Man City's inevitable Treble

I remember walking down Deansgate 2001 ish and City had just won promotion back into the premiership. Their fans (not many) were singing and shouting etc and I congratulated one. It was more like a well done little neighbour, enjoy your moment, you’re no threat to me. How things changed :(
 
Real Name said:
We werent dominating but a 2007-09 was well on top in Europe I think.
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Yup, but not dominating. I dont think we ever have destroyed a team like Madrid 4-0. And yeah Madrid are not having the best of seasons in La Liga but they are no mugs. City made them look average.
My United loyalties aside, this is very very impressive from City. I don’t think it has sunk in yet with most people how great this is if they win the treble. And very annoying.
 
Rooney24 said:
Good point. Our starting line up in Barca in 99 cost around 37m. In todays money that would be around 67.5m.

Citys last night cost around 535m.

Its madness.
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Yeah and Chelsea’s is what, £600 million? Pep is just superb, annoyingly. Let me put it another way, if he were to manage United with no change in ownership of the two clubs, he would have won us the league already by now.
 
Imagine how nice it'll feel when we're singing "You can stick your fecking treble up your arse." next month when we're 2-0 up with 5 minutes to go at Wembley.
 
Ludens the Red said:
Going along these lines it’s almost too perfect a treble. It’s all just very straight forward. There’s no adversity, drama, comebacks, injuries or suspensions to key players to overcome, it’s all up until this stage just been ‘easy’. It’s basically like a football manager treble. City just mechanically cruising their way through with over powered tactics.

The finals will be won by complete ease by them too and I’m sure no city fan will give a toss and they shouldn’t but it is odd seeing it done this way when you see how United, Inter and Bayern won there’s for instance. Our juve, Liverpool, bayern comebacks. The horrific fa cup draws. Inter somehow overcoming that ridiculous Barca side playing with ten men at camp Nou. Roma bottling the title by inexplicably losing to sampdoria. Bayern completely bottling the finals the year before and then coming full circle, there was always something, a story. Deffo getting vibes from that “do city leave you cold” thread.
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We have bottled the CL for over 10 years. If that is enough for a story, we certainly qualify
 
DeGea said:
Yup, but not dominating. I dont think we ever have destroyed a team like Madrid 4-0. And yeah Madrid are not having the best of seasons in La Liga but they are no mugs. City made them look average.
My United loyalties aside, this is very very impressive from City. I don’t think it has sunk in yet with most people how great this is if they win the treble. And very annoying.
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And we didnt cook the books.

It seems you're a huge Pep fan.
 
All feels very sterile as a football fan.
The 99 Treble, I was more surprised it was done.
This one I would be more surprised if it wasn't.
 
Rooney24 said:
Good point. Our starting line up in Barca in 99 cost around 37m. In todays money that would be around 67.5m.

Citys last night cost around 535m.

Its madness.
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Our would be more than 67.5 in today’s market. But nowhere close to City‘s expensive team.
Yorke, Cole and Stam were expensive signings back then. What balanced it out was almost half of the 99 team being made of academy players. Plus our back up for the entire defence was 1 cheap player, the back up for midfield was an academy player, upfront we had quality but cheap Ole and Teddy as backup.
 
Gazautd18 said:
All feels very sterile as a football fan.
The 99 Treble, I was more surprised it was done.
This one I would be more surprised if it wasn't.
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Yeah I went into all those big european games feeling like an underdog. Largely because we were. We'd only been back in the competition for a few years having been out of it for a long time.
 
PepG said:
City will have reinforcements this summer regardless of winning the treble or not. Bernardo Silva, Gundogan, Laporte and may be even more will leave the club after the season ends so new players will be needed.
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They're at the stage prime Liverpool were in the 80's and 90's.

A well oiled machine, firing on all cylinders with only one or two perfectly suitable signings each season
 
Rooney24 said:
Good point. Our starting line up in Barca in 99 cost around 37m. In todays money that would be around 67.5m.

Citys last night cost around 535m.

Its madness.
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I think it might be way beyond 67 but still nowhere near City's.

I never really get this amazement at points totals. What kind of points tally do people think that '99 squad should have got. The bench really wasn't all that good outside of the CF positions.
 
Marwood said:
I think it might be way beyond 67 but still nowhere near City's.

I never really get this amazement at points totals. What kind of points tally do people think that '99 squad should have got. The bench really wasn't all that good outside of the CF positions.
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Yeah, the obsession with points totals is weird when it basically just reflects the depth of the squad or luck with injuries. If we're going by points totals then this Arsenal team are better than our treble winners which is very clearly not the case.

