Jose Mourinho | 2017/18 Assessments | Poll Added

[Andersons Dietician]

I am much more a United supporter than you are. I am objective, I know the team has strengths and weaknesses and I understand why those flaws exist and I know what needs to be done to reduce the flaws to the barest minimum.

You just want to throw the baby with the bath water. It’s jusr criticism all through without at least appreciating what work had been done. Compare this season to what we endured under LVG/Moyes and maybe your memory would come back to life.




To win any game, your defence must be very good. Why do people laugh at Liverpool all the time? Isn’t it because they concede as much as they score or what exactly are you talking about?

The board knew what they were getting when they signed Jose. He was signed to come and steady the ship & he’s doing a pretty job so far. I’d rather where we are than what we endured under his predecessors since SAF left. We are even picking up 2nd tier trophies while he’s rebuilding.

What more can you ask for?

Just weird that you said “you” were top. Made it sound like you weren’t a united supporter.

From reading your posts it quite clear I’m afraid that you aren’t objective in the slightest. Your point of view is so onesided.

I concede our midfield is somewhat lacking but then I’m also aware it’s not helped by how we play, that’s called an objective opinion. It does look like we don’t work that much on movement or patterns and it doesn’t take magically gifted technical players to be able to pass, move, create an angle. He obviously has us set in a defensive thought process in a lot of games and to be honest there is no shame in counter attacking football. People just need to stop painting it as Something it isn’t and stop using the goal tally as an argument. It’s silly, if we had say scored 40 own goals so would you say because our goal tally is 40 we have played attacking football, or if they were 40 penalties, would you say that was attacking football?

No one is saying that the point tally and the results we’ve ground out or destroyed teams are bad, it’s actually pretty damn impressive and it’s a shame that right now there is a team as good and gifted as City are right now. However it’s not particularly impressive football, some will only care about results, others will hold United to a higher standard and you’ll probably find a lot of those people will be ok with finishing 3rd, 4th as long as Something looks like it was happening, there was a longer plan afoot.

You mock LVG all you want but he had a completely different job from Jose which was to build a team for the future, he had built a decent team in need of some sparkle, it was good in possession and good defensively. Just lacked a killer instinct. You also mention the boredom of watching LVG and Moyes. That’s your opinion but I’ve been and seen others mention how equally uninspired they are watching Jose’s United.

In the end no one is going to agree, I’ve come to terms with Jose is going to do it his way, he’s never going to change and really there is no point debating it as he has some cult like followers who can see no other reasoning or path than their own.

 

[Dobbs]

You've hit the nail on the head. By some comments, you'd think that despite all the investment we should be hanging around the 6th position.

Thanks to Moyes, the expectations of fans have reached an all time low. We've become the "at least" club now. And it doesn't help when José tries to radicalise fans with this useless siege, us against the world, victim complex mentality. Was it not a few weeks ago, he came out with "at least, we are better off than 18 other clubs", no joke Sherlock after comfortably outspending 18 other clubs.

It amazes me how at the start of each season, the same people said we had a solid squad to at least challenge for the title at the start are now saying that we are overachieving by being 11+1 points behind City after 16 games. I still cringe at that poster that said after the wobble against Stoke that after a third summer window is when José should be expected to start winning games like these.

I am just going to blame it all on Moyes

I'm of the opinion the managers of the top four or five have been getting away with it for a few years now. With the budgets we have it's a serious under achievement to be of no threat in Europe.

So if it seems harsh on Mourinho to expect more I have at least been harsh with Wenger, Klopp, Guardiola, Pellegrini, LvG etc. Big reputations with big budgets.Should all be doing better and hopefully this season we will.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

You can't simultaneously point to the best start in years and then claim the squad is poor.

Quite.

Which means...I don't know, actually.

Points accumulated...well, that's always a bit random (how good is the opposition). Just focusing on the performances, we might look at this:

We're precisely where we're supposed to be: The starting point means that José is exactly where he is supposed to be - he has recruited perfectly and gotten rid of just the right players, but the "process" (sorry) takes time.

