I'm not sure where I said that about Maguire but I rate him pretty highly and was disappointed United didn't sign him. Don't think there's much difference between him and VVD tbh. If at all.
Liverpool 2018/19
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I'm not sure where I said that about Maguire but I rate him pretty highly and was disappointed United didn't sign him. Don't think there's much difference between him and VVD tbh. If at all.
So you base how good a manager is on their trophies - regardless of calibre if said trophy or when it was - over attractive, exciting football and clearly improving their teams?
Each to their own - but personally I like seeing what Poch and Klopp are doing. Great football and turned their teams around
Because we have a lot of pricks as fans.
And winning nothing. Winning things is kind of the point.
They'd won a European Cup, a UEFA cup and 6 league titles?
'Spoilt' pricks.
Just improving a team is good and all but you have to start winning stuff. Take Poch for example, how much more he can improve that team until they win something or the main stars start to leave?
Hadn’t they dropped off completely in the years prior to Klopp’s arrival though? They’d finished nowhere in the league for a while I think.
Not much considering Levy has given him literally no money this summer.
Their next step on the transfer market will probably be splashing cash on a new top CB.
You have done really well to win 3 trophies during a transition period, but the football has been mainly poor. I assume that Utd fans are accepting this because you're in transition after Sir Alex. But I think your club has a huge call to make when Jose does leave. Do you continue to prioritise pragmatic football and completely sacrifice what your club was built on (for the most part) from 1945-2013 by appointing another defensive minded manager? Or do you perhaps take a risk by appointing say Poch and get back your reputation for entertainment but with less of a guarantee of trophies?
There is nothing quite like looking forward to every single game anticipating exciting edge of seat football and the side Klopp has built rarely lets us down in that respect. I was lucky enough to be an LFC fan during our heyday and although I would love to obviously get back to those times, from a trophy perspective, I realise that its only 8 years since we nearly went into admin, we're still building and its been a very bumpy road.
It does fell now tho that we're close to the finished article and under normal circumstances, considering the money we've spent I would say yes you're 100% right we should challenge for the title. But this City team is not normal and if they hit 100 points again it will be virtually impossible to challenge them. If that happens and we get 85+ points I wouldn't be too upset. If City (or any other team) win the league with 85 points and we don't challenge at all that would be a huge disappointment.
Well his team is still a pretty good team.
I'd say they are a European heavyweight though surely?
Liverpool probably won't finish within 10 points of City, and in my opinion that's not really challenging. If we get to May and Liverpool are still in it, than you can say they challenged for the title. But being best of the rest and have City rap up the title in late March isn't really challenging.
They had finished 9th and 13th in the 2 years before he arrived, 4 years later were champions.
'Must' according to who? Will he spontaneously combust if he doesn't?
Depends how you define heavyweight. They’re not in the United/Bayern/Madrid bracket though.
Probably according to the people who sanctioned the transfers?
I thought he was going to after that second goal today.
The people who pay his wages, I imagine.
Good fair post and good point in bold.
This is what some of the fanbase need to decide as right now they want it all and fast. They want instant success but don't want JM to replace younger players with experience. They want to develop our youngsters but won't accept the inconsistencies that come in performance by taking such a stance.
Personally the club needs some stability. A DoF will also help.
Jurgen Klopp was allocated a large transfer kitty for the sole purpose of winning the premier league title. You do not spend north of £175 million inside a year just to end up with a typically standard top 4 finish.
"But City were too good for us" is pretty sad excuse after the quality (and costly) additions Klopp has made to a squad that was good enough to reach the CL final. He need's win the title this season, no ifs no buts.
I think it's fair to say Klopp has managed the second biggest club in Germany and one of the most wealthy in the world. He's not had some hard life with little opportunity to succeed.
Its very easy for me to say this because my team hasn't had recent success, so getting such a high level of entertainment is great but if I was Utd fan, especially one who had supported the team during the lean times of the 70s and 80s I would probably want to take the risk and get back the DNA of the club ie swashbuckling entertaining football. And the great thing is the two aren't mutually exclusive - its still possible to entertain and win. It might just take a bit longer to get the balance right.
