Keeping Midfield Strong

[jesperjaap]

Definitely... Blind can do a decent job as #6. And as you mentioned, we still need to buy a dynamic midfielder. Maybe that's why we were linked with Sanches and Saul months ago.

I dont understand peoples loving of Blind he is an average centre back, a decent left back and a decent central midfielder. Though personally I think central midfield is his best position I dont think he should be a starter there either, great squad player, very average first team player in my opinion.

I think we need two central midfielders with lots of energy. Herrera and Mensah look like the only possible box to box players in ours side. Herrera hasnt cut it and Mensah is very young and hasnt even played there. I grew up with Bryan Robson, then Paul Ince then Keane, all world class box to box players, that is what we are crying out for in my opinion and if we can find anyone anywhere close to the quality of any of those three we have done well.

Not seen him since he has been at Inter but beforehand, although he was raw and not the cleverest I really liked the look of Kondogbia. The other one who has surprised me in terms of his aggresiveness as a player is Dele Ali. Somebody like these two or the dream signing of Pogba that wont happen would be ideal. Hopefully Mourinho can sign someone of that ilk........another Essien

 

[Fer]

If we play 433... who do you prefer as No.6/CDM?

• Carrick
• Schweinsteiger
• Schneiderlin
• Blind
• Fosu-Mensah

 

[YouOnlyLiveTwice]

I would rotate between Carrick, Bastian and Blind, because i prefer a good passer as the #6.

 

[Freak]

Get Pogba back no matter the price.

 

[Mike09]

If we play 433... who do you prefer as No.6/CDM?

• Carrick
• Schweinsteiger
• Schneiderlin
• Blind
• Fosu-Mensah

Carrick. He's the best one in that list according to this season. I would like to see Mensah in that role as well since a lot of people have been talking about him play as No.6. McNair will be another interesting option from what I heard. Schneiderlin is just so average in my eyes and he should be in his peak right now.

 

[Verminator]

We should be busting a gut to get Kante.
Add Pogba in there for a dream team scenario.

 

[Fer]

Carrick signing an extension and the rumors about Matic it seems that Mourinho would have Schneiderlin, Schweinsteiger, Matic and Carrick as options for a midfield of 2. I think we should go for someone more athletic and creative (maybe that's why we are linked with Andre Gomes).

 

[Fer]

I don't think we can afford to just skip buying new CM's this summer, we are still really lacking there and I think those that think they'll all suddenly come good under Jose are kidding themselves. If all of the ones you list are unavailable I'd go for Joao Mario and Andre Gomes or Leon Goretzka.

We signed Bailly and we are linked with players like Embolo, Lozano and Ounas. So I wouldn't be surprised if we go for one of the players you want.

Goretzka is an interesting choice. I saw Schalke lasthe season (mainly for Sane). They have good midfielders like Meyer and Geis. In some moments, I was a bit impress with Goretzka, he reminds me Javier Martinez but he was able to attack more and he has a good shot.

I have not been following Joao Mario so I can't comment on him. But you normally propose quality players.

I'm not totally convinced with Andre Gomes. I mentioned before players like Gundogan/Pjanic because I think they are better, cheaper and available. Pogba would be my favorite signing but I can see him going to Madrid, Pjanic to Juve as I mentioned a week ago and Gundogan to City.

So even it wouldn't be my 1st choice, Andre Gomes could be our creative midfielder. There are rumors about Matic, but we already have Carrick, Schweinsteiger, Schneiderlin, Blind and Fosu-Mensah able to play as defensive midfielder if needed. IMO we need a creative midfielder to improve Rooney and Herrera.

 

[Devil may care]

We signed Bailly and we are linked with players like Embolo, Lozano and Ounas. So I wouldn't be surprised if we go for one of the players you want.

Goretzka is an interesting choice. I saw Schalke lasthe season (mainly for Sane). They have good midfielders like Meyer and Geis. In some moments, I was a bit impress with Goretzka, he reminds me Javier Martinez but he was able to attack more and he has a good shot.

I have not been following Joao Mario so I can't comment on him. But you normally propose quality players.

I'm not totally convinced with Andre Gomes. I mentioned before players like Gundogan/Pjanic because I think they are better, cheaper and available. Pogba would be my favorite signing but I can see him going to Madrid, Pjanic to Juve as I mentioned a week ago and Gundogan to City.

