Aside of a narrowly lost UCL final and another World Cup final?
Kylian Mbappé | Real Madrid watch
- Thread starter Samid
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Aside of a narrowly lost UCL final and another World Cup final?
But the question is has he kicked on since that, and I think the answer to that is no. He really looks the same player. One could even make a case that he has regressed.
I’m talking about him individually as a player, not overall team achievements.
His style is how C. Ronaldo started playing in his mid-30's, not when he was 25. He should be running games.
Already has his prime.
Reminder of the ridiculous hype around this lad. He's the highest rated active player in the world on EAFC/FIFA, and genuinely top 3 players in the game including icons. I don't want him to fail because he's a bad player, I want to him go fail because he's the epitome of everything wrong with modern football. Selfish, overpaid and workless.
And as much as it pains me to say this, on the other side is Salah, who has done it for 9 years, year in, year out. Puts in the numbers, works his arse off for the team, and then you have the likes of Peter Crouch thinking Mbappe would get in over him in a joint XI.
And as much as it pains me to say this, on the other side is Salah, who has done it for 9 years, year in, year out. Puts in the numbers, works his arse off for the team, and then you have the likes of Peter Crouch thinking Mbappe would get in over him in a joint XI.
Yes he kicked on.
He got better after that WC final in 2018.
We'll see how he ends the season with Real. He was a better player 2 years ago imo, but he might still finish the season in impressive fashion.
I believe that in these next two years, it will be proven how far his club career can go. During this period, he will be between the ages of 26 and 28, which is considered the peak period for most footballers. After that, his physical abilities will clearly decline (to be honest, they already have slightly declined now). He will need to learn how to be a full-fledged forward in the Real Madrid style, including skills such as ball control, aerial duels, and even playmaking, all of which should be developed. At the moment, he has lost a lot of confidence, and he has limited time to regain his normal form. However, at Madrid, he will never play as a left winger because Vinícius is a better left winger than him in almost every aspect. I am only referring to his club career because at the national team level, his footballing journey is already legendary. His performances in the 2018 and 2022 World Cups cannot be downplayed; they are nothing short of excellence.
His work rate is absolutely terrible, and I don't know how the Madrid staff, including Carlo, will address it. Percentage of time spent walking...... shows it.
Good post.
He doesn't have the production/talent of Messi to walk about that much on the field(and I think Messi spent less time walking too).
How he closes this season and plays next season will be quite telling for his club career legacy.
Nah, he has such game breaking pace that if he learned to stop living offside, ffs, you dumb feck, that threat alone would justify him walking around and doing nothing defensively - let him stay up and not waste energy, because as soon as we win the ball back all we have to do is kick it beyond the defence and he'll get it. He'd be an incredibly easy source of attack, against anybody
@Iker Quesadillas posted this quote a couple of pages back - https://www.redcafe.net/threads/kylian-mbappé-real-madrid-watch.482980/post-32666796
Right now I do think he looks lost - one step behind the game, like he's trying to plan what he's going to do next. It's a strange thing to say about a big game player but he looks like he's just noticed the cameras and the crowd and it's made him too self-conscious to play.
What I don't know is whether that was happening at PSG as well. Maybe all that's happened is that you can now see it in his shooting stats as well as his general play. In which case things may not change much.
I'm still more optimistic that that, I don't like seeing young talent just fade away for no strong reason.
At Madrid, it might simply be that old striker/ketchup bottle problem. Once he gets those first few goals or more importantly for him - his first couple of good games - the pressure will be released. Then he can start to get back to playing instead of thinking about playing again.
Which struck me as interesting. Obviously you never know with Madrid what's PR and what's got its roots in reality, but I can believe it's true.
Right now I do think he looks lost - one step behind the game, like he's trying to plan what he's going to do next. It's a strange thing to say about a big game player but he looks like he's just noticed the cameras and the crowd and it's made him too self-conscious to play.
What I don't know is whether that was happening at PSG as well. Maybe all that's happened is that you can now see it in his shooting stats as well as his general play. In which case things may not change much.
I'm still more optimistic that that, I don't like seeing young talent just fade away for no strong reason.
