Pandya forcing people to eat humble pie again here.
India Tour of South Africa
- Thread starter prath92
- Start date
There was a In Wenger we trust banner at the protests in Mumbai a couple of days back.
It's hilarious that we've been crying for a player like him for the last two decades and when we get him, he's been derided as absolutely shit from majority of the Indians here.
I don't follow any Indian Cricket forums but what's been the general opinion of him? I was thoroughly impressed by him on the tour of Sri Lanka and have seen enough to have faith in him. He played superbly in the CT final when everyone else failed, so I can't understand why so many would deride him before even facing a ball.
I was addressing the point about the team that made #1 - which I am taking to mean Dhoni's team - which won in NZ and drew in SA, yes, but Dhoni has one of the worst records away from home in test cricket as captain. No references to the Indian team that came before it.
I am not sure how we can talk about Dhoni's record 2008-2011 by saying 'till 2011' because that is like 50% of his away captaincy outside subcontinent.
Anyway, moving on.. I hope we can put on another 100, as unlikely as it is.
Pandya is very talented.
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Were all the squad members with him as well?
The teams we're describing are *slightly* off. You're right that Kumble left (so did Ganguly). But the core (in my eyes) was the middle-order of Dravid, Sachin, Laxman, (Ganguly), and Harbhajan and Zaheer were the constant bowlers. Jaffer-Karthick were the original openers but were replaced by Sehwag-Gambhir.
In that climb to #1, their away results were 1-0 in England 2007, 1-2 in Aus 2008, 1-0 in NZ 2010, 1-1 in SA 2011. Which by Indian standards are not bad. The beat Eng and Aus at home and drew with SA (twice).
The rot set in after the last SA home series, as Dravid, Sachin, and Laxman all declined very close to each other. 0-4 in Eng and Aus. After that Aus tour, the team changed as well.
Rest don't matter.
Incredible innings really. We'll still lose obviously but this was some serious stuff.
Bhuvaneshwar Kumar played a just as important innings. Mix of patience and skill.
So a lead of 79. Take another 3 wickets today and it’s anyones game
Pandeya is awesome, generally stands up when the rest of the batting fails too. Such a clean hitter.
Optimistic much. Would love if they were 30 for 5 or something but a lead of 79 gives them a massive advantage. Need more than 3 wickets today with 20 overs to go.
Bookmarked.
Reckon it's flattened out (in the sense there's not as much lateral movement) and quickened up a bit and India will chase 400+. Champion innings from Pandya and champion bowling from Rabada. Love watching young cricketers develop.
This has been a good test match so far.
India start the tour well with three quick wickets, Faf and ABDV counter attack after that, India remove both set batsmen quickly after lunch but De Kock and Philander get a nice partnership going with counter attack again, India remove both just before tea but Maharaj scores a cameo and Ashwin wraps up the tail quickly (including a very good runout of Maharaj).
SA replicate India's opening spell and get three wickets before stumps, Pujara and Rohit consolidate for 20 overs, SA knock the middle order with some great bowling, Pandya and Bhuvi counter attack with almost a century partnership but SA get both of them after tea. Pandya with a great innings, Faf and ABDV both very good innings, nice cameos from De Kock, Maharaj, Pujara (just about) and Bhuvi. Over rates have been awful from both teams with respect to the mandated rate but some of the seam bowling has been really good - Indian bowlers in patches but SA bowlers terrifyingly consistent. When everyone's fit, their attack of Philander, Rabada, Morkel and Steyn is a match for any other side in the world. And they used to have Kyle Abbott and Chris Morris in reserve!
India will most likely lose this match as there are still more than 3 days left while their resources are not as good as SA's. A 2-1 loss is probably the most expected outcome while a 1-1 draw would be amazing like they managed in 10-11. They would have benefited with a tour match but BCCI in all its infinite wisdom agreed to host SL for 9 matches (3+3+3) instead of in late Feb 2018. There are opinions that they intentionally delayed SA tour to get back at SA board as they didn't support BCCI in the ICC meeting (I don't follow off-pitch shenanigans much). Players including Kohli voiced their concerns as early as NZ ODI series I think but it is what they have to finally put up with. SA had to settle for a farcical 4-day test with Zimbabwe on Boxing Day instead of a marquee one vs India.
