LOCAL VS FOREIGN BASED SUPPORTERS

devilish

Juventus fan who used to support United
Joined
Sep 5, 2002
Messages
62,923
It is typical. An argument starts, and all of a suddenly someone say " Hey you cannot judge the team on this or that after all you are not a local"

Typical Local based behavior.

From the local based supporter viewManutd is our religion, our everything, something we dont want to share. Critising Manutd is like critising our city and this is something we cannot tolerate. Support the team but you have NO right in influencing our heritage

From the foreign based view Manutd is not of the locals but of everyone. Many of us have have supported the team for ages, suffering when we needed to suffer like all the locals. We pay big money to come at OT and we spend a fortune to follow Manutd. Without our Money Manutd would not be half of the empire it is now and is not fair that we are treated that way.

A way to control Glory hunters or a clear sign of Racism? YOU DECIDE
 
Nice the way, you've took the best points from an outsider and the opposite from a local.
 
Com'on you're taking it too seriously.. Not all locals are like that! There are some good ppl here at the RedCafe too.. cool it and btw these topic have been debated many many time...

<img src="graemlins/angel.gif" border="0" alt="[Angel]" />
 
Another distinction can be made between ex-pat and foreign supporter - but whether any of these distinctions have any relevance or not is another matter, I personally don't think they do. One funny line is that a non match goer doesn't know what match goers think, despite loads of match goers posting their opinions on here - far more than talk goes on during the match - and that their view of the game is more accurate, despite it being much harder to see what is going on for example at the other end of the pitch, or having slow motion replays, from different angles etc.
 
Originally posted by pjaya:
<strong>Com'on you're taking it too seriously.. Not all locals are like that! There are some good ppl here at the RedCafe too.. cool it and btw these topic have been debated many many time...

<img src="graemlins/angel.gif" border="0" alt="[Angel]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
devilish only registered in september though.
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I disagree, Neil. You can't beat watching the game from the stands, TV is good, but it doesn't give you the complete picture, mainly because, cameras zoom in.
 
Originally posted by Spoony:
<strong>I disagree, Neil. You can't beat watching the game from the stands, TV is good, but it doesn't give you the complete picture, mainly because, cameras zoom in.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I find I always want to watch the game on TV afterwards to see what really happened, was it really a penalty for example, and to fully appreciate the build up to a goal. You get to see off the ball movement, and the shape of a team, better, I agree - but Sky Interactive allows you to pick your camera angles now anyway, and you get a much better idea of individual technique. I agree that highlights are a complete distortion though.
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Originally posted by devilish:
<strong>

or a clear sign of Racism?</strong><hr></blockquote>


i think that's a bit strong mate, but i know where you're coming from.

the 'local' fan thing is pretty much redundant now, especially when a team contains players from every corner of the world who have no geographical / emotional ties to the club.

though those who say that you get a clearer picture from being at the match as opposed to watching it on TV are spot on.
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At the Maccabi game I was near the goal but the goals were so fast that I barely registered that he'd shot into the net let alone properly appreciate it. Different parts of the ground have different views too.
 
I don't understand why the foreign fans often claim they are as good supporters as those who attend the games regularly, it's obvious that we're not.

another interesting aspect is the manchester born and bread who dislike the foreign tourists. Saw a documentary on Liverpool and they estimated that the football clubs alone attract about one million tourists / year. United do the same and this is the same as money for eveyone within public service from hotels to taxi drivers. So it's an interesting thing to first say you love your city and then say you hate the hand that feeds it.
 
Originally posted by michael owen's mum:
<strong>


though those who say that you get a clearer picture from being at the match as opposed to watching it on TV are spot on.</strong><hr></blockquote>

agreed, with you and spoony..

altho', neil made some good points about checking, the highlights for possible pens etc etc...but on the whole, its much better to watch from in the stadium, you get a much better idea how the players performed, movement of the ball, build up etc etc.

nothing beats it TBH.
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Originally posted by giggzy:
<strong>

agreed, with you and spoony..

altho', neil made some good points about checking, the highlights for possible pens etc etc...but on the whole, its much better to watch from in the stadium, you get a much better idea how the players performed, movement of the ball, build up etc etc.

