Christ, Matic was an amazing player in his peak. Like you said, even the old and slow version we had at the end would probably be our best CM right now. Certainly technically.
25
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 19
- Goals
- 0
- Assists
- 1
- Yellow cards
- 3
Christ, Matic was an amazing player in his peak. Like you said, even the old and slow version we had at the end would probably be our best CM right now. Certainly technically.
Told you.
Looking a bit like Torreira was for Arsenal.
Out of his depth.
Out of his depth.
Incredibly early days for him, in a tough area of the pitch, I'm not shocked its been a patchy start. I'm willing to give him a bit more time and patience.
Way off the pace, but that is something that should be easily rectified as he gets used to the league. Some very sloppy passing also but I think that was mostly due to my first point. Think he can come good.
Amorim will bring the best out in him
Well we definitely hope he can. Otherwise we are looking at another failed signing.
We never should have signed him.
We needed more 'la pausa' type midfielders similar to Mainoo with a more expansive passing range.
Hopefully he plays better though.
We needed more 'la pausa' type midfielders similar to Mainoo with a more expansive passing range.
Hopefully he plays better though.
He was one of Amorims top players before PSG, right?
I think we can relax here
I think we can relax here
He’s definitely good out of possession but gets a nose bleed when trying to pass forwards.
Will most likely be a squad player if we’re trying to win leagues again.
Someone like Guimaraes would be ideal but him specifically would cost a bomb.
Will most likely be a squad player if we’re trying to win leagues again.
Someone like Guimaraes would be ideal but him specifically would cost a bomb.
Correct, but that doesn’t necessarily mean he has the ability to be a top premier league player, irrespective of manager. Playing against Portuguese league players is entirely different.
I agree we should wait and see, though.
I’m not too worried yet. He’s been disappointing but also showed some good sides. We can see his limitations but Liverpool won a league with Jordan Henderson so let’s see if Amorim takes him up a level. I just wish we’d sign more Mazraoui types, players who don’t have these technical issues and can deal with the ball properly.
Hard to judge our midfielders when we’re not playing a succinct system. Often left exposed out of position and in possession without options or patterns of play to follow.
He’s no Frenkie De Jong on the ball but he also shows moments of real quality, which hopefully in the right system we are able to see more of.
He had one nice pass out wide, a 40 yarder.
Very poor in possession but so was our front 4 plus Cas, so many misplaced passes and the movements to open passing lanes was bad from all including this fella.
Not looking good. Think we're still within the return window, though, so as long as we kept the receipt.
I miss Toby Collyer.
I miss Toby Collyer.
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Terrible game.
That performance summed up my concerns when this transfer happened. I would have thought that the club learnt a lesson after the Awb signing but nope.
75% passing accuracy yesterday, with around 29 passes attempted.
Anybody who has seen him play could have told you that he was not comfortable on the ball.
But I was told to keep quiet when I brought that up, apparently he was brilliant at keeping the ball for the team and a destroyer who is shit on the ball was exactly what our midfield needed
Anybody who has seen him play could have told you that he was not comfortable on the ball.
But I was told to keep quiet when I brought that up, apparently he was brilliant at keeping the ball for the team and a destroyer who is shit on the ball was exactly what our midfield needed
It wasn't tough to deduce why PSG and Enrique were letting him go after just one season. Even the stats and highlights pointed out to similar with regards to his forward passing.75% passing accuracy yesterday, with around 29 passes attempted.
Anybody who has seen him play could have told you that he was not comfortable on the ball.
But I was told to keep quiet when I brought that up, apparently he was brilliant at keeping the ball for the team and a destroyer who is shit on the ball was exactly what our midfield needed
The only hope now is that Amorim may be able to get the best out of him as he played under him at Sporting. However, de Meek had played under 'Aggy at Ajax too. So you never know.
I thought we made a mistake by signing Casemiro as he didn’t help control football matches and we’ve only gone ahead and signed someone who makes Casemiro looked great on the ball.
like Donny Van De Beek under Ten Hag
Early days but technically doesn't look good enough
Fred was a more consistent passer
75% passing accuracy yesterday, with around 29 passes attempted.
Anybody who has seen him play could have told you that he was not comfortable on the ball.
