Kylian Mbappe | PSG

JPRouve said:
He hasn't lost any of that. He has actually improved in that area when it comes to shorter runs and play between the lines instead of being very vertical because teams focus on taking away those vertical options and neither France nor PSG have the passers able to play those vertical passes.
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The thing about Mbappé is that you can't really take vertical options away unless you park 7 players 20 yards in front of your goal and never attack with more than 3 or 4 men. And you don't need good vertical passers either, Ligue2 players would be capable of releasing him into space consistently because he has an arguably unprecented combination of pace, timing, spatial awareness and game reading/decision making when it comes to off ball runs in behind
 
SirMonteyne said:
If Mbappe scores 60-70 goals per season for at least 6 more years, wins everything multiple times, and does his usual World Cup magic in two more World Cups and euros. Then he will be the GOAT for many. I have never seen someone who looks like a monster, villain, or the final boss of a world cup like Mbappe.
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Not happening. You only need to watch someone like Messi to see the huge gulf.

Mbappe is fantastic though and all the negativity surrounding him is odd. He’ll be the best player in La Liga and seems a sure bet to go down as a great of the game.
 
Hammondo said:
Sounds made up.
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I mean, he scored over a hundred headers. How many 5 foot 8 players do you know that could do that? Just watch the goal in the 1958 WC final to see how high he climbs in the air. And obviously, all the things I've said are searchable, and you've probably searched them and found the info, and resorted to 'it's made up'. Why must it be? He was an extraordinary athlete.
 
De Portago said:
Prime Michael Jordan was measured at 48 inches vertical if I remember correctly. That obviously doesn't mean Pele's figure is impossible but it seems very unlikely for a football player in the sixties no matter how athletic.
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Yes, it was measured at the same number as MJs. Pele was famed for his leaping ability. I mean, Michael Jordan began playing Division 1 basketball about 4 years after Pele retired, so it's not exactly ancient history v modern technology. Jordan's athletic peak was almost 40 years ago.
 
Kwabs said:
I mean, he scored over a hundred headers. How many 5 foot 8 players do you know that could do that? Just watch the goal in the 1958 WC final to see how high he climbs in the air. And obviously, all the things I've said are searchable, and you've probably searched them and found the info, and resorted to 'it's made up'. Why must it be? He was an extraordinary athlete.
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Its a small jump.
 
It's totally off-topic but I wouldn't be surprised if Pelé maximum vertical jump was very high, if you look at his headers a lot are at the top of the ball's travel and he jumped effortlessly. He also had fairly muscular legs.
 
Hammondo said:
Its a small jump.
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You are correct in fact, I had mistaken it for another goal. But you are wrong in suggesting that his vertical is 'made up'. Just watch any video comp of his headers.
 
Kwabs said:
You are correct in fact, I had mistaken it for another goal. But you are wrong in suggesting that his vertical is 'made up'. Just watch any video comp of his headers.
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I researched this 48 Inch jump, apparently it's totally made up, and he's never done close. Though he is a very good jumper, 48 is silly.
 
Just for reference, quick google will show that there are currently zero players in the NBA with a 48 inch vertical. Now we're talking about the premier basketball league in 2024 with all the medical/training improvements available and for obvious reasons vertical leap is a much more important attribute in basketball than in football. So again, not outside the realms of possibility but I personally don't think it's true.
 
Hammondo said:
I researched this 48 Inch jump, apparently it's totally made up, and he's never done close. Though he is a very good jumper, 48 is silly.
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Apparently made up according to who? And why is 48 silly? Jordan's is 48. Spud Webb, the great Atlanta Hawks player who won the slam dunk contest (and who is about the same height as Pele) was measured at 47. The record belongs to famous professional dunker Kadour Ziani, whose vertical was measured at between 56 and 61 inches. So I'm not sure why 48 for one of the greatest sportsmen of all time, who, again, scored 120+ headers at 5'8 is silly. Unless you know lots of players that height who have done this? I'd be interested to hear the names.
 
