He was cooked last season, this season he's being microwaved to warm him up.
Is Casemiro Cooked?
- Thread starter Fortitude
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He could still do it well in Spain/Italy, I think choosing England in 30's was a bad move, on top of that playing in the system we are trying here wouldnt help him either.
He is not a bad player, its just the way whole team plays.
He is not a bad player, its just the way whole team plays.
He had an atrocious game.
But bad games do happen. The current system requires insane fitness. Someone who can do up and down throughout 90 mins. And misplaces no pass. Those kind of midfielders dont exist
Liverpool exposed our system with pressing our 2 midfielders. You can only beat the press if there is a pass available. But the shape our midfield was taking, it was difficult to find a free player without hoofing the ball to the sides or to the channels. Casemiro couldnt do that at all.
But bad games do happen. The current system requires insane fitness. Someone who can do up and down throughout 90 mins. And misplaces no pass. Those kind of midfielders dont exist
Liverpool exposed our system with pressing our 2 midfielders. You can only beat the press if there is a pass available. But the shape our midfield was taking, it was difficult to find a free player without hoofing the ball to the sides or to the channels. Casemiro couldnt do that at all.
It might sound crazy, but I do believe in a proper system he could be an asset still. If we had a coach who valued possession and build up then he wouldn't be trying these constant hollywood passes and would hopefully be more sensible defensively if not having to cover so much ground. Being a midfielder at United is a thankless task right now and there is no build up or respite from just keeping possession, it is just all guns blazing constantly and one mistake usually ends in a goal which just diminished your confidence in yourself and in your coaches plan.
Should've sold him last window.
It was clear that he's finished at highest level. Even the weak Brazil NT team did not want him
It was clear that he's finished at highest level. Even the weak Brazil NT team did not want him
I think he'll be useful this season, just not as a full time starter. Off the bench and fresh with the right mindset, he'll win us points.
I think he means well but he doesn't have the desire to be truely elite combined with his legs getting slower. A well organised side he would perhaps not struggle in as badly (see Modric) but I don't think his style of play suits his ageing ability unfortunately.
He's shockingly bad but doesn't seem to care. "Just pay me and shut up" seems to be his philosophy.
It's painful to watch him at United but the team seems rather short in terms of their midfield options right now. With some cover and more options for him to rotate with, and not play every single game, he can still be a good player.
Medium rare at Real Madrid
Burnt steak at ours.
Get rid.
Burnt steak at ours.
Get rid.
I don't think he's completely cooked but he needs a different role in a different system. He clearly isn't a Ten Hag player so I don't understand why he was sold. Casemiro at Real played with Modric and Kroos. He was playing with two of the best of all time in midfield. He wasn't the one dictating the game, he was the one breaking up play and winning the ball back. For us, he has more responsibility when it comes to dictating play and that's not his game. We also don't have disciplined midfielders next to him to complement him. He should have been sold over McTom.
McTom will guide Napoli to the title with a record points haul and Casemiro may be gone in Jan.
McTom will guide Napoli to the title with a record points haul and Casemiro may be gone in Jan.
Surely it's down to professionalism as well. Carrick was never world-class like Casemiro was in his prime, had zero pace left in the last couple of years of his career (when he was much older than Casemiro now), played under failing managers post-Fergie too, but never let himself become a liability for the team like this. Was still quite important in his penultimate season (under Mourinho), there was a period of about 3 months when we were undefeated every game he started iirc.
He looks like a feckin' corpse at times. And his bottom level is abysmal, he can't be trusted in the slightest.
Nowhere near a starter unless we have given up all hope of challenging (for anything).
(Don't see him as much of a bench option either, to be honest. But the right manager could possibly turn him into that, who knows: the safer option is to just get rid of him as soon as possible, before he deteriorates even further.)
Nowhere near a starter unless we have given up all hope of challenging (for anything).
(Don't see him as much of a bench option either, to be honest. But the right manager could possibly turn him into that, who knows: the safer option is to just get rid of him as soon as possible, before he deteriorates even further.)
Watch another manager come in, change the tactic and Casemiro looks good again. Ten Hag is making him look a fool.
Possibly.
Buying a certain category of player, giving them a huge salary - it has never ended well for us.
