Marc Guéhi | Newcastle Open Talks - Ornstein

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redIndianDevil said:
We never learn do we? A world class player like Varane looked ordinary for us, I'm not expecting much from De Ligt, Bayern don't let good players leave that easily.
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No he didn't, he just wasn't reliable. He was easily our best CB defensively and was integral in most of our best performances
 
Fair play to Palace, doing a Leicester/Maguire on the geordies and making them break their transfer record
 
He's not tall enough. And he's not a Martinez.
 
December_16 said:
Not sure if he will be a good fit for our defense with Martinez already being short. He’s not that stellar on the ball either.

Maybe Palace would be interested in Lindelof or Maguire as short-term replacement for him?
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Dougie Freedman is pretty smart and Palace seem like Brighton / Brentford v2 these days. I'd be surprised if they don't have someone lined up already.
 
He is a good, solid defender. Good tackler, good positional sense - but he is not dominant in the air, not quick and not impressive on the ball. I just feel his ceiling is 8/10
 
lysglimt said:
He is a good, solid defender. Good tackler, good positional sense - but he is not dominant in the air, not quick and not impressive on the ball. I just feel his ceiling is 8/10
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They have enough height in their army of giants (Burn, Schar, Botman etc.). Is their backline going to be Livramento, Guehi, Botman and Burn? What is he expected to bring to that? Better Passing? Ball Carrying?
 
Devil_forever said:
I’d agree with you, if we ourselves didn’t actively pursue with multiple bids for a English CB who’s worse than Guehi.
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...before walking away when we identified it clearly wasn't representing value for money, and chose a better option?
 
Devil_forever said:
I’d agree with you, if we ourselves didn’t actively pursue with multiple bids for a English CB who’s worse than Guehi.
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I'd argue Guehi is only marginally better than Branthwaite at most things right now, but the latter has time and about 5 inches in height on his side.

If I was Newcastle I'd take the £65m and see if I can tempt Everton with it instead. It's a better long term investment.
 
I think 65 million for Guehi is a terrible transfer. That’s not to say he isn’t a decent CB, but he is worth half of that. Palace doing a great job capitalizing on his international tournament.

While he looked good there, I think it also hinted at a player that often needs to scramble because he doesn’t read the game overly well.

A CB should be top class at 65 million in an era of financial fair play, and he isn’t that. Great work from Palace.
 
Lash said:
I don't think 24 you're the finished article at all in terms of CBs. It's usually when you make your big step up and you can either thrive in that situation or stagnate. I would say VVD improved at Liverpool, Pepe at Real Madrid, Akanji at City. There are loads of examples of players just stagnating when they do move as well. 24-27 is where a CB properly matures for me.
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VVD and Pepe improved and stepped up from what they were showing from their previous clubs. I'm not sure I would put Akanji in the same category, who looks the 'same' as his Dortmund days and before that as a young prospect, which is being athletically gifted and capable but prone to lapses of concentration and not that dominant defensively speaking. He's just another cog in the City machine and hasn't been as impressive as Dias was in his first season imo.
 
If Branthwaite has another good season this should help strengthen our bargaining chip too.
 
I gather everyone at Palace is relaxed about this including Guehi. It’s a step up for him but not a transfer you can’t turn down and if we have a good season I’ll fancy a ‘proper’ top club to come in….so will he I’m sure.

My prediction if he doesn’t go in this window is that he’ll sign a new contract with a pay increase and a release clause just like Eze and Olise did.
 
criticalanalysis said:
VVD and Pepe improved and stepped up from what they were showing from their previous clubs. I'm not sure I would put Akanji in the same category, who looks the 'same' as his Dortmund days and before that as a young prospect, which is being athletically gifted and capable but prone to lapses of concentration and not that dominant defensively speaking. He's just another cog in the City machine and hasn't been as impressive as Dias was in his first season imo.
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Fair enough, I've been massively surprised how good Akanji has been, but I guess you're right about the cog in the city machine - but I wouldn't say that about Ake. I think he looks exactly as what I saw at Bournemouth.
 
I wonder what Souness’ thoughts will be on this transfer. No doubt waxing lyrical that Newcastle have got a steal at £65m whilst a player of de Ligt‘s pedigree is a ‘gamble’ at £40m.

Anyway, Guehi’s a very ordinary player. Don’t think it improves Newcastle at all - he’s inferior to both Schar and Botman.
 
Lash said:
No he didn't, he just wasn't reliable. He was easily our best CB defensively and was integral in most of our best performances
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He was reliable at one thing, winning the ball from crosses into our box. In every other area he was lacking.
 
Guehi is better than some give him credit for, but 65m is already a bonkers price for him, let alone the 70-75m it’s going to take. Paul Mitchell running their transfer business now and after the hype he got on the car, I’d have expected more creativity from him than to just keep going back to palace offering more and more. Makes you feel like if he’d been here we’d have given Everton 70m for Branthwaite.
 
Ekeke said:
Guehi is worth £30 million max and if he wasnt English it would be less than £20 million.
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Mate we paid £20m for him after his Championship season at Swansea…he’s now the club captain and probably first choice starter for England.
 
Shipperley said:
Mate we paid £20m for him after his Championship season at Swansea…he’s now the club captain and probably first choice starter for England.
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I think he's judging it on what he perceives his ability to be which as we all know isn't how transfer fees work.
 
Shipperley said:
Mate we paid £20m for him after his Championship season at Swansea…he’s now the club captain and probably first choice starter for England.
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You overpaid because hes English and he's now an average CB playing for England because Maguire was injured and made mistakes for 3 of the 5 goals England conceded at the euros including 2 out of 2 against Spain.

