Back on topic. Martial had a decent game, but all things said I don't see any particular advantage to starting him over Rashford.
Marcus Rashford vs Anthony Martial (2017 / 2018 Season)
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This is getting ridiculous 
I like how they are pushing each other forward.
I like how they are pushing each other forward.I'm seeing a lot of this, and hearing it from Robbie Savage but what i seen of the game ( and i didn't miss much like a minute or two here and there) i thought he had a bad game, he seemed all over the place. Bad touches, bad shots, overall a bad performance for him in my eyes.
Some of his shooting was off, but he did pretty well at attacking 2-3 players on the edge of their box. This has basically just reinforced what I was saying last week - that there is no legitimate argument that he absolutely has to start instead of Rashford. If anything this just reinforced to Mourinho that there is no tangible benefit to disrupting the previous lineup where Rashford starts and Martial comes on in the 2nd.
Pretty identical performances id say today. Martial tore douglas apart with his dribbling, won a pen with a brilliant run. Rashford comes on and does the same.
What did anyone on the right do for us? Nothing really. Non existent right flank as always. Fecking play them both and have 2 threats on the pitch.
What did anyone on the right do for us? Nothing really. Non existent right flank as always. Fecking play them both and have 2 threats on the pitch.
It's our own shitty little version of Messi vs Ronaldo except nobody has told Mourinho he's allowed to play both.
Just play both. Really is that simple.
You seem to be implying that rashford has been superior this season? That this 'tangible benefit' you speak of is present when rashford starts? That's simply untrue. Both definitely deserve to start, enough of this bench one rubbish. Tevez, Rooney and Ronaldo worked as a fluid front 3, and only one of them was considered a 'winger'. Do we seriously not think Rashford, Martial and Lukaku could not work too?
Oh and funnily enough, by your logic, we should start Martial based on today's game because seeming Rashford can come off the bench and win a penalty so therefore he's more effective from the bench? Isn't that the logic...?
The longer the season goes on the more I actually don't like the idea of playing them together on the wings.
I don't think either are ready to play 90 minutes every game. What seems to happen is that both of them can have a frustrating game where they are doing everything well except for the final ball. Their level drops off as the game goes on because nothing is coming off for them.
I feel that neither have earned their place as guaranteed starter like Matic, Pogba etc. because they are still very raw (especially Rashford).
I don't think either are ready to play 90 minutes every game. What seems to happen is that both of them can have a frustrating game where they are doing everything well except for the final ball. Their level drops off as the game goes on because nothing is coming off for them.
I feel that neither have earned their place as guaranteed starter like Matic, Pogba etc. because they are still very raw (especially Rashford).
I don't think "winning a penalty" is some sort of positive accomplishment one can boast of. Tonight was Jose's chance to see if the inverse of what he's been doing for most of this season was more beneficial - and it clearly wasn't.
This is really Gold.
When Lukaku moved onto the right in the 2nd half he was actually really good tbh.
Our best attacking results imo, have been when Martial comes off the bench. West Ham & Swansea etc
Yeah he's capable of drifting wide and making an impact, that's why I keep thinking that our best attack is having those 3 in a 3 drifting and swapping positions when needed. So much pace, power and should have the control from a 3 man midfield behind them.
That's kind of insane when you consider how little the other players are creating. Almost everything good we're doing is coming from one of them. By your standards what in the world have Mata, Mhki or Lingard done to deserve to start ahead of either of them? Where is the scrutiny of their anonymous performances? Martial and Rashford are miles ahead of them on current form.
This Rashford/Martial stuff is getting out of hand. It's as if neither one can have a quiet half without somebody finding fault. Not even Messi or Ronaldo play well in every half of every match. Martial terrorised Benfica tonight but you still have people trying to suggest it was a bad performance because he had an iffy 15 minute spell in the second half. It's completely ridiculous. Both players are absolutely flying at the moment.
100%
That's true. Not sure if it was Mourinho's idea or his but it was something he had success with at Everton when he was struggling in the CF position. Helps him find his comfort zone again, receiving the ball on the half turn and running at the back line. He was unlucky not to get a goal in that second half.
Love this.
You say "etc" but none of them have really stood out. If you look back since Pogba got injured, our best (attacking) player in every game is either Martial or Rashford, and then the sub having a big impact later. What does our right wing or #10 ever do? Next to nothing but try to get the ball to the left winger on the day (or Valencia doing everything from right back). Put one on the right and one on the left in a front 3 will get them all in advanced positions and keep a threat from both sides and it'll make it harder to double up on one of them.
Both are great really and glad we have them. Could we play a 3-4-3 with them both and Lukaku. Maybe having Lukaku more to the right could be the answer since he seem to do well in that area and then we have Rashford centrally although he could move around a lot while Lukaku moves into the box.
I am not sure they should both start in every game, but we should at least test it in some of the easier home games we have. Can certainly need more attacking power.
