Jurgen Klopp and Dortmund

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Sean_RedDevil said:
Of course it's possible but i can't see it.

They're making so many mistakes in the defence....a Lewandowski could maybe score a hat-trick in a match against Cologne (or Hamburg two weeks ago) and they could still win a match.
But like said they don't have a striker like him and their attacking players can't score enough goals to get something from this matches.

We're average/poor in the defence too....but Di Maria, Rooney, Falcao, RVP, Mata & Januzaj can give us enough goals to win matches against clubs like QPR, West Ham or Everton.

Bayern Munich vs Dortmund in two weeks will be very important for Dortmund....first of all they must beat Hannover next weekend
If they beat Hannover and then can beat Bayern Munich or at least a draw with a very good game.....then they go up in the table
But no win against Hannover then they're really fecked and will probably lose 3-0/4-0 in the Allianz Arena
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Finishing has always been Lewandowski's biggest weaknes.. Immobile might actually be stronger in that aspect.. and Mkhitaryan, Aubameyang, Reus, Kagawa and Kuba are all very capable of scoring 10 goals a season in the league, their problems aren't that simple.

Finishing also wasn't the problem today, it was clearly sloppy touches/passing/defending and a lack of cohesion/automatisms. Whereas at the beginning of the seaons I would have attributed Dortmund's problems almost entirely to their injuries it now seems pretty obvious that they are also in a bit of a vicious circle when it comes to the mental aspects of the game.

And I doubt that the result against Bayern will simply mirror the one against Hannover..
 
Sean_RedDevil said:
Why??
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Because the knockout stages are still about 4 months away. That's more than enough time for this team to start firing on all cyllinders. I think they will have reached top form long before that.

We're talking about a team with Reus, Hummels, Kagawa, Gündogan and Sahin, with much added squad depth and Klopp as the manager. There's no way they'll remain this bad. They won the group of death in the CL two years in a row with significantly less squad depth and experience, after all.
 
Cant see them making the top 4 and certainly wont get past the quarters in the CL, they are a woeful side at present. They must win their next two or I feel Klopp could be under severe pressure.
 
ItsEssexRob said:
Cant see them making the top 4 and certainly wont get past the quarters in the CL, they are a woeful side at present. They must win their next two or I feel Klopp could be under severe pressure.
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Analysis on the Caf would be very interesting if he were to get the sack given most people on regard him as their favourite manager.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
Analysis on the Caf would be very interesting if he were to get the sack given most people on regard him as their favourite manager.
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If they sack the man when they have been troubled with injuries, after all he has done for the club then it's on Dortmund, not really on Klopp.
He'd still be my favorite. Attitude is right, philosophy is right and execution has up til now been excellent on a budget so much below Uniteds that it's insane.
 
MrEriksen said:
If they sack the man when they have been troubled with injuries, after all he has done for the club then it's on Dortmund, not really on Klopp.
He'd still be my favorite. Attitude is right, philosophy is right and execution has up til now been excellent on a budget so much below Uniteds that it's insane.
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Don't like injuries being an excuse for a team not performing.
 
MrEriksen said:
If they sack the man when they have been troubled with injuries, after all he has done for the club then it's on Dortmund, not really on Klopp.
He'd still be my favorite. Attitude is right, philosophy is right and execution has up til now been excellent on a budget so much below Uniteds that it's insane.
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I;d be a little bit concerned that he cant seem to stop a rot of defeats, They've lost 3 in a row to low opposition and 4 out of 5 overall 1 point out of 15. Injuries or not thats poor management. Admittedly he has done enough to deserve a stay of execution but I think it is a blot on his CV right now.
 
ItsEssexRob said:
I;d be a little bit concerned that he cant seem to stop a rot of defeats, They've lost 3 in a row to low opposition and 4 out of 5 overall 1 point out of 15. Injuries or not thats poor management. Admittedly he has done enough to deserve a stay of execution but I think it is a blot on his CV right now.
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The last 3 games were:

Schalke (A)
Hamburg (H)
Cologne (A)

The games don't look that difficult on paper, but they're more of a challenge than some might think.

