Maguire | he stays!

Reserves it is then for him, this club act to soft, the clu/ten hag need to make it clear he is not getting no game time for united again, just like madrid do with players, same with city and Chelsea etc..
 
Fridge chutney said:
He is at his lowest ebb and already a meme, yet West Ham just offered £30M and 100k/week for him. It would be naive to think there won't be a host of suitors for him in 2-3 years time.

So why should he leave £7M on the table? I'd argue he is making the smart decision.
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He's not as his lowest ebb yet. If he stays and is kept on the bench he'll fall further out of favour and jeopardise his England career. He has every right to negotiate and in most cases there will be a compromise between all 3 parties (United, West Ham and Maguire) with each taking a hit. But its not like Maguire has nothing to lose by holding out, he has limited time left in the game.
 
I don't think that would make any difference. He/his agent wants the money from the contract, and/or doesn't really fancy West Ham.
 
Fridge chutney said:
He is at his lowest ebb and already a meme, yet West Ham just offered £30M and 100k/week for him. It would be naive to think there won't be a host of suitors for him in 2-3 years time.

So why should he leave £7M on the table? I'd argue he is making the smart decision.
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He’s not yet. He’s still in around his peak years. In two years time without any match practice and 32 years old CB with tarnished resume, I wonder who will offer him 100k a week?
 
Tyrion said:
Thats what a lot of fans don't get. The people in charge of the club can't just "get the deal done", unless the other parties agree, without paying absurd prices.

That said, the offer for Maguire is generous and I'd actually prefer to pay him to be at West Ham than at Unites.
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Yep, i agree, i think that would be best for all parties.
 
Enigma_87 said:
He’s not yet. He’s still in around his peak years. In two years time without any match practice and 32 years old CB with tarnished resume, I wonder who will offer him 100k a week?
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He doesn't need 100k/week to come out ahead in 2 years. He'll most likely get less but by staying at United, he won't need an additional 1-2 years on 100k to climb out of the 90k/week x 2 or 3 years hole that he leaves on the table by walking away from his current contract
 
Trequarista10 said:
He's not as his lowest ebb yet. If he stays and is kept on the bench he'll fall further out of favour and jeopardise his England career. He has every right to negotiate and in most cases there will be a compromise between all 3 parties (United, West Ham and Maguire) with each taking a hit. But its not like Maguire has nothing to lose by holding out, he has limited time left in the game.
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He's at the lowest ebb of his career so far. The rest is speculation.

Harry also has a lot to lose by walking away from his current contract, so his calculus is that his contract now is more valuable than what West Ham are offering over the long term for his career.
 
DavelinaJolie said:
I don't see how this bolsters your original post I quoted, where you said the club have a strong position too?
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Club is in strong position because he can potentially revive his career and potentially receive a good 1-2 years on top of his current contract at around 100k.

let’s assume the other scenario. He bags 200k for the next two years, assuming he drags his ass every day to the training ground, otherwise I’d fine him into oblivion - that’s 100k on top of what he will receive from WH.

After that I’m pretty sure he’ll receive peanuts as no sane club will want to pay him anywhere near 100k. He’d either receive part time contracts or pay as you play type of deal, assuming someone even wants him (looking at Bailly and his current value for example).

other scenario is receive 4 year contract at WH which essentially covers the two years at United. Then he’ll have some resale value and might receive a final good contract.
 
Fridge chutney said:
He is at his lowest ebb and already a meme, yet West Ham just offered £30M and 100k/week for him. It would be naive to think there won't be a host of suitors for him in 2-3 years time.

So why should he leave £7M on the table? I'd argue he is making the smart decision.
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He's not at his lowest yet imo. Another year without any competitive football, older, slower (I'd doubt he can get any slower but once you hit 30 you will get alot slower) and he'd hit a new low.