Nobody's going to convince me that fecker gives 100% every minute he's on the pitch.
He's obviously a good player, that ain't the issue. And the issue ain't - either - that he's suddenly turned into an old man.
So, yeah - call it what you will, why not professionalism.
At any rate, he's sub standard.
Spot on. He can still do a job in a proper team. He didn't suddenly turn completely shit, and he has never been a great playmaker or in any way progressor of the ball. Expecting him to do that is unfair and just bad planning. And I don't think there's a DM in the world that can run around covering the gaping voids in Ten Hag's "system" for 90 minutes. He has obviously dropped off noticeably and this was a terrible transfer, something I called out all the way back when, but what's happening is not his fault.
Casemiro is still a decent, sometimes even good player, but this is just a mismatch and an awful manager.
He didn't have to cover many gaps yesterday and he was rubbish, stop making excuses for him hes toast. He can't hack getting pressed in midfield, means he can't play midfield for a top club in the PL simple as
The tactics have nothing to do with him making that lazy pass before the first goal. His performance yesterday was on him.
Every player can make mistakes, especially when tasked with things they are not great at. And Casemiro played well enough the previous two games. He didn't become terrible overnight. I won't argue he is amazing or anything, and should have been sold this summer, but I'm certain he can still do a good job in a proper system.
He carries significant blame for yesterday, but it was much more a case of a proper manager schooling a totally clueless manager.
What on earth was he trying to do here?
Might be OK playing the 8 next to Ugarte.
The system was not the issue yesterday, he was not left isolated in midfield and he did not have to cover large spaces, he had a bad game against better opposition that Fulham and Brighton, also against Brighton second half when Beleba came on he was also poor
Tactics
The tactics have nothing to do with him making that lazy pass before the first goal. His performance yesterday was on him.
Hes actually an idiot because the obvious pass is to Mazraoui we just played out of their weak press and he can bypass the majority of their midfield with one pass and we have a 4 vs 3/4 depending on how quickly Granvenberch gets back and Mazraoui and Garnacho are 2 vs 1 on Robertson
Instead he passes the ball to the side where they have cover, what a twat
Clearly he's not the future but 32 isn't that old. I think in a more controlled approach Casemiro can still do a job for us but he needs that little bit of extra time on the ball, which isn't always there in the PL. Yesterday certainly wasn't the game to ask him to be expansive in. He's a wily old fox, if we'd asked him to break up play and slow the game down I'm sure he could've done that. Frustrating them and making it a scrap would've undoubtedly been a better approach yesterday but instead we played at a frantic pace no doubt desperate for the first goal and asked him to play something akin to pirlo mixed with adama traore
Casemiro wasn't the only one playing scary mid range passes across the centre of the field that were getting cut out more often than not. Licha especially was very lucky on a number of occasions not to get punished for it. Sadly I think they targeted him in the end and his day quickly unravelled, it was right to hook him but I did feel sorry for him aswell. He was given something of a thankless task really
My main worry is I'm not sure if anyone can make this approach that ETH is trying to establish work. As soon as we win possession everyone bar the CBs and 1 midfielder charge forward, if we lose the ball in our half we're fecked
Casemiro wasn't the only one playing scary mid range passes across the centre of the field that were getting cut out more often than not. Licha especially was very lucky on a number of occasions not to get punished for it. Sadly I think they targeted him in the end and his day quickly unravelled, it was right to hook him but I did feel sorry for him aswell. He was given something of a thankless task really
My main worry is I'm not sure if anyone can make this approach that ETH is trying to establish work. As soon as we win possession everyone bar the CBs and 1 midfielder charge forward, if we lose the ball in our half we're fecked
Casemiro is over-cooked, but is in good company. Still definitely better than Tobias Christopher Collyer. We could benefit from having players like Casemiro in the squad (great experience and professionalism), like Arsenal use Jorginho.
Casemiro is unfortunately way to expensive to justify as a squad player. Jorginho is a better player, but earns £70.000 less a week. Casemiro is definitely not value for money and has to be replaced in January.
Casemiro is unfortunately way to expensive to justify as a squad player. Jorginho is a better player, but earns £70.000 less a week. Casemiro is definitely not value for money and has to be replaced in January.