The game against Schalke is THE derby, the most important game of the season for both. Little things can change the whole outcome of the game. In the end Schalke scored off a terrible mistake by Ramos (the striker) and conceded from a corner. After that they had many chances but in the end it just wouldn't happen.

The game against Hamburg: If you look at the statistics, Hamburg are pretty much the team Dortmund has most difficulties against. They lost 4 out of the last 5 encounters against them. Hamburg usually play out of their skin whenever these 2 meet. last season Dortmund lost 3:0, the season before they got defeated 4:1 at home and 3:2 away.

Now the game against Cologne you should certainly expect a win, most of the key players were back, but in the end it was obvious that they were not back to 100%. And when your defense isn't fully fit either, you will get punished. Dortmund again dominated the game but Colognes game plan was executed very well.

I'm pretty sure Dortmund will bounce back soon, they just have too much quality not to.
 
gofelx said:
The last 3 games were:

Schalke (A)
Hamburg (H)
Cologne (A)

The games don't look that difficult on paper, but they're more of a challenge than some might think.

The game against Schalke is THE derby, the most important game of the season for both. Little things can change the whole outcome of the game. In the end Schalke scored off a terrible mistake by Ramos (the striker) and conceded from a corner. After that they had many chances but in the end it just wouldn't happen.

The game against Hamburg: If you look at the statistics, Hamburg are pretty much the team Dortmund has most difficulties against. They lost 4 out of the last 5 encounters against them. Hamburg usually play out of their skin whenever these 2 meet. last season Dortmund lost 3:0, the season before they got defeated 4:1 at home and 3:2 away.

Now the game against Cologne you should certainly expect a win, most of the key players were back, but in the end it was obvious that they were not back to 100%. And when your defense isn't fully fit either, you will get punished. Dortmund again dominated the game but Colognes game plan was executed very well.

I'm pretty sure Dortmund will bounce back soon, they just have too much quality not to.
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They've got Bayern in a couple of weeks in Munich which will be interesting.
 
ItsEssexRob said:
I;d be a little bit concerned that he cant seem to stop a rot of defeats, They've lost 3 in a row to low opposition and 4 out of 5 overall 1 point out of 15. Injuries or not thats poor management. Admittedly he has done enough to deserve a stay of execution but I think it is a blot on his CV right now.
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I agree with you, my thoughts were on the idea of him getting sacked for a purple patch, which everyone but Cristiano Ronaldo as a player seem to have.
Even fecking Mourinho had a "purple patch" against one of the best teams ever in Barcelona.

Haven't Hummels been injured for long?
Gundogan just came back?
Reus has been out injured.

That's 3 of their very best players through the central line out with injuries.

Immobile, Ramos & Dong are all new to the team, and with Reus injured that's just about all their attackers.
Note, haven't watched them, but regardless of how they have performed you still have to say it's another thing for Klopp to work on, implementing the new players in his system.

You can blame a purple patch on injuries, lack of luck, having a lot to chew over at the same time and players maybe not being good enough.
But Klopp has replaced his best players after they have left, key parts of their squad for peanuts and have made BvB to what they are today in my opinion, and he shouldn't be sacked based on what has happened up til now this season.
I'll stop now... It seems i've written way too much on something that possibly could be summed up in a few lines.
 
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ItsEssexRob said:
Cant see them making the top 4 and certainly wont get past the quarters in the CL, they are a woeful side at present. They must win their next two or I feel Klopp could be under severe pressure.
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Doubt it. If they are a relegation candidate in January Klopp might be under pressure but if that doesn't happen he will still be their manager next year.
 