Tbh I don't really mind if he stay as long as he doesn't play. He singlehandedly kicked us out of the Europa League last season and I don't want any repeat of that. If he behaves ok else just send him to the reserves.
 
soralapio said:
First off, I will always side with the worker over the employer. If Maguire wants to stay, he is 100% entitled to the stupidly large contract United foolishly gave him. No arguments about that. What he isn't entitled to is a pay off to move elsewhere. He can stay and have his current contract, or leave and get whatever contract his next club is willing to give to him, and that's it. United owe him nothing in that case.

Also, I believe that if he stays, he is either purely motivated by money, or delusional. There is no universe in which he wins back his spot. He will never be a first choice (or even second choice) defender for Manchester United again, much less the captain. He is completely unsuited for the style of football we want to play, and he's not going to suddenly become faster, more agile etc at the age of 30. He's only going to get worse. I realize that in order to make it in sports you have to have incredibly high self-confidence, but this is ludicrous.
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It will be a lose lose situation for both parties if his service is no longer required by Man Utd. The logical solution is to pay the difference of his remaining contract and call it done.
 
Enigma_87 said:
Club is in strong position because he can potentially revive his career and potentially receive a good 1-2 years on top of his current contract at around 100k.

let’s assume the other scenario. He bags 200k for the next two years, assuming he drags his ass every day to the training ground, otherwise I’d fine him into oblivion - that’s 100k on top of what he will receive from WH.

After that I’m pretty sure he’ll receive peanuts as no sane club will want to pay him anywhere near 100k. He’d either receive part time contracts or pay as you play type of deal, assuming someone even wants him (looking at Bailly and his current value for example).

other scenario is receive 4 year contract at WH which essentially covers the two years at United. Then he’ll have some resale value and might receive a final good contract.
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Yep him staying at the club and rotting the next 2 years will cost him a fair bit too if he's genuinely rotting in the team. I think our proposal of meeting him halfway seems very fair for all parties. Maguire choosing the lose-lose option is pretty toxic in my books.

This is why I don't understand why ETH is seemingly giving him an option to stay at the club. If he's clear that Maguire will rot away in the reserves then this may change the outcome. As of now Maguire gets to enjoy the best of both worlds of playing a bit part role and cashing in, then getting a final decent payday in 2 years'.
 
JPRouve said:
I'd be surprised if it's the last contract, in fact I would worry about United bench shortening his career.
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Deep down, thick as he is, he would know that a 4-year deal with West Ham basically ends his career, without even the Saudis bailing him out at 34.
Mou Mou Land said:
He is being 'forced' to play for West Ham because he has been crap when he has tried to play as the manager wants him to , nothing more and nothing less.

The chance of losing his England place might change his mind, although Southgate seems to pick any old shite as long as he likes them, whether they are playing regularly or not.
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The United/West Ham plan will have him retire at West Ham = not winning any major trophy henceforth + money lost on wages, he is asking for some compensation for the money he would have otherwise earned by sticking to the current contract. And he's not even demanding that the entire loss be compensated for, which would be perfectly fine if you ask me, but just half of the total loss.

"He has been crap" argument doesn't hold any water. A contract was signed with the crap player moving him out of his comfort zone (the perfect fit for his abilities) to another club where he was found wanting. Like I said before, he is not moving to a top English side. Moving from United to West Ham, aged 30, is a huge demotion and he is absolutely right with his demands for compensation.
 
That Luckhurst tweet is ridiculous. Maguire is a bit of a dope and you'd imagine he'd be better off trying to find a way out, but he's clearly completely within his rights to ask for the money if he wants. I kinda think fair play to him.
 
Despise him, hope he never plays another minute for us. That being said we should have just paid him. At least we'd get £23million to reinvest.
 
Plastic Evra said:
Not pointing fingers at anyone but is it that different in essence with the speculated 17m€ in deferred wages that were due to de Jong by FC Barca ?
I feel people here last year were more sympathetic to the player in that hypothetical.
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Because performance-wise, FDJ never been a problem for Barcelona. They just can't afford his salary due to mismanagement.

On the other hand, we desperately need to get rid of Maguire because he's been a liability for us.