But I was told to keep quiet when I brought that up, apparently he was brilliant at keeping the ball for the team and a destroyer who is shit on the ball was exactly what our midfield needed
based on stats his passing was good, not in progressive passing obviously, but otherwise he averaged 90% or more in the simple sideways or backward passing, we all assumed he would be a safe passer, then he comes here, and he just starts misplacing simple 5 yard sideway passes, I don't want to think we signed a dud here, it is early days, let's hope he gets better with time, otherwise, it is another useless CM/DM in our hands.
There are some "orange flags" for sure, but we should give him some time to settle before we write him off.
It's not easy to go to a new club in a new league, especially one coached by EtH, and immediately slot right in.
It's not easy to go to a new club in a new league, especially one coached by EtH, and immediately slot right in.
Whatever about being average/limited on the ball, he didn't win enough duels.
2/12 ground duels won
0/1 aerial duels won
0/1 dribbles completed
1 tackle
1 interception
6 fouls
1 yellow card
2/12 ground duels won
0/1 aerial duels won
0/1 dribbles completed
1 tackle
1 interception
6 fouls
1 yellow card
Funny how there were no mentions of Palhinha's lack of progressive passing, or his passing in general when he was playing for Fulham. He was the best defensive midfielder in the league, and would apparently be a great signing for any top team. Bayern had no problem paying £50m for him. His passing stats in the 23/24 season were:
82.4% pass completion, averaging 44 passes per game with 3.23 of those being progressive. That is worse than Ugarte, but apparently he is just absolute trash, while Palhinha is divinity in person. Make it make sense.
82.4% pass completion, averaging 44 passes per game with 3.23 of those being progressive. That is worse than Ugarte, but apparently he is just absolute trash, while Palhinha is divinity in person. Make it make sense.
where are these stats from? I can remember off the top of my head more wins of the ball and interceptions than this.
I thought he had a good game yesterday and I think people think every player should be everything. Does anybody think its a coincidence that Casemiro looked better alongside him. Chelsea had a decent midfield yesterday with Lavia and Caceido and Palmer in front of them but they didnt dominate the way many teams have. To be a good team we need players who play a balanced part that adds up to an effective whole and Ugarte to me, is going to be integral to it.
Surprised at the overreaction to yesterday, certainly his early appearances were a bit of nothing, but he looks to me like he's growing into things now.
Sofascore and Fotmob.
I thought he was woeful. Our worst player. Garnacho was our 2nd worst performer.
Serious revisionism on Fred in here.
Ugarte has been underwhelming and is clearly limited on the ball.. but I think he has enough about him to at least be a useful asset if played to his strengths.
Should also be noted that he is only 23 - which for a CM is pretty young still.
Ugarte has been underwhelming and is clearly limited on the ball.. but I think he has enough about him to at least be a useful asset if played to his strengths.
Should also be noted that he is only 23 - which for a CM is pretty young still.
Still too early to write him off. I'm sure when the teams on a better wavelength he'll be much better. A midfielder with his skillset is more effective if the field is more compressed/compact. Amorim will be fully aware of how to get the best out of him. Also adjusting to a new league. So let's give him a bit more time.
Shame Antony, Onana etc never got to work with the manager that made them into top players at Ajax....
Playing midweek and then playing again Sunday when you're new to the league is going to be difficult, playing in a disjointed team where there's space everywhere when the the opposition ball would make any player look average.
Give him time, certainly more concerned about Zirkzee.
Give him time, certainly more concerned about Zirkzee.
Fred was shite, the only thing wrong with his departure was that it was about 4 years too late. Can't understand anyone that would pine for him or McT but at the same time write another player off after a handful of games. We had 5 years of that trash.
That being said, Ugarte needs to show some improvements in his game on the ball, otherwise it's just another Fred/McT scenario again. He runs about, wins the ball etc.. but midfielders at top clubs generally get judged more about what they do on the ball than off it. And top clubs have midfielders who can control and dictate the game based on what they do with the ball. Utd haven't had one of those since Carrick.
Exactly my view as well.
There were times when it looked like he was struggling fitness wise.
But I have no doubt that with a proper Coach and a more organised set up, he will come good.
75% passing accuracy yesterday, with around 29 passes attempted.
Anybody who has seen him play could have told you that he was not comfortable on the ball.
But I was told to keep quiet when I brought that up, apparently he was brilliant at keeping the ball for the team and a destroyer who is shit on the ball was exactly what our midfield needed
Are you going to keep making the same "I told you so" post after every bad game? Because that's an immensely tiresome way to post.
