He is, but he hasn't been clutch in any CL final he was involved in, unlike Messi who was best player in pretty much every final he's been involved in. Ronaldo was very quiet in every CL final Real Madrid won, and he's missed a penalty for us in CL final. So I am not sure how that goes against Messi.
Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance
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He is, but he hasn't been clutch in any CL final he was involved in, unlike Messi who was best player in pretty much every final he's been involved in. Ronaldo was very quiet in every CL final Real Madrid won, and he's missed a penalty for us in CL final. So I am not sure how that goes against Messi.
If you look go back to the 2006/07 season, which is the first year both players started scoring goals with increasing abundance, they have both scored nearly the exact same number - Messi has 533 and Ronnie has 534 in all comps, which averages about 44 goals a year over a 12 year period. At the end of the day, there's little between them in this regard.
probably because they remembered the type of player he was at Manchester United and his early Real years..
Which is like half his entire career before he transitioned into more of a pure goalscorer.
There we go again, I can just about accept some people think Messi is better, but fat Ronaldo?
This isn't a valid comparison.
Serie A in the 1990s was far more competitive top to bottom than La Liga in the 2010s, the quality of defenders in Serie A was far superior to the quality of defenders in La Liga, the tactical and referee paradigms are completely different and RM in the 2010s is a far more dominant team in league than Inter in the late 1990s.
In Ronaldo's first three seasons at Inter, Inter had a total of 62, 59 and 58 Goals For (with no team even breaking 70 GF during this era).
Throughout the 2010s Real Madrid averages more than 100 goals as a team every season (102, 121, 103, 104, 118, 110, 106).
Completely different eras in different leagues so impossible to rationally compare raw numbers like you are.
Yeah, no doubt mate. The Seria A at the time did it for him as it was very physical. In todays game he'd receive much more protection that could've prolonged his career. Cristiano and Messi are lucky not to endure all the abuse attacking players were facing 20-30 years ago.
I disagree on the numbers point tho. Suarez scored 57 goals for Barcelona and he's not a patch on either. Being focal point in great team always help so going only by the numbers won't show the big picture.
Cheers, Gio.
Think he was against Juve. Very clinical apart from one miss and won them the game with his third.
In Moscow final he also scored the first and generally was pretty good against a solid Chelsea side. Agree on the other finals, but Messi has been a bit anonymous against Atletico in the CL as well, despite earlier stage.
So aggressively debated within the thread, but 72% in favour of Messi in the poll.
This obsession with the amount of goals scored is madness. You say that scoring goals is the actual only thing in football? Answer this, why is Gerd Muller (arguably the greatest goal scorer in history) never mentioned amongst the very best? The best players in the history of the game (Pele, Diego, Di Stefano, Cruyff) we’re deemed the best because they offered MORE than goals. They scored goals AND at the same time were the most influential players on the pitch besides. Cristiano outside of his goals doesn’t even touch Ronaldinho in the playmaker stakes, never mind the best in history.
Genuinely don't have the energy to debate any more. If the eye test doesn't convince some people then stuff people type on the internet won't either.
Who do you prefer in one word or less
Don't debate. Wait 1 hour, grab a cold beer and be unimpressed at the way Ronaldo wins his team another game of football.
funny enough, after so many talk about Messi's bad record against Chelsea, that Ronaldo goal for our lead in final remained the only one he ever scored against them. 15 games, 1 goal in almost double minutes played compared to Messi.
Because Messi doesn’t do that? He is the reason Barca are so far ahead in La Liga. He almost single handedly beat Chelsea the other week as his most recent example of doing so.
Did I say Messi doesn't win games for his team? Did I even mention him? Jesus... it was just a joke.
Indeed, and this applies to Messi as well. We're in an era of super-teams.
I don’t mean to attack, my bad. But you did say “dont debate” then went on to say watch Ron win another game. Which suggests there is no need to debate because Ron wins his team game after game, but Messi doesn’t.
After all this is the Messi vs Ronaldo thread.
I’d like to know the demographics of the more rabid Cristiano Ronaldo defenders.
