I have a feeling Mourinho is taking a relaxed approach to coaching and dealing with players. The performances against Leicester and Brighton were of a team without any sort of plan.
José Mourinho | 2018/19 Performances
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If anything the board 'refusing to sign cheques' is more of an indication he wont get sacked. They aren't going to write off £20m+ to pay off the rest of his contract.
Or they saved money so they can pay him ?
And we paid £7m for Vidic, the other half of the best CB partnership the PL has ever seen, as described above
That doesn’t in any way mean that spending more money isn’t more likely to land you a world class player. The same Liverpool who did well to unearth a relative bargain in Salah have just spent £150m on a CB and a GK who barely have a trophy of any significance between them - because Klopp believed they would improve his XI and the Board backed him
And too the poster who said ADM and Pogba prove big signings are risky too - thats also true of course. However, the mistake with ADM was that he never wanted to be here in the first place. That deal cost us £12m for which we got an average return. If we sold Pogba now, we would probably make £50m. So the risks ARE minimised by buying quality
For the record I think both are good players but we have been guilty of buying candles before we have a cake
So in your opinion any player automatically bought for over 60-70 million is a success? Yeah, I can see Morata living up to his price tag. Or Bakayoko.
Is Salah worth only 38 million then?
Quality players usually cost more. But not always. That's down to a club's assessment of their player's worth. You can buy quality players from lower leagues or lesser clubs with good scouting for a lower price than their actual worth. Similarly, average players like Morata could cost an arm and a leg.
Why do people keep saying this Zidane wouldn't do better with this squad BS ???
Zidane would get transfer windows you know. LVG got 4 and Jose has had 5.
Why are people acting like he'd have to make do with what we have? He wouldn't.
Someone suggested to sack Jose and get Zidane right now if we lose against Spurs tonight so yeah "he'd have to make do with what we have".
That was me and yes he would do until January. If Zidane came in now (like when Klopp came into Liverpool after a few weeks of the season) he'd get a free hit for me.
United fans get right on my nerves. Always want a quick fix. There's no quick fix from this. Will take time to recover from this mess. Maybe another 2-3 windows.
Keeping Jose regardless of team morale, form etc just because the window is shut is a stupid reason to not change. If we don't do well this week Vs Spurs and Burnley he'll probably go anyway.
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Why is this thread so long? It's only been 2 games into the season.
You'd swear he only joined this Summer
This thread is for 18/19? Even if this is a general thread what else new is there to say other than discussing new games?
These are genuine questions by the way, are people just going around in circles saying the same thing over and over? Don't we already know what Mourinho is about?
Yes.
Or that we barely avoided relegation last season and got humiliated by every half decent team we've played since he joined.
No one is expecting a quick fix but making such an important decision based on emotions will create more mess. Jose is still probably the safest option to get us TOP 4, then we could part ways and find a right replacement.
The point isn’t that there can be no value from the cheap aisle, it is that you buy at risk of it being rubbish and you have to buy again, which means you wasted your money.
E.g: I want Bose Noise canceling headphones but the gear costs 200 quid minimum. Couldn’t bring meself to spend that so I gambled on some I found for 20 quid. I had no idea how they would turn out but to my delight they have been incredible and still going strong a year later.
Conversely, my mate was unlucky. Same bargain shop, different brand of gear advertised to do the same thing as mine but was bang average and he had to fling them in the bin and buy the Bose anyway. He was livid.
If I had the fortune I would buy quality all day long as you will have peace of mind and know exactly what you are getting.
Pogba is on a 6 yr contract, if he leaves we'll definitely get upwards of £150m for him and that could be reinvested by the new manager. So either way the manager is in a good position. We have seen the potential of Bailly and though he makes mistakes sometimes he could be worked upon. Lindelof i agree is not up to the mark yet . You got to factor in the likes of Lingard who has really grown in stature last couple of years. If we get a manager who likes to press, he is going to play a important role for us. Fred looks quite agile and already has CL experience and makes Brazil's NT. Pereira has come leaps and bounds too and already well settling into the team and could eventually replace Matic . SO we have De Gea, Bailly, Matic, Pereira, Pogba, Fred , Lukaku, Lingard who are quite ready not even addling the likes of Martial , Rashford, Sanchez.
