We need a player that plays on the right. Just saying 
Kylian Mbappe | PSG
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I never made the point that Ronado had no talent when he was younger, that's just dumb. And the post you quoted was in response to a comparison with Argentina and Messi, I said that both Ronado and Messi didn't benefit from good teams at International level.
So we are not in disagreement.
Sorry I didn't mentioned on the last point, I was mentioning other posts in general not saying you mentioned it, chill out I particularly like Mbappé.
The case of Weah is interesting - clearly one of the greatest African players - but you know Weah won the Ballon d'Or at the age of 29.
As a PSG fan, if I had to choose between Weah/Ronaldinho and M'bappé/Neymar, I would take the latter to go to war week after week because they don't choose their games!
It's really unnecessary because we know his value, but if you want to create videos on Youtube like 'Cristiano Ronaldo vs Country (all touches)', then let's go!
Uh, what? 2 UEFA Cups and a CWC?
Current Neymar is miles above Ronaldinho when he played for PSG. Neymar is terribly underrated here and i hope he'll show Man Utd's fans that he's an exceptionnal football player in a couple of weeks. The diving jokes are really getting old and even english players (Liverpool) complain about it while it was obvious they were doing far worst. It's ridiculous.
Elite title would go to former Champions cup and current Champions League. I guess a slight case might be made for the former UEFA cup since it did contain 2nd and 3rd teams from the best leagues, but all the champions still participated in the Champions cup. As far as i know Maradona's Napoli didn't cover themselves in glory when they participated in it. Ronaldo didn't win it either if I'm not mistaken?
Unfortunately, he is less sharp since his injury and I'd even say Neymar version 2017
was the most talented player in the history of the French League, Zlatan being the greatest one following a period of 4 years.They both destroyed the league and dominated every opposing team week after week head and shoulders.
I know some players like Papin were superb but they were space aliens.
Tell someone from the 90s that the UEFA and CWC don't matter or aren't elite trophies, see what they answer. The UEFA Cup had stronger competition than the European Cup many times
Ronaldo technically did win the CL with milan, thoughhe couldn't play with them
@Ecstatic I know this is Mbappe topic but as a PSG fan don’t you think the team with Weah, Valdo or Ginola was more exciting to watch?
Mbappe probably has trophies and stats in his favour, but in terms of raw talent Messi U20 still comfortably beats him IMO.
I've probably watched more football in the late nineties-early 2000s than in the last fifteen years, so I do have an idea how those competitions were rated. Nowhere did I state that they were unimportant, maybe using the word elite hinted that I consider UEFA and CWC second rate/unimportant which was far from my mind.
However, both then and now it was very clear which European club trophy was considered the pinnacle, and UEFA cup it certainly was not (though the difference was much less pronounced as compared to now).
Wouldn't mind a punt if it's true that PSG need to get rid of Neymar or him. Give them Sanchez and 100m.We need a player that plays on the right. Just saying
I feel a lot of the people criticizing or downplaying Mbappe only watch some highlights of him. If you're comparing him to Messi or R9's talent, I think that's blasphemous and I wouldn't entertain it either just like I don't think CR7's talent even comes close to those two. However, the discussion about talent is a bit redundant, it's about potential to achieve great things. Mbappe has already done something that I've only experienced once before in my life, helping my country win a world cup (and to anyone who thinks his only contribution was the Argentina game, look up Mbappe vs Belgium). Even without that, let's say that never happened, his club stats do not lie, and if you want to discount the French league as some of you like to do, then let's just focus on Champion's league, he kills everybody not named R9 in every statistical category.
He is so much more than pace and good decision-making (which is a myth, he still has ways to go there). His passing is more impressive than Messi's was at his age, including his different range of passing, not just precision. His finishing is far above Messi at the same age, his dribbling is far below but that's like saying Michael Phelps is not as good a swimmer as a Dolphin. Messi is an alien, and I don't think I'll personally see another player that was not just the greatest talent I've ever seen, but also someone that realized it over and over again. However, I do think Mbappe can eclipse him in achievements, whether it's goals, trophies, etc.
