Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less

Pogue Mahone said:
Hard to be absolutely certain with all the backpacks but looks like the student struck the first blow too? Teacher's head certainly snaps around quite sharply, before he raises his hand.
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It's strange kids have grown up with phones with cameras but struggle to point at things actually happening.
 
Revan said:
It happened 3 times right: 1948, 1967 and 1973. The first war was when Israel was a baby state, the second time they got humiliated in 6 days and the third time they caused some pain to Israel but still convincingly lost.
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Wasn't the first one just before the British Mandate was revoked so before 2 state solution was even implemented?
 
do.ob said:
Teachers should not hit students, but the video shows mostly backpacks and you spin this into normalization of racism, even when the tweet you went through the trouble of translating makes no mention of it. Good posting.
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16-year olds being a**** wouldn't be unheard of... The Gynmnasium suspending the student and protecting the "non-racist" teacher who feels the urge to hit a kid because he raised a Palestinian flag, says it all.


But my comment is more general, and in regard to Germany are you denying there global anti-Palestinian racism both in social media, in the MSM?

I've been watching a few German shows on Youtube. It looks like plain Israeli propaganda...

Did award-winning journalist Maloclm Ohanwe really express support for Hamas, or was he fired as part of the "silencing dissenting voices" ?



"A disgusting cancel campaign is now underway against @MalcolmOhanwe because he dared to speak about human rights. Full solidarity with him, and deepest contempt for the behavior of this media that obeys 'reasons of state'."
 
Revan said:
It happened 3 times right: 1948, 1967 and 1973. The first war was when Israel was a baby state, the second time they got humiliated in 6 days and the third time they caused some pain to Israel but still convincingly lost.
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In 1948, Nobody asked the palestinains what they thought. But they have to pay now in 2023 for what Arabs tried to do in 1948...

Arab states were also baby states... And Israel was a baby state doing stuff like this:

 
Jewish restaurant in London vandalised and stones lobbed at Jewish primary school children today. This is getting nasty quickly.
 
I just don't understand how you can hope to achieve anything with Hamas representing you. Within it's foundational charter it explictly lays out working towards a future where even mother nature is helping it exterminate the Jewish people. And multiple leaders of Hamas have doubled-down on this belief.

I'm older, and cynical these days, but for Hamas this seems a win-win. Huge media grabbing attention, big Jewish casualties and now non-stop coverage of Palestinian innocents being killed, ensuring future recruiment. Rinse. Repeat.

And all it achieves is death, increasing tension and less understanding.

I closely followed the negotiations back in 2000 as I'd studied the conflict at college, and when that fell apart (and how) and I just can't see it being resolved in any way now.

Little bit like gun control in the states, the wrong actors with the wrong incentives are being put in the positions that matter.
 
Traub said:
Hearing rumours that they're concerned the North might explode. Catastrophic if that happens - I'd expect the US to get involved.
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All the noises from Hezbollah are that they want no part in this. They'll only act if they sense weakness now.
 
Pintu said:
16-year olds being a**** wouldn't be unheard of... The Gynmnasium suspending the student and protecting the "non-racist" teacher who feels the urge to hit a kid because he raised a Palestinian flag, says it all.


But my comment is more general, and in regard to Germany are you denying there global anti-Palestinian racism both in social media, in the MSM?

I've been watching a few German shows on Youtube. It looks like plain Israeli propaganda...

Did award-winning journalist Maloclm Ohanwe really express support for Hamas, or was he fired as part of the "silencing dissenting voices" ?



"A disgusting cancel campaign is now underway against @MalcolmOhanwe because he dared to speak about human rights. Full solidarity with him, and deepest contempt for the behavior of this media that obeys 'reasons of state'."
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He wasn’t fired. He’s a free lancer who will not be hired again.
And yes, that is because of his support for the Hamas. He painted their actions as without alternative. The subtext was obvious to everyone who can read. Quite obviously. Which is a shame, because he did some good work and at his best was a voice of reason.
If you work in the public sector or for public institutions in Germany and paint the cruel murder of civilians, especially Jewish ones, as something without alternative, you‘re done. Within seconds. And rightly so.
 
Pintu said:
16-year olds being a**** wouldn't be unheard of... The Gynmnasium suspending the student and protecting the "non-racist" teacher who feels the urge to hit a kid because he raised a Palestinian flag, says it all.
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You have no idea what happened. You see maybe 5 seconds of actual footage in that video and you just fill in the blanks. The far left politician, who shared the video, didn't mention racism, but you are sure, because you want to. He must be racist, too.

But my comment is more general, and in regard to Germany are you denying there global anti-Palestinian racism both in social media, in the MSM?

I've been watching a few German shows on Youtube. It looks like plain Israeli propaganda...

Did award-winning journalist Maloclm Ohanwe really express support for Hamas, or was he fired as part of the "silencing dissenting voices" ?