Kwabs said:
Apparently made up according to who? And why is 48 silly? Jordan's is 48. Spud Webb, the great Atlanta Hawks player who won the slam dunk contest (and who is about the same height as Pele) was measured at 47. The record belongs to famous professional dunker Kadour Ziani, whose vertical was measured at between 56 and 61 inches. So I'm not sure why 48 for one of the greatest sportsmen of all time, who, again, scored 120+ headers at 5'8 is silly. Unless you know lots of players that height who have done this? I'd be interested to hear the names.
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Passarella was incredible in his leap and header ability, another freak in terms of ability and athletism.
 
Kwabs said:
Apparently made up according to who? And why is 48 silly? Jordan's is 48. Spud Webb, the great Atlanta Hawks player who won the slam dunk contest (and who is about the same height as Pele) was measured at 47. The record belongs to famous professional dunker Kadour Ziani, whose vertical was measured at between 56 and 61 inches. So I'm not sure why 48 for one of the greatest sportsmen of all time, who, again, scored 120+ headers at 5'8 is silly. Unless you know lots of players that height who have done this? I'd be interested to hear the names.
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Well according to the fact no one can find anywhere where he has gotten close to 48 inches.

You are just highlighting my point though, so few can jump that high, and there is no reason to think Pele did.
 
Kwabs said:
Apparently made up according to who? And why is 48 silly? Jordan's is 48. Spud Webb, the great Atlanta Hawks player who won the slam dunk contest (and who is about the same height as Pele) was measured at 47. The record belongs to famous professional dunker Kadour Ziani, whose vertical was measured at between 56 and 61 inches. So I'm not sure why 48 for one of the greatest sportsmen of all time, who, again, scored 120+ headers at 5'8 is silly. Unless you know lots of players that height who have done this? I'd be interested to hear the names.
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Also if you look at the vertical jump records Pele isn't mentioned.
 
Hammondo said:
Also if you look at the vertical jump records Pele isn't mentioned.
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Hammondo said:
Well according to the fact no one can find anywhere where he has gotten close to 48 inches.

You are just highlighting my point though, so few can jump that high, and there is no reason to think Pele did.
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No reason?

Read this

https://www.nytimes.com/1975/06/10/...thletic-perfection-pele-a-slim-figure-of.html

I'll stop going back and forth on this now because I'm mindful that this is not what the thread is about. You're free to believe whatever you want to believe
 
De Portago said:
Just for reference, quick google will show that there are currently zero players in the NBA with a 48 inch vertical. Now we're talking about the premier basketball league in 2024 with all the medical/training improvements available and for obvious reasons vertical leap is a much more important attribute in basketball than in football. So again, not outside the realms of possibility but I personally don't think it's true.
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There is Keon Johnson.
 
Kwabs said:
No reason?

Read this

https://www.nytimes.com/1975/06/10/...thletic-perfection-pele-a-slim-figure-of.html

I'll stop going back and forth on this now because I'm mindful that this is not what the thread is about. You're free to believe whatever you want to believe
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"Pele can run 100 meters in 11 seconds and jump almost 6 feet high. He jumps earlier than other players to head the ball because he has the ability to hover longer in the air. That split‐second advantage is tremendous in soccer"

If you ever wanted proof of how much bollocks this is, it's here.
 
Zehner said:
One of the biggest German football magazines published an article on Wirtz' future this week and claims that Real Madrid is in the pole position for a move in 2025. They seemingly tasked one of their most reknown scouts, some guy called Felipe Martin, with bringing him to Madrid, and apparently document every appearance of his. The plan is to extend Kroos until 2025 and when he retires, moce Bellingham back to CM and give Wirtz the spot in AM. Wirtz himself apparently sees himself in Spain or England and has seemingly ditched the idea of an intermediary step at Bayern. Plus Alonso will likely move to Madrid in 2025 as well and the squad would be perfect for him.