I am not sure they should both start in every game, but we should at least test it in some of the easier home games we have. Can certainly need more attacking power.
Hold the phone. Why hasn't anyone else suggested that?!
If only the man who is actually responsible for the selection would at least try it. What’s the worst that could happen? It’s not like Mata or Mkhitaryan are offering anything at the moment. They both work hard so it’s not like we’d be exposed defensively.
Matic, Pogba, Lukaku, Valencia, Jones have all stood out, you could even say Ashley Young has made the LB spot his own.
I simply don't have the confidence that they can give consistent performances. One game they are 10/10, the next game they are useless, the next they are in the middle.
Our problem areas are no.10 and RW (you could say LB as well, but Young has been doing quite well). Putting either of them in the no.10 spot won't change a thing because we already have a wide forward playing there (Mkhitaryan) and I feel that putting them on the right makes them far less of a goal threat.
A lot of 'play them both'.... but , realistically, how? Seeing as Lukaku is nailed on, the only option would be one either side, but neither are right wingers. It's square pegs and round holes again (which granted is the case with whoever plays RW).
He's getting the results and we've scored more than double anyone else in the league in the last 10 minutes. There's clear value to having one of them come off the bench. Having it posted here 15 times a day won't change that.
I love how Jose is rotating them both. It's pushing both Rash and Martial to perform better IMO. Jose can play both, but it's always great to have a solid option available on bench when most of the opposition players are tired.
He had a few bad last touches, but they were generally preceded by little bits of brilliance that no one else in the team is capable of replicating.
Martial gets a lot of praise because he's French. If he were English like Rashford, we wouldn't be hearing the same plaudits from the media.
Both this and "Rashford's only hyped because he's an local lad from the academy" are nonsense. This probably moreso.
I think rashford is better to start if we are going to choose one over the other.... don’t feel like going into detail so long story short just basing this opinion on what I’ve seen
Except tonight wasn't the first time Jose has 'tested' this, Martial has started all the CL games.
At this moment it looks like Jose prefers Martial in CL and Rashford in the PL.
Martial played well, but also left a lot to be desired. Vis a vi Rashford in other games. As a collective left flank they work.
I said this in another thread but I feel an attacking coach would have found a way to fit them in together. How much output are we getting from Mata from the right to justify him starting all the games he has?
Yes I agree... Lukaku was more effective when he switches to the right
The Mata+Valencia dynamic is better balanced than Rashford+Valencia would be. I can understand Mourinho's thinking, although I don't agree with it.
Rashford on the right won't happen until we get a better (ie. more creative) passer at rightback. I can see why we didn't buy Aurier. A right-footed Evra would be perfect.
Rashford on the right won't happen until we get a better (ie. more creative) passer at rightback. I can see why we didn't buy Aurier. A right-footed Evra would be perfect.
It doesn't make sense to build the attack around Lukaku, 1 or 2 of Mhki, Mata, and Lingard, and 1 of Rashford and Martial. Lukaku, Rashford, and Martial are clearly better in attacking positions than Mhki, Mata, and Lingard. I think most United fans would agree that it should be the best 3 attacking players starting and if a 4th attacking player is needed in the starting 11 or as a sub, it should be 1 of Mhki, Mata, and Lingard.
Lukaku, Rashford and Martial are bright, skillful young players who would grow together if they were allowed to train as a front 3 and play as a front 3. If playing only 1 of Rashford and Martial with Lukaku was working, United wouldn't have dropped points vs 13th and 14th place teams or be depending on a late goal to salvage a point or get a win.
Lukaku, Rashford and Martial are bright, skillful young players who would grow together if they were allowed to train as a front 3 and play as a front 3. If playing only 1 of Rashford and Martial with Lukaku was working, United wouldn't have dropped points vs 13th and 14th place teams or be depending on a late goal to salvage a point or get a win.
Can't see how anyone can say that was a bad performance. He was by far the most exciting player on that pitch rivalled only by Pixie (or whatever his name was from Benfica and Goncalves - sure I've made these names up).
It was a poor pen - not sure if he even looked at the keeper like he usually does and he had some really poor moments in the second half trying to overdo it but in general he was thrilling to watch and a menace which is all you can ask from a wideman.
We usually criticise Martial for not having the same oomph or quality when he starts a game but yesterday he had a lot of drive in his performance and he sustained it throughout the game. It was a positive step for him.
Next step is to try and do that in the EPL and follow that up with end product when he starts.
Do feel Jose is making it harder than it needs to be for our young players as they're playing left back instead of closer to Lukaku and thus they can't focus on end product which might explain why they're more effective off the bench. But hopefully once both start scoring and assisting from the start we will see both together..
Rashford playing on the left is a square peg in a round hole but it's working out
Lukaku looking good running at their defence from the RW is a square peg in a round hole
Heck, mata playing RW is a square peg in a round hole
But suddenly either one of martial or rashford playing there is seen as unthinkable?
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