Lionel Messi
- Thread starter cesc's_mullet
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So because Messi is close to repeating what he managed last season, when he was the best; no one can be better even if they do more?
Rooney this season is the Messi of last season, the big break through season where everyone can see he belongs as one of the best.
Before you get started, Messi before last season was not on par with Ronaldo. It isn't even debatable.
Barcelona were shit that season, Messi was still outstanding when fully fit. He still came 3rd in the WPOTY award so basically he and Ronaldo have been in and around the best in the last 3 or even 4 seasons in my opinion. If you look at Messis career statistics it's incredible. He averages more than a goal every 2 games in his career. He's been consistent from the start. ROoney is now reaching that level, Ronaldo and Messi are still in my opinion out on their own.
For now Rooney is going through a great season, is in fine form but players do that from time to time, have a great season and then form dips. If Rooney is now in the bracket of Ronaldo and Messi he'll be this player from here on in and will not go through the bad patches he has in the past.
how?
I'd like to see what Messi can do in England. He's already proven everything there is to prove in Spain. It's just too easy for him.
Think he came 2nd in 2008, but the point is that Messi has really only "done it" since the start of last season, before that he's injured half the time.
I agree that Rooney can't be rated at that level just yet, but another season and he's there.
You must believe Defoe is better than Berbatov then?
I'm sure Messi isn't going to make a great goalkeeper or defender.
So ignoring "goals", ie the most important part of his job, there are plenty of better players.
Quite frankly, Jermain Defoe has likely won his side more points than Berbatov has over the past two seasons.
So for you Messi has only been great since 2008...
Great enough to be considered 1 of the best players in the world? Yes.
Before that he shows flashes of brilliance, but doesn't follow it up.
Berbatov is better. It is a no brainer.
and when exactly did Ronaldo follow it up?
Ronaldo was the best player in the world by some distance in both 06/07 & 07/08 (even if those muppets at Fifa chose Kaka based on a few CL games).
Even in his so called dry season in 08/09, he played a big part in winning the PL and us making the CL final.
This season he has 22 goals in 23 games or something.
Well of course he's not going to make a great goalkeeper or defender. The point is he would still be an excellent player if he never scored another goal in his career. Which for a forward is quite something but he could easily adapt to other roles, his game is not based around one aspect.
scoring with his head in the CL final against us wasn't enough?
By some distance until he threw a strop agaisnt Milan, was completely ineffective when it mattered and was shown up by Kaka... 06/07 he was outstanding but didnt deliver at key moments. 07/08 was his year and he's doing great at Madrid so far this season.
Messi, bearing in mind he is still 22 whilst Ronaldo is 25 was outstanding in from 2005 and anyone could see he was "when fit" one of the best in the world already. When he finally had his fully fit season he blew everyone away, before that everyone knew how good he was but it takes stats and trophies to drill it into some people.
If he never scores another goal, he'd be a good midfielder who is nowhere near world class.
Hence, all those world class keepers, defenders I mentioned would be better players.
I'd say the same about Ronaldo, so it's nothing against Messi... (actually Ronaldo might make a great centerback given his height and great jumping ability...)
Nah, he was up there in contention along with a couple of others such as Totti and Kaka.
he'd still be world class in my opinion. Ronaldo would be a excellent winger but Messi could be an excellent winger, an excellent central mid or an great play maker, all of which he could still be world class without goals.
Anyway this is a pretty stupid way of looking at it considering they are both great at scoring goals.
Decent conclusion.It surprises me from you
I think the fact we had our defenders missing against Milan was a much bigger problem.
Age has nothing to do with it, the players are rated on their performances alone. As I said, best or just "top 3", Ronaldo has consistently, since the World Cup in 2006, proven he's one of the best players in the World.
Messi has done that since 2008, Rooney since 2009...
I agree.
I try and sum it up as Ronaldo is a great goalscorer. Messi is a great player.
No point debating this point, it was just a reply to this post:
You just can't "ignore goals", as it's the most important part of the game.
Nah, Rijkaard tried to make Messi hold the width during the 07/08 season and I think that's the worse I've seen him. He someone who loves to dart into space with the ball, so being a winger is pretty much useless to him, when Rijkaard freed him, his form picked up.
I see it. I don't get excited by it. There's a difference.
In that case I recommend synchronised swimming.
Awesome.
he was comfortably Barcas best player that season, injury halted him. He was the only hope for Barcelona to do anything but got injured at a bad time. He was still voted number 2 as cal pointed out in the WPOTY awards. Not bad for his worst season. Personally i thought he was excellent but unfortunate.
he was comfortably Barcas best player that season, injury halted him. He was the only hope for Barcelona to do anything but got injured at a bad time. He was still voted number 2 as cal pointed out in the WPOTY awards. Not bad for his worst season. Personally i thought he was excellent but unfortunate.
He was sensational that season as usual,just not in them few games Rijkaard had restricted him, just conveying he can't be a winger in the technical sense, funny enough Messi says his favourite position is central.
Everyone said that his future would be in the middle. Rijkaard himself always maintained that and you could see from a young age that he was very suited to that role. I don't know where he'll end up, he plays wide and through the middle in every game now.
He could be a winger in a technical sense. Stick him on the left, tell him to beat his man and get a cross in. He'd do it and probably better than anyone around to be honest.
I should probably qualify my remarks with the annecdote of how my wife and I waited outside the Adidas shop on the Champs Elysees for about 30 mins just to catch a glimpse of Messi, who was doing an instore visit last October. I wasn't particularly excited (), but I figured I'd travelled all that way to Paris and we happened to be in the vicinity of a great player, so it was worth hanging around for.
), but I figured I'd travelled all that way to Paris and we happened to be in the vicinity of a great player, so it was worth hanging around for.I don't think he could, he beats so many people because he likes to attack space which means he ends up playing everywhere in a match. His game needs freedom.
If you put him as a traditional winger, you are restricting his game, because he needs to come inside. If he has to hold the width and you place two people on him, there's not much the genius could do. I've seen it for myself.
Here's an example, Messi vs Liverpool, there's not much he can do when forced to stay out wide.
Lionel Messi vs Liverpool
As outwide it's not hard to restrict the space for him to move the ball into, making it easier for defenders to deal with him. Rijkaard did Messi an injustice playing him like this.
wow, 5000+ replies.
IIRC, that was Arbeloa's first game at leftback. Rafa said afterwards he put him there because Messi will always try to go inside, attacking Arbeloa's preferred foot, so he should be suited for the job.
Yeah, was it Bosingwa who he also had to face in one of the Chelsea-Barca meetings? As the Valencia game amply demonstrated, there's no doubt Messi does his most dangerous work inbetween full-back and centre-half.
why? did you need to see Zidane, or the brazilian Ronaldo or Kaka to admit they where great players?
No, I don't think anyone is contending that. But I'd like to have seen them all in the Premiership.
Messi more so, because the standard of Premiership defences has overtaken La Liga in recent years.
Zidane won a world cup, Kaka and Ronaldo won a world cup
they also won local leagues, champions leagues and continental leagues
yet, to convince you that they where great players they needed to succeed in the league of a country that won a wolrd cup over forty years ago
why Rowen? why?
btw, messi won the CL last year after leaving behind chelsea and us
What are you talking about??
Please re-read my earlier comments and johnmufc's comment.
Please re-read my earlier comments and johnmufc's comment.
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