We're performing below par: We should be better at this point. Playing better. Being more cohesive.

We're performing above par: Our players are so shite - but this isn't the manager's fault - that we're actually punching above our weight at the moment.

Truth is somewhere in between, as per usual, I suspect.

Big points: Pogba and Lukaku.

Former: Not only our best player but seemingly representing our only chance of playing something resembling actual good (attacking) football. That's damning on the manager, I would say. If you depend on one player to that extent, there's something fundamentally wrong. All teams depend to some extent on having their best players available, but the absence of one player shouldn't mean the difference between cohesive attacking and...headless crap.

Latter: Doesn't look all that, let's be honest. Good player, no doubt, but not top bracket. We paid enough for him (sanctioned by José) and he hasn't stepped up to look like a top class striker for a (supposed) top class team.

 

[dichinero]

I'm of the opinion the managers of the top four or five have been getting away with it for a few years now. With the budgets we have it's a serious under achievement to be of no threat in Europe.

So if it seems harsh on Mourinho to expect more I have at least been harsh with Wenger, Klopp, Guardiola, Pellegrini, LvG etc. Big reputations with big budgets.Should all be doing better and hopefully this season we will.

Dude, you're speaking.

Whether you're United or City or Arsenal, if you are a big club, with a big manager, having spent big, it must be required of you to perform and meet expectations beyond the average. I still find it cringe when people like to remind me that we won what was possibly the weakest EL competition in decades, being the biggest and most expensive side. What else should have been the minimum? We just have zero expectations at this club, that's the real shame. If José did not pull off the EL, I will not be surprised if his head was called for after finishing 6th. Last season was bare minimum and nothing to brag about. I only expected more from him giving the amout he spent and the vast amount of top level experience he has.

The same way I considered Pep's first session a flop despite finishing 3rd, because I expected better from a big name manager but I had to consider that it was his first season in England, something I expected José's 7 year experience to have counted for something. Am I now surprised that he is blowing teams away? No, because something similar should be expected given the name and investment. Despite City's amazing run, if they lose 2 games, they'll get hammered and rightly so.

Expectations!

 

[Minimalist]

LVG played attacking football my arse. At no point under Jose have we been as boring as an average LVG game.

Well that's not true.

 

[JohnnyKills]

Whats are Uniteds fecking standards? Appointing David Moyes as manager? Then following that up by appointing Louis van Boring as manager? Losing to Newcastle, WBA, Everton, Southampton, MK fecking Dons? I've no idea what Uniteds standards are, man? I've seen nothing but shambolic season after another.

So your argument is that we should blind ourselves to mourinho's flaws because the two guys before him were worse?

 

[breakout67]

So your argument is that we should blind ourselves to mourinho's flaws because the two guys before him were worse?

You have no choice, because the club already decided for you.

Mourinho was not brought in to bring back the glory days, or build a dynasty. He was brought in to stop the bleeding and prevent us from becoming another Liverpool.

We tried to do it the 'right' way and failed spectacularly, and the price you have to play is hire a pragmatic manager like Mourinho.

 

[Sunny Jim]

Well that's not true.

Well it is.

 

[Minimalist]

Well it is.

This is the worst panto...ever.

For clarity, I simply know/remember that some people have found a match here or there to be just as bad/boring as Van Gaal's worst matches. It's not that ridiculous - there was some shite on display last season. But it's subjective and there's no stat for it.

 

[Cassidy]

LVG played attacking football my arse. At no point under Jose have we been as boring as an average LVG game.

Attacking doesn't mean exciting tbh.

 

[whatwha]

Well that's not true.

Okay, maybe there have been two or three games over the course of Jose's reign that have been as bad as the average LVG game.

Attacking doesn't mean exciting tbh.

Huh? It basically does. And we weren't usually attacking at all during LVG, hardly created a single attempt on target in most games. All sideways and backwards passes, very safe and boring.

 

[Garethw]

It really is something when LVG is calling the football your team is playing boring.