Yeah, exactly. Didn't you lose 6-1 to Stoke in Rodgers' final full season? Klopp has completely turned you around, nobody in the league wants to play you anymore. He's spent money but mostly through player sales (this summer has been his only real 'splurge') so it was always going to take a couple of seasons before it became his team. Getting you to a CL final is an immense achievement, first English team since Chelsea in 2012 I believe, and he did so playing some wonderful football. No shame in losing to a Madrid side who are winning the competition for fun these days, especially since you lost because of two howlers and a wonder goal, little a manager can do about that. He's accomplished a fantastic rebuild job and you now have genuine quality across the pitch, I won't pretend he doesn't irritate me but you cannot deny that he's done a great job and it's totally understandable that the fans are behind him.
I think most United fans would begrudgingly admit he's done well, to be fair. I think if you look at it from the angle of 'No trophies? Not a success' then you have tunnel vision and aren't appreciating the position you were in when he took over. It's not as if he's taken over Barcelona and had them playing great football but not winning a trophy, you were in no mans land in the league under Rodgers and like I said, had completely wasted the Suarez money. I think the frustration with some United fans comes with the fact that people do tend to big up Klopp and Pochettino to stupid levels, whilst hammering Mourinho and calling him past it, useless etc, which is just utterly ridiculous. Said it before but he's a manager who has won everything in football and is deserving of respect, and whilst Klopp and Poch have done great work they have a hell of a long way to go to even be considered on his level.
At the end of last season Jose was asked can Utd win the title this season if City get 100 points again - and his answer "no, we can't get 101 points". he also said last season's 81 points was a great achievement.
We can only take 6 points off City, we can't directly affect anything else they do. If they hit those heights again it's game over for everyone else.
Basically, yeah.
I think this thread had gone off track.
Anyway, based solely on today's performance, I thought Liverpool were great. They were playing the sort of football that united should be playing. Its really difficult to say this as a united fan, but they are a much better side then us
Anyway, based solely on today's performance, I thought Liverpool were great. They were playing the sort of football that united should be playing. Its really difficult to say this as a united fan, but they are a much better side then us
I agree and had the same conversation with another red in work earlier.
I do think United aren't as far away as some make out though. The squad is full of youth and quality, it just needs stripping back somewhat and a clear philosophy.
It's blatantly obvious though that our squad is in a much better shape now than it has been since SAF and that's down to Jose.
The question is are Dortmund a heavyweight or not? I would say yes
Is it weird that the idea of watching Salah, Mane and Firmino didn't excite me as much as it should have today? The thing that excited me the most was our back lot: Alisson, TAA, VvD and Robertson starting on the FIRST day of the season (not half way through like January). West Ham weren't the best of tests but this is the sort of club we concede against time and again (last season Gomez switched off completely and let Lanzini score). Gomez switched off again today and Alisson had a Karius moment but on the whole our defenders did the defending properly.
Oh yeah, and Keita.
Oh yeah, and Keita.
I don't think you're that far off either - but I do think you have a few players (Pogba, Rashford, Martial etc) who would flourish more under a Poch type manager. If you keep those players until the change happens it will mean the new man having to buy less.
No offense, but isn't that to be expected from a club with (by a country mile) the highest net spend together with City and PSG since Mou took over?
You're making excuses for him. Klopp is a lucky man, lucky enough that if he somehow finishes outside of the top 4 with Liverpool he would retain his job without question, regardless of the money he spent, and the Liverpool fans wouldn't bat an eyelid.
Despite spending mere peanuts by comparison to Klopp's expenditure, Jose finishing outside the top 4 will see him promptly sacked with immediate effect. And the United fans, myself included, will be in full agreement with the decision.
Expectations.
I thought Jose and Klopp have roughly spent the same since Jose arrived at Utd - do you expect Utd to win the title if City get 100 points this season?
And it almost cost them a top 4 finish in the PL. Now their squad looks to be deeper so they should be more capable of competing for multiple fonts.
Yeah, I do.
But unlike many of the spoiled brats among our fanbase, I won't whine and cry about it should it not happen.
If we beat City twice and beat everyone else it won't matter if they get 100 points. Same goes for Liverpool.
I don't think net spend is a stick to hit the club with though as there are a number of factors to consider when you look at what needed, and still needs, to be done.
Essentially post SAF we have had to replace;
Vidic
Ferdinand
Evra
Carrick
Scholes
Giggs
Rooney
van Persie
All world class players who were hitting the end of their powers/careers.
That is some rebuild and emphasises just how big the job was and why it is essentially still on going three managers in.
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