So even it wouldn't be my 1st choice, Andre Gomes could be our creative midfielder. There are rumors about Matic, but we already have Carrick, Schweinsteiger, Schneiderlin, Blind and Fosu-Mensah able to play as defensive midfielder if needed. IMO we need a creative midfielder to improve Rooney and Herrera.

Goretzka seems to be very below the radar and I guess that is down to the amount of quality CM's Germany have right now, but he's a strong all rounder that I think would be a great addition for us. Joao Mario would seem unlikely now as Jose said he didn't intend to buy any players from the Portuguese league.

Gomes looks be last CM standing at this point if we want a creative midfielder as the rest have been hoovered up. I wouldn't be that surprised to see Jose add a DM as well though as Schneiderlin is not a holding CM and Blind doesn't seem Mou's type of player to me. Someone like Krychowiak or Kante would fit for that role.

 

[Fer]

It seems that there are not many options left, the best available are heading to other clubs:

• Pjanic to Juventus
• Pogba to Real Madrid
• Gundogan to City
• Xhaka to Arsenal
• Sanches to Bayern

There are talented midfielders staying in their clubs like Saul and Verrati. But, If Pogba signs for Madrid. Someone of Kroos, Isco and James could be sold, so any of those players would be a good option.

IMO some young players like Neves, Tielemans or Bazoer are not the solution yet. I prefer someone like Kante, he would be a good signing. Unfortunately, PSG and Chelsea want him (and I wouldn't be surprised if City try to sign him too).

For now, we are linked with Matic and Andre Gomes... Assuming Rooney would start as one of the midfielders, which 2 CMs would you play with him?

 

[apotheosis]

Why no mention for Payet? He would certainly be my first choice for a creative midfield option. He has just been so impressive every time ive watched him, and tbh, im a bit surprised he's not getting more of a mention. In my view, signing both Payet and Kante would give us everything we would currently need to give us that next level midfield.

 

[Devil may care]

Him and Fellaini don't really offer anything I don't think. I guess one of them as squad players, to get subbed on to add more steel in midfield to see out games, but that's literally their only role.

Easy games, Herrera and Pogba is the midfield. Hard games, Carrick comes in and sits behind them. Those 3 have a perfect blend of everything between them, and in a run of easy games, they rotate around each other.

When one of Schneiderlin or Fellaini comes in, there is a huge decrease in quality. Like, massive decrease in quality. So ideally, I think Mourinho wants any other midfielders we have to be able to come in and not have a drop in quality like we currently see. Probably a Carrick replacement to be first choice. Then we'd have Carrick as his back up. Herrera as the '12th man' who comes in all the time, rotates anywhere and starts the big games while also being first back up for pogba. And then 1 more, maybe some promising younger midfielder to have a role. But that would be a good group of 5 to have I think, all 5 with clear roles and very good with them. Not like right now where Schneiderlin and Fellaini are in their prime years but are a bit shit, and then Schweinsteiger who is old, often injured and clearly no future here.

@bosnian_red

Thought it was worth quoting this post from the Schneiderlin thread in here. We all know that we need to find Carrick's successor but adding another box to box CM to replace Schneiderlin, Schweini and Fellaini should also be on the cards to keep the quality in depth high.

 

[Mike09]

@bosnian_red

Thought it was worth quoting this post from the Schneiderlin thread in here. We all know that we need to find Carrick's successor but adding another box to box CM to replace Schneiderlin, Schweini and Fellaini should also be on the cards to keep the quality in depth high.

Herrera, Pogba, Carrick, Mensah, Carrick's replacement. Do we need 6 midfields to compete for two position? Just want to remind you worst scenario of injury we can still use Blind as well.

 

[Devil may care]

Herrera, Pogba, Carrick, Mensah, Carrick's replacement. Do we need 6 midfields to compete for two position? Just want to remind you worst scenario of injury we can still use Blind as well.

We will hopefully be playing 4-3-3 so two for each spot, plus Carrick has maybe one more season at most in him and there's no gurantee that Jose even sees Fosu-Mensah as a CM of any description.

 

[Mike09]

We will hopefully be playing 4-3-3 so two for each spot, plus Carrick has maybe one more season at most in him and there's no gurantee that Jose even sees Fosu-Mensah as a CM of any description.

Lol you are so inconsistent mate. You are referring 433 because thats what you wanted to see but Jose plays 4231. But you think Mensah might not play as CM because Jose might not see him as CM.