Comparing a player that's had two years of professional football to legends is never going to be a sensible conversation anyways, but comparing them at a similar age and Mbappe is crushing Messi and CR7 combined, no one knows if that will last but I wouldn't bet on Mbappe burning out or losing motivation, he very much has his sights set on beating those two and has the mentality to pursue those ambitions and, yes, the talent as well.
I think people should just sit back and enjoy the fact that football won't die when Messi and CR7 retires. There's exciting players coming up like Mbappe, Sancho, Dembele, Martial, Aouar, etc...comparisons will naturally happen, but some of you seem to have already made up your minds that Mbappe's progression won't be continuing on this trajectory for x and y reasons, you are simply pulling an argument out of thin air with no basis.
He is so much more than pace and good decision-making (which is a myth, he still has ways to go there). His passing is more impressive than Messi's was at his age, including his different range of passing, not just precision. His finishing is far above Messi at the same age, his dribbling is far below but that's like saying Michael Phelps is not as good a swimmer as a Dolphin. Messi is an alien, and I don't think I'll personally see another player that was not just the greatest talent I've ever seen, but also someone that realized it over and over again. However, I do think Mbappe can eclipse him in achievements, whether it's goals, trophies, etc.
Comparing a player that's had two years of professional football to legends is never going to be a sensible conversation anyways, but comparing them at a similar age and Mbappe is crushing Messi and CR7 combined, no one knows if that will last but I wouldn't bet on Mbappe burning out or losing motivation, he very much has his sights set on beating those two and has the mentality to pursue those ambitions and, yes, the talent as well.
I think people should just sit back and enjoy the fact that football won't die when Messi and CR7 retires. There's exciting players coming up like Mbappe, Sancho, Dembele, Martial, Aouar, etc...comparisons will naturally happen, but some of you seem to have already made up your minds that Mbappe's progression won't be continuing on this trajectory for x and y reasons, you are simply pulling an argument out of thin air with no basis.
Yeah, with our style of play doing a 360 from the Jose days, it would be interesting to see what can happen over summer if we could keep this up. Martial - Rashford -Mbappe is stuff of dreams.
What makes me criticize him are the complete games I watch, not the highlight videos, in which he looks fantastic. When he has space in front of him, he is probably already the most dangerous player in the world. But if he hasn't.. well, then his game still lacks something. That's also why I think Neymar is still better than him and will probably continue to be. He's maybe not that good with space to run into but on the other hand much, much better in tight spaces, creating chances and setting up his team mates. With Messi it is is even more extreme at both ends. And in this area of his game, I can't see Mbappe even coming close, really. As silly as it sounds, he may also come to his physical boundaries here since what gives him his insane pace is also a big disadvantage in tight spaces: His high center of gravity.
I also think your way of comparing the young Messi and the young Mbappe is a bit unfair. IMO it makes no sense to say "look at Mbappe's goal and assists stats in every competition, these dwarf Messi's at the same age" because scoring was a byproduct of Messi back then so that it was an inacurate metric to measure his performances. Mbappe is a much more "result-oriented" player than him. People forget how good Messi was as a teenager because his scorers weren't as good. 19 year old Messi was already considered better than Ronaldinho (who scored 30 goals and assists in 32 league games) and Eto'o and second only to Cristiano after his first real freak season. That's every bit as good as Mbappe was at 19 years of age.
However, at the end of his career Mbappe could very well end up with more trophies, goals and assists than both of them. However, this is still a very long way to go. The "goal advantage" he currently has may diminish pretty quickly since both CR7's and Messi's output exploded suddenly in an almost absurd fashion. But yes, Mbappe can do it. Won't change that goals and assists are only one aspect of a players class, though.
360 is a full circle, 180 would be going to the opposite.
It’s based on 100% bullshit
Interesting question. I will reply later
Ok answer when you can on the PSG thread if you want.
Very difficult question for different reasons:
- The way in which I enjoy football these days can't be compared with the one I had as a child for obvious reasons. Drink a coca-cola does not generate the same pleasure for a child or an adult
- My football consumption is not the same too.