What I'm trying to say is the spine is quite healthy. If next manager could get best out of what we have with a new LB, and RW, then we're quite capable of challenging for the title.
The Sevilla game last season has led to a lot of this.
Plus the defeatist football which has been a theme of his tenure.
Jose also spent the preseason telling us how this would be a difficult season. Im not surprised people are reacting this way .
See the post above.
No one is saying we are relegation fodder.
But even Jose said that this would be a difficult season if he didn't get the players he wanted. Positivity breeds from the top.
And guess who got Cesc to come to CFC over Utd? You guessed right. It is known that Jose personally flew to Spain to convince Fabregas that he would build the midfield around him, which he did and we walked the league. The first half of that season we played some scintillating football with Hazard/Schurle on the wings and Costa banging them in.
Re Cesc, he came to CFC to play for JM even though “all Barca players hate JM” from his time at Madrid. Quite telling.
Couldn't one just go the other way and say that the relegation battle was so close due to increased but still equally distributed tv money meaning % gap in income between relegated teams and mid-table teams is eroded and quality higher than ever? Harry Maguire played for Hull City...
Both. I still wouldn't say Chris Smalling is a natural leader, nor does his ability command respect or complement our overall best defender Bailly's style of play. Phil Jones is the closest thing we have, which speaks for itself.
Hasn't Varane captained France before, and did captain Lens, while Alderweireld captained Tottenham once or twice season before last? It's not just about the organisation, it's about the been-there-done-coolness that this caliber of defender exudes throughout the whole team.
I didn't say that, I said right now and half a decade on from our last major trophy it's far more important for us to win something than it is to be flashy like the poster I was responding to seemed to assert.I'm sorry but it's not exclusively one or the other. Sir Matt used to talk about the fans and how they had worked all week to go to the games, that the players had a responsibility to entertain them. Sir Alex knew he had a responsibility to maintain those values even 20 odd years since we had last won the league.
I'm sure both great managers had their share of ground out wins to get over the line. In the end you do what you have to, to win sometimes. However it's nonsense to suggest Manchester United are only about winning. To try to pretend there's no more substance to our history than winning at all costs. You do a great disservice to Sir Alex and Sir Matt by even suggesting all that mattered to them was winning. Nothing more.
Well we aren't winning, and we're terrible to watch. 26 years of watching this football and we won't be supported as we were in the 80s.
The Busby babes, playing reactive football away at Brighton ? Cos winning was all that mattered to United. Ffs.
You don't need to convince me that everyone likes to have their cake and eat it too, but the quality of accepting pragmatism is a far more important one at this moment imo.
I know I am
Nope, even Everton were flirting with relegation spots at one point. Many lower table teams did not spend or spend wisely enough last season. It really was a shit league outside of the top 6 bar Burnley.
Sorry mate but I see it as a very realistic possibility.
Here in lies a problem, not noticing that Bailly is the actual problem, not the other way around, no defender is going to compliment him if he keeps doing what he does and if anything out of who we have Smalling is still the best player to compliment him.
Smalling has captained us. I get it’s not just about organisation, it’s a persona, it’s an x factor which again watching Varane he is an extremely good player I just wouldn’t say he is a leader either, none of the CB’s except maybe Godin were what I feel like you were alluding to. I think it was just a case of we can’t get the best out of either Lindelof or Bailly therefore he wants another CB to replace one as a 1st teamer.
Who knows what will happen through out the season, I have a feeling we win tonight which might relief some of the pressure that has been on us this week.
If we lose or draw today I'd say it's over. The one thing he is known for is being strong at home games. Todays performance could be a make or break for our entire season, we've played 2 and already lost 1. If we drop points here the environment within the club will most likely become incredibly toxic, unless they get rid of him. It's a true shame his stubborness has put him in this position, he used to be one of if not the greatest managers after SAF. He should have changed his tactics long time ago as the game keeps evolving but he is refusing to adapt. If we lose today then what would be the actual point of keeping him?