From what I heard and what I know, once Jose knows his best XI, he will not do too many rotation. Thus, having 6 natural midfields might not be a good idea. It will be nice to have so many options but I don't think another box to box is priority after finding Carrick's replacement.
Jose might play 433 in big games but so far we know that he prefers 4231.
Jose has been ignoring Mensah as a full back and has been using Blind, Young and Darmian as his 2nd choice full backs. Two last games of Mensah when he played less than 5 minutes in Europa League and Swansea game. Both games he played as a midfielder. So there is a chance Jose might see him as a midfielder, I thought a lot of people want to see him as a midfielder.

 

[Devil may care]

Lol you are so inconsistent mate. You are referring 433 because thats what you wanted to see but Jose plays 4231. But you think Mensah might not play as CM because Jose might not see him as CM.

From what I heard and what I know, once Jose knows his best XI, he will not do too many rotation. Thus, having 6 natural midfields might not be a good idea.
Jose might play 433 in big games but so far we know that he prefers 4231.
Jose has been ignoring Mensah as a full back and has been using Blind, Young and Darmian as his 2nd choice full backs. Two last games of Mensah when he played less than 5 minutes in Europa League and Swansea game. Both games he played as a midfielder. So there is a chance Jose might see him as a midfielder, I thought a lot of people want to see him as a midfielder.

I don't get how what I wrote was inconsistent. I said we will hopefully play more 4-3-3 as we paid £89M for Pogba and that is how you get the best out of him. As for TFM I was simply pointing out Jose might not be sure where he's best yet, or frankly if he's even good enough, none of that is inconsistent.

Jose still doesn't know his best 11, but I would hope he's been smart enough to know Pogba is not suited to playing in a 2 man midfield with a #10 in his space.

 

[Mike09]

I don't get how what I wrote was inconsistent. I said we will hopefully play more 4-3-3 as we paid £89M for Pogba and that is how you get the best out of him. As for TFM I was simply pointing out Jose might not be sure where he's best yet, or frankly if he's even good enough,none of that is inconsistent.

Jose still doesn't know his best 11, but I would hope he's been smart enough to know Pogba is not suited to playing in a 2 man midfield with a #10 in his space.

Lol. I called it inconsistent because the two things you mentioned (433 and Mensah) are based on "what you think at best" (433) and "what Jose might thinks at best" (Mensah). If you want to use what Jose thinks at best then you should follow what Jose thinks about 4231 is his best formation to get the best out of Pogba. Oh well, the inconsistent thing isn't really important to discussed anyway.

Well so far Pogba has been playing as a no8 most of the time apart from the big game against Arsenal and Chelsea. And I thought we were talking about the potential our next summer signings not about right now? So he will definitely knows his best XI for sure after next summer windows if he still here.

 

[Devil may care]

Lol. I called it inconsistent because the two things you mentioned (433 and Mensah) are based on "what you think at best" (433) and "what Jose might thinks at best" (Mensah). If you want to use what Jose thinks at best then you should follow what Jose thinks 4231 is his best formation to get the best out of Pogba. Oh well, the inconsistent thing isn't really important to discussed anyway.

Well so far Pogba has been playing as a no8 most of the time apart from the big game against Arsenal and Chelsea. And I thought we were talking about the potential our next summer signings not about right now? So he will definitely knows his best XI for sure after next summer windows if he still here.

I'm not sure you have the right word mate, but ok. TFM isn't really pertinent to the discussion IMO, so far one thing we do know is that he's not done enough to force himself conssitently into Jose's squads and from that we could gather that he porbably has a loan or two in his future. As for the 4-2-3-1 vs 4-3-3 we have dabbled in both but longer term we will have wasted our money if we keep trying to force Pogba into a role he's not used to IMO.

 

[bosnian_red]

Herrera, Pogba, Carrick, Mensah, Carrick's replacement. Do we need 6 midfields to compete for two position? Just want to remind you worst scenario of injury we can still use Blind as well.

Its 3 positions really a lot of the time (so you can include Mata). Also I doubt Fosu Mensah will ever really be anywhere near good enough on the ball to play in midfield as anything more then someone like when Mourinho threw Zouma in midfield just to break things up. He is a defender (one without much positional sense atm), not really a midfielder.

So yeah, we definitely need someone. A holding midfielder primarily who can be the starter, carrick his back up, then pogba next to him with herrera his back up and being the one to come in to make a midfield 3 when needed. A 5th midfielder (be it a more creative or playmaker type or a more defensive and stronger physically one) would round that group up nicely, so he can fill in at any of the midfield positions. That could actually be Andreas Pereira, though he seems to mostly play on the wing.

