People watch sport for entertainment. It's not supposed to be a chore, it's a hobby or a way of unwinding away from work and other stressful shit in life. I know there's a snobbery amongst football fans where certain groups pretend to be more hardcore and better supporters, but most ordinary folk tune in with the hope of watching a good game of fast paced end to end footy.
José Mourinho | 2018/19 Performances
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Long term success is better than short term success.
Fans spend hard earned money to go and see their team play every week. They expect to see good football not some of the boring stuff we have played. Yes winning is important but winning with style is heaven.
Why do you watch it then? I seriously do not understand. If winning is all that matters then surely checking the score is sufficient?
We watch to see our team win?
You taking a 1-0 win, or a 3-2 loss?
Nahhhh. Gotta watch. Never even thought about not watching. There's multiple reasons for watching sports. Entertainment absolutely being one. For me, one thing i am entertained by watching a bunch of people do things I couldn't imagine being able to do. But
It's never a chore to watch my favorite team play a game. I love great end to end action. Who doesn't. But if it came down to it, i prefer them winning. That's all.
Of course it is, but that's not realistic nowadays with the current hierarchy.
Nah. Boy I struck a nerve. Lol.
This is a Jose thread. If yall want, ill gladly discuss this more elsewhere. But in this thread, Jose is a win at all costs dude. He gives two fecks about anything other than the 3 points.
He's steadied the ship, and put silver in the cabinet. Thanks for that Jose.
But now, I'm sick of his miserable face and his miserable football.
But now, I'm sick of his miserable face and his miserable football.
3:2 win but it's pointless to discuss anything with a man who asks this question why is it important the way we play…
Sir Matt Busby had a different opinion.
Pointless cuz we disagree. Why you so mad?
Untill recent years, having a "pragmatic" approach to matches was arguably the most secure way to ensure wins. Mourinho success over the years, and Simeone at Atletico are good examples of this. But in the last 2-3 years teams trying to outplay the other side has shown to be more successful, indicating that some of the top teams have become better at attacking than the more pragmatic teams are at defending. Meaning that playing to score one goal more than the opposition is a better approach than to concede one less goal than the opposition.
Pointless cuz we disagree. Why you so mad?
Oh typical "let me save some dignity maneuve" , first you devise just 2 options that suit only your agenda (1:0 win or 3:2 loss) then when I go with option number 3 and say it is pointless to talk because you seem unable to understand why football style is important despite you yourself admitting you love and "enjoy" footy, you come with "why you so mad"…
Disappointing, but expected.
IMO it's hard to determine which is more negative between Mourinho's bus parking and LVG's "possession as a means of defense". Both result in very few chances created in many games.
Amazing comment
Why did you even start supporting Man United? Just because they used to win?
Why are you trying to dodge from what we originally talked about? You said our season was over when we brought Sanchez which was simply not the case. What happened afterwards doesn't really matter, does it?
That is funny. Consider that with Sanchez signing out gap became bigger. And we crashed out CL in a humiliation manner to a Sevilla team, whose whole squad cost less that Lukaku.
For Mikhi to be sold, you have to have someone who'd want him. Our season was not over. Mikhi was not needed and we needed Sanchez. That's it.
What are you trying to even say here? In the grand scheme of things Lukaku was definitely not that of a crazy transfer considering what is going on in transfer market, no matter how many times you try to spin it around. He had proven himself at every club, in the PL and was an absolute goalscorer which is what we needed after Zlatan's injury. We did overpay, but not by much.
We are not talking about how impressed Jose is, we're talking about how well he is backed compared to Moyes.
As far as I remember, Lukaku chose to go and Mourinho didn't really want to sell him. That's why Lukaku was so happy to be back with Mourinho and holds no hard feelings towards him. He wanted to be the main starter, ahead of Diego Costa, who you can't really argue that back then was just better than Lukaku. Sometimes things don't work out. He made a mistake with KDB, sure, Mourinho is not fautless, I never said he was. Was SAF clueless when he let Pogba go when we had Tom Cleverley and Anderson in midfield?
Ok, let's see their first season signings. Jose brought: Baily for 30 million, Pogba for 90 million, Zlatan on free and Mikhi for 30 million. He sold lots of youngsters, if going by the price that McNair went out, for 6 million or less. Schniederlin for 25 million, Depay for 15 million with addons. He also let go of Schweinsteiger and Valdes who were probably on massive wages. Basically making his transfer expenditures at 104 million, and if we add Valdes and Schweinsteiger's wages, as well as the numerous players like McNair he sold, much less than 104 million.
In comparison to Moyes - we brought Fellaini for 30 million and Mata for 40 million. We sold no notable players. That makes it 70 million
For 30 million or less, with no accounting to inflation and the fact that Jose inherited us when we were in deep shit - out of the CL and in desparate attempt of getting back there while we were comfortable champions under Moyes... And you have the gall, seriously, to say that Moyes didn't get backed? It's really insane, if you ask me. For 30 million more we brought Pogba, Zlatan, Mikhi and Baily - in comparison to Fellaini and Mata (a player who was brought in probably the only position that we needed no immediate improvement).
Wow... Just wow.