nothing beats it TBH.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I think they're complementary, both have different strengths and weaknesses. I'd rather go to the match just for the atmosphere though, even if the atmosphere can be a bit lacking sometimes, and I'm the only one singing in my section.
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Originally posted by AhmedDimwitson:
<strong>
another interesting aspect is the manchester born and bread who dislike the foreign tourists. Saw a documentary on Liverpool and they estimated that the football clubs alone attract about one million tourists / year. United do the same and this is the same as money for eveyone within public service from hotels to taxi drivers. So it's an interesting thing to first say you love your city and then say you hate the hand that feeds it.</strong><hr></blockquote>

don't think anyone hates it...

but its silly to say 'foreign' fans feed our city...when quite clearly there are more local match goers than non..


we've got a good mix.....IMO.
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Originally posted by Neil Thomson:
<strong>
I think they're complementary, both have different strengths and weaknesses. I'd rather go to the match just for the atmosphere though, even if the atmosphere can be a bit lacking sometimes, and I'm the only one singing in my section.</strong><hr></blockquote>

at the match you see every little off-the-ball incident. . .fouls, runs, shouts, any incident which the TV cameras miss you can see live.

then you can go home and watch the slow-mo replay on video.
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Originally posted by giggzy:
<strong>

agreed, with you and spoony..

altho', neil made some good points about checking, the highlights for possible pens etc etc...but on the whole, its much better to watch from in the stadium, you get a much better idea how the players performed, movement of the ball, build up etc etc.

nothing beats it TBH.</strong><hr></blockquote>

very true indeed, I've been once to OT during the early eighties and I was immense with the whole atmosphere and until now I could still get ghoosebump recalling those wonderful moments!
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Originally posted by michael owen's mum:
<strong>

at the match you see every little off-the-ball incident. . .fouls, runs, shouts, any incident which the TV cameras miss you can see live.

then you can go home and watch the slow-mo replay on video.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yeah I agree about the larger picture, though some of the alternative feeds on Sky Digital aren't so zoomed in. But even with my glasses on, if I'm behind the goal I find it very difficult to work out who's who at the other end of the pitch let alone form a decent judgement about it.
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Originally posted by devilish:
<strong>A way to control Glory hunters or a clear sign of Racism? YOU DECIDE</strong><hr></blockquote>
United have attracted a strong foreign following, I remember there were Maltese fans at the first game I went to and that was a long time ago! We welcomed them then and for my part I welcome them now. However, you have to remember that over the last decade or so there is a certain type of ‘fan’ who has emerged who we call ‘glory hunters’. They live in the UK and abroad. The point about these people is that if, for example, we went 26 years without winning the league, they’d more than likely start going to Highbury or Anfield. So we don’t much like them. And their most noticable trait is that they start slagging the team when things aren’t perfect. I don’t mean criticising – on here we have Neil T, Julian Denny, lots of others criticising but they don’t slag players off like some do. If you say Phil Neville is not the ideal person for our defensive central midfield slot, a lot of people will agree with you. Saying “If P Nev can play for United, so can I” is going to get people annoyed. It doesn’t mean they’re racists.
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I personally like MUTV, you get the match, then you get a player from it analysing either the defence or the attack, then you get ProZone, as well as all the observations of former united players and the phone-ins. Collectively I think you get a better picture of it than just going to the game, though obviously doing all the above is best possible.
 
Originally posted by giggzy:
<strong>

don't think anyone hates it...

but its silly to say 'foreign' fans feed our city...when quite clearly there are more local match goers than non..


we've got a good mix.....IMO.</strong><hr></blockquote>

ahh, I wasn't talking about the clubs economy but about the influence the tourists have on your local economy. United having a big foreign fan base has a bigger effect as well.
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I don't mind foreign fans at all.

It's those nasty Mancs that annoy me! ;)
 
Originally posted by Spoony:
<strong>I disagree, Neil. You can't beat watching the game from the stands, TV is good, but it doesn't give you the complete picture, mainly because, cameras zoom in.</strong><hr></blockquote>

In that case doesn't it mean that the match goers don't have the complete picture ;)
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There are some local fans or Mancs who now live overseas who obviously think that they are "better" fans than others. I do not agree.

However, there are differences between local and overseas fans. Recognising difference is not racist ot bigoted but discriminating based solely on sterotypes based on race, colour or creed is.