 

[Mike09]

I'm not sure you have the right word mate, but ok. TFM isn't really pertinent to the discussion IMO, so far one thing we do know is that he's not done enough to force himself conssitently into Jose's squads and from that we could gather that he porbably has a loan or two in his future. As for the 4-2-3-1 vs 4-3-3 we have dabbled in both but longer term we will have wasted our money if we keep trying to force Pogba into a role he's not used to IMO.

I don't think I have the right words too because I'm not that good in explaining things but I think you understand what I meant

It doesn't seem to be a waste of money when Pogba played as no8 against West Ham and Feyenoord. Again, It's up to the manager whether we use 4231 or 433. As far as what i know this season we have been playing 4231 in most of our games and 433 only at big games.

 

[Robertd0803]

Reading through the first few pages of this thread shows how unlikely Pogba re-joining really was at one point.

 

[Devil may care]

I don't think I have the right words too because I'm not that good in explaining things but I think you understand what I meant

It doesn't seem to be a waste of money when Pogba played as no8 against West Ham and Feyenoord. Again, It's up to the manager whether we use 4231 or 433. As far as what i know this season we have been playing 4231 in most of our games and 433 only at big games.

Yeah, I gotcha mate, no problem.

I think when Mata was playing as the #10 if you look at his starting position him and Pogba were really operating in a 4-3-3 with Mata in the inside right channel. Sometimes what is laid out by the TV for a positional line-up does not reflect where the players actually pick up on the pitch. I guess we will see what happens but I think we will find more frustration if we continue to try and force Pogba into a different role to the one he excelled in at Juve.

 

[AndyJ1985]

Replacing Carrick is crucial. Verrati would be my #1 choice but that ain't going to happen. We also need to bin Fellaini and bring in someone who can win the ball back without using their elbows.

 

[Devil may care]

I already thought it was necessary and today just highlighted it further, if Jose is going to stick with this thing of bringing on an extra CM and moving Herrera to the RW when he wants to shut up shop, we need to get in a better class of option, the drop off in quality is way too steep with Fellaini and Schneiderlin.

 

[United Pro]

I already thought it was necessary and today just highlighted it further, if Jose is going to stick with this thing of bringing on an extra CM and moving Herrera to the RW when he wants to shut up shop, we need to get in a better class of option, the drop off in quality is way too steep with Fellaini and Schneiderlin.

I think Schneiderlin is very solid defensively and is exactly who we needed to play when shutting up shop. Fellaini on the other hand wasn't, but atleast he adds height to the team (sarcasm).

 

[Devil may care]

I think Schneiderlin is very solid defensively and is exactly who we needed to play when shutting up shop. Fellaini on the other hand wasn't, but atleast he adds height to the team (sarcasm).

I don't think Schneiderlin has the nerve to play for United, he often looks lost and this is two managers in a row that haven't fancied him. The shut up shop role requires a CM with composure and smarts IMO.

 

[United Pro]

I don't think Schneiderlin has the nerve to play for United, he often looks lost and this is two managers in a row that haven't fancied him. The shut up shop role requires a CM with composure and smarts IMO.

I agree in that Schneiderlin isn't technically the best, but defensively he's easily our best CM imo and when we are parking the bus, that's the most important thing required. Saying that, I personally don't think Schneiderlin is that much worse technically than Herrera tbh and if we remember last season, statistics showed that we did considerably better when Schneiderlin started (if I remember correctly), so he did perform for United.

 

[Devil may care]

I agree in that Schneiderlin isn't technically the best, but defensively he's easily our best CM imo and when we are parking the bus, that's the most important thing required. Saying that, I personally don't think Schneiderlin is that much worse technically than Herrera tbh and if we remember last season, statistics showed that we did considerably better when Schneiderlin started (if I remember correctly), so he did perform for United.

The stats to prove player A means we win more is why stats are not a true barometer of a team IMO, bar Carrick I don't think any one player has a big effect. It's not so much about technical quality but mental composure, I don't think Schneiderlin has it. We should be aiming to have our midfield be in a position where Carrick can be that guy we bring on for the last 10-15 minutes to calmly see out a game.

 

[United Pro]

The stats to prove player A means we win more is why stats are not a true barometer of a team IMO, bar Carrick I don't think any one player has a big effect. It's not so much about technical quality but mental composure, I don't think Schneiderlin has it. We should be aiming to have our midfield be in a position where Carrick can be that guy we bring on for the last 10-15 minutes to calmly see out a game.