I wonder if they may also be fans of American sports as their attitudes do seem to betray statistic-driven assessments.
Football is more nuanced than other team sports and sometimes a player can control a game without necessarily playing the final ball or putting the ball in the net. As Pink Moon rightly said (and if anyone hasn’t listened to Nick Drake, they bloody should), if you can’t see these things through a simple eye test, it’s not worth discussing.
Zidane, original Ronaldo, Ronaldinho and Rivaldo, were all better footballers than Cristiano Ronaldo (they’re just 4 examples I imagine will irk but you could name a myriad of players throughout history), but these rather obsessed fans just quote trophies won and goal scoring stats without a full idea of how a team sport actually works.
This leads to my final point (you’ll all be relieved to hear): I’ve been watching football for over 35 years and I’ve never seen a more selfish individual as Cristiano. His behaviour during the penalty shootout against Chelsea in the CL final was hilariously childish and, unfortunately, this mindset continues today (‘I’m the best, aren’t I?’ Et al...)
That’s the main difference I see between Messi and Ronaldo - Messi plays for the team first and Ronaldo expects the team to play first for him.
He’s still an amazing physical specimen and must be applauded for how he’s committed to his fitness throughout his career, but he’s nowhere near the quality of footballer that his uber-fans of statistics think.
So, to all CR7 fans: relax, take joy in your favourite now seemingly deciding to start playing properly after January and scoring lots of goals at the business end of the season for the next few years (helps with individual awards), and just remember, football is meaningless; use the time you spend looking for statistics more enjoyably, whatever that may be. Please.
To any CR fans that have steam coming out of their ears at this blasphemy, don’t bother responding as this will be my only contribution to this massive waste of everyone’s time. (In case any CR disciples are wondering as I’ve not posted one statistic, I think Messi’s by far the superior player and, in other shocking news, I do believe the Pope shows Catholic sympathies and bears defecate in forest-like areas.)
There’s a lot of fun to be had in life...but not here!
I wonder if they may also be fans of American sports as their attitudes do seem to betray statistic-driven assessments.
Football is more nuanced than other team sports and sometimes a player can control a game without necessarily playing the final ball or putting the ball in the net. As Pink Moon rightly said (and if anyone hasn’t listened to Nick Drake, they bloody should), if you can’t see these things through a simple eye test, it’s not worth discussing.
Zidane, original Ronaldo, Ronaldinho and Rivaldo, were all better footballers than Cristiano Ronaldo (they’re just 4 examples I imagine will irk but you could name a myriad of players throughout history), but these rather obsessed fans just quote trophies won and goal scoring stats without a full idea of how a team sport actually works.
This leads to my final point (you’ll all be relieved to hear): I’ve been watching football for over 35 years and I’ve never seen a more selfish individual as Cristiano. His behaviour during the penalty shootout against Chelsea in the CL final was hilariously childish and, unfortunately, this mindset continues today (‘I’m the best, aren’t I?’ Et al...)
That’s the main difference I see between Messi and Ronaldo - Messi plays for the team first and Ronaldo expects the team to play first for him.
He’s still an amazing physical specimen and must be applauded for how he’s committed to his fitness throughout his career, but he’s nowhere near the quality of footballer that his uber-fans of statistics think.
So, to all CR7 fans: relax, take joy in your favourite now seemingly deciding to start playing properly after January and scoring lots of goals at the business end of the season for the next few years (helps with individual awards), and just remember, football is meaningless; use the time you spend looking for statistics more enjoyably, whatever that may be. Please.
To any CR fans that have steam coming out of their ears at this blasphemy, don’t bother responding as this will be my only contribution to this massive waste of everyone’s time. (In case any CR disciples are wondering as I’ve not posted one statistic, I think Messi’s by far the superior player and, in other shocking news, I do believe the Pope shows Catholic sympathies and bears defecate in forest-like areas.)
There’s a lot of fun to be had in life...but not here!
arsehole is that legible enough for you
Rivaldo
Yeah Cashley is notorious for having a good record against him both internationally and at club level.