I can understand if he wants to fight for his place and keep his income. But it is clear as a day that his manager and teammates don't trust him any more.

If he can stop making people nervous and just do the basics correctly, I'm okay with him staying.
 
TheLord said:
Deep down, thick as he is, he would know that a 4-year deal with West Ham basically ends his career, without even the Saudis bailing him out at 34.

The United/West Ham plan will have him retire at West Ham = not winning any major trophy henceforth + money lost on wages, he is asking for some compensation for the money he would have otherwise earned by sticking to the current contract. And he's not even demanding that the entire loss be compensated for, which would be perfectly fine if you ask me, but just half of the total loss.

"He has been crap" argument doesn't hold any water. A contract was signed with the crap player moving him out of his comfort zone (the perfect fit for his abilities) to another club where he was found wanting. Like I said before, he is not moving to a top English side. Moving from United to West Ham, aged 30, is a huge demotion and he is absolutely right with his demands for compensation.
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I wonder if people are in Maguire's shoes, will they just give up the salary they are legally entitled to and just accept a reduced salary somewhere else without negotiation.
 
TheLord said:
Deep down, thick as he is, he would know that a 4-year deal with West Ham basically ends his career, without even the Saudis bailing him out at 34.
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My point was litteral because it is about money. It's very likely that he won't retire at 34 years old unless he wants to which means that he will be able to earn money even if it's a lower wage. He could easily follow the same steps than Jagielka and many other CBs.

Which isn't to say that he should forfeit any wage but that it's likely not his last contract.
 
ThierryHenry14 said:
I wonder if people are in Maguire's shoes, will they just give up the salary they are legally entitled to and just accept a reduced salary somewhere else without negotiation.
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He is only legally entitled to that money of he stays here. If we agree to sell him and he goes he isn't entitled to it.

He trying to have his cake and eat it. Either stay and be in the reserves or leave without the payoff. It isn't the clubs fault he can't prove his value to another club on his current wage.
 
peridigm said:
Exactly. Not sure why everyone is lashing out at him. I still think he will move before the end of the window, possibly on loan. With all the ACL injuries, there could be a more of them in the next two weeks and who knows what club will need an emergency England CB (for now).
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I think he'll go too. Don't care as long as he doesn't play.
 
lilcurt said:
He is only legally entitled to that money of he stays here. If we agree to sell him and he goes he isn't entitled to it.

He trying to have his cake and eat it. Either stay and be in the reserves or leave without the payoff. It isn't the clubs fault he can't prove his value to another club on his current wage.
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But he doesn't agree with the transfer without negotiation, isn't it? It is United no longer want his service,and why the employee in this case needs to take the consequence of reduced salary without compensation?
 
ThierryHenry14 said:
But he doesn't agree with the transfer without negotiation, isn't it?
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He can negotiate with the club sure. But we are 100% in our rights to say either go or rot in the reserves.

It comes down to if the player has any ambition and the mentality to play and succeed. It is becoming apparent that money is his primary driver.
 
lilcurt said:
He can negotiate with the club sure. But we are 100% in our rights to say either go or rot in the reserves.

It comes down to if the player has any ambition and the mentality to play and succeed. It is becoming apparent that money is his primary driver.
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Utd owe him the money though. It’s his. Sounds as much like Utd trying not to pay what they agreed to pay, as it does Maguire being primarily motivated by money.
 
Revan said:
Sure, no problem with him demanding to get x amount of money for him to leave.

At the same time, I think we are completely within our right to completely omit him from the team. Which is what many other clubs do when they want to incentivize a player to leave.
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Absolutely.
 
NicolaSacco said:
Utd owe him the money though. It’s his. Sounds as much like Utd trying not to pay what they agreed to pay, as it does Maguire being primarily motivated by money.
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Can you explain how they owe him the money?

Unless I'm missing something, he is asking for the sum of the difference in pay between his contract with us and his new one with West Ham over the next two years.