If we lose tonight this thread will be in total meltdown. It's probably the most important game of his tenure so far after the EL final.
if he plays Matic at CB you wonder how much of it is a message to the board over the lack of backing
Has Matic ever played as a CB for Chelsea?
Will be interesting to see how he performs, it could just work out quite nicely and become the missing experienced and ball playing CB!
It's about a leader. Which is what Alderweireld or Varane would be.
I can only speak to playing to a mediocre level of hockey but I'm a naturally hyper-competitive hyper-shouty person (aka dickhead) on the pitch, if I yell in 2nds people listen but don't always respect, but on occasions where I have dropped down to fill in for the likes of 6ths when I say anything it's like I'm controlling that person on a console and the whole team raises their level, particularly those closest to me. Obviously this is Premier League football we're talking about, but I don't think group dynamics change that much, it would be like that if Varane or Alderweireld came into our back 4.
Similar to when I drop down to 2nds in uni tennis come to think of it, I can massively raise the quality of my doubles partner.
Moyes wasn't the only reason we didn't get Fabregas that year, Barca had just lost Thiago on the cheap to Bayern and they were thin in midfield, even Mourinho couldn't have gotten him that year if he had tried. The next year it was clear that Fabregas didn't fit in at Barcelona and that's why he was keen on the Chelsea move.
Castles reported that Jose was considering it weeks ago before the window shut
There's no chance of him getting sacked, even if we lose by quite a margin.
However, I do think the board would move faster than they did with Moyes and LVG if results start to slide.
However, I do think the board would move faster than they did with Moyes and LVG if results start to slide.
Won't happen, even if we lose.
Nah, realistically I know it most likely won't happen. It's just how I personally feel, I don't see a reason to keep him and endure a toxic season if we are going to lose out on top 4 anyway.
the pessimism in here is bordering on the insane.Really it's quite incredible, to the point where I actually wonder if some of you are undercover oppo fans!
Like I've said in other posts, the term (for me at least) that comes to mind is 'witch hunt'.
Really it's quite incredible, to the point where I actually wonder if some of you are undercover oppo fans!
Like I've said in other posts, the term (for me at least) that comes to mind is 'witch hunt'.
Are you admitting that José is a witch?
Sorry but that is complete rubbish as one neither are that vocal. If you go to OT also you can hear Smallings squeaky voice shouting at the back 4, midfield and so on with instructions. He’s constantly directing and at this level the lot of our CB’s should know the role, Bailly is just hyper aggressive and gets carried away. There is no proof that with anyone else he would be less inclined to journey miles out of position to miss what he was going for and leaving us exposed. Jonesand Rojo tend to have the same issue, all fight no brain. But here in is where Smalling does a good job with Bailly as he realises that Bailly is prone to rash decision making and he’ll often cover him a lot, it’s really basic but it’s what good CB’s do. Varane is organised by Ramos and Alderweireld by Vertonghen. Neither are what you would hope they would be in that sense of a leader, both are just really good CB’s. Kompany, Ramos,Godin, Vidic,Rio,Terry are leaders of men.
What you’re talking about isn’t really available out there at the moment so for me Jose wasn’t looking for an experienced CB, he was looking for another option as he probably doesn’t think one of his 2 purchases is up to task or he leant has time to coach them. I’ve said this many a time on here having watched Lindelof at Benfica he is so much better than what we have seen here, there is something to work with there but does Jose have the time and does he have the patience.
Really it's quite incredible, to the point where I actually wonder if some of you are undercover oppo fans!
Like I've said in other posts, the term (for me at least) that comes to mind is 'witch hunt'.
It’s so insane that it is now actually funny
You hired Moyes, we hired JM. That’s why we got him and you didn’t. Who knew hiring world class managers would make a difference eh?
Further, Moyes had the advantage, which was being manager of the biggest club in the land and, instead of finding some way to capitalize on that he sat by the fax machine while Jose got on a plane himself to go convince Fabregas!
Again, difference in class, as far as management really.
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