How can anyone discuss the potential sacking of Klopp? They wouldn't fire him if the team faced relegation this season ffs. There might be a small chance that he steps down, if and that's a very big if, he believes that he can't help the team anymore. I highly doubt that anything extreme happens this season, but in case Dortmund finishes out of the top4, Klopp will still be the manager at Dortmund next season. He won't run away, just like he didn't when he got relegated with Mainz.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
They've got Bayern in a couple of weeks in Munich which will be interesting.
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Yep and it will be a totally different game than the last few. Dortmund is one of the few teams in the world that can really hurt Bayern with their quick counter attacking style. Hopefully they'll have gained a little more confidence before the encounter, then we'll see a very good game I think.
 
I am going with a crazy prediction. They will comfortably finish on top 4 of Bundesliga and will win Uefa Champions League.
 
ItsEssexRob said:
Cant see them making the top 4 and certainly wont get past the quarters in the CL, they are a woeful side at present. They must win their next two or I feel Klopp could be under severe pressure.
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They'll finish in the top four, no qualms.

How you finish the season which matters.
 
Dortmund will finish top 4 and will again perform very well in the CL. No doubt at all.
 
Revan said:
I am going with a crazy prediction. They will comfortably finish on top 4 of Bundesliga and will win Uefa Champions League.
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If they are having such problems with injuries, then they will struggle to make an impact in the CL. You need most of your key players fit throughout the season to be challenging on all fronts like that. Top 4 will definitely be maintained.
 
Red Shorts said:
If they are having such problems with injuries, then they will struggle to make an impact in the CL. You need most of your key players fit throughout the season to be challenging on all fronts like that. Top 4 will definitely be maintained.
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Not really.
They do have a good squad, they just need most of their players to play at a decent level and have key-players fit at the right time and hit form and have a bit of luck at the right time.

Not at all saying they will win the Champions League. But key-players not being fit for the start of the season (for example) doesn't disqualify their chances of winning it & getting top 4.
 
ItsEssexRob said:
Cant see them making the top 4 and certainly wont get past the quarters in the CL, they are a woeful side at present. They must win their next two or I feel Klopp could be under severe pressure.
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Almost all of that post is wrong :D
 
EssexRob is just pissed that Dortmund's feck ups cost him so much money with his sports betting :lol:. No wonder he's frustrated with Klopp at the moment.
 
Mad Winger said:
Shocking post:lol:
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Bayern, PSG, Real Madrid, Barcelona and Chelsea all have a great chance of making the quarter finals. That's five teams who I'd say are all better than Dortmund, and one of the five I mentioned one won't make semi finals. Dortmund might get to the quarters at best. So, I don't disagree at all with ItsEssexRob.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
Bayern, PSG, Real Madrid, Barcelona and Chelsea all have a great chance of making the quarter finals. That's five teams who I'd say are all better than Dortmund, and one of the five I mentioned one won't make semi finals. Dortmund might get to the quarters at best. So, I don't disagree at all with ItsEssexRob.
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I think Klopp being under severe pressure if they don't win their next two is the shocking part right? That's clearly not true.

Top 4 is touch and go (but they'll prob get it) and the UCL quarters could go either way.
 
Tarrou said:
I think Klopp being under severe pressure if they don't win their next two is the shocking part right? That's clearly not true.

Top 4 is touch and go (but they'll prob get it) and the UCL quarters could go either way.
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Severe pressure is strong, but questions should be asked.
 
