I tried explaining this to you before also. Where does it say that buying a left back for 15m will be a hindrance in getting a CM?
Leighton Baines
- Thread starter ::sonny::
- Start date
I tried explaining this to you before also. Where does it say that buying a left back for 15m will be a hindrance in getting a CM?
Considering how much of our creativity comes from the wide areas (and it seems directing play through the center more isn't going to happen overnight) it makes sense that we try to have the players with the best end product from those areas. While Evra does a lot for us he doesn't often put in a good cross, and with Valencia's final ball also weak a lot of the time we're effectively getting nothing from the flanks, which is where we tend to try to create things. Baines is a certainty to put in good crosses every week.
You seriously thing that the money we spend in the players doesn't matter for the other transfers?
plus you are treating 15m as 30m here. Baines is a player worth 15m, I have no doubts about that.
are you saying that our budget is so tight that a 15m signing will hinder another signing?
I mean you are talking as if you know the number we have as a limit and how Baines will eat some of that, which will result in us missing out on Fellaini
We've pulled out of loads of signings over the years because we didn't want to pay a little extra...
yes, but has it been cause we bought another player?
take sneijder as an example or even hazard.
we did not want to pay so much, but was it cause we bought some other player? Was it cause of that?
Who knows?
All I know is that £15m on top of what we offered for Fabregas would probably have done it for Barcelona.
Baines won't improve us greatly. There's far more pressing concerns.
We usually (on average) have a net spend that is somewhere between 15-20m. Every big signing we make matters.
we should look at our past and think, yes we don't tend to overpay and also give up on some players cause of that. Hence we sit rest assured thinking that whatever we pay in the end for Baines, if we get him, won't be over the top
I don't know. But it's galling that we miss out on the likes of Hazard and Lucas for the sake of £5m in agents fees but we're happy to spend treble that on Baines.
Of course it was. There is a limited budget. If we didn't conclude some deals because of 3-5m, do you really think that 15m on Baines won't matter. Maybe it won't for this summer, but surely on the next one we won't have those money to spend.
The money of the premier league really makes people blasé when £15m is dismissed with almost a "that's nothing" kind of attitude!
so you don't know right? let it be then. Stop whining.
You use too many probablys and then use those assumptions to argue.
anyway, the club obviously limits how much they will pay for a particular player. if we adding 15m to our max evaluation for a player, it will set a wrong precedent and cost us with future transfers.
15m is ok for baines is what i mean.
What on Earth are you on about?
We need a central midfielder quite desperately - we have done so for the last few years - and yet, we look to be closing in on a left back that we don't need: Evra is in good form and Fabio is a capable understudy. Is Baines going to bring enough improvement to justify the outlay? I don't think so.
There's no assumptions from me; we haven't signed a midfielder - it's as clear as day!
I don't know if you remember the hazard thing, payments to the agent was something fergie complained about. there are other factors too.
By all accounts, we also wouldn't pay the agent fees for Lucas. We constantly take a principled stance on such matters but it serves to do nothing other than make us miss out on top level transfer targets. We split hairs over £6/7m of agent fees yet we are happy to fork out £15m+ on a left back we don't need, all because we don't want to line an agent's pockets.
so about baines you say, we look to be closing in on a left back. if that's what you believe, then you should also believe that we are closing in on fellaini too. Isn't that right? So your problem that of we are signing a LB when we need a CM does not exist does it?
I mean you are considering Baines done but just conveniently ignoring the fellaini situation cause it suits your whine. I mean both bids were made together.
yes cause the manager feels that that 15m will go for a player that he needs and deems important. While paying 6/7m to agents or paying the 5m extra for transfer price will set a precedent and end up costing us more in the long run.
you want to buy a t-shirt. you like it, but its x amount over your budget. you are in a mall, so you see a pair of shorts too that you like and also can wear sometimes, those pair of shorts cost x amount.
you might not buy the t-shirt cause you only want to pay so much for a shirt and it does not make sense to you to spend on one t-shirt. but you buy the shorts anyway, cause it seemed like a good deal and you can use it too.
you might not buy the t-shirt cause you only want to pay so much for a shirt and it does not make sense to you to spend on one t-shirt. but you buy the shorts anyway, cause it seemed like a good deal and you can use it too.