At Madrid, it might simply be that old striker/ketchup bottle problem. Once he gets those first few goals or more importantly for him - his first couple of good games - the pressure will be released. Then he can start to get back to playing instead of thinking about playing again.
Right now Vinicius is clearly faster than him
and technically better.
I don't think technique wise, since Mbappe has a better shot, but creativity, flair, stamina and relentlessness he's way ahead.
Mbappe has better shot technique, but thats about the only technique I would say hes better at. Touch, close control, passing Vinicius is better imo.
He's not though. He's maybe faster with the ball, but that's a different thing entirely
But the thing is, Vini actually uses his pace well. Mbappé doesn't, and it makes no sense given how good he was with it until a couple seasons ago
Come on, suddenly Mbappe is el Piojo Lopez. He has a fantastic technique, no huge gap with Vini at all.
His pace like Giorno said it's beyond great.
Him missing tons of chances? IT's HIM, even in his best days, he will be sometimes too much sellfish in certain ocassions or fumble many easy ones and later bend it on the top right corner shooting from the left angle of the big area.
Lucho Suarez was like that too, yet Lucho with his stamina and constant fierce attitude always safe his face and was a constant menace. Kiki can't do an indolent Dembele if he doesn't score goals galore, no matter if he runs 450 metres, pressure or whatever, no one would care if he scores or creates chances regularly and I very much doubt he would ever have a Suarez/tevez attitude in him, so he just have to be back to his better self, even missing chances galore, he has to simply create more and his team helping him in consequence, there have been ocassiosn where the ball didn't return to him and it should.
He has to acknowledge that the spoiled brat enviroment like in PSG in Madrid doesn't come instantly by name, you have to gain it, in Madrid it's starting all over again no matter how great he did before.
He has to regain confidence given he is in a new scenario, after quite a turmoil, over the top expectations, lots of already very young yet very accomplished teammates to compete and an accusation of raping in the middle.
He has to adapt to the malice and in my view better understanding of how to deal with dribblers from the Italian and Spanish League since almost ever.
For all the pace, power, money, great names, more big teams battling, better infraestructure in the EPL and the extremely physical and fast pace of the French League has, both are more naif when comes to deal with dribblers since ever.
No league is 5 steps above any other traditional one, but every league has its nuances and players must adapt to those.
Yet it's the lesser "issue", the big issues ALWAYS for any player are: how he deals with his mates (it doesn't require to be pals, but gain your place and respect), how to deal with the setup and style of the team involved and mostly the manager (adding in this case how to deal with the huge spotlight).
Any player of the talent of Mbappe can play anywhere, any player no matter talent must have those three things more or less under control in order to give their best.
His pace like Giorno said it's beyond great.
Him missing tons of chances? IT's HIM, even in his best days, he will be sometimes too much sellfish in certain ocassions or fumble many easy ones and later bend it on the top right corner shooting from the left angle of the big area.
Lucho Suarez was like that too, yet Lucho with his stamina and constant fierce attitude always safe his face and was a constant menace. Kiki can't do an indolent Dembele if he doesn't score goals galore, no matter if he runs 450 metres, pressure or whatever, no one would care if he scores or creates chances regularly and I very much doubt he would ever have a Suarez/tevez attitude in him, so he just have to be back to his better self, even missing chances galore, he has to simply create more and his team helping him in consequence, there have been ocassiosn where the ball didn't return to him and it should.
He has to acknowledge that the spoiled brat enviroment like in PSG in Madrid doesn't come instantly by name, you have to gain it, in Madrid it's starting all over again no matter how great he did before.
He has to regain confidence given he is in a new scenario, after quite a turmoil, over the top expectations, lots of already very young yet very accomplished teammates to compete and an accusation of raping in the middle.
He has to adapt to the malice and in my view better understanding of how to deal with dribblers from the Italian and Spanish League since almost ever.
For all the pace, power, money, great names, more big teams battling, better infraestructure in the EPL and the extremely physical and fast pace of the French League has, both are more naif when comes to deal with dribblers since ever.
No league is 5 steps above any other traditional one, but every league has its nuances and players must adapt to those.