Sean_RedDevil said:
We're average/poor in the defence too....but Di Maria, Rooney, Falcao, RVP, Mata & Januzaj can give us enough goals to win matches against clubs like QPR, West Ham or Everton.
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One of those players is not like the others.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
Bayern, PSG, Real Madrid, Barcelona and Chelsea all have a great chance of making the quarter finals. That's five teams who I'd say are all better than Dortmund, and one of the five I mentioned one won't make semi finals. Dortmund might get to the quarters at best. So, I don't disagree at all with ItsEssexRob.
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If they win their group they don't face one of those teams before the quarters, PSG/Barca is the only exception. We got to the quarters last year because we beat the mighty Olympiacos. But that wasn't the shocking thing of his post anyway.
Klopp won't be sacked, that' for sure even if they finish midtable. Do some people here think we would have sacked Fergie if he would have finished 14th in one season? After everything he did for us? No we wouldn't. And Klopp is also a legend in Dortmund, they won't sack him and I can only see him resign at some point, but that's also very unlikely imo.
Top 4 is still only 7 points away, way too early to write them off. Bundesliga is similiar to the PL right now, with 2 wins you can jump from midtable to a CL place and the past had so many teams, who showed us a complete different face in the second half of the season (good or bad). Except Bayern (same with Chelsea in the PL) the teams don't look like they are uncatchable at all as long as Dortmund improve their performances.
 
Pyroblazer said:
If they win their group they don't face one of those teams before the quarters, PSG/Barca is the only exception. We got to the quarters last year because we beat the mighty Olympiacos. But that wasn't the shocking thing of his post anyway.
Klopp won't be sacked, that' for sure even if they finish midtable. Do some people here think we would have sacked Fergie if he would have finished 14th in one season? After everything he did for us? No we wouldn't. And Klopp is also a legend in Dortmund, they won't sack him and I can only see him resign at some point, but that's also very unlikely imo.
Top 4 is still only 7 points away, way too early to write them off. Bundesliga is similiar to the PL right now, with 2 wins you can jump from midtable to a CL place and the past had so many teams, who showed us a complete different face in the second half of the season (good or bad). Except Bayern (same with Chelsea in the PL) the teams don't look like they are uncatchable at all as long as Dortmund improve their performances.
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Yeah, sacking him would be too far, but if they finish outside the four questions should be asked.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
Bayern, PSG, Real Madrid, Barcelona and Chelsea all have a great chance of making the quarter finals. That's five teams who I'd say are all better than Dortmund, and one of the five I mentioned one won't make semi finals. Dortmund might get to the quarters at best. So, I don't disagree at all with ItsEssexRob.
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His post has 3 parts. All of which are ridiuclous.

1. "I can't see them making the top 4"
What the hell? It's been 8 games! We're talking about the second best team(by a country mile) on paper here. To predict that they will finish 5th or lower with the same coach and a team that's stronger on paper than ever, is just madness.

2. "They certaintly wont get past the quarters in the CL"(i.e. reach the semis)
Certainly? This is a cup where an underdog wins almost 30% of the time. And Dortmund isn't even an underdog! They are, on paper, easily amognst the top 5 teams in the world. They are in fact so good on paper(especially in Europe) that they should expect to reach the semis.

Also, the knockout stages are still 4 months away!

3. "They must win their next two or I feel Klopp could be under severe pressure."
This is so stupid that my brain nearly shut down in protest. I don't even have to elaborate why this is the case.
 
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Mad Winger said:
His post has 3 parts. All of which are ridiuclous.

1. "I can't see them making the top 4"
What the hell? It's been 8 games! We're talking about the second best team(by a country mile) on paper here. To predict that they will finish 5th or lower with the same coach and a team that's stronger on paper than ever, is just madness.

2. "They certaintly wont get past the quarters in the CL"(i.e. reach the semis)
Certainly? This is a cup where an underdog wins almost 30% of the time. And dortmund isn't even an underdog! They are, on paper, easily amonst the top 5 teams in the world. They are in fact so good on paper(especially in Europe) that they should expect to reach the semis.

Also, the knockout stages are still 4 months away!

3. "They must win their next two or I feel Klopp could be under severe pressure."
This is so stupid that my brain nearly shut down in protest. I don't even have to elaborate why this is the case.
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I agree with the point about severe pressure, That's a bit over the top. I don't see them reaching the semi finals of the champions league although as you rightly point out that's a competition where the unexpected can happen. Point one, time will tell
 
Mad Winger said:
His post has 3 parts. All of which are ridiuclous.