Again I agree that Carrick is a must starter, but most of our big wins last season came when Schneiderlin started. He provided the defensive security when our other players pushed forward. Even though he by himself was unspectacular, he was an important piece of last seasons strong defensive displays. Ofc, there are better options out there, but atm especially in the circumstance we were in, during the last 15 minutes of the game against Everton, Schneiderlin was surely a better option than Fellaini?

 

[Devil may care]

Again I agree that Carrick is a must starter, but most of our big wins last season came when Schneiderlin started. He provided the defensive security when our other players pushed forward. Even though he by himself was unspectacular, he was an important piece of last seasons strong defensive displays. Ofc, there are better options out there, but atm especially in the circumstance we were in, during the last 15 minutes of the game against Everton, Schneiderlin was surely a better option than Fellaini?

Oh yeah, in this role I'd use him over Fellaini, but my main point is I think we need to get rid of both and get in options that don't see the quality drop off from Herrera and Pogba be so steep.

 

[United Pro]

Oh yeah, in this role I'd use him over Fellaini, but my main point is I think we need to get rid of both and get in options that don't see the quality drop off from Herrera and Pogba be so steep.

I personally don't think there is much of a quality drop from Herrera and Schneiderlin, but I'd also sell if we could get £20m+ for him.

 

[ghagua]

Again I agree that Carrick is a must starter, but most of our big wins last season came when Schneiderlin started. He provided the defensive security when our other players pushed forward. Even though he by himself was unspectacular, he was an important piece of last seasons strong defensive displays. Ofc, there are better options out there, but atm especially in the circumstance we were in, during the last 15 minutes of the game against Everton, Schneiderlin was surely a better option than Fellaini?

None of our midfielders have proven anything this season. IF and WHEN an opposition team bother's to attack, they slice through our midfield as if it was non existent. Schneiderlin will be given his chance soon when Mourinho realizes his job may be in danger. Everyone said the same shite about Mkhitaryan, but since been given a proper chance, he has managed to show that he can play a bit as well.

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

The thought of losing any of our midfielders for suspension/injury is scary. Surely this has to be a priority for upcoming windows. Our depth is shocking.

 

[Devil may care]

The midfiled machine is looking great right now but we are lacking options should any of the main trio go down. In fairness there's not really a player that can cover what Pogba brings but he seems to be a super athlete like Ronnie and likes to play 90 minutes every game, plus if was injured I imagine we'd just play a #10 instead, and we know we need a Carrick replacement, but I think we need someone to cover and compete with Ander, he gets through so much work it's impossible to expect him to sustain it without some breaks.

Trigueros from Villareal and Tolisso from Lyon are both good options, they have the midfield versatility like Ander, are at an age where their best is still in front of them but they still have plenty of experience, and they are at clubs that will sell.

 

[Devil may care]

This reared it's ugly head tonight, take Pogba out and we looked devoid of passing creativity and we had no change of gear to eleviate pressure, the midfield was completely one paced. We all know we need a holding midfielder but adding another athletic box to box option to cover/compete with Pogba and Ander would be welcome.

 

[Blind]

Fabinho and Naby Keita, job done.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

This reared it's ugly head tonight, take Pogba out and we looked devoid of passing creativity and we had no change of gear to eleviate pressure, the midfield was completely one paced. We all know we need a holding midfielder but adding another athletic box to box option to cover/compete with Pogba and Ander would be welcome.

We didn't lack athleticism. We simply lacked the ability to keep and use the ball under pressure, so it's doubtful a box to box player would have helped. But long term I agree we need like for like cover for Pobga and Herrera.

 

[Infra-red]

Fabinho and Naby Keita, job done.

I like Keita. Nainggolan, Tolisso, Kovacic, Cyprien options too, perhaps.

 

[Devil may care]

We didn't lack athleticism. We simply lacked the ability to keep and use the ball under pressure, so it's doubtful a box to box player would have helped. But long term I agree we need like for like cover for Pogna and Herrera.

Another box to box that could drive the ball out and relieve the pressure would have been very importnat, yes we need them to be techncially good as well, not disagreeing with that.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Another box to box that could drive the ball out and relieve the pressure would have been very importnat, yes we need them to be techncially good as well, not disagreeing with that.

People like Naingollan, Naby Keita, Cyprien Kessie, Kovavcic, Goretzka, Koke, Saul, Joao Mario and Hector Herrera fit the archi type. But I doubt we'd look their way. We seem more interested in a Bakayoko or Danilo Pereira type.