It also points to the depth of the league not being great, the fact that there were genuinely 10 teams this season who were facing relegation tells you how weak it is right now. There was also only one English team in the semis of either the CL or EL. I'd we want to use Europe as the yardstick then Italy is clearly superior this season and it's also had far more competitive titles races for the past few years.
 
Marwood said:
I think it might be way beyond 67 but still nowhere near City's.

I never really get this amazement at points totals. What kind of points tally do people think that '99 squad should have got. The bench really wasn't all that good outside of the CF positions.
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It's simple: if a team won all their games in the league they'd automatically be in the shout for the best champion of that league, ever. The more points you get, the closer you are to that standard.

Of course there's context with squad sizes and competing on multiple fronts but point totals are a valid factor.
 
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City's domination is a combination of two things, two things they wouldn't be as dominant without even with the money.

1. Pep

2. Everyone else viewing mere top four as a major success.
 
Marwood said:
I think it might be way beyond 67 but still nowhere near City's.

I never really get this amazement at points totals. What kind of points tally do people think that '99 squad should have got. The bench really wasn't all that good outside of the CF positions.
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Especially as this was the norm back then. Barca in 1998/99 also reached 79 points in La Liga and they had a very good team.
About half of our squad was made up of academy players back then.
 
adexkola said:
It's simple: if a team won all their games in the league they'd automatically be in the shout for the best champion of that league, ever. The more points you get, the closer you are to that standard.

Of course there's context with squad sides and competing on multiple fronts but point totals are a valid factor.
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Squad size is more than context. Its the very reason for the high points totals.
 
adexkola said:
I disagree. We've seen Liverpool get close to 100 points 3 times in the last 5 seasons. Fergie cleared 90 points a few times.
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Ok so if City only had Nick Butt to cover the CM positions, only Blomqvist to cover both wide positions, only P Neville to cover both fullback positions and David May as a backup CB, roughly what points tally do you think they'd amass?

Same? More? Less?

Liverpool had an incredible run of injury free seasons. As soon as the injuries kicked in we saw the problems a thin squad can create.
 
Edwards6 said:
Amazing what you can do with just 115 charges for cheating
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Sickening how they can just employ the most high profile lawyers to get them off charges. Sadly unlike Toney they will never get suitably punished for any of it whatsoever.
 
We got 91 points in 99/00. That was basically the same team as the treble winning one - minus Schmeichel
 
Dancfc said:
City's domination is a combination of two things, two things they wouldn't be as dominant without even with the money.

1. Pep

2. Everyone else viewing mere top four as a major success.
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The second factor isn't the cause of City's domination. It's the effect.
 
adexkola said:
I disagree. We've seen Liverpool get close to 100 points 3 times in the last 5 seasons. Fergie cleared 90 points a few times.
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When was the 3rd time for Liverpool? Also it was hardly sustainable for them. They suffered with injuries the season after winning the title (despite getting a 3 months covid break in their title winning season) as well as this season. We also reached 91 points in 1999/2000 but that was an exception and we weren’t burnt out afterwards.
Longterm you can only reach 90+ points with quality on the bench. That’s also how Chelsea did it in 2005 and 2006.
 
Got a gun manager, with the whole footballing side backing him, while also having close to unlimited funds to make sure said vision of manager is working, add in great depth due to said funds and its a combo that is rare.

Man City is arguably the best run sports team in the world ATM
 
Mmm-Qatarian said:
This paragraph perfectly captures the essence of why I'm vehemently opposed to the idea of Jassim taking over at United.
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Don't worry you will get your wish because the minute Ratcliffe got into bed with Glazers the possibility of that stopped
 
Daydreamer said:
The second factor isn't the cause of City's domination. It's the effect.
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Refusing to go the extra mile when you have an 8 point lead over them or getting in three underwhelming loans when you have an outside chance can't be put on City.

They may have advantages but no one bar Liverpool for a while (and even that was aided by a Coutinho windfall) seem to make any effort to even try and properly challenge them, be it by maximising the resources they have got and/or putting a solid structure in place.
 
Dancfc said:
Refusing to go the extra mile when you have an 8 point lead over them or getting in three underwhelming loans when you have an outside chance can't be put on City.

They may have advantages but no one bar Liverpool for a while (and even that was aided by a Coutinho windfall) seem to make any effort to even try and properly challenge them, be it by maximising the resources they have got and/or putting a solid structure in place.
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You make it seem like it’s such an easy thing to do.
 
Dancfc said:
City's domination is a combination of two things, two things they wouldn't be as dominant without even with the money.