1 against Slovakia very poor
didnt play against Switzerland
Didnt cost England a goal vs Netherlands however he did find himself at leftback with no urgency to get back to the middle and put any pressure on Xavi Simons for his goal. Other players were closer its more their fault.
First goal against Spain he allows the ball to Yamal with poor positioning and not confronting him, then he's the person in position to be able to stop Yamal's run and he doesnt confront him. Yamal puts the ball out to Williams who scores.
Second goal the ball is played between the 2 England CBs for Oyarzabal and Guehi comes over to take responsibility of the player but he's already passed it on first time to the left wing. Oyarabal now makes a run in behind and Guehi doesnt track him and lets him get goalside to tap in the winner.

Guehi is decent at taking the ball and bringing it forward from the backline. He's a poor defender
 
Crimson King said:
I'd argue Guehi is only marginally better than Branthwaite at most things right now, but the latter has time and about 5 inches in height on his side.

If I was Newcastle I'd take the £65m and see if I can tempt Everton with it instead. It's a better long term investment.
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Completely agree. There are plenty of better options than Guehi for £65m+. He’s good, but he’s not that good.
 
duffer said:
If Newcastle finish above us with Hall, Livramento and Guehi all playing a significant part, I will be miffed.
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another 2 transfer windows and every single player on the planet would have played for chelsea at some point during their career.
 
I'm abit baffled. £65-70mil would pretty much buy you one of the 90% of the CBs across Europe (barring the super elite rich clubs).

Why do they want guehi so badly?
 
dinostar77 said:
I'm abit baffled. £65-70mil would pretty much buy you one of the 90% of the CBs across Europe (barring the super elite rich clubs).

Why do they want guehi so badly?
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He's young, English, talented and by all accounts is a top pro who is a great influence on the dressing room.

Even in the most recent England squad, the likes of Kyle Walker (who is 10 year older) was calling him Uncle Marc.
 
Buying players from PL sides especially English and especially defenders is pure idiocy at this point. Have to pay a kings ransom for every bang average of them these days. No thanks. Learnt our lesson the hard way after forking out £130m for Maguire and AWB. Jesus wept.
 
Ekeke said:
He was reliable at one thing, winning the ball from crosses into our box. In every other area he was lacking.
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Maybe a tad harsh in my eyes, but he did also have a much better nose for danger than any of the other CBs and could cover the ground to get to it.
 
duffer said:
He's young, English, talented and by all accounts is a top pro who is a great influence on the dressing room.

Even in the most recent England squad, the likes of Kyle Walker (who is 10 year older) was calling him Uncle Marc.
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Didn't know any of that. Fair enough.

Shame we can't sell them Maguire on a cut price deal....
 
Lash said:
Maybe a tad harsh in my eyes, but he did also have a much better nose for danger than any of the other CBs and could cover the ground to get to it.
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I'll give you that he was probably the most mobile of our CBs last season given that Maguire, Lindelof and Evans were never the fastest.
 
It’s like an unwritten rule that no average to decent English player would go for less than £50m. No matter the position no matter the talent or lack of and no matter the contract situation. It’s ridiculous.

Toney - £60m wanted with one year left.
Solanke - £65m
Guehi - £65m-70m fee wanted
Branthwaite - £70m wanted
Archie Gray - £40m for Championship player
Even smith Rowe went for £35m with 2 seasons being injured.
 
Lash said:
Fair enough, I've been massively surprised how good Akanji has been, but I guess you're right about the cog in the city machine - but I wouldn't say that about Ake. I think he looks exactly as what I saw at Bournemouth.
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That's quite funny because I would say Ake has improved. I always thought he was athletically talented but again too prone to lapses of concentration and quite lacksidal at Bournemouth. At City, he looks more assured and switched on, which make senses at he's now a lot older and approaching his thirties.

I will say I don't watch City a lot and base my assessment on very limited viewing though.

@padr81 - your thoughts on whether Akanji and Ake have improved since joining your team?
 
Ekeke said:
You overpaid because hes English and he's now an average CB playing for England because Maguire was injured and made mistakes for 3 of the 5 goals England conceded at the euros including 2 out of 2 against Spain.

1 against Slovakia very poor
didnt play against Switzerland
Didnt cost England a goal vs Netherlands however he did find himself at leftback with no urgency to get back to the middle and put any pressure on Xavi Simons for his goal. Other players were closer its more their fault.
First goal against Spain he allows the ball to Yamal with poor positioning and not confronting him, then he's the person in position to be able to stop Yamal's run and he doesnt confront him. Yamal puts the ball out to Williams who scores.
Second goal the ball is played between the 2 England CBs for Oyarzabal and Guehi comes over to take responsibility of the player but he's already passed it on first time to the left wing. Oyarabal now makes a run in behind and Guehi doesnt track him and lets him get goalside to tap in the winner.

Guehi is decent at taking the ball and bringing it forward from the backline. He's a poor defender
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Sorry? He was in most peoples’ team of the tournament but was at fault for most of the goals conceded? We very clearly didn’t overpay and he very clearly isn’t a poor defender.
 
Another proof that the english market is crazy, I've been saying it for some time now barring some extraordinary exceptions we shouldnt buy anyone from the premier league. The prices are crazy and you can get more value for the money outside. De Ligt-Guehi is the latest example.

Can you imagine any team outside the premier league paying those prices for Guehi? it's madness.

Another example is Spurs paying 65M for Solanke. Prices are unreal.
 
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Shipperley said:
Sorry? He was in most peoples’ team of the tournament but was at fault for most of the goals conceded? We very clearly didn’t overpay and he very clearly isn’t a poor defender.
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Most "people" from where?

Watch the goals yourself dont argue with reality.
 
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