Yes you're probably right, I don't think he would have got in the Newcastle team this season.
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I think it's a problem alright, especially in the league. I don't think several of our current players are good enough even as squad players.
Don't think that was all him. Could have been Mourinho's instructions.
Comparing him with Bale, Neymar etc is not fair. He's never tried to be a goal-scorer. He will always do the dirty legwork, make the right runs and passes and leave the scoring to scorers.
Agree that his level is average though.
His work ethic and movement are needed in some games. He's very good in defensive aspects and can be very good at exerting high pressure on the defense if we're in big games. Comparing him to Welbeck is the best description for him : the same work ethic and same lame finishing, however Welbeck was favored by SAF and Jose said he would have favored him as well.
He's not a regular starter and a squad player at best but he still has his uses in many games. I'm happy with him as a back-up option. He just needs to work on his finishing really , really in the training and he'll be more useful.
I'm still standing that away from his misses he supported Valencia very well and without him the right flank would have been exposed. Mata, Mikhi and Martial wouldn't have done the same defensive roles he did imo.
He's not a regular starter and a squad player at best but he still has his uses in many games. I'm happy with him as a back-up option. He just needs to work on his finishing really , really in the training and he'll be more useful.
I'm still standing that away from his misses he supported Valencia very well and without him the right flank would have been exposed. Mata, Mikhi and Martial wouldn't have done the same defensive roles he did imo.
We were playing Celta Vigo, who were there to be ripped apart, and it's still with the "but he supports the defense well" argument. Just say he offered nothing for us today.
If Manchester United wants to get back to being one of the top clubs in Europe then we need better players than Jesse Lingard in our starting eleven. He is an OK option off of the bench.
End of, it's not even debatable.
End of, it's not even debatable.
Underestimating your opponent is the perfect way for failure.
Agree. Useful guy in away games at the moment. Long-term, he'd be a squad player and offer cover for Mkhi/new signing on the right wing. Definitely don't want him gone.
At home though, Martial starts ahead of him.
He should not have started the game. I don't get these claims about selling him though.
Thought he had a decent game, except the finishing. Unfortunately his finishing is still poor and hes not clinical enough. The chance which Rashford put him through seemed like it should have been the easiest one. The volley I actually think if he hits the target it hits the defender (need to see it again though). The slide im not even sure if it was a case of him sliding and missing it completely or just not reaching it?
I think were all frustrating at the finishing for United this season, but hes not the only one guilty of it.
I think were all frustrating at the finishing for United this season, but hes not the only one guilty of it.
Did you watch Martial in the derby last week?
He worked his balls off to protect Darmian on our left side.
The team was all defending in the second half this match.
He's not started only two of our last dozen matches
Either you were watching a different match but what defensive role did he do, love to see a video of all his tackles
He's starting now because of the multiple injuries we have, simple. Same for Fellaini, too.
He was always supporting Valencia when the attack goes on his side and tracking back. Without him Valencia could have easily been double teamed by Celta's flank players and since Valencia didn't get any rest the flank would have been exposed if the wing wasn't tracking back to support him. Absence of any decent attacks from that flank during the match proves so.
His atrocious finishing just makes it easy to forget anything beside it.
He does no more than is expected defensively and because of that it does not justify his totally lack of cutting edge, he's just shit
Good thing: he can get into good scoring positions, and you hope that he will improve his finishing.
I hope that he will stay here next season.
I hope that he will stay here next season.
It's expected from him yes but simply no other wing in our team will do this job as him imo.
No one's saying he's a great player. He's a squad player at best but he got his uses in some games.
Quite frustrating to watch, up there with Fellaini. Reminds me of the times watching Cleverly. Same shite was spouted out then, decent squad player. Playing far too much for decent squad players even if that were true
Agree with you. Don't know why people have to downplay the good aspects of a player's game just to emphasize his weaknesses. Yes, we know his finishing sucks, but his workrate doesn't. That's why Mourinho plays him often in away games.
Yeah Jose's using him the same way SAF used Welbeck as I said. These kind of players can be very frustrating for the fans to see what not for the managers.
The fact he starts over Martial is frustrating. But I guess Rashford cant play on the right and/or Martial is not doing what he is being asked to do. Ho hum.
He really doesn't tho, any average player can track back, it's not like he bullies players to win the ball back he just runs back.