Fans who have never been to OT and may never even have been to England will always find it difficult to truly know what it means to be a United fan when you grew up as such in Manchester. How could you? As someone who grew up in Manchester I will never be able to have the same insight into say baseball or gridiron as I would if I was born and raised in the States. Or know what Sumo means to the Japanese or kickboxing to the Thai's. It doesn't mean that I can't be a faithful and loyal supporter of these sports, just that my appreciation will be different. No neccesarily worse.

However, I would be very careful, no matter how convinced of my viewpoint, before I started getting too negative about my sport or team of choice when discussing it with a local because I would accept that my appreciation of a sport might have a different cultural meaning and/or importance to someone who grew up eating and breathing the sport.

Not better or worse - just different.
 
Originally posted by Wibble:
<strong>There are some local fans or Mancs who now live overseas who obviously think that they are "better" fans than others. I do not agree.

However, there are differences between local and overseas fans. Recognising difference is not racist ot bigoted but discriminating based solely on sterotypes based on race, colour or creed is.

Fans who have never been to OT and may never even have been to England will always find it difficult to truly know what it means to be a United fan when you grew up as such in Manchester. How could you? As someone who grew up in Manchester I will never be able to have the same insight into say baseball or gridiron as I would if I was born and raised in the States. Or know what Sumo means to the Japanese or kickboxing to the Thai's. It doesn't mean that I can't be a faithful and loyal supporter of these sports, just that my appreciation will be different. No neccesarily worse.

However, I would be very careful, no matter how convinced of my viewpoint, before I started getting too negative about my sport or team of choice when discussing it with a local because I would accept that my appreciation of a sport might have a different cultural meaning and/or importance to someone who grew up eating and breathing the sport.

Not better or worse - just different.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Good post
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Originally posted by AhmedDimwitson:
<strong>

ahh, I wasn't talking about the clubs economy but about the influence the tourists have on your local economy. United having a big foreign fan base has a bigger effect as well.</strong><hr></blockquote>

yep..


Old Trafford..or manchester united is a great attraction to tourists...


we also have the largest student population in Europe...so i suppose, they feed the city n'all. <img src="graemlins/nervous.gif" border="0" alt="[Nervous]" />
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Originally posted by pjaya:
<strong>

very true indeed, I've been once to OT during the early eighties and I was immense with the whole atmosphere and until now I could still get ghoosebump recalling those wonderful moments!</strong><hr></blockquote>

kinell... its like a library nowadays! more atmosphere in a graveyard!! ;)
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Wibble nailed it on the head. What can foreigners do to avoid the stereotype set by the locals?
 
Originally posted by Canes1935:
<strong>Wibble nailed it on the head. What can foreigners do to avoid the stereotype set by the locals?</strong><hr></blockquote>

TBH, i hate non-manchester born n' bred english united supporters... foreign fans are ok. ;)


don't they have a local club to support or sommat??? ;)

and shouldn't this thread be titled 'local vs outside supporters'?
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glory hunter till death!
if we don't beat west ham on saturday i might have to bust out my ronaldo real madrid kit...
 
Originally posted by devilish:
<strong>It is typical. An argument starts, and all of a suddenly someone say " Hey you cannot judge the team on this or that after all you are not a local"

Typical Local based behavior.

From the local based supporter viewManutd is our religion, our everything, something we dont want to share. Critising Manutd is like critising our city and this is something we cannot tolerate. Support the team but you have NO right in influencing our heritage

From the foreign based view Manutd is not of the locals but of everyone. Many of us have have supported the team for ages, suffering when we needed to suffer like all the locals. We pay big money to come at OT and we spend a fortune to follow Manutd. Without our Money Manutd would not be half of the empire it is now and is not fair that we are treated that way.