Im not paying 25million for a pair of 2nd choice shorts!!! 
Sometimes you look in a field and you see a cow, wearing shorts...
I was discussing this with a mate who supports Everton a couple of weeks ago. My basic position was summed up by a post above:
I wasnt getting into who is a better player (Baines or Fellaini) or anything else. Just basic need.
But my mate was really emphasising just how quality Baines is. I mean, i know he is a good player and everything. But this guy said "people who dont watch Everton every week dont realise just how good Baines is. He is like having two players on the pitch, he defends and attacks so well, he gets everywhere." The way he tells it, maybe we arent weak at LB, but Baines is a major upgrade on Evra.
Not saying I necessarily agree with or believe that particularly, and I still want a midfielder more, hence Fellaini more. But my mate was saying Baines is a much, much more important player to Everton, and a much better player.
Still doesnt change the fact that we need a midfielder. Or to come back to the analogy above, I dont want to buy yet another pair of shorts when I have to walk around wearing one of my wife's bras because I dont have anything else to wear above my belt line.
I wasnt getting into who is a better player (Baines or Fellaini) or anything else. Just basic need.
But my mate was really emphasising just how quality Baines is. I mean, i know he is a good player and everything. But this guy said "people who dont watch Everton every week dont realise just how good Baines is. He is like having two players on the pitch, he defends and attacks so well, he gets everywhere." The way he tells it, maybe we arent weak at LB, but Baines is a major upgrade on Evra.
Not saying I necessarily agree with or believe that particularly, and I still want a midfielder more, hence Fellaini more. But my mate was saying Baines is a much, much more important player to Everton, and a much better player.
Still doesnt change the fact that we need a midfielder. Or to come back to the analogy above, I dont want to buy yet another pair of shorts when I have to walk around wearing one of my wife's bras because I dont have anything else to wear above my belt line.
According to M.E.N we're going with £40m for the pair of them.
Wish we'd just drop the Baines nonsense, but it seems we're determined.
Wish we'd just drop the Baines nonsense, but it seems we're determined.
Just sort our midfield out and forget about Baines, please...
Will be Young all over again
Yeah, Baines is a very good player, he's just not neccesary... and not as good as Evra at his peak (which is what I would, probably foolishly, hope is the level that Evra's replacement would be at).
maybe in a couple of respects he is but he certainly isnt as an overall defender.
I think people will be in for a rude awakening when they see his defensive abilities in a United jersey.
Really hope its yet another bullshit story...
Evra at his peak was a bloody monster. Waiting till we got someone of similar quality would be like the keano in midfield case all over again.
Will be Young all over again
It seems so. Young at that time was regarded as top quality.
Both overrated players who were/are playing at their level.
He's no mug defensively certainly not on a level way below Evra's. Think the awakening will be what he adds going forward in terms of his crosses.
No chance will he be like Young IMO. Whatever you say about Baines, he is one of the best left backs in the league if not the best.
He is better than Evra currently for me. The issue I have he isn't £20m better when we have issues elsewhere.
He is better than Evra currently for me. The issue I have he isn't £20m better when we have issues elsewhere.
Argh, i'm going to start throwing my keyboard around if people mention his crossing again. Evra can cross the ball just as well as demonstrated twice already this season with two assists for RVP. So if Evra can cross the ball like that, it makes you wonder why he isn't doing it more often (tactical reasons?).
No, he cant. He's very hit and miss with the final ball. Had the reasons been tactical, he'd have attempted less crosses, failing to get them to a striker cant be tactical.