaldo and what happened?

 

[Peyroteo]

@Peyroteo , what is your main argument for why you think Ronaldo is better?

I think despite Messi consistently being better, Champions League and international football are by far the two main stages which matter most in a footballer's career and I think Ronaldo's done better there. I think this is true for any player by the way, not just Ronaldo and Messi. I love Ibra for example but there are a lot of strikers I'd put above him from this generation for the same reasons.

In terms of atributes Ibra would be the perfect striker, strong, tall, mobile, creative, great finisher, everything but I'd take 'less talented' footballers above him because they've performed better in the biggest stages.

Right mate enoughs enough. There’s not much to be gained from participating in this thread for anyone, but for you it’s clearly at an all time low. Stop bringing such sadness into your life and move on. I hope if you argue this way in real life someone properly pulls you up on it and clips you around the ear.

That was literally what you did but ok. You're right, it's fun to discuss this subject and talk about football but when those comments are personal they just piss me off and I shouldn't have replied and derail the thread so sorry about that.

 

[Deleted member 101472]

@Cal? Says

“Cristiano Ronaldo (11-14), 166 goals for Real Madrid during those 3 seasons, Ballon d'Or 13 & 14, La Liga in 12 and finally La Decima in 2014, possibly the greatest player ever.
Messi (08-11), Ballon d'Or in all 3 years, winning everything with Barca, also possibly the greatest player ever.”

Form your participation in a draft, I remembered clocking it at the time. So if you could, please in detail explain why messi is also possibly the greatest player ever