A way to control Glory hunters or a clear sign of Racism? YOU DECIDE</strong><hr></blockquote>
From the local born players view....blah,blah,

From the foreign born players view....blah,blah,
Keanoooooooooo

<img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" />
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The only way you can differentiate between glory hunters and true fans is not by where they live, but by the passion and love for the team. Many of us, foreign fans, would be at every Utd's game home and away IF we lived in England. If I could afford it, I swear I would fly to every possible Utd game. I envy the blokes who grew up in Manchester and are lucky enough to enjoy the games live. But the mancs should also appreciate that many of us have followed Utd since decades (35 years in my case). This despite having very limited information on our beloved team, watching 2 weeks stale Big League games on tv but still screaming and sighing as if it were live, making do with the odd Shoot or Match at the barber's shop and listening to BBC sports news on a radio with an antenna as long as an electric pole at hours when we should be long long long in bed. And finally that we successfully survived the pre-internet era, we are now taxed second rate...

I also know of fans who boast of being from manchester, but only go to games so that they can see what's inside the fans sandwichs. These muppets know more about who wasted how much money on what jersey than about the players performance. I am sure they are more thrilled about the Saturday "outing" rather than the joy of watching the players live.

I'll rather be 3000 miles away in front of my tv, with a crate of beer, and punching air,kicking the sofa and screaming my lungs off. At the end of the game, all true fans will FEEL the same, either extreme joy or extreme sadness depending on the results.
 
My advice to foreign Reds is to try and get a ticket for an away game if you are gonna spend all that money making the trip...

You can go to Old Trafford anytime and see a load of Reds.

You can visit another city and have a whale of a time (Guaranteed) at an away match.
 
Oh Christ! Not this again? This is as bad and as old as the 'Who is a real United fan and who isn't and what is the critera for a real fan. Get over it. As I have said before, we are all fans and support the team through thick and thin. What does it matter if one gets to see a match at Old Trafford or watch it on tv? I watch as many matches as I can on television here and what I cannot watch I at least try to listen on the internet. So am I less of a fan because I cannot see a match live? I seriously doubt it. This topic is so old.
 
Originally posted by Canes1935:
<strong>Wibble nailed it on the head. What can foreigners do to avoid the stereotype set by the locals?</strong><hr></blockquote>

I think the thing that annoys most ppl (well me annyway ;) ) are the fans who have recently decided to support Man Utd. Imo you have to grow up supporting a club to really be able to apreciate them. "Choosing a team" as a grown man is lame imo.

Ive never been to OT (seen Utd once in Dublin though) and i probably never will be able to go on a regular basis (hoping to make it a few times a yr in the not too distant future) but i do consider myself a 100% red.

I wouldnt call meself a diehard though as for several reasons i am not willing to go there every odd week etc and if i were to call meself a diehard what would you call a season ticket holder?
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Manchester United are a team who like to boast about their worldwide support, and why not we have the best support of any club on the planet. I do not come from Manchester, nor do I come from England. I come from Ireland and live in Germany but I am a United fan since 1967, after seeing George Best , Dennis Law , Bobby Charlton , and I continue to follow my team from over here in D land. I have created a rule at work that we all came to agree on, the rule is that in order for you to be able to hang a team pic of your favourite club on our canteen wall that club has to have won either the Domestic double in their homeland or a European trophy and those trophies MUST be in the photo. On our wall we have the following 1 photo Werder Bremen with Cup Winners Cup, 1 photo Schalke 04 with Uefa cup, 1 photo Dortmund with Champions League Cup, 2 photos Bayern München 1 with uefa cup, 1 with Champions league cup. 4. Photos Manchester United , 2 of our double winning teams, one with European Cup Winners Cup and one with the lot. I am proud to look at those photos everyday. It makes my breakfast taste just that little bit better :D
 
Originally posted by 26 may 1999:
<strong>And some people would call you sad for that.

;) </strong><hr></blockquote>

and I would call them envious
:D :D :D
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Devilish, how about getting behind the club and supporting them instead of bringing up the shite slinging topics you post here. Your on the Nevilles, your on Sir Alex, your on Veron, and your on the Locals. How about something supporting the club win , lose or draw.
 
i personally think that if ticket allocation was favoured towards the 'local' supporters, rather than those from further afeild (who are more likely to spend money in the megastore!). Then the atmosphere in O.T would be 10 times better as the 'local' supporters have O.T in their in their blood. Which would encourage the team to play better at times!. I am a regular at O.T and i can say at times i feel ashamed that 2000 traveling away fans can make more noise than 65000 Reds. Thus having an effect on the teams performance!!! <img src="graemlins/devil.gif" border="0" alt="[Devil]" />
 
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