Knox/Sollecito Appeal Verdict due Today

If she is innocent she might feel that she deserves some recompense for her time in prison.
 
Nah wibbs, she looks like a bad 'un. Even if she is innocent she probably deserved her time any anyway.
 
Surely it makes no difference, she is in the states now so she doesn't have to go back to Italy either way.
 
Yep. I doubt there'd be a rush to extradite her (if the hearing goes against her).
 
Decision reserved for 10am (9am UK) tomorrow morning.
 
JustAFan said:
:lol:


no it doesn't say that, try reading it again
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:nervous: Erm you forgot the fact that I have one final thing I want you to consider. JustAFan, consider Chewbacca. Chewbacca is a Wookiee from the planet Kashyyyk. But Chewbacca lives on the planet Endor. Now think about it; that does not make sense!
 
JustAFan said:
Only if the US agrees to extradite her or if she agrees to go back to Italy willingly
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They won't extradite her. The yanks love foxy knoxy. Could you imagine the public outcry in the states from the yanks if she was extradited back to Italy.
 
So the prosecution, which didn't effectively prove its case the first time, can just keep appealing until it gets the result it wants?

In the US, you can't be retried after an acquittal.
 
The court examined whether there had been procedural irregularities, rather than looking at the details of the case, and it will announce the reasons for its ruling within 90 days.
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In 180 days they will announce why they couldn't explain straight-away.
 
I can't believe the timing of this. Bring her back into the spotlight when her book is out next month. The US will not extradite her, she'll be a borderline celebrity.
 
Bill.s.preston said:
I can't believe the timing of this. Bring her back into the spotlight when her book is out next month. The US will not extradite her, she'll be a borderline celebrity.
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She's also a convicted felon for life now, due to her framing of bar manager Patrick Lumumba (completely cleared within days), a false accusation which placed Knox at the scene of the murder. From the first trial:

Knox told the police Lumumba was the killer of Kercher, thereby implicating herself as his accomplice. She said she had met Lumumba at the basketball court at 8:30 pm, before going with him to Via della Pergola 7. Of the murder, she said: "I have a hard time remembering those moments but Patrick had sex with Meredith, with whom he was infatuated, but I cannot remember clearly whether he threatened Meredith first. I remember confusedly that he killed her."
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Bill.s.preston said:
I can't believe the timing of this. Bring her back into the spotlight when her book is out next month. The US will not extradite her, she'll be a borderline celebrity.
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She won't be extradited because it would be considered double jeopardy and would violate her rights under the Constitution. Most likely.
 
iSparky said:
They won't extradite her. The yanks love foxy knoxy. Could you imagine the public outcry in the states from the yanks if she was extradited back to Italy.
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It wouldn't be as bad as you expect, probably last a couple of days at the most, and for the most part it would be media driven. I wouldn't say there is a huge love for her here in the States, she is only back in the news because of this ruling, most people had moved on.

The case against extraditing her would be more based on the issue of "double jeopardy", being tried for the same case twice, in the U.S. it is an absolute no-no. Not so in Italy. But a U.S. Court might reject the idea of subjecting a U.S. Citizen to double jeopardy.

Her book will do well, and that will get her back in the spotlight, but even that will be short lived.
 
Given that the product blurb provided by her publisher is factually inaccurate, I don't hold out much hope regarding the validity of her memoirs. And I doubt that the blurb will be updated:

Product Description:

About the Author
Amanda Knox, 24, was convicted of murder in Perugia, Italy in 2009. In 2011, the conviction was overturned, and she was acquitted of all charges. She now lives in Seattle, her hometown, and is studying creative writing.
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In the interests of fairness...one of the main reasons why this book has been written is to compensate Amanda Knox's parents for the (very large) legal & other fees accrued during the affair.
 
Still though, what a joke of a justice system it is there. Here is a NY Times article on it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/27/world/europe/amanda-knox-retrial-ruling.html?pagewanted=2&_r=0

ROME — Italy’s highest court on Tuesday ordered a new trial in the case of Amanda Knox, an American exchange student accused of murdering her 21-year-old roommate, Meredith Kercher of Britain, in 2007.

The judges’ announcement that earlier acquittals had been overturned was greeted by a shocked silence in the courtroom here. Ms. Knox, who now attends the University of Washington in Seattle and had expressed hope that the ordeal was behind her, said through a spokesman that the news of her resurrected prosecution was “painful.”

The ruling by the Court of Cassation means that the case against Ms. Knox and her former boyfriend, Raffaele Sollecito, will be reheard at a new appeals court in Florence either later this year or in 2014. The two were initially convicted in a trial that divided public opinion internationally, but they were acquitted on appeal 18 months ago. Prosecutors then challenged that acquittal.