 

[Cassidy]

Okay, maybe there have been two or three games over the course of Jose's reign that have been as bad as the average LVG game.


Huh? It basically does. And we weren't usually attacking at all during LVG, hardly created a single attempt on target in most games. All sideways and backwards passes, very safe and boring.

Nah effective attacking is exciting, LVGs tactics for attacking basically were boring, his attacking tactics were too be patient with the ball and wait for openings by moving the defenders by changing angles with passing. It was ineffective because our passing and movement wasn't good enough or quick enough, that doesn't mean he wasn't trying to attack, it just means his method of attack was ineffective and boring.

 

[breakout67]

So passing the ball between your centre backs and holding midfielder for 90 minutes is now considered attacking football?

It would explain why some think City were amazing yesterday, because they had lots of the ball with little penetration.

 

[sammsky1]

So your argument is that we should blind ourselves to mourinho's flaws because the two guys before him were worse?

You want him sacked?

 

[Cassidy]

So passing the ball between your centre backs and holding midfielder for 90 minutes is now considered attacking football?

It would explain why some think City were amazing yesterday, because they had lots of the ball with little penetration.

Doesn't mean they didn't try to penetrate, its means they were ineffective. Its not exactly defensive football is it, its ineffective attacking.

 

[whatwha]

Nah effective attacking is exciting, LVGs tactics for attacking basically were boring, his attacking tactics were too be patient with the ball and wait for openings by moving the defenders by changing angles with passing. It was ineffective because our passing and movement wasn't good enough or quick enough, that doesn't mean he wasn't trying to attack, it just means his method of attack was ineffective and boring.

Whatever. Semantics. I wouldn't say that LVG's style of play was focused on attack, I'd say the "patient" tactic was meant to protect us defensively first and foremost.

 

[Cassidy]

Whatever. Semantics. I wouldn't say that LVG's style of play was focused on attack, I'd say the "patient" tactic was meant to protect us defensively first and foremost.

Haha, don't worry I don't think LVG was great, but no way he parks the bus at home vs City

 

[RuudTom83]

I’m hoping Jose takes this challenge on and we can see Pep vs Jose for many years.

The Premiership has been missing any true rivalries for a while now and this could be the start of something.

 

[Son Of Sam]

It really is something when LVG is calling the football your team is playing boring.

Hypocrisy of the highest order. In many games at OT, LVG’s team never scored a goal in the first half. It was just endless square passes that had no penetration.

If LVG was a horse, he would have been shot!

 

[whatwha]

Haha, don't worry I don't think LVG was great, but no way he parks the bus at home vs City

Maybe he wouldn't. We did see some games against the big teams where the passing and moving worked. In an away game against a top 6 side I'd probably put my money on LVG rather than Jose to get the points. But in most other games, I'd want Jose as LVG's football would be mind numbingly boring due to passing extremely safely and keeping meaningless possession.

 

[breakout67]

Doesn't mean they didn't try to penetrate, its means they were ineffective. Its not exactly defensive football is it, its ineffective attacking.

Well then you have to admit that we played well defensively, and not that we were dominated like some seem to think. My view was that both managers cancelled each other out and what was left over was the difference in concentration levels.

I was confident for most of that game that City would not score from open play. Silva and De Bruyne were going deep to get the ball, and their forwards were more interested in playing for the penalty than getting into goal scoring positions. The only problem was that they were very good at stopping us from counter attacking, and we were very poor with the ball.

 

[Cassidy]

Maybe he wouldn't. We did see some games against the big teams where the passing and moving worked. In an away game against a top 6 side I'd probably put my money on LVG rather than Jose to get the points. But in most other games, I'd want Jose as LVG's football would be mind numbingly boring due to passing extremely safely and keeping meaningless possession.

I certainly wouldn't want LVG over Jose, but yes the big games Jose needs to do better and stop being so negative.

 

[whatwha]

I certainly wouldn't want LVG over Jose, but yes the big games Jose needs to do better and stop being so negative.