Anyone knows Messi's and Cristiano's record against Atletico since Simeone took over including penalties? Probably the best comparison against top defensive units in modern day are Jose's Chelsea and Simeone's Atletico - plenty of games for both against them.
Ronaldo has done well to get close to 30% vote. That’s pretty good when you are up against the GOAT.
Rivaldo
I’ll assume that you think there’s something amusing about positing that Rivaldo is a better football player than Ronaldo but you didn’t laugh at Zidane. In the spirit of enlightenment, I’ll bite at this one...
Did you see Rivaldo play at Depor and Barca? Or have you just seen YouTube clips and his farcical reaction against Turkey in the 2002 WC? It’s OK to be young and know it all - we’ve all felt that way in our youths.
Do you know that both Scholes and Keane said he was one of the best midfielders they’ve ever faced? On a level with Zidane and Xavi?
Here’s an article of the time that may enlighten and it even has some statistics that I’m sure will be enjoyed by many: https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.sk.../2208114/rivaldo-would-only-make-reds-greater
Things that happened before you reached sentience still happened, I’m afraid. Apologies if these cruel, cruel truths are hurting any particularly sensitive CR7 fans, but sometimes, as Nick Lowe quite rightly said, it’s cruel to be kind (in the right measure)...
Have fun, kids!
yeah, pretty expected outcome, even among United supporters. it'd be interesting to see this poll on Barca and Madrid forums. I reckon Messi would do well even on Madrid forum, as I know a few R. Madrid supporters that have no problem admitting he's better. as for Ronaldo votes on Barca board, I think he'd collect about 5 votes at best.
Nothing happened, move on
Ronaldo fans are really funny, He's not even the better player at Real Madrid, Ramos and Modric are far more important for the team than Cristiano.
dude come on, I'm a Barca fan but Ramos more important?
I'd say Marcelo is their most talented playerThese are the kind of posts that make me laugh. Whilst I agree that Messi is better, why do so many Messi fans have to try so hard to downplay Ronaldo? On what planet are Modric and Ramos 'far' more important than Ronaldo? Why so much hyperbole just to prove a point? It just makes your opinion less credible imo.
Ronaldinho and fat ronaldo were better than messi and ronaldo and Im leaving Maradona out of this discussion.
Do we have any newbies that want quick promotion that can pull up the stats of how many goals both have scored that
A) tied the game
B ) won the game
A) tied the game
B ) won the game
I thought it was your only post in the thread. I'm honored that you come back.
On your choice of Messi, it is understandable. I also think that Messi is a better football player,without using statistics (although I decided to vote for Cris).
You choose several mediapuntas / enganches / jugones.
Actually you could put on that list any top number 10 in the last 30 years and you´d say that plays better football than Cristiano.
In fact that's what a playmaker does, play and make play to the others.
Domain of space, ball and combinations.
I also like those examples, I'm not a purist but I like the concepts of tikitaka, Menotti or Cruyff, but that has nothing to do with underestimating the goal. Although Cristiano does more than just penalties and easy goals. If we search deeply perhaps we will find some assist,or the abstract concept of football intelligence on the pitch.
I don't know very well the point of that anecdote of penalties against Chelsea?. Maybe you do not like him and are being slightly subjective?.
Of course I remember Rivaldo, at Barça and his season in Coruña where I used to go to the stadium.Did you see him live? (and by the way, Cristiano?)
Firstly you complain about the statistics and then you bring an article full of them
I also remember endless debates in radio about his position on the left where many times disappeared,his lack of leadership.
I liked his dribbling,his stride and the amazing free kicks but in my opinion was so slow.Leadership and intelligence ... were not his greatest virtues,
and personally I think that affected his departure from Barcelona. Tostao said it, "he scores goals but can not think because he does not know.".
Comparing him with Cristiano is incredibly excessive .
This thread needs to be closed after this
Jesus, I wonder how people like you have managed to survive the past couple of years. Say what you want about Messi and Ronaldo but the biggest difference between them is that for Ronaldo there are people like you... while for Messi there aren't.
So you think Messi is a better footballer, but you voted for Ronaldo, what's the point of that?
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