[gaffs]

I think we can all see what ETH likes about Martinez, but the squad is so lacking in confidence and basic football skill that his weaknesses are being exposed.

One day if ETH gets the chance to build a squad for the football he wants to play then Martinez will be perfect.

However until that day comes Martinez will need to adapt and other players will have to cover for him.

I think your are right. And if you are then this is a huge mistake from ETH.

We need players who are ready to go now.

 

[Chief123]

Carragher on MNF saying him at CB won't work in the PL, Neville didn't flat out disagree with him. The same pair that said Pep's football would never work in the PL

I don’t recall Neville and Carragher ever saying Pep’s football can never work in EPl.

Much like Pep's football if the opposition can't get the ball off of you you can protect your CB's pretty well

Opposition rarely get into City’s final 3rd. Yet they still have 3 centre backs who are all over 6ft. There’s a reason for it. If height wasn’t an issue, every team would play shorter players who are great on the ball with a lot better centre of gravity. Teams don’t play tall defenders for a random reason.

 

[sglowrider]

If Shaw gets injured and we have to play Malacia. Can we then start Martinez (5ft 8) as the Left CB and Malacia (5ft 7) as the LB?

 

[Adnan]

 

[Adnan]

 

[criticalanalysis]

Thanks for posting this. It was exactly my impression of his game against Brentford also.

People already made their minds up about how he's weak, short and loses every aerial ball when it's actually more closer to the opposite.

The fact the rest of his teammates are so shit to reacting to first, second and third balls is way more alarming. He's not been fantastic but the hyperbole making it out like he's a lower league player is truly outstanding from our fanbase.

Unfortunately, he's likely to be made a scapegoat because narratives.

 

[roonster09]

Would love to see what the replies would be for this post. I'm assuming this will be ignored and usual "how they won so many duels vs Martinez" will be posted.

 

[Adnan]

Thanks for posting this. It was exactly my impression of his game against Brentford also.

People already made their minds up about how he's weak, short and loses every aerial ball when it's actually more closer to the opposite.

The fact the rest of his teammates are so shit to reacting to first, second and third balls is way more alarming. He's not been fantastic but the hyperbole making it out like he's a lower league player is truly outstanding from our fanbase.

Unfortunately, he's likely to be made a scapegoat because narratives.

You were correct in your assessment which is backed up by the post above.

He's just arrived at the club and needs time to settle and acclimatise to new surroundings. I honestly can't believe some of the comments I've read in this thread since the Brentford game. It seems like people want their biases confirmed, and those biases don't correlate to the reality of the game in question. The reality is that Thomas Frank's tactic of targeting our left hand side failed.

 

[caid]

Yeah he's probably being unfairly criticised. I suspect that in a lot of cases Brentford probably picked the ball up from the headers he won. Picking up the 2nd ball, picking up loose passes, winning 50:50's (or even challenging for them) and theres a few examples of shaw missing headers in the mix there so maybe its been misdirected more than inaccurate?
I'm not necessarily worried about it but its something we need to adjust to potentially at least on set pieces. I mean theres other ways around it - stop giving away cheap free kicks in our own half, maybe bring in a tall ish midfielder etc. Or get a goal keeper who will attempt to control his 6 yard box.
Mascherano was 5'7 or something and Barcelona managed.

 

[Adnan]

Yeah he's probably being unfairly criticised. I suspect that in a lot of cases Brentford probably picked the ball up from the headers he won. Picking up the 2nd ball, picking up loose passes, winning 50:50's (or even challenging for them) and theres a few examples of shaw missing headers in the mix there so maybe its been misdirected more than inaccurate?
I'm not necessarily worried about it but its something we need to adjust to potentially at least on set pieces. I mean theres other ways around it - stop giving away cheap free kicks in our own half, maybe bring in a tall ish midfielder etc. Or get a goal keeper who will attempt to control his 6 yard box.
Mascherano was 5'7 or something and Barcelona managed.

Agreed.

What it ultimately comes down to is having players with intelligence who understand and carry out the strategy put forth by the manager. The Brentford manager's strategy was a very basic one where his aim was to go direct towards Martinez attempting to win the second balls, but the strategy failed. But unfortunately for us, our goalkeeper decided to help them.