If you were predicting low passing accuracy before he arrived then it makes sense that people told you to keep quiet, as his career up to this point is characterised by high passing accuracy. And despite yesterday's anomalous performance in that regard, his overall passing accuracy since he arrived is indeed already 87%. Higher than any of our midfielders sustained across last season.
Of all the stats to use point to to back up your point about his ability on the ball, that's the silliest. Because now all people have to do is quote the same stat back to you when he inevitably posts high pass completion stats. When in reality pass accuracy isn't his problem.
More to the point, Fred was a 30 year old midfielder heavily reliant on physicality who has missed approx. three times as many games in the year and a bit since he left than he did in his entire time here, as a result of different muscle/tendon/ligament injuries.
Even if you think Fred was good, handing him another contract would have been an obviously stupid move. The time was right to move him on an replace him with a younger player. Even more so considering that in our widom we had brought in two other midfielders in their 30's.
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You seem to be having an argument with yourself here. Why would Palhinha have been discussed in-depth when he was never really a serious target for us?
It’s a fact Ugarte was dropped at PSG for his ability and use of the ball in possession and he’s come over here and we are seeing evidence of that with each passing game.
It’s also a weird comparison because even if we say both aren’t great on the ball, Palhinha did the defensive side of his job brilliantly in the PL. So far Ugarte isn’t even doing that, he has looked off the pace so far defensively and has been a fouling machine. So let him reach Palhinha’s level of defensive work before going on a weird rant about the difference in how they are treated.
I've been pretty patient with him so far, last couple of games I was actually pleasantly surprised, which I posted here.Are you going to keep making the same "I told you so" post after every bad game? Because that's an immensely tiresome way to post.
If you were predicting low passing accuracy before he arrived then it makes sense that people told you to keep quiet, as his career up to this point is characterised by high passing accuracy. And despite yesterday's anomalous performance in that regard, his overall passing accuracy since he arrived is indeed already 87%. Higher than any of our midfielders sustained across last season.
Of all the stats to use point to to back up your point about his ability on the ball, that's the silliest. Because now all people have to do is quote the same stat back to you when he inevitably posts high pass completion stats. When in reality pass accuracy isn't his problem.
But if you see him struggling to keep the ball under pressure, and then stat padding against weaker teams who dont press us with sideways/backwards passing to up his passing %, but still believe he is good with the ball, what can I even say
I've been pretty patient with him so far, last couple of games I was actually pleasantly surprised, which I posted here.
But if you see him struggling to keep the ball under pressure, and then stat padding against weaker teams who dont press us with sideways/backwards passing to up his passing %, but still believe he is good with the ball, what can I even say
Every player does this though. They all get better stats playing against weaker opposition, evened out by the matches against tougher opposition
Maybe I'm an anomaly but I kind of liked his performance.
It was no where bad as its made to be, he did have some losses of possesion but I kind of like that we now have a midfielder than can be a tackling fouling machine.
Looking forward to him alongside Mainoo to help keep his weaknesses simple and strengths elevated.
It was no where bad as its made to be, he did have some losses of possesion but I kind of like that we now have a midfielder than can be a tackling fouling machine.
Looking forward to him alongside Mainoo to help keep his weaknesses simple and strengths elevated.
Uhm, you can't properly discuss a player's quality and abilities without them being linked to us? What is the point of discussing any player then?
Ugarte was dropped because of better midfielders breaking through who were a much better fit for Enrique's football. I seriously don't get why this is so hard to grasp for some. It is not like he was dropped for Fellaini. Fabian Ruiz, Vitinha and Zaire-Emery are some of the best midfielders in Europe, so this whole "dropped because his shit ability on the ball" is taken so ridiculously out of context. Mainoo would be dropped for these players, it doesn't mean much when you look at the quality of these midfielders.
So you are judging his defensive abilities based on 108 minutes in the league? Come on, man.. we all know how good defensively he is. We saw it literally against Leicester where he kept breaking up play, and even started the attack for the first goal. One less than average game against Chelsea and he's suddenly shit defensively?
What is wrong about being a fouling machine if you don't get carded for it? Fernandinho did it, Caicedo was ridiculous yesterday, and Palhinha also fouled a lot. Ugarte doesn't do it more than them. It is a part of being a ball winner.