- Another era with a maximum of 3 foreign players in the staring 11, the Champions League limited to one club per country
- Memories are selective, transformative but also subject to loss of information
On the one hand, I'm tempted to say the 1994 generation was more attaching and the collective soul was stronger. Some very classy players as the players you mentioned: Ginola, Weah, Rai, Valdo. And the offensive subs were much better than the current subs: Nouma, M'boma. The competitive landscape was much more open with 7-8 clubs which won the league in a period of 10 years. Now, of course the French league is boring with a PSG side much more superior that the other contestants.
That said, I don't forget how inconsistent and frustrating were the PSG players of the 1990s: one league between 1987 and 2011. The current quality level of the team since 2011 never reached before in the past. The team is overly dominant since 2011 but more pleasant to watch; and depending the coaches the style of play has evolved. The Brazilian defender Ricardo Gomes - part of this generation - recently said that only Ginola-Valdo-Weah-Rai had the required technical skills to be part of the 2018 PSG squad.... and also said that Thiago Silva and Marquinhos were better than him.
The fan in me has changed: ok Ronaldinho, Weah, Okocha are much more likeable players than the current ones... but I would respect/rate/ the current players who has a much more stronger winning mentality: they don't choose their games and respect any opponent. In a certain sense, I'd even say that Zlatan is more humble than some pseudos divas of the 1990s or 2000s
More legendary games in the 1990s but not a more legendary team than the current one.
Last but not least, I have forgotten how PSG used to play in the 1990s so I need to re-watch some of these games!
Call me a fool, but we have the money plus his french buddy Pogba to sign him and made him succeed here.
Fair enough I have the same feeling too. Even Weah looked more spectacular on that Champions League run under Fernandez but not as consistent like Ginola, Valdo, Ricardo or Rai. Certainly a great team to watch on the pre Bosman era but not many would start for the current one.
49 goals/assists for 2018.
Here's hoping he sees out 2019 as a Champion's League winner now.
Such an unbelievable player. Monaco have snapped up some absolute gems over the last while. Great scouting or luck? I’m fairly sure we could have got him for the same money as martial that summer. has he surprised football world somewhat or was he always expected to be as effective as he has been?
He was already being hyped up as a better talent than Martial when Martial started to breakout for United.
It's not so much great scouting, because everyone knew about Mbappe since the age of 14. It's more that they gave the best recognition of his talent, and made certain assurances other clubs might not have been as willing to do, and also it didn't make it too difficult for the family to remain in France. His family is a big part of why he is where he is today. They've managed him extremely well, and they are no push-overs and very protective of their son's development, which sometimes clashed with Jardim.
However, no doubt, Monaco is one of those clubs renowned for developing great players, there's a few of them in France but they are up there.
It’s fair to say if teams like Monaco and Dortmund weren’t selling clubs they’d be competing in the later stages of the CL regularly on a fraction of the money we spend. It’s doable if you give the players a chance.
The fact that Monaco sold a player that played for them about half a season for 180m when they got him for peanuts (not to mention the money made on other players like Silva, Mendy, or Lemar now) and the team is in the state it's in right now is borderline criminal in my eyes.
This guy is sensational, his pace is frightening. Sheer class.
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What a player he is. Can only admire his quality. That pace for his goal was electric stuff.
My eyes could barely keep up with the way he went around Lindelof.
Asides from being incredibly quick, he seems to have steps, especially when turning, it's incredible.
He's a bulkier Theo Walcott according to a poster in the Mbappe vs Rashford thread
Once in a generation talent no doubt about it now. I mean you sometimes forget this guy is 19. Sorry to say but rashford can not even be mentioned in the same breath.
I think he’ll win them the champions league with a few goals in the final this year. Their defence seems pretty solid, that midfield can control most games but mbappe as the outlet is the tip of the iceberg. He just has to make it look like he’s about to make a run and it puts defenders in panic mode.
I didn’t see the psg games v Liverpool but did he look threatening against their pacier defence?
I didn’t see the psg games v Liverpool but did he look threatening against their pacier defence?
Yep and Rashford has been very good last two months and is very good young talent in his own right, same for Martial.
Said before but only disappointment for me is Mbappe is going to play majority of his career in his French league so only threatening scoring records of Shearer in premier league or Ronaldo/Messi in Spain if he moved to those leagues say this summer and played for 10 years.