The decision opened another tangled and dramatic chapter in a long-running case whose youthful protagonists, sometimes lurid detail and courtroom spectacle have fascinated many people in the United States, Britain and the rest of Europe.

Ms. Kercher, a 21-year-old exchange student at the University of Perugia, was killed in her bedroom on the night of Nov. 1, 2007. Her half-naked body was found under a duvet, her throat slit.

Ms. Knox, then 20, and Mr. Sollecito, then 24, were arrested days later. They were convicted of murder in December 2009 in a lower court in Perugia and were sentenced to 25 years in prison. Ms. Knox received an extra year for calumny for accusing another man of committing the murder.

When the convictions were overturned on appeal, the two were released in October 2011. But last year, Italian prosecutors and lawyers for the Kercher family filed an appeal with the Court of Cassation, whose rulings are final. Ms. Knox’s lawyers appealed against the accusation of calumny, but the ruling on Tuesday upheld the charge.

A third man, Rudy Guede, an Ivory Coast native residing in Perugia, was tried separately and sentenced to 16 years.

The ruling on Tuesday did not call for the rearrest of the two defendants. Carlo Dalla Vedova, Ms. Knox’s lawyer, said she was unlikely to return to Italy for a retrial. “The psychological stress of the case has been heavy,” he said. “I don’t think that she’ll come.”

In a statement issued by her media advisers within minutes of the announcement, Ms. Knox said it was “painful” to receive the court’s ruling “when the prosecution’s theory of my involvement in Meredith’s murder has been repeatedly revealed to be completely unfounded and unfair.”

“No matter what happens, my family and I will face this continuing legal battle as we always have, confident in the truth and with our heads held high in the face of wrongful accusations and unreasonable adversity,” the statement said.

Giulia Bongiorno, a lawyer representing Mr. Sollecito, said in a telephone interview: “The battle continues. In this trial we always had to climb up the mountain.”

“We feel greatly confident,” she said. “We know that Raffaele is innocent, and we also know this is not a conviction.”

Ms. Bongiorno said she did not believe that Mr. Sollecito would be sent back to prison.

A lawyer for the Kercher family was jubilant.

“This is marvelous,” said the lawyer, Francesco Maresca. “I am very happy. I had faith in the Court of Cassation. I was sure it would annul the acquittal.”

He added: “This ruling gives justice the chance to re-establish the truth. No matter what’s said, more than one person committed this crime.”

Mr. Maresca said the Kercher family did not travel to Rome for the latest hearings because Arline Kercher, the victim’s mother, was unwell.

Mr. Dalla Vedova, Ms. Knox’s lawyer, said his client was in Seattle and had stayed up waiting for the outcome until 2 a.m. local time. “She was sad,” the lawyer said. “She believed the nightmare was over.” But a day of hearings on Monday about the case “went on for so long,” he added, “it became clear that there was going to be further harassment against this young girl.”

Ms. Knox “is ready for a new trial; she’s gone through this before,” Mr. Dalla Vedova said. “She’s ready to fight.”

Mr. Dalla Vedova said that the precise reason the new trial was ordered was expected from the Court of Cassation within 90 days, and that lawyers would then learn “which points will have to be re-examined.” “It could be the DNA, witnesses or a footprint” that needs clarification, he added.

If the new appeals court upholds the previous conviction and the Court of Cassation confirms it, Mr. Dalla Vedova said, Ms. Knox would have to serve out her sentence. The lawyer said that the Italian authorities would have to authorize an extradition request and that the United States government would have to approve it.

Arguments about double jeopardy — preventing Ms. Knox from being sentenced twice for the same crime — would not apply in this case because there had been no final ruling, he said.

Ms. Knox moved back to her hometown, Seattle, after her release from prison and is now studying creative writing, said David Marriott, the Knox family media adviser. A book by Ms. Knox, “Waiting to Be Heard,” is expected to be published on April 30, the same day that Diane Sawyer, the anchor of “World News” on ABC, will conduct the first interview with Ms. Knox since her release.

Mr. Sollecito has been living in Verona, where he is getting a degree in computer engineering. He did not go to the new hearings.

“He didn’t want to get caught up in this mob scene,” said his father, Francesco Sollecito, who attended Monday’s hearing with his wife. “He didn’t want to be here.”

The Court of Cassation rules on questions of procedure, not on the merits of a case. On Monday, both the prosecutor’s office and the defense gave impassioned arguments that dredged up the minutiae of evidence that initially convicted Ms. Knox and Mr. Sollecito.

In the original case, prosecutors argued that Ms. Kercher had been the reluctant victim of a drug-fueled game of rough sex gone awry, involving Ms. Knox, Mr. Sollecito and Mr. Guede.