Yet it's the lesser "issue", the big issues ALWAYS for any player are: how he deals with his mates (it doesn't require to be pals, but gain your place and respect), how to deal with the setup and style of the team involved and mostly the manager (adding in this case how to deal with the huge spotlight).
Any player of the talent of Mbappe can play anywhere, any player no matter talent must have those three things more or less under control in order to give their best.
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Not a single thing Mbappe is better at. Vini is the superior player in every aspect of the game. And at the moment it’s not even close.
Playing well for his country?
Mbappe has never been great technically.
Has never been Pele, Zico, RG, Ney, Messi or Maradona but him not being great? it's too much.
Mostly he lacks a better reading and decision making (not that smart and extremely lazy), but he is great technically none the less.
You do not need to go to that extreme, Just to list a few players, Mainoo, Amad, Erikson, Bernardo Silva, Foden, Salah, Mac Allister, Ødegaard, Trossard, I am just picking out some obvious ones but if you just go through every team in the PL the list would be very long.
I would swap Rashford for Mbappe
yes it's true I went to an extreme, but mainly because of his role and also the type of demands he has to deal with, similar to those players.
It takes a great deal of ability and talent to play at the pace of Kiki and the way he does it, his technique is great in many areas, he has lots of tools in his bag. I'm not in the group that put him on a level of skills and mostly intelligence of the ones mentioned, yet let's not go to the other extreme
That's a very odd list you've named, for many reasons and not quite suitable to make any comparison with the french lad.
Scolding hot take!
You still feeling the same way a few days later?
Indeed.I’ll need more convincing than two goals vs the worse footballing team in the division.
You can't judge anyone a couple of months after they move to a new league, I don't care how good your 'eyes' are. Some come good and some don't, but it's ridiculous to suggest that you can be sure after such a short period of time.
So far Mbappe has been awful, that much is true. Could turn it around but rough start for sure.
I’ll need more convincing than two goals vs the worse footballing team in the division.
Ah yes. Everton. A team which every striker worth his salt will fill his boots against. Only that’s not true, is it? He scored the same number of goals against them today that they had conceded in total in their last six matches.
Obviously making long term conclusions after one game is silly. But not a whole lot more silly than doing the same as quickly as you did.
The thing is you guys are telling this tail as if Zirkzee is an 18 year old whose arrived from the Bosnian league. He’s 23 years old and has played in Bundesliga and Serie A. He’s been around enough.
I said in August that I thought he’d be the flop signing of the season based on what I had seen and read about him at the time. I then watched him play several times and used the evidence that I had to conclude that he wasn’t going to be good enough for man united.
If Man United turn around and sign, I dunno Adam Idah tomorrow. I don’t need ‘insert random amount of months’ to be able to suggest he won’t make it at United. I genuinely don’t get this thing where people basically claim you must not judge a player who comes from abroad until they’ve played for a season in the Prem.
Fantastic finish!
It really is something though, that even when i try to praise Mbappe, which is not often, it all just reverts back to Perez and fixing something that didn't need to be fixed, so it isn't really praise after all.
Its exactly the space Vinicius would be in, when fit, so while its great to have another top LF and all, its not built to last.
It really is something though, that even when i try to praise Mbappe, which is not often, it all just reverts back to Perez and fixing something that didn't need to be fixed, so it isn't really praise after all.
Its exactly the space Vinicius would be in, when fit, so while its great to have another top LF and all, its not built to last.
It's basic logic that a handful of games is not enough. Some players settle in faster than others, some make it and some don't. But everyone has players that they thought would fail that succeeded and vice Versa. You can try and lie and say that's not the case with you, but we all know that would be false.
Also, because Manchester United has been such a basketcase of a club over the last few years, they're almost exempt from this discussion, because virtually every high profile player that has gone there in that period has failed. The way a club is run also has an impact.
It’s actually completely illogical. Using a one fits approach/analysis to basically any player man United sign from abroad when it comes to making a judgment about them. As I said in the previous post. If United signed Adam Idah tomorrow do I need to wait six games or months to come to the opinion he’s not good enough?