Agreed!

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Well then you have to admit that we played well defensively, and not that we were dominated like some seem to think. My view was that both managers cancelled each other out and what was left over was the difference in concentration levels.

I was confident for most of that game that City would not score from open play. Silva and De Bruyne were going deep to get the ball, and their forwards were more interested in playing for the penalty than getting into goal scoring positions. The only problem was that they were very good at stopping us from counter attacking, and we were very poor with the ball.

I think there is a half truth there. I thought all in all the back 4 was sort of decent but at times City still opened us up and for whatever reason seemed to want to walk it in to the net. Jesus should have had 2 goals and Sterling should have had 1 as well. They made some really weird choices and when we were chasing the game they should have scored another two. That Silva one was just ridiculous, how many touches did he want.

I do think for the most of it City bossed the game and seemed in complete control so I’m not sure I would say both managers cancelled each other out as when Sterling shifted in to a false 9 we couldn’t cope with them.

 

[Still ill]

So passing the ball between your centre backs and holding midfielder for 90 minutes is now considered attacking football?

It would explain why some think City were amazing yesterday, because they had lots of the ball with little penetration.

What a terrible misinterpretation of what went on yesterday. They constantly looked forward. They rarely carved us open but they had very little meaningless possession. Hate them all you want but sometimes you just have to put your fecking hand up and take it. We were a long way second best.

 

[Dobbs]

Well then you have to admit that we played well defensively, and not that we were dominated like some seem to think. My view was that both managers cancelled each other out and what was left over was the difference in concentration levels.

I was confident for most of that game that City would not score from open play. Silva and De Bruyne were going deep to get the ball, and their forwards were more interested in playing for the penalty than getting into goal scoring positions. The only problem was that they were very good at stopping us from counter attacking, and we were very poor with the ball.

Don't really agree with your version of events there but isn't the bigger more important part of this about a style of play that carries you through the season and hopefully to trohies. City continued with their usual attacking style even though they weren't quite firing. It's no great surprise that if you have all the ball you might force a bit of fortune. We did it for years. They'll go on to play in the same fashion for the rest of the season.

For us I don't know how we'll play next. It's guesswork. Can we just switch from that performance to playing flowing, possession based stuff? Just switching good football on and off? Playing like that against City can't be good for confidence going into the next game.

 

[Garethw]

Hypocrisy of the highest order. In many games at OT, LVG’s team never scored a goal in the first half. It was just endless square passes that had no penetration.

If LVG was a horse, he would have been shot!

Dreadful dreadful football mate. He really had a cheek with that comment.

 

[zenith]

The LVG comparisons are crazy, the man played the dullest football imaginable. I'd say, apart from the big games against pool, Chelsea and city, Jose has done well. He's got us playing some amazing counter attacking football with goals coming from all over the pitch, we are quite well placed in the league and frankly should finish second from here on, which would be our highest since SAF left.

I agree his approach to games with the big teams needs to change and reckon that will happen in time, the signing of lindeof was an indication for me and more so, it's a part of a managers evolution. Don't believe that mourinho is so far down the defensive road that he can't see an alternative.

We need another summer to complete this squad and he challengers at the domestic and European level and I have no doubt that Jose is the man to do it.

 

[JohnnyKills]

You want him sacked?

No I don't want him sacked, I just want to be able to criticise him on a forum without being accused of being spoilt.

 

[Siorac]

I doubt even Moyed told teams to go out and play terrible football. But it's the manager responsibility to get the team performing.

If Moyes had said that, the team probably would have gone out and played brilliantly. He could even fail at being terrible if he did it on purpose.

 

[Canagel]

Surely Jose didn't think it was a penalty with Herrera. Everyone can see it was a dive so why did he complain about post match? I'm guessing he wanted to deflect attention away from the performance but still he shouldn't be making excuses and having a go at the ref for it. Now everytime Oliver referees one of our games we are going to be at a disadvantage.

 

[Smores]

No I don't want him sacked, I just want to be able to criticise him on a forum without being accused of being spoilt.