But questions were raised during the appeal about the prosecutors’ theory of the crime and the quality of the evidence, including the reliability of some witnesses. An independent review also cast doubt on the DNA evidence of two critical exhibits for the prosecution: the knife they claimed was used to kill Ms. Kercher, and a bra clasp found in her room. The appellate court ruled that the prosecution’s case did not stand up.

The prosecutor general, Luigi Riello, told the court on Monday that the acquittal was a “violation of the law and a monument to illogicality” that should be overturned. “The appeals judge lost his way in this case,” he said.

He argued that the appellate court had been superficial in retrying the case, cherry-picking the forensic evidence that it had reviewed, rather than examining all the elements that had led to the conviction. “The DNA evidence was used as the final word over all other evidence,” Mr. Riello said.

“I believe that all the premises exist to ensure that the curtain does not fall on this crime,” he said.
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So there we have it, she is not going back for trial anyway. As for the second bit in bold, I dont think that will happen, Italy will put in an request to have her expedited and the USA will turn it down. I dont see it going any other way.
 
Harvard Law Professor Alan Dershowitz said that Italian prosecutors might very well extradite Amanda Knox. And, if retried, she "likely will be found guilty, because the evidence supporting a conviction is pretty strong."

Knox, now 25, has established a fan base in the United States "because she has a beautiful face and an angelic appearance," Dershowitz said. "But remember, she originally admitted she was at the scene of the crime and she tried to blame an innocent man -- for which she was also convicted."

After Knox and Sollecito were detained for questioning in the killing, she allegedly confessed to being at her home when Kercher was killed and implicated Patrick Lumumba, the owner of a bar where she worked. Lumumba was detained, but was released after two weeks when his alibi was corroborated: he had spent the night of the murder talking to a customer in his pub in Perugia, police say. He went on to sue Knox for libel, winning 40,000 euros ($54,000) in damages.

Dershowitz said the case was not well tried the first time. "But at a second trial, there's a very high likelihood that they may very well convict her."

He predicted that Knox would resist any extradition attempt. But even if she were to succeed in that, "she remains a prisoner in the United States, because Interpol will put a warrant out for her and, if she travels anywhere outside the United States, she'll be immediately arrested and turned over to Italy."

If Knox were to lose an extradition fight and then wind up being convicted, she would go to jail, he said. If he were advising Kercher's parents, Dershowitz said, he would recommend that they file a civil suit to claim the money Knox has received as an advance for a book about the case that is scheduled for publication next month.

"They have a right to sue her on behalf of their dead daughter," he said, noting that the standard required for conviction in civil cases is a preponderance of the evidence. "I think that would be easy to do."

And the extradition treaty's reference to double jeopardy may not be binding in some cases, he said. "In the United States, generally, when you appeal a conviction, you waive your double jeopardy rights, and we permit retrials of people who have had their convictions reversed, at least on procedural grounds," he said.

And what about Casey's prediction that Italian law enforcement would not seek extradition?

"I think he's wrong," Dershowitz said. "I think the Italian legal system will welcome a second trial. They'll put new prosecutors on the case, good ones, and seek to vindicate themselves. They will want to have a second opportunity to show that Italian justice can be pure."

Dershowitz said purity has also eluded many members of the U.S. news media who have covered the case closely.

"One issue is why the American media portrayed her in such positive terms," he said. "At best, she was a terrible person who tried to blame it on some innocent person and she was clearly a liar, and at worst she participated in a horrible murder, and the American media focused much more on Amanda Knox than on the victim of the case because Amanda Knox was prettier and an American and an American sweetheart."

(Source: CNN)
 
The retrial begins. Italy, probably the only place where you end up back on trial after being exonerated. Joke of a legal system, I thought they have someone banged up for this now anyway?
 
I've not read her book, but does she provide an explanation for originally blaming her boss?
 
Brophs said:
I've not read her book, but does she provide an explanation for originally blaming her boss?
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I think I read that she claims she was interrogated for a long time, often by a room full of cops at once. She claims to have not been able to understand most of what they were saying and that she was also hit during the interrogation. I believe she also said she quickly tried to take back the accusation but the interrogators would not let her or did not listen.

True or not, I have no idea.
 
Brophs said:
I've not read her book, but does she provide an explanation for originally blaming her boss?
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She claimed (until the case against Lumumba collapsed and he was released) that she'd been hit by police, deprived of food and was suffering from 'traumatic memory loss' all of which apparently led her to have 'a vision of Lumumba at the crime scene'. Lumumba successfully sued Knox:

Knox was also ordered to pay Patrick Lumumba €10,000 in damages as a result of her conviction for slander, and €40,000 compensation for his legal expenses. The decision was upheld by the appeals court in October 2011, which sentenced Knox to three years' imprisonment, already served, and ordered her to pay a further €22,000.