Coutinho went for $170 million. If it was Jose, he would have sold him and laughed his way to the bank. You're making it like Klopp got a bad deal here. For that kind of money you expect Ronaldo or a Messi, or Liverpool's Suarez at least. Coutinho was nothing really amazing. Jose was in that position, just not in united
You're comparing Liverpool, who are a much smaller club financially than us, to us. This is stupid. It's like trying to compare Sheikh City to us. Doesn't work like that.
Ok, let's compare the champions of 13/14 season City and our spending going by transfermarkt. City spend just 20 million more. Or let's compare Mourinho's spending in that season to Moyes' (finished 3rd). Spend just 6 million less. End of discussion. It really doesn't matter how much you try to spin this, Moyes was completely backed. Comparing him to Mourinho with the transfer market back then compared to now is just stupid to me. The prices for every single player, especially when it comes to us, have risen considerably. Mourinho spend less back then, has spent relatively more now in comparison to Moyes back then, but went on and got way better purchases in comparison to Moyes.[/quote]
Sandro, Willian and Perisic were unrealistic? C'mon.
How do you know his targets? You have some insider information in the club?
We have no idea what is going on behind the scenes. You're just going by absurd media rumors.
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Dignity? HA! My dignity is quite alright, certainly not shattered from going back and forth about personal preferences regarding sports with a stranger.
Football style is a preference. Not a rule. More than one way to get a win. Possession, high press, park the bus, counter attack, all out attack. Whatever wins i like. So why do you give a feck what my preference of getting the job done may be?
Jeez and later you say I'm "so angry"…
You never answered. This is a Jose thread. This shit can continue elsewhere.
Weren't you the one not understanding why people cared about the way United play?
No. I fail to understand the magnitude it matters when winning should be more important.
Swap Silva for Sanchez and Pep for Mourinho and imagine how this would be received.
I find it odd, you say you love and enjoy footy but then you ask me why style of footy is important.
Maybe you wanted to say you love and enjoy winning, you did after all admit you enjoy bragging rights in the end.
Maybe I can help with that one, United do not have to choose between good football(defensive or attacking) and winning. That dichotomy is stupid when we are talking about the richest club in the world. Also if you don't play particularly well, you are not going to win consistently, good performances are the foundation of success.
We are not exactly winning either are we?
Yes but what did we win last season, mate. Finished 2nd place, 19 points behind City, 6 points ahead of Liverpool while playing some pointless football, it was hardly something to cheer for.
People watch football for entertainment, winning is entertaining, beautiful football is entertaining. We were neither and no one should tolerate dull playstyle just for the sake of top 4. That's the point of manager like Jose, either he wins or he walks.
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Almost like the teams are in two different places. But continue...
And when Jose praises the team and their attitude, what is the response? It is not even talked about.
Also, he made it clear that he was talking about that match alone, he did not say that in a way that implied that the players were not good enough to play along side him.
He's praising an individual performance after a win, not throwing his toys out of a pram after a defeat.
Again, Mourinho cultists cry "But Saint Pep!"
Both styles have bored me half to death. I think I’d take the possession based defensiveness over the bus parking though. This Mourinho team can’t even hold onto the fecking ball.
He’s won more in 2 years at United than Liverpool Football Club have won in 12 years. His finish last season would have been Liverpool’s 3rd greatest in Premier League history. His finish last year was better than any Arsenal season in 13 years. There are some positives that can be thrown in amongst all the negativity.
So when you are winning its ok to throw 10 players under the bus? What point are you exactly making?
When you've just broken multiple PL records, you can afford to dish out a mild warning to avoid complacency. It's not bloody rocket science this stuff.
Mourinho doing it is a completely different scenario given what our team is like. Our team needs built up, not shit on.
Yep Rocket Science.
That when we are missing over 15 players, and the manager says that the u-23s aren't good enough yet its unacceptable. But, when City have most of their first team available and says everyone was shite except Silva it's fine.
All you are doing is the typical, spin everything the best team does into a positive and spin everything we do into a negative because you aren't happy with where we are.
It's perfectly rational to think that what both managers said is fine. Because they were giving an honest opinion on the game.
Not enough
Correct. He wins and fans deal with it and tolerate it. Like me, i can tolerate everything he entails because hes a proven winner. Others hate him, and he brings pressure on himself which leads to short tenures. Last season was not good enough. This season must be better. Year 3 with 3 years of a United budget, expectations better win the damn league. And definitely not fizz out of the CL in the way they did last year.
Agreed.Its just in this circumstance, with this manager, right wrong or indifferent, i will not hide from the fact that he takes pride in winning at all cost. And i dont mind it at all.
Now if he fails, then United fails, and he cant hide behind results. A change should be made.
Yeah Mourinho practically said the same thing about Sanchez and got pelters for it on here. So it's exactly the same. The result is completely irrelevant.
At the moment we are not-winning at all cost and the people that don't like this type of football will feel particularly aggrieved and they are 100% correct. Personally I just like football and the only thing that matters for me is competent football that's what I find entertaining, I can watch prime Atletico every weeks and enjoy it but what we are doing is just not good from a collective standpoint, it's not going to make us successful not because of the style but because of the poor execution.
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