Rüdiger Militao Alaba
Tchouameni Bellingham
Rodrygo Güler Wirtz Vinicius
Mbappe​

You could bring in Valverde, Carvajal, Vazquez, Camavinga, Mendy, Diaz, etc. all pretty easily as well. Most of them in different positions even.
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How is Rodrygo in some peoples top 11 for Real in a year or two time? I don't see him of the required level. He will be more of a utility player like Lucas Vasquez in the future I think.
 
Zehner said:
One of the biggest German football magazines published an article on Wirtz' future this week and claims that Real Madrid is in the pole position for a move in 2025. They seemingly tasked one of their most reknown scouts, some guy called Felipe Martin, with bringing him to Madrid, and apparently document every appearance of his. The plan is to extend Kroos until 2025 and when he retires, moce Bellingham back to CM and give Wirtz the spot in AM. Wirtz himself apparently sees himself in Spain or England and has seemingly ditched the idea of an intermediary step at Bayern. Plus Alonso will likely move to Madrid in 2025 as well and the squad would be perfect for him.


Rüdiger Militao Alaba
Tchouameni Bellingham
Rodrygo Güler Wirtz Vinicius
Mbappe​

You could bring in Valverde, Carvajal, Vazquez, Camavinga, Mendy, Diaz, etc. all pretty easily as well. Most of them in different positions even.
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Valverde is irreplaceable. He had renewed months ago with a very good improvement and he has done it again together with the Brazilians, which means he is already a "hierarch".
In any case, I think Madrid are still thinking in terms of a large squad with the super league in mind, so a fixed starting eleven is misleading.
In any case, I don't see Belli so far behind. Having barely seen Wirtz, could he be the one delaying his position? making a "Kroos" with a shoehorn?
 
carvajal said:
In any case, I think Madrid are still thinking in terms of a large squad with the super league in mind, so a fixed starting eleven is misleading.
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There's not going to be a super league. Definitely not the one Flo is working on with some dodgy consultant group based out of Madrid who know nothing about football. As influential as Perez can be, that project ain't going anywhere.
 
He was terrible. It really hasn’t been his tournament so far. He had some decent chances too but he just hasn’t been clinical at all.
 
Can't help but think he wasn't needed for Real. On the other hand, he is likely the best player in the world when he's in form so there's that.
 
Is he really improving his chances of Ballon Dor with these...performances?

I hope somebody is looking at both his knockout performances vs Barca/Dortmund, and France's entire tournament, and find that he didn't really do all that much.
 
Hard to say he bottled the shootout when he banged in 3 in a World Cup final.... but still, bizarre, and if the nose is so bad he can't last 15 minutes, how's he going again in a few days? Maybe he just fears the Euros in general?
 
Morty_ said:
Is he really improving his chances of Ballon Dor with these...performances?

I hope somebody is looking at both his knockout performances vs Barca/Dortmund, and France's entire tournament, and find that he didn't really do all that much.
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Huh Ballon D'or should not be in the same conversation with him this season. Unless he scores two hat tricks in semis and final.
 
I think the mask probably makes it more difficult than people think. It looks like he's got 0 peripheral vision with that thing on, and for someone who plays on the shoulder it must be a massive handicap
 
Skills said:
I think the mask probably makes it more difficult than people think. It looks like he's got 0 peripheral vision with that thing on, and for someone who plays on the shoulder it must be a massive handicap
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Not to mention turtles are usually known for their great peripheral vision.
 
The most overrated player in the history of football.

I'm so glad that Real Madrid signed him.
 
Invisible, lazy, wasteful.

dembele caused way more problems when he came on than mbappe has done all tournament
 
JogaBonitoRooney said:
Huh Ballon D'or should not be in the same conversation with him this season. Unless he scores two hat tricks in semis and final.
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Yeah, but then, Messi's and Mbappe's stats in ligue 1 were treated as any other, as if it was top 3 league, leading up to last Ballon Dor, and despite crashing out in R16 in UCL.

I recognize Euro's isn't quote world cup status, but then, there isn't anybody having the name and performance's to challenge him, besides Vini and Bellingham.
 
Looks like he misses a younger Giroud and some other players with ability and expression.
 
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