 

[Harry190]

Didn't mind the lost header for the goal. I've seen Smalling and bigger players miss those. Thought he was a bit slow and off the pace though. Like everyone else. Expected him to be more dynamic and aggressive, bit like Koulibaly.

 

[RedC]

What a shock, people have been uttering complete nonsense, based on the shite opinions of shite pundits.

 

[A-man]

Now the guy has edited the movie in such a way you can’t really see to whom the second ball goes, but I think there are actually quite a few second balls that are up for grabs. If it is a normal amount for 45 minutes I really don’t know, but I can see how the tactics worked out for them. They could easily play out from our press and move the game up the pitch.

This is a problem we also have had with both Smalling and Maguire, who are both very strong in the air but not so good at directing the ball, and the opponents win it back too often.

 

[sullydnl]

Indeed.

If teams kept just trying to target Martinez in the air then I'd be delighted, because I don't think that's the best way to attack us even before we get better at winning second balls.

Unfortunately Brentford also pressed the hell out of us, which was a lot more effective. Our defence struggles a lot more with the ball at their own feet than in the air.

 

[Bestietom]

He could be used as a DM.

 

[Borys]

If the opposition will be trying to lump long balls on Martinez side, sensible thing to do would be to have more players who will fight for second ball just ahead of the defensive line. I don't think you can do it with Eriksen as the deepest midfielder.
We probably need to be more compact between back 4 and midfield (bye bye Bruno), and unfortunately I can see McTominay getting his place back soon. Unless we buy an actual midfielder.

 

[Teja]

He'll be fine. I'm not worried.

The thing I'm worried about is more general stuff like how do we get better at winning the second ball, how do we deal with opposition pressure and still play out the back etc.

These are much harder to fix than one player being targeted aerially.

 

[Carl]

He'll be fine. I'm not worried.

The thing I'm worried about is more general stuff like how do we get better at winning the second ball, how do we deal with opposition pressure and still play out the back etc.

These are much harder to fix than one player being targeted aerially.

I'm also not worried. Think his performances have been blown so ridiculously out of proportion.

 

[redcucumber]

If we as a club get our shit together I'm sure he'll have a good career here. If we continue on our current trajectory he'll likely fail, just like the vast majority of our other talented players have failed here since Fergie retired.

 

[kouroux]

For me, his height isn't an issue at all. I just wonder if we shouldn't have prioritzed other positions ahead of another CB.

 

[Joseunited]

ETH bought him in for a reason to play his brand of football,when it's his team he'll excel.

 

[Kostov]

I don't get it, if everything was fine, why did ETH sub him off at half time?

 

[Borys]

Surely this video shows it happened many more times though? I mean, it seems like it's 50/50, he is quite comfortable going into those duels (aerial duels stats I found are not correct judging by this video too, but it's often the case with this parameter), it's more of a who will collect those second balls because clearly not Eriksen and Bruno. Fred also is a kind of midfielder who is much better at getting the ball back in opposition half, the problem is when the ball is in the air obviously.

Now the guy has edited the movie in such a way you can’t really see to whom the second ball goes, but I think there are actually quite a few second balls that are up for grabs. If it is a normal amount for 45 minutes I really don’t know, but I can see how the tactics worked out for them. They could easily play out from our press and move the game up the pitch.

This is a problem we also have had with both Smalling and Maguire, who are both very strong in the air but not so good at directing the ball, and the opponents win it back too often.

Exactly. We clearly need to work on that, we need a big guy in midfield + other "bodies" tucking in fighting for second ball, and we need to somehow find a way to involve keeper for those long balls.

As for Martinez, he will be fine (I still don't understand why it was so important to get him for that price, but time will reveal the masterplan hopefully), De Gea is a far bigger issue.

 

[Sylar]

I don't get it, if everything was fine, why did ETH sub him off at half time?

Maybe because the game was done ?

 

[evil_geko]

Tired of everyone transferring him to CDM, he is brought as CB, he will play CB, just stop.

 

[Kostov]

Maybe because the game was done ?

If a Manchester United manager thinks a game is done at half time, he should resign immediately.

