[VP89]

I did say he's about average, which isn't good when you look at the CBs we have. Far off what is required. He has those issues I mentioned, I notice them in games, but he hasn't really been punished as of yet like he was at Juve at times, and Bayern. Probably helps to an extent being in a back 3 for that reason. I'm not declaring any of them to be great, I think they're a solid set of options and probably the least of our worries right now (apart from ball progression, which they are struggling with). But they still aren't great, and I don't think he's really any better than Maguire or Martinez, just another defender of a similar level that doesn't dominate, can be got at, has frailties, average at distribution, a bit cumbersome and slow, but is fairly steady for the rest of it.

I think he is better than average and if I'm not mistake he was seen as Bayerns best center back, or one of them. He was trusted heavily under Tuchel.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Still our best defender. Why would we bin him when we have/had worse CBs? Lindelof, Evans, Varane (last season - rightly binned). Maguire will only be 'binned' when there is better players to take his place. He's nowhere near an issue right now, and would be decent backup in a back 3. It's not his fault we keep signing average CBs and none can really force him out.

He should have been binned years ago. We should never have went near him, but that's a different story. As I said, Hojlund was also our best striker last season.

 

[pocco]

He should have been binned years ago. We should never have went near him, but that's a different story. As I said, Hojlund was also our best striker last season.

I agree we shouldn’t have bought him, but he’s not the first CB that needs to go. I have barely rated him but he’s doing ok these days and that’s better than most other players we have. You don’t just bin off starters and try to replace them, you get in players that force them out of the team, down the pecking order and then you sell them. Like I said, unless somebody comes along and forces him out of the team, or he wants to leave, then he’s not going anywhere just yet.

I’d go as far as to say he’s actually probably one of the safest players in our squad right now. I don’t rate him highly or anything (see my previous post history if you are bothered, I’m not some Maguire fanboy by any means) but he’s shown a good attitude and performed reasonably well when he looked down and out, and was barely used. As somebody that has been a critic I can only take my hat off to the guy. I wish more of our more talented players showed this character. Imagine Rashford, or Sancho had that approach…we’d be a lot better off right now.

 

[pocco]

I think he is better than average and if I'm not mistake he was seen as Bayerns best center back, or one of them. He was trusted heavily under Tuchel.

Didn’t Tuchel drop him and MDL got the hump? Tuchel didn’t like his distribution I believe, and preferred Upamecano and Min Jae. Last season he even preferred Upamecano and Dier when he wanted to play with a higher line!

He also found himself 4th choice for Netherlands too.

 

[Robbie Boy]

I agree we shouldn’t have bought him, but he’s not the first CB that needs to go. I have barely rated him but he’s doing ok these days and that’s better than most other players we have. You don’t just bin off starters and try to replace them, you get in players that force them out of the team, down the pecking order and then you sell them. Like I said, unless somebody comes along and forces him out of the team, or he wants to leave, then he’s not going anywhere just yet.

I’d go as far as to say he’s actually probably one of the safest players in our squad right now. I don’t rate him highly or anything (see my previous post history if you are bothered, I’m not some Maguire fanboy by any means) but he’s shown a good attitude and performed reasonably well when he looked down and out, and was barely used. As somebody that has been a critic I can only take my hat off to the guy. I wish more of our more talented players showed this character. Imagine Rashford, or Sancho had that approach…we’d be a lot better off right now.

I wasn't strictly speaking about the here-and-now; I think he should have been binned years ago. The fact he's still here to have this "redemption" is ridiculous. He's consistently been part of awful defences, and he's just not good enough, and never has been. Considering what he cost, the bar for him "playing well" is very, very low.

I disagree about him playing well by the way. I think his performances have been wildly exaggerated - a good example is the Leicester game: he was awful then scores a late goal, and apparently he played great. Sometimes I feel I'm watching a different match when I login here and his 3 or 4 super fans are praising him to the hilt. This narrative that "he's been far better than MDL" is insane. Neither have been remotely impressive barring the odd game here-and-there. Yet, some nutter on here swears Maguire has been Barsei reincarnated and has been levels above MDL. I'm just not seeing this "redemption".

 

[VP89]

Didn’t Tuchel drop him and MDL got the hump? Tuchel didn’t like his distribution I believe, and preferred Upamecano and Min Jae. Last season he even preferred Upamecano and Dier when he wanted to play with a higher line!

He also found himself 4th choice for Netherlands too.

I don't believe so? There was this myth that he was replaced by Dier and in the stats of when Dier started he had MDL as a partner in almost all the games.

The Netherlands thing is because VVD is the central striker, and De Virj covers that space between CB and wingback more naturally (though I'd argue MDL has been good at this for us, notably pocketing the winger for Southampton that had Yoro on toast).

MDL also handles attackers a lot better than Maguire for example. The latter finds himself in more compromising positions and outright fouls the shit of a player or obstructs them in a high risk situation that can often lead to a penalty.