1. Pep

2. Everyone else viewing mere top four as a major success.
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Last point doesn’t even make sense.
 
united_99 said:
When was the 3rd time for Liverpool? Also it was hardly sustainable for them. They suffered with injuries the season after winning the title (despite getting a 3 months covid break in their title winning season) as well as this season. We also reached 91 points in 1999/2000 but that was an exception and we weren’t burnt out afterwards.
Longterm you can only reach 90+ points with quality on the bench. That’s also how Chelsea did it in 2005 and 2006.
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My mistake, they got 92 points last season.
 
Rooney24 said:
Good point. Our starting line up in Barca in 99 cost around 37m. In todays money that would be around 67.5m.

Citys last night cost around 535m.

Its madness.
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This is nonsense though isn't it.

If I recall, we signed Keane for £4.75m (?) so you're saying he'd be valued at about £8.5m now? ok.
 
When we did our treble, Paul Dickov was scoring a last minute equaliser against Gillingham in the league 1 play off final. How things might be different if that never happened.
 
cpresc said:
This is nonsense though isn't it.

If I recall, we signed Keane for £4.75m (?) so you're saying he'd be valued at about £8.5m now? ok.
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£ 3.75 m. Was record British transfer in 1993. But he didn’t start in Barcelona in May 99, so a zero cost academy player had to replace him.
 
adexkola said:
I disagree. We've seen Liverpool get close to 100 points 3 times in the last 5 seasons. Fergie cleared 90 points a few times.
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Fergie would win the league with a couple of games to spare and play the youngsters and/or reserve guys for the last few games in the season when applicable. He did this routinely. Even in his last season, we dropped 7 points in the last 3/4 games meaning he would have got at least 96 points. Instead we got 89.

Point being it didn't really matter how many points you got as long as you got first place.
 
Righteous Steps said:
You make it seem like it’s such an easy thing to do.
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It's not an easy thing to do, but can you honestly say any team are currently doing everything they can to give themselves every chance? Even when they're in a position of advantage.

The same was being said about us in the mid 00s but unfortuently for us there was actually a club/manager back then that didn't read the script.

Righteous Steps said:
Last point doesn’t even make sense.
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To give one example you're the biggest club in the country and you have who many people regard as your best player tweeting "one step closer" about a top four finish.

Could you even imagine a Real Madrid player doing that while Atletico were crusing to 3 titles in a row and a possible treble?
 
The Corinthian said:
Fergie would win the league with a couple of games to spare and play the youngsters and/or reserve guys for the last few games in the season when applicable. He did this routinely. Even in his last season, we dropped 7 points in the last 3/4 games meaning he would have got at least 96 points. Instead we got 89.

Point being it didn't really matter how many points you got as long as you got first place.
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There were really only two seasons like this, the last season and 06-07.

Clearing 90 points was extremely unusual for any PL side until recently.
 
Powderfinger said:
There were really only two seasons like this, the last season and 06-07.

Clearing 90 points was extremely unusual for any PL side until recently.
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He dropped 11 points in the last 5 in the 00/01 season which would have got him 91 points...matching the total the season before.

My point being - Fergie would have cleared 90 points fairly regularly if he was playing a strong 11 every game after winning the league.
 
The Corinthian said:
Fergie would win the league with a couple of games to spare and play the youngsters and/or reserve guys for the last few games in the season when applicable. He did this routinely. Even in his last season, we dropped 7 points in the last 3/4 games meaning he would have got at least 96 points. Instead we got 89.

Point being it didn't really matter how many points you got as long as you got first place.
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Most insane point totals in recent times have been driven by tight title races. For example: the 18-19 title race that ended up with City at 98 points: none of those points were vain.

Yes, 1st place matters for the purpose of awarding titles. And your point about Fergie playing youth players is valid. But I'd need more context to declare a champion with 70 points better than a champion with 97 points. Was the league harder? Was squad size a factor? And so on.
 
The Corinthian said:
He dropped 11 points in the last 5 in the 00/01 season which would have got him 91 points...matching the total the season before.

My point being - Fergie would have cleared 90 points fairly regularly if he was playing a strong 11 every game after winning the league.
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And we can't assume a strong 11 wins every game post league being secured. The proper method would be to extrapolate form before the league is clinched.
 
adexkola said:
And we can't assume a strong 11 wins every game post league being secured. The proper method would be to extrapolate form before the league is clinched.
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It's a safe assumption to make. You can't extrapolate form if you change the starting 11 from the guys that have won the league to youth/reserve players.
 
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