"A disgusting cancel campaign is now underway against @MalcolmOhanwe because he dared to speak about human rights. Full solidarity with him, and deepest contempt for the behavior of this media that obeys 'reasons of state'."
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Germany, as a state, has a favorable stance towards Israel and jews, for historical reasons, that should be obvious to anyone.
If you think that's racism, too, then things are getting seriously silly.

I went through his Tweets I can see why people think he expressed sympathy for Hamas, so I can see why public broadcasters want to stay clear of that controversy and decided not hire him as a freelancer anymore.
 
HTG said:
He wasn’t fired. He’s a free lancer who will not be hired again.
And yes, that is because of his support for the Hamas. He painted their actions as without alternative. The subtext was obvious to everyone who can read. Quite obviously. Which is a shame, because he did some good work and at his best was a voice of reason.
If you work in the public sector or for public institutions in Germany and paint the cruel murder of civilians, especially Jewish ones, as something without alternative, you‘re done. Within seconds. And rightly so.
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One of my first posts of the cafe was based on my thesis about Bayern in the Nazi era and how they suffered for protecting Jews. When I'd spoken to pretty much everybody at the club they had said this, that in Germany it cannot become acceptable discourse again to cast jews as monsters. Seems a particularly sensitive subject there.

Raoul said:
Hamas and Hezbollah are Iranian proxies, so they will behave accordingly.
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Hezbollah are effectively Russian owned now. Iran are paymasters, but not pissing off Russia is more crucial to them. And the lines Russia and Israel dance are real damned complex. Maybe @harms can summarise effectively because I'm not knowledgeable enough.
 
Gehrman said:
I remember a quote that he was offered 98% of what he wanted and rejected hence getting the nickname "no deal Arafat". However my knowledge of all this is scant, so people more invested in the subject can explain the details better.
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Thank you. What I don't get is why some people think that because two-state wasn't agreed twenty odd years ago it should be forgotten about for ever. It is still the best solution however unlikely it may seem.
 
RedDevil@84 said:
They are not actually spoilt for choice, if they have one?
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Of course, but if the people can't influence who represents them, who else is supposed to? It's obviously a tragedy, but any true solution will not feature Hamas imo.
 
owlo said:
One of my first posts of the cafe was based on my thesis about Bayern in the Nazi era and how they suffered for protecting Jews. When I'd spoken to pretty much everybody at the club they had said this, that in Germany it cannot become acceptable discourse again to cast jews as monsters. Seems a particularly sensitive subject there.



Hezbollah are effectively Russian owned now. Iran are paymasters, but not pissing off Russia is more crucial to them. And the lines Russia and Israel dance are real damned complex. Maybe @harms can summarise effectively because I'm not knowledgeable enough.
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They are literally a movement that emerged out of the Iranian revolution. Their funding and weapons are mostly sourced from Iran - hence they are Iranian proxies that advance the Iranian regime's policy on Israel.
 
Tibs said:
Zionists have stopped all food, electricity and water going in to Gaza.

Thoughts with the people of Gaza…hopefully some the spineless Arab nations step up now (never happen I know)
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The Arab nations will step up and offer normalisation of relations if Israel withdraws from the strip again. Win win for everyone, falafels for everyone!
 
Pintu said:
The normalisation of anti-palestinian racism in Europe continues.



“War in Israel and Palestine leads to violence by a teacher at the Ernst Abbe Gymnasium in Neukölln. A student shows the Palestinian flag, gets a slap in the face from the teacher, and the student defends himself. Student is suspended.

I learned from my teachers at school that we discuss differences. Pedagogical goal fulfilled?”
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https://www.tagesschau.de/inland/re...n-wegen-palaestina-flagge-aneinander-100.html

Suspected racist German media reports that German police found out that the pupil headbutted the teacher.

Another win for Twitter investigators.
 
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owlo said:
One of my first posts of the cafe was based on my thesis about Bayern in the Nazi era and how they suffered for protecting Jews. When I'd spoken to pretty much everybody at the club they had said this, that in Germany it cannot become acceptable discourse again to cast jews as monsters. Seems a particularly sensitive subject there.



Hezbollah are effectively Russian owned now. Iran are paymasters, but not pissing off Russia is more crucial to them. And the lines Russia and Israel dance are real damned complex. Maybe @harms can summarise effectively because I'm not knowledgeable enough.
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It is the most sensible topic there is in Germany, I think. The journalist obviously knew this. And he’s not dumb. The opposite, really. He knew what he was saying and he knew how people would understand his words. He fecked up. He deserves the consequences.
 
Hamas Israel attacks: Humza Yousaf's in-laws trapped in Gaza

Scotland's first minister says his wife's parents are "trapped" in Gaza, as he unequivocally condemned the attacks by Hamas in Israel.
Humza Yousaf said his in-laws, who live in Dundee, had travelled to Gaza to see her sick grandmother.
The Israelis have told them to leave, but Mr Yousaf said they have no way to get out and the UK Foreign Office cannot guarantee safe passage.
He said he and his wife were "sick with worry" that they would not survive.