Pandya's had a good career so far, though it's still in nascent stages. He did well vs NZ in 2016, alright vs Eng in early 2017, a very good innings in Champions Trophy final and Man of the Series in Aus series (all in ODIs). Debuted in SL tour for tests, scored a very good century in final test while farming last two batsmen and now played another blinder on a bouncy pitch against fearsome pace attack. Got lucky with Elgar dropping him early and De Kock missing a stumping very late in the innings but still you got to ride the luck sometimes. I don't follow IPL at all so maybe he rubs the people the wrong way during those matches - but I was always impressed with him while playing for India.
Also, a very good post by @berbatrick regarding the decline of India's middle order and corresponding fortunes of their away tours. Dhoni's captaincy can broadly be divided into two halves - with the 1st half being great (top of test rankings for 18 months) and an awful away record in 2nd. Eng tour in 2011 was the first time we saw the decline of India's usually solid batting (only Dravid played well with two centuries) and the tour Down Under was the rock bottom - first Aus tour where Sachin couldn't score a century, and to think he scored two when he was 18! Of course this decline combining with the lopsided schedule calendar meant a 0-10 record in away matches with 4-0 in Eng and Aus with 1-0 in NZ (one of the all time best innings from McCullum) and SA (Kallis being the usual thorn). Sehwag, Gambhir, Dravid and VVS all left almost together while Sachin stayed - despite calls for his retirement - until 2013.
It also didn't help that India didn't have a comfortable away series in subcontinent conditions to get their players accustomed to tours before unwrapping them on tougher tours like Eng, Aus, NZ and SA - which almost always come together again due to lopsided schedule. Didn't tour SL between 2010 and 2015 (I think), no cricket vs Pak since 2009, and they barely play vs B'desh. Dhoni has to be one of the best captains for a spinner in subcontinent matches - he could get the likes of Pragyan Ojha and Amit Mishra play well while he wasn't good for fast bowlers. Had success as long as Zaheer was around but once he left, fast bowlers didn't have any direction like they do now with Kohli. Dhoni also became more conservative as he aged and played for draws on away tours as he knew spinners won't help him much while fast bowlers are going to be erratic. I think he once played on until India had 600+ lead in NZ instead of pushing for a win - which ultimately meant NZ comfortably drew the match. But based on overall record, can't agree that he's one of the worst test captains at all.
India start the tour well with three quick wickets, Faf and ABDV counter attack after that, India remove both set batsmen quickly after lunch but De Kock and Philander get a nice partnership going with counter attack again, India remove both just before tea but Maharaj scores a cameo and Ashwin wraps up the tail quickly (including a very good runout of Maharaj).
SA replicate India's opening spell and get three wickets before stumps, Pujara and Rohit consolidate for 20 overs, SA knock the middle order with some great bowling, Pandya and Bhuvi counter attack with almost a century partnership but SA get both of them after tea. Pandya with a great innings, Faf and ABDV both very good innings, nice cameos from De Kock, Maharaj, Pujara (just about) and Bhuvi. Over rates have been awful from both teams with respect to the mandated rate but some of the seam bowling has been really good - Indian bowlers in patches but SA bowlers terrifyingly consistent. When everyone's fit, their attack of Philander, Rabada, Morkel and Steyn is a match for any other side in the world. And they used to have Kyle Abbott and Chris Morris in reserve!
India will most likely lose this match as there are still more than 3 days left while their resources are not as good as SA's. A 2-1 loss is probably the most expected outcome while a 1-1 draw would be amazing like they managed in 10-11. They would have benefited with a tour match but BCCI in all its infinite wisdom agreed to host SL for 9 matches (3+3+3) instead of in late Feb 2018. There are opinions that they intentionally delayed SA tour to get back at SA board as they didn't support BCCI in the ICC meeting (I don't follow off-pitch shenanigans much). Players including Kohli voiced their concerns as early as NZ ODI series I think but it is what they have to finally put up with. SA had to settle for a farcical 4-day test with Zimbabwe on Boxing Day instead of a marquee one vs India.