1. "I can't see them making the top 4"
What the hell? It's been 8 games! We're talking about the second best team(by a country mile) on paper here. To predict that they will finish 5th or lower with the same coach and a team that's stronger on paper than ever, is just madness.

2. "They certaintly wont get past the quarters in the CL"(i.e. reach the semis)
Certainly? This is a cup where an underdog wins almost 30% of the time. And Dortmund isn't even an underdog! They are, on paper, easily amognst the top 5 teams in the world. They are in fact so good on paper(especially in Europe) that they should expect to reach the semis.

Also, the knockout stages are still 4 months away!

3. "They must win their next two or I feel Klopp could be under severe pressure."
This is so stupid that my brain nearly shut down in protest. I don't even have to elaborate why this is the case.
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Werent you the same guy who predicted United would comfortably finish top four last season?( amongst many admittedly) and got very annoyed at anyone who suggested otherwise. Below Bayern that league is very competitive now and its in no way assured they will especially given their current form.
 
Mad Winger said:
His post has 3 parts. All of which are ridiuclous.

1. "I can't see them making the top 4"
What the hell? It's been 8 games! We're talking about the second best team(by a country mile) on paper here. To predict that they will finish 5th or lower with the same coach and a team that's stronger on paper than ever, is just madness.

2. "They certaintly wont get past the quarters in the CL"(i.e. reach the semis)
Certainly? This is a cup where an underdog wins almost 30% of the time. And Dortmund isn't even an underdog! They are, on paper, easily amognst the top 5 teams in the world. They are in fact so good on paper(especially in Europe) that they should expect to reach the semis.

Also, the knockout stages are still 4 months away!

3. "They must win their next two or I feel Klopp could be under severe pressure."
This is so stupid that my brain nearly shut down in protest. I don't even have to elaborate why this is the case.
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I don't think it's ridiculous to suggest Dortmund might drop out of the top four. I think they will make it, but they need to fix their weak defence soonish or they will be too far behind.

CL is a cup competition, anything can happen. They're likely to win their group, as Arsenal and Anderlecht suit their style and Gala aren't that good either. The knock-outs are months away giving them enough time to find their form and their counter-attacking works better against the big teams anyway.

Klopp won't get sacked, obviously. That part is indeed nonsense.
 
ctp said:
I don't think it's ridiculous to suggest Dortmund might drop out of the top four. I think they will make it, but they need to fix their weak defence soonish or they will be too far behind.

CL is a cup competition, anything can happen. They're likely to win their group, as Arsenal and Anderlecht suit their style and Gala aren't that good either. The knock-outs are months away giving them enough time to find their form and their counter-attacking works better against the big teams anyway.

Klopp won't get sacked, obviously. That part is indeed nonsense.
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The ridiculous part is the supposed certainty. Dortmund have enough time to fix their season, the CL quarters are 4 months from now, compared to now they will be literally a completely different team by then and Klopp is still untouchable. It seems like some poeple look up results, ignore everything else and then think they can judge things with certainty.
 
ctp said:
I don't think it's ridiculous to suggest Dortmund might drop out of the top four. I think they will make it, but they need to fix their weak defence soonish or they will be too far behind.

CL is a cup competition, anything can happen. They're likely to win their group, as Arsenal and Anderlecht suit their style and Gala aren't that good either. The knock-outs are months away giving them enough time to find their form and their counter-attacking works better against the big teams anyway.

Klopp won't get sacked, obviously. That part is indeed nonsense.
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I never said he would be sacked just severe pressure. Comes with any top job no?
 
People don't forget the years of success he created and gave them just because of a couple of bad weeks. Klopp has a legend status in Dortmund is worshiped by the fans, they won't turn on him. Especially not when there is a clear reason for the problems.
 
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