Mr Yousaf said his in-laws Maged and Elizabeth El-Nakla had been visiting his father-in-law's 92-year-old mother when the Hamas attack took place.
He said they were told by Israeli authorities to leave because "Gaza will effectively be obliterated".
Gaza is home to about 2.3 million people, 80% of whom rely on aid.
More than 500 people have died there in Israel's retaliatory strikes and the region could now be on the brink of a new humanitarian crisis.
Mr Yousaf said: "Despite the best efforts of the British Foreign Office, nobody can guarantee them safe passage anywhere.
"So I'm in a situation where we don't know whether or not my mother-in-law and father-in-law, who have nothing to do - as most Gazans don't - with Hamas or with any terror attack, will make it through the night or not."
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Hamas Israel attacks: Humza Yousaf's in-laws trapped in Gaza - BBC News

Indiscriminate attacks by the state is state sponsored terrorism.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Is there any source caftards would recommend who can give a balanced view of this situation? As, in India all our mainstream media are pro Israel as they, like our government, hate everything Muslim anyway.
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I've noticed this as well on Indian twitter. A lot of pro-Israel tweets from India.
 
do.ob said:
https://www.tagesschau.de/inland/re...n-wegen-palaestina-flagge-aneinander-100.html

Racist German media reports that equally racist German police found out that the pupil headbutted the teacher.

Another win for Twitter investigators.
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This text is a bit misleading. But at least they agree the teacher got ratted by seeing a Palestinian flag.

In the first part they are using the subjunctive to imply uncertainty. ( except the part about the kid head-butting him) And at the end they say the video shows that the teacher slapped the kid (this time no subjunctive is used).


Der Lehrer soll den 14-Jährigen ermahnt und versucht haben, ihm die Flagge wegzunehmen. Der 15-jährige Schüler hat dem Lehrer laut Polizeiangaben daraufhin einen Kopfstoß gegeben, woraufhin ihn der Lehrer geohrfeigt haben soll. Der Schüler trat den 61-Jährigen danach in den Bauchbereich.

In Videos, die auf Instagram und X (ehemals Twitter) kursieren, ist zu sehen, wie der Lehrer den Schüler ohrfeigt und dann von ihm getreten wird und umfällt. (No subjunctive used here..)


Did the police make a statement about this incident confirming he head-butted the teacher first ?
 
Raoul said:
I've noticed this as well on Indian twitter. A lot of pro-Israel tweets from India.
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Not surprising though. A huge internet crowd in India (especially on twitter, facebook, whatsapp) are vociferously against Muslims. Thanks to BJP running well funded departments to drive the social media trends.
 
Pintu said:
This text is a bit misleading. But at least they agree the teacher got ratted by seeing a Palestinian flag.

In the first part they are using the subjunctive to imply uncertainty. ( except the part about the kid head-butting him) And at the end they say the video shows that the teacher slapped the kid (this time no subjunctive is used).


Der Lehrer soll den 14-Jährigen ermahnt und versucht haben, ihm die Flagge wegzunehmen. Der 15-jährige Schüler hat dem Lehrer laut Polizeiangaben daraufhin einen Kopfstoß gegeben, woraufhin ihn der Lehrer geohrfeigt haben soll. Der Schüler trat den 61-Jährigen danach in den Bauchbereich.

In Videos, die auf Instagram und X (ehemals Twitter) kursieren, ist zu sehen, wie der Lehrer den Schüler ohrfeigt und dann von ihm getreten wird und umfällt. (No subjunctive used here..)


Did the police make a statement about this incident confirming he head-butted the teacher first ?
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Since you're handing out German lessons now, I'm sure you're aware that this is indirekte Rede to convey what someone else (the police) told them.
You're also literally quoting the words "headbutted the teacher according to police".
But please do keep on investigating. You never know with the thugs of Tagesschau.
 
do.ob said:
Since you're handing out German lessons now, I'm sure you're aware that this is indirekte Rede to convey what someone else (the police) told them.
You're also literally quoting the words "headbutted the teacher according to police".
But please do keep on investigating. You never know with the thugs of Tagesschau.
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It would be funny if the topic wasn’t this serious.
 
Raoul said:
They are literally a movement that emerged out of the Iranian revolution. Their funding and weapons are mostly sourced from Iran - hence they are Iranian proxies that advance the Iranian regime's policy on Israel.
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Won't argue on this, will just reiterate I'd be surprised if they got heavily involved.
 
Raoul said:
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Maybe the link in the tweet is wrong but this isnt a Reuters report, it is AFP and it doesn't mention, a mock settlement being built or that many Hamas leaders were unaware. Still an interesting article though about Israel believing economic incentives had moderated Hamas's ideologocal view against Isreal.
 
Raoul said:
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Earlier this month, Israel’s national security adviser Tzachi Hanegbi said that for the past two years Hamas has not initiated any rocket launches, as part of its decision to curb its violence in an “unprecedented” manner.

“Hamas is very restrained, and understands the meaning of further defiance,” he said in an interview with army radio on October 1.
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If only they had practiced restraint for another 4 years, maybe they'd be in a better place
 
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