We can't expect to win league titles finish top 4 with dross like him stinking up our attack which is his main job
He's simply being deployed in our current tactics. I don't think anybody expects him to be a definite starter next season, it's just for the past 2-3 seasons we've had zero pace in our attacking third. Rooney, Zlatan, Mata, Van Persie, Fellaini its all very slow.
Lingard is an intelligent player who takes very little glory himself but instead drags players around the pitch because of his pace and acceleration, which frees up Rashford, which frees up holes for Pogba to run in to. Lingards performances on the pitch are very underrated because he doesn't score much, doesn't do anything particularly eye catching enough, but he gives Mourinho a solid 6 out of 10 in a role that he needs performing this season.
Next season we will have some new, better players and as a result Jose will formulate a slightly different tactic, but right now Jesse plays his part in our attack, and our attack is creating chances.
And so what?
He was tracking back and defending well in the first half also. So you can't say Martial couldn't have defended exactly as Lingard did tonight.
Lingard isn't doing anything defensively that other players in the squad can't replicate.
I think I make it clear that he's the only wing we have on the right who can do it, Mata and Mikhi won't do the defensive side as efficient as him, hence he got his uses in such games, in other games when you need to go attacking Mata and Mikhi or Martial are better than him, as they both tend to leave Valencia alone tomtake the right flank all on and forth.
He's a good squad player for some games when you need his movement but definitely not regular starter. No one is saying he's great, mate, but he's a good squad option and I'm sure SAF would have kept him if he was the manager.
Martial did a good job but we were all setting back it's not like we were attacking to need the wing to back track when losing the ball. The setup was different against City than today.
From the current squad he's the most useful one regarding these roles on the right flank IMO.
Can other players do this job and even better ? Yes. But from the current squad ? Don't think so.
I really don't understand how this guy got so popular. It's so basic and he gets even simple things wrong. Look at Ferdinand and Vidic position
I'm not criticising Jose for selecting him as like you said there is almost no one else.
That doesn't change that he is still a poor footballer and one we can't carry, saf may of, but then would of sold him
They make some pretty good videos.I really don't understand how this guy got so popular. It's so basic and he gets even simple things wrong. Look at Ferdinand and Vidic position
He plays no role and wastes chance after chance
Yes and yes. If Mata was fit he would be playing ahead of him, Young can replicate what he gives us no problem but he's being used primarily as cover for the fullbacks.
Martial for me has always showed he's willing to tack back and help out defensively, even last season. No idea where this idea comes from that he doesn't.
Yeah I have seen them linked a lot on Reddit but most of them seem extremely basic. You get a lot more detailed analysis in posts on this forum
I haven't really seen any that I would say are good...any links?
I'll have him as a backup option but definitely not a starter. Lingard himself knows he's not a starter and Jose knows this too. We'll get better players who are more skills and technically better in summer no worry about that, but Lingard will remain as a back-up used in some games which need his movements or for resting other players. He's also one player who never be upset about being benched and these are good ones of players to have in the squad IMO.
Mata is too good to be wasted on backtracking a lot. If used he'll be used for his offensive side. He's not pacey and doesn't move a lot everywhere but instead is more technical on the ball. Playing Mata will come with different roles than Lingard , more offensive roles and many games need this approach.
Anyway Martial isn't playing on the same side as Lingard and Mata as they're on the right and he's on the left.
I'm normally skeptical of YouTube videos, but that was well-explained. But one thing I will say is playing him in a front three is defensive overkill from Mourinho. Depending on formation, one out of Fellaini and him is enough, esp since goal-scoring is our main problem.
Doesn't really matter though you can play Martial left and move Mkhy to the right or play him up front and move Rashford to the right.
And anyway Valencia has been playing very well this season regardless of who is in front of him. He doesn't specifically need Lingard to defend well.
Such an ignorant post. Watch the game, he stretches teams open. Why does a world class manager see that and you, a fan doesn't?
Valencia can't catch a breath nowadays, even when we got a chance to rest vs Swansea we couldn't due to Shaw injury. Hell get tired as any human sooner or later, thus needs some support at this point of the season against a team attacking from flanks.
There really aren't any good posts about him here, which is why I posted it. Have a look at their channel, there's loads of good material there.
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