If I'm correct in that, then he isn't "due" this money at all. He is due the money if he fulfils his contract and stays the next to years. If all parties agree to a transfer (as they must in this scenario) then a kind of break clause is activated in a contract so we can sell and he can leave.

He is essentially playing an extra card here, saying he will only go if paid off. He can try and negotiate this, but we are not obliged to accept and he isn't owed it at all.

Happy to be proven wrong.
 
NicolaSacco said:
Utd owe him the money though. It’s his. Sounds as much like Utd trying not to pay what they agreed to pay, as it does Maguire being primarily motivated by money.
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He can rot in reserves if he wants what is “owed” to him. He is in this situation because he has performed poorly and no decent club will pay him the wages he is on. If he cant see that and wants the money, then he can kiss bye his career for next two years. It shouldn’t matter because he is throwing hissy fits for 70k per week more money despite earning millions already
 
Pronewbie said:
Yep him staying at the club and rotting the next 2 years will cost him a fair bit too if he's genuinely rotting in the team. I think our proposal of meeting him halfway seems very fair for all parties. Maguire choosing the lose-lose option is pretty toxic in my books.

This is why I don't understand why ETH is seemingly giving him an option to stay at the club. If he's clear that Maguire will rot away in the reserves then this may change the outcome. As of now Maguire gets to enjoy the best of both worlds of playing a bit part role and cashing in, then getting a final decent payday in 2 years'.
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Maybe trying to save his value till the end of the window? Last night having Lindelof put on instead of him was telling once again.
 
Fridge chutney said:
He doesn't need 100k/week to come out ahead in 2 years. He'll most likely get less but by staying at United, he won't need an additional 1-2 years on 100k to climb out of the 90k/week x 2 or 3 years hole that he leaves on the table by walking away from his current contract
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My point is that if he fits in the reserves for two years he won’t even get close to 50k let alone 100k. I’m not sure even a PL club would offer him part time contract and in lower leagues he’ll get 10-20k at best.

Saudi is not an option as he’s not marketable in any shape or form.
 
Maguire negotiated a contract with West Ham who dont value him at the same level. He is only entitled to get that extra money if he stays. There is no legal binding aspect here that United should compensate him for his failure and consequently poor evaluation from his future employer.

If he doesn’t want to let go off the money, let him stay and rot in reserve. Many players move on with reduction in salary as their worth decreases. United needs to take the financial hit and remind all players that this isn’t charity. If you dont perform on the level of your contract, then you wont be compensated on leaving.
 
I guess we can litigate what's moral and legal but at the end of the day it boils down to Maguire having to agree to be transferred and him not finding the terms convincing enough at this point (reportedly).
 
Not paying Harry what he is ask for to leave so that United can pay him his full wage and tank his transfer value even more is the most Glazers are still in charge move you can possibly think of.
 
ThierryHenry14 said:
I wonder if people are in Maguire's shoes, will they just give up the salary they are legally entitled to and just accept a reduced salary somewhere else without negotiation.
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They are not entitled for future salary ffs.

if I was in his shoes I’d want to play and not be a constant meme and hated even from the own fans.
 
Reapersoul20 said:
this is a really bad opinion
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Why? I used to have a lot of sympathy for him as I thought people were deriding him just because he wasn’t playing football well despite trying his best. I even gave him a massive cheer when he came on at Wembley against Newcastle.

However, now, I can have absolutely no sympathy for a man who rejects £100k a week and the captaincy at a Premier League club just to sit on the bench and collect a vast underserved paycheque every week at a club where he’s not liked by the fans or manager. As you said, it’s my opinion, and my opinion is that he can have absolutely no qualms about being booed now, and very much deserves to lose his England place for Euro 2024.
 
ThierryHenry14 said:
I wonder if people are in Maguire's shoes, will they just give up the salary they are legally entitled to and just accept a reduced salary somewhere else without negotiation.
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Of course they wouldn't. It would be good to negotiate with many of the buy high, sell cheap impatient posters in the transfer forum though.
 
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