 

[Sylar]

If a Manchester United manager thinks a game is done at half time, he should resign immediately.

That's way too simplistic especially given our circumstances in 2022.

Obviously I'm guessing ,as there wasn't any glaring obvious mistakes from him compared to the rest of the back four.

 

[Escobar]

Our fans are such drama queens and love exaggerating. And give him some time ffs

 

[Borys]

I don't get it, if everything was fine, why did ETH sub him off at half time?

Most likely "my captain will always play" scenario. Maguire is poor but I don't think we can afford not having him on this pitch and in this team of small guys.

 

[led_scholes]

Blind had the same issue as a CB. But I think Martinez is stronger, so I believe he will cope better.

 

[Kostov]

That's way too simplistic especially given our circumstances in 2022.

Obviously I'm guessing ,as there wasn't any glaring obvious mistakes from him compared to the rest of the back four.

What do you mean there was no glaring obvious mistake compared to the rest? What about the 3rd goal? If that was Maguire you would never hear the end of it.

Most likely "my captain will always play" scenario. Maguire is poor but I don't think we can afford not having him on this pitch and in this team of small guys.

Maybe I am wrong but Maguire has looked a much better CB than Martinez, of course it's too early for Lisandro.

 

[Borys]

What do you mean there was no glaring obvious mistake compared to the rest? What about the 3rd goal? If that was Maguire you would never hear the end of it.

Maybe I am wrong but Maguire has looked a much better CB than Martinez, of course it's too early for Lisandro.

I dunno which one has been better over the two games, I can't force myself to analyze this properly. Although I don't think Martinez is that bad, at this point I would only question if he's better than Lindelof and he doesn't really fit this already small team with a GK really really scared of leaving goalline.

 

[Abraxas]

It has been a shaky start in a United shirt, but not specifically because of his size in my opinion. Him and the defence have just had a pretty bad time of it. Most of them have made errors, are getting little protection and seem disorganised.

 

[Kostov]

I dunno which one has been better over the two games, I can't force myself to analyze this properly. Although I don't think Martinez is that bad, at this point I would only question if he's better than Lindelof and he doesn't really fit this already small team with a GK really really scared of leaving goalline.

Apart from the 3rd goal which was very bad looking, he was actually not as bad as he was against Brighton imo, but subbed off and the people follow the narrative. I asked the same question yesterday, what does he actually bring to the table that we lacked I really fail to see.

 

[OpenIntrovert]

Martinez was brought off because he was being targeted by the opposition during their attacks, which ETH realized was going against him. In terms of his defensive capabilities, he is very good but there is nothing much he can do with physically bullying. Martinez should have played as a DM in this game but I guess ETH wanted to go for stability by playing the same back four.

 

[Cassidy]

Martinez was brought off because he was being targeted by the opposition during their attacks, which ETH realized was going against him. In terms of his defensive capabilities, he is very good but there is nothing much he can do with physically bullying. Martinez should have played as a DM in this game but I guess ETH wanted to go for stability by playing the same back four.

If you can pull out more than 1 clip of him being physically bullied against Brentford, I will give you £100

 

[Tony247]

Thanks for posting this. I have my concerns but not so much after your post.

Hope his confidence is not shattered because of the sub. We don't have anyone else who can distribute like him from the back.

 

[ti vu]

Would love to see what the replies would be for this post. I'm assuming this will be ignored and usual "how they won so many duels vs Martinez" will be posted.

Better clip to look at.

The area is clearly targeted, and there are more sequences showing Brentford looked to get adapt favored result. It's not like they could pin point long kick to where they contested aerial directly with Martinez.

In this clip with all attempt included, it is clear Brentford doesn't always aim to win the first ball. We hardly gain comfortable possession when we get the ball with all these attempt. Compared to second half, there is a contrast.

Brentford has very basic counter pressing tactic. Get the ball up there, and press. Isolating our attackers when our other players too busy trying make the pitch big after all this bombard.

 

[antohan]

Yet Pep still doesn't have small CB's playing for City.

Pep suffered first-hand Ronald Koeman being the Dream Team's defensive weak link time and again. Sensational on the ball, mind.

 

[Berbaclass]