Is it really that surprising that you're challenged on your criticisms? And that this isn't some safe place where you're not judged?

After two managers who broke negative records repeatedly we finally have a manager who has already equalled a positive SAF record.

Jose is far from perfect but if you ask me we'v gone back into the type of criticism that SAF regularly got on here, spoilt moaning that demands more and more.

 

[cantonaldo]

Not sure why people are criticising our manager who got us trophies last season plus improve our standings from 7th to 2nd (for the time being). We are also qualified for CL 2nd stage. Sure, we got beat at home, but you have to go a full year back the last time it happened, and that is to a team that sits pretty on top of the league.

How on earth can you be angry at him?

Also, we lost to two unfortunate goals that fell kindly to City, and we almost drew level if not for Lukaku deciding to shot at the goalie instead of the goal. We are really not that far away from being a great side again. Just need a little bit more patience from fans.

 

[SirAF]

Not sure why people are criticising our manager who got us trophies last season plus improve our standings from 7th to 2nd (for the time being). We are also qualified for CL 2nd stage. Sure, we got beat at home, but you have to go a full year back the last time it happened, and that is to a team that sits pretty on top of the league.

How on earth can you be angry at him?

Also, we lost to two unfortunate goals that fell kindly to City, and we almost drew level if not for Lukaku deciding to shot at the goalie instead of the goal. We are really not that far away from being a great side again. Just need a little bit more patience from fans.

Because people gonna people..

 

[Dobbs]

Is it really that surprising that you're challenged on your criticisms? And that this isn't some safe place where you're not judged?

After two managers who broke negative records repeatedly we finally have a manager who has already equalled a positive SAF record.

Jose is far from perfect but if you ask me we'v gone back into the type of criticism that SAF regularly got on here, spoilt moaning that demands more and more.

Think that's an unfair summary. We've just bent over in a derby. Fans have a right to expect more from a team that's well capable of more. It isn't just fans on here who hold that opinion either. There's a consensus in the footballing world(pundits, journalists etc) that we're capable of giving City a proper game. Are they all spoiled and driven by agenda?

 

[Adebesi]

Obviously the football we played under Van Gaal was poor. But in saying he would rather watch City than United he is simply stating the obvious. Any neutral would feel the same, they play much better football than we do. The only reason you would choose to watch us instead is if you were emotionally invested in the club, which us fans are and Van Gaal isnt.

 

[superdry]

Think that's an unfair summary. We've just bent over in a derby. Fans have a right to expect more from a team that's well capable of more. It isn't just fans on here who hold that opinion either. There's a consensus in the footballing world(pundits, journalists etc) that we're capable of giving City a proper game. Are they all spoiled and driven by agenda?

Well said sir.

 

[JohnnyKills]

Is it really that surprising that you're challenged on your criticisms? And that this isn't some safe place where you're not judged?

After two managers who broke negative records repeatedly we finally have a manager who has already equalled a positive SAF record.

Jose is far from perfect but if you ask me we'v gone back into the type of criticism that SAF regularly got on here, spoilt moaning that demands more and more.

Happy to be challenged, but it seems that every time anyone directs any criticism of Mourinho they're labelled spoilt and it just descends into a playground slanging match.

 

[Paul778]

Think that's an unfair summary. We've just bent over in a derby. Fans have a right to expect more from a team that's well capable of more. It isn't just fans on here who hold that opinion either. There's a consensus in the footballing world(pundits, journalists etc) that we're capable of giving City a proper game. Are they all spoiled and driven by agenda?

Journalists want to write good copy and that's easier when you don't park the bus. Considering we've struggled against many teams without Pogba this season the result was no surprise. We needed Martial, Lukaku, Rashford to all have 8+ games and that just didn't happen.

The individuals in our squad are all capable of putting in those sorts of performances but just nowhere near regularly enough for either Man Utd or for the amount we paid for them (both in terms of transfers and salary). All far too timid - I want the players to play with their chests jutting out like Cantona!