Pandya's had a good career so far, though it's still in nascent stages. He did well vs NZ in 2016, alright vs Eng in early 2017, a very good innings in Champions Trophy final and Man of the Series in Aus series (all in ODIs). Debuted in SL tour for tests, scored a very good century in final test while farming last two batsmen and now played another blinder on a bouncy pitch against fearsome pace attack. Got lucky with Elgar dropping him early and De Kock missing a stumping very late in the innings but still you got to ride the luck sometimes. I don't follow IPL at all so maybe he rubs the people the wrong way during those matches - but I was always impressed with him while playing for India.
Also, a very good post by @berbatrick regarding the decline of India's middle order and corresponding fortunes of their away tours. Dhoni's captaincy can broadly be divided into two halves - with the 1st half being great (top of test rankings for 18 months) and an awful away record in 2nd. Eng tour in 2011 was the first time we saw the decline of India's usually solid batting (only Dravid played well with two centuries) and the tour Down Under was the rock bottom - first Aus tour where Sachin couldn't score a century, and to think he scored two when he was 18! Of course this decline combining with the lopsided schedule calendar meant a 0-10 record in away matches with 4-0 in Eng and Aus with 1-0 in NZ (one of the all time best innings from McCullum) and SA (Kallis being the usual thorn). Sehwag, Gambhir, Dravid and VVS all left almost together while Sachin stayed - despite calls for his retirement - until 2013.
It also didn't help that India didn't have a comfortable away series in subcontinent conditions to get their players accustomed to tours before unwrapping them on tougher tours like Eng, Aus, NZ and SA - which almost always come together again due to lopsided schedule. Didn't tour SL between 2010 and 2015 (I think), no cricket vs Pak since 2009, and they barely play vs B'desh. Dhoni has to be one of the best captains for a spinner in subcontinent matches - he could get the likes of Pragyan Ojha and Amit Mishra play well while he wasn't good for fast bowlers. Had success as long as Zaheer was around but once he left, fast bowlers didn't have any direction like they do now with Kohli. Dhoni also became more conservative as he aged and played for draws on away tours as he knew spinners won't help him much while fast bowlers are going to be erratic. I think he once played on until India had 600+ lead in NZ instead of pushing for a win - which ultimately meant NZ comfortably drew the match. But based on overall record, can't agree that he's one of the worst test captains at all.
The cannon sound when a player hits a boundary is bad at the best of times, but is there anything worse than when they when they do it after a player nicks one through the slip cordon?
Kohli's being a bit passive here. India's best hope is the ball will reverse with the harder pitch and Ashwin can tie up an end (and take a few wickets) to allow the seamers to rotate on short, sharp bursts.
India should have played Umesh and Ishant, those two would have offered far more than Shami and Bhumrah. Not sure what Shami does when the ball isn't reversing.
Actually wait, having seen Hardik's hair I can completely understand why everyone wants him to be shit.
Pandya single handedly keeping India in the match
Pandia vs SA going on right now.
*cliche* Big first hour tomorrow morning */cliche*.
nah, the match is done unless we could get them all out for less 130 or something.
I don't know yet, pitch will be good to bat on until Day 4, maybe even until Day 5 where I think it'll start to offer good assistance for spinners. Couple of quick wickets in the morning and South Africa will be nervous. So far this reminds me of the Jo'burg test of 2013 where SA nearly chased 458.
Plus Steyn might not bowl again unless there was an update I missed.
Bruised heel is what I heard. Unlikely he'll come back.
Yup. CricInfo saying he could be out for the entire series. Shame, really. Good for India, though.
Rain. Unlikely that there will be any play for a while
Frustrating. Could spice up the wicket, though. Hopefully, with a little assistance from the wicket, we can bowl 'em out quickly.
Appears that at the very worst India will have to bat out an entire day to secure a draw.
.. Which is not something that I trust this lot to do against SA in SA.
This has turned interesting 
What bowling. This is why Test Cricket is the best. Great first hour and a bit.
This is exceptional. Too bad SA have better bowlers
Bowlers have done their job beautifully, now it is batsmen who have to capitalise.
Can't ask for more from the bowlers.. Time for the batsmen to step up..
Is Steyn cleared to bowl?
Is Steyn cleared to bowl?
Nope.