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Past his best for sure but that was obvious as soon as Real were willing to part ways.
He isnt cooked. In a working system he would still be a very useful player. It just wouldn't be for a team challenging City unless they had an abundance of world class players around him.
He looks cooked in ETH's system because it's a crazy system that will not work regardless of the personnel. Last thing you do with a player who is psst their peak is overload them with leg work and give them 3x as much ground to cover. This is common sense. Out manager doesn't have it.
I said this as far back as this time last year and will say it again. The player who can play DM in our system and make it work does not exist, because this would requite the ability for them to either teleport or create duplicates of themselves ala Chien from Dragon ball z. I am yet to be aware of a player capable of mimicking super powers from an anime series so suspect it is because there aren't any.
I would plead with people not to pile pressure on Ugarte to somehow fix this and then lable him as shite when he inevitably can't, but barring ETH getting sacked or actually accepting he is wrong and changing his set up, that is probably what is going to happen.
He isnt cooked. In a working system he would still be a very useful player. It just wouldn't be for a team challenging City unless they had an abundance of world class players around him.
He looks cooked in ETH's system because it's a crazy system that will not work regardless of the personnel. Last thing you do with a player who is psst their peak is overload them with leg work and give them 3x as much ground to cover. This is common sense. Out manager doesn't have it.
I said this as far back as this time last year and will say it again. The player who can play DM in our system and make it work does not exist, because this would requite the ability for them to either teleport or create duplicates of themselves ala Chien from Dragon ball z. I am yet to be aware of a player capable of mimicking super powers from an anime series so suspect it is because there aren't any.
I would plead with people not to pile pressure on Ugarte to somehow fix this and then lable him as shite when he inevitably can't, but barring ETH getting sacked or actually accepting he is wrong and changing his set up, that is probably what is going to happen.
Exception case
Weak, but it also shows that we are not set up properly. Where are the passing options? Liverpool closed them down much better than us and they moved a lot faster in possession whereas our players often don’t seem to have a clue where to position themselves in the best way.
Looks to be continuing last season's form. Which is a shame.
His first season with us he was one of our best performers.
Alongside Eriksen and Bruno in midfield we looked solid and stable in the middle of the park for the first time in ages.
I think Casemiro's decline is a combination of age (natural..he's past his prime) and tactics employed by the manager.
His first season with us he was one of our best performers.
Alongside Eriksen and Bruno in midfield we looked solid and stable in the middle of the park for the first time in ages.
I think Casemiro's decline is a combination of age (natural..he's past his prime) and tactics employed by the manager.
I´m coming to a point where i´m giving up on understanding what EtH is asking of the players. From the eye test it seems he is going for some kind of gung-ho tactics with Hollywood attempts not just from Bruno, but also from the DM in Casemiro. While this can work in occasional games, it will lead us into problems more often than not. Especially since we have a tendency of not taking our first couple of chances.
I can somehow see that he´d want to maximise what he can get from Bruno, being the player he is, but it is to detriment to the team as a whole, and how he can not see that after last season is beyond me.
Seems this became more an EtH tactics post than a Casemiro post, but i´m sure you´ll forgive me.
I can somehow see that he´d want to maximise what he can get from Bruno, being the player he is, but it is to detriment to the team as a whole, and how he can not see that after last season is beyond me.
Seems this became more an EtH tactics post than a Casemiro post, but i´m sure you´ll forgive me.
Casemiro seems a nice lad. He could probably say something to his teammates too, even if they are following the managers plan but a simple hey you guys are too far away from me I need some options on on the ball. Say something to Erik too while he's at it.
Still applies
Carricks long and short passing was far superior.
There are midfielders the same age and profile as Casemiro who are still playing at or close to world class levels because they have competent managers. Unfortunately ten Hag’s tactics do not play to Casemiro’s strengths. Do we really think that he would have this serious dip in form and confidence under Ancelotti? Ten Hag is the problem not Casemiro.
I'm not defender of Ten Hag, but I very much doubt his instructions to Casemiro pre-game include making reckless slide tackles and picking up bookings.
Chat, am I cooked? - Casemiro before the game