(Sources: Wikipedia & others)
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JustAFan said:
I think I read that she claims she was interrogated for a long time, often by a room full of cops at once. She claims to have not been able to understand most of what they were saying and that she was also hit during the interrogation. I believe she also said she quickly tried to take back the accusation but the interrogators would not let her or did not listen.


True or not, I have no idea.
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Yeah, I was aware of quite a bit of that, I'm just wondering about the mechanics, really. Who mentioned him first? What level of detail was given etc. Steve's post adds a little more, though I suspect, if she wasn't the murder and been trying to divert attention, that she may have just thought of the first male she knew in the area and thrown him under the bus.

SteveJ said:
She claimed (until the case against Lumumba collapsed and he was released) that she'd been hit by police, deprived of food and was suffering from 'traumatic memory loss' all of which apparently led her to have 'a vision of Lumumba at the crime scene'. Lumumba successfully sued Knox:
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Lumumba's name came up because Sollecito changed alibis several times: he first claimed that AK left his apartment at 9pm to work in Lumumba's bar, even though it was later found that Lumumba sent a text to AK (to which she replied) stating that there was no work for her that night. At this stage, it appeared that Sollecito was trying to distance himself from Knox. Subsequently, Sollecito claimed that the pair had downloaded a film, watched it, and spent the night at his flat.
 
Ms. Knox moved back to her hometown, Seattle, after her release from prison and is now studying creative writing, said David Marriott, the Knox family media adviser. A book by Ms. Knox, “Waiting to Be Heard,” is expected to be published on April 30, the same day that Diane Sawyer, the anchor of “World News” on ABC, will conduct the first interview with Ms. Knox since her release.


To help with her defence and new book no doubt!

They are taking the piss...she and her family have a media adviser? Not sure what the law is in the US but should she be found guilty sure she should not benefit financially from her crime and no book should come out until after any verdicts if at all.
 
Marching said:
Ms. Knox moved back to her hometown, Seattle, after her release from prison and is now studying creative writing, said David Marriott, the Knox family media adviser. A book by Ms. Knox, “Waiting to Be Heard,” is expected to be published on April 30, the same day that Diane Sawyer, the anchor of “World News” on ABC, will conduct the first interview with Ms. Knox since her release.


To help with her defence and new book no doubt!

They are taking the piss...she and her family have a media adviser? Not sure what the law is in the US but should she be found guilty sure she should not benefit financially from her crime and no book should come out until after any verdicts if at all.
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Well she received circa $2m up front which supposedly all went back to the family for legal fees and expenses, but I wouldn't worry about her making too much more since the book itself has bombed. Out of about 450,000 printed, numbers including e-books sold approximate 30,000 worldwide. The publishers have taken a bath, deservedly.
 
So yet another verdict is due today (I think it is today) on this case. Not sure what this judge will rule this time around, but my guess is that no matter what he rules it will do little to clarify what actually happened, who did it, or bring any kind of closure to the situation. I seem to remember reading someplace that even if found not-guilty Knox and Sollecito could be tried one more time under Italian law, is that true?
 
They would be tried again under Italian law, Knox has already said though she is not going to return for a trial and there is no way the yanks would extradite her to Italy, the American public like her, the outcry would be huge. Don't they have a chap serving time for this crime anyway?
 
iSparky said:
They would be tried again under Italian law, Knox has already said though she is not going to return for a trial and there is no way the yanks would extradite her to Italy, the American public like her, the outcry would be huge. Don't they have a chap serving time for this crime anyway?
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not sure the outcry would be that huge considering how much her book flopped. Mostly the extradition will not happen because the US Govt will be unlikely to turn over a citizen who already has been tried once for this given the US law against being tried twice for the same crime.
 
JustAFan said:
not sure the outcry would be that huge considering how much her book flopped. Mostly the extradition will not happen because the US Govt will be unlikely to turn over a citizen who already has been tried once for this given the US law against being tried twice for the same crime.
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I thought they were happy having her back?
 
iSparky said:
I thought they were happy having her back?
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Lotsa of media coverage for sure and certainly in her home town lots of people happy. I just am not sure the entire country was deeply engrossed in this trial, I can only speak for myself and people I know and I have spent far more time here talking about the case then I have with people in the US. Oh I think there would be some outcry, mostly stirred up by media coverage, but just not a nationwide thing. Though perhaps her US lawyers would be able to wind people up enough to get a big outcry by time any extradition hearings actually took place.
 
I have to say, given the fact that they day the DNA evidence is inconclusive and that someone is incarcerated for the crime it just looks stupid on the Italians part that you can be convicted, have the conviction overturned and then convicted again. They will appeal to the Supreme Court no doubt.

Like I said I don't see the USA extraditing her anyway. They are famously protective over their citizens.

And how can Knox get 28 years when the fella who is serving time for murder only gets 16?
 
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