Players do have careers before they join United.
I myself don’t even use that approach. Again in a previous post I pointed out I believe Hojlund can make it here. From what I’ve seen from Amad I also believe he can make it here. This is my point. There is no hard set rule that you just wait ‘insert random amount of games/months’.
There were a fair few Dutch league followers on here who called Vdb and Antony signings being shite before they even landed. Presumably they weren’t allowed an opinion or were incorrect at the time because Antony and Vdb hadn’t played six games or been here six months…despite the fact they’d spent a number of years watching them play in Holland.
This is just a silly post now. Read what I said before. How many players have come to United and failed in the last few years? From abroad and from England? It would be easier to count the players that have been a resounding success. The team has not been good, the structure of the club is not good and the management has not been good. Here's hoping that all that will change going forward.
You talk about Amad and Ras, what have they actually done? Saying that some people thought correctly about Antony or whoever and therefore that means that you can always know immediately who will work and who will not is just asinine. Those are isolated examples and easily countered with examples of the opposite.
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No idea why @Kwabs has such a thing for Mbappe.
Mbappe is insanely talented, which he has displayed quite a few times over the years, but instead of aiming high and continuing to progress he decided to hold off on moving to a better team and a better league so he could stay in a farmers league that has been completely disrupted and destroyed by PSG. With such financial gains, it’s hardly much of a surprise that he opted for money to the point where he could’ve easily retired instead of signing for Real Madrid.
He’s 25, turning 26 in a few weeks, came at an insane cost and instead of being close to his peak and completley dominating as people expected from him, it’s now a question of how he progresses at Real Madrid, if he can play in the same side with Vinicius or if it’s going to be a case of one of them being benched more often than not. His overall performances aren’t very good, and miles away from what you’d expect from him.
Maybe he’ll turn things round and show that he’s a beast of a player, that the comparisons with former greats aren’t just fan bollox, but it’s hardly too early to question the decision making of club and player.
Mbappe is insanely talented, which he has displayed quite a few times over the years, but instead of aiming high and continuing to progress he decided to hold off on moving to a better team and a better league so he could stay in a farmers league that has been completely disrupted and destroyed by PSG. With such financial gains, it’s hardly much of a surprise that he opted for money to the point where he could’ve easily retired instead of signing for Real Madrid.
He’s 25, turning 26 in a few weeks, came at an insane cost and instead of being close to his peak and completley dominating as people expected from him, it’s now a question of how he progresses at Real Madrid, if he can play in the same side with Vinicius or if it’s going to be a case of one of them being benched more often than not. His overall performances aren’t very good, and miles away from what you’d expect from him.
Maybe he’ll turn things round and show that he’s a beast of a player, that the comparisons with former greats aren’t just fan bollox, but it’s hardly too early to question the decision making of club and player.
I don't have a 'thing for him', I just think he's a great player, and there's mountains of evidence to suggest that I'm correct. Same as I think any other great player is a great player. The problem with this forum and football discussion online in general is that everyone has access to every single game of every single player now, so people get judged on a game by game basis. Every time any top player has a bad game or a run of bad form, all of a sudden, they're a bum.
In reality, even great players are good sometimes and bad at others. I'm sure if this forum had existed when Maradona moved to Barcelona, there would be people on here saying Maradona was rubbish. I mean, when United played Barca in the CWC, Robson dominated the game and Maradona did nothing.
I can't imagine what this forum would be like in judging a hyped up player like Diego after a game like that. And he's a far greater player than Kylian Mbappe.
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I'll add to your notion, that not even just that, because the majority won't even watch the games, but would read a certain opinion in the news (many with an agenda behind) or even just a vid in youtube, an opinion a in a forum, a highlight, etc.
PD: Off topic, man, what you've said in that post, it's also sthg I've told you about in other interactions about Pele, Mane or Alfredo and such on other posts and you sometimes overlook that aspect with past players, with some sort of idea of a pristine/perfect carreer, that wouldn't look like that (even unfairly) with current nitpicking and current yellow press approach from everyone (remaining traditional media, social media "pros" or just us mere fans in forums and such) .