How do we solve our midfield problem?

If we aren’t going to buy anyone I’d rather try Shaw in midfield than see Fred again.
 
We need 2 midfielder. Its clear Matic cant last 90min . We have no midfielders
 
By a CDM right now. He doesn't have to be a world beater, merely competent.

We can then play a midfield 3 combo like...

Pogba CDM Fred
McT CDM Bruno
Pogba CDM Bruno
DVB CDM Fred
DVB CDM McT


etc etc etc.
 
Zlatattack said:
By a CDM right now. He doesn't have to be a world beater, merely competent.

We can then play a midfield 3 combo like...

Pogba CDM Fred
McT CDM Bruno
Pogba CDM Bruno
DVB CDM Fred
DVB CDM McT


etc etc etc.
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Yeah would take any of Kessie, Zakaria, Kamara or Haidara, they might not be the answer but would at least give us something different
 
croadyman said:
Yeah would take any of Kessie, Zakaria, Kamara or Haidara, they might not be the answer but would at least give us something different
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Exactly - something we've been dying for since the first 18 months of Matic.
 
Are there any credible rumours about us signing players? This surely cant go on. Seems like there are some good deals available
 
pratyush_utd said:
Are there any credible rumours about us signing players? This surely cant go on. Seems like there are some good deals available
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Whitwell's words on his Talk of The Devils Podcast give a tiny glimmer of hope, however it will probably come to nothing as usually happens with midfield targets.
 
D. Grayson said:
What do you guys reckon Julian Weigl would cost and is he the type of player we need, because I honestly can't think of any other metronomes out there whom we could realistically get in this window.
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That’s a name I haven’t heard in years, is he at Benfica now ? I know he was highly rated in the Carrick/Pirlo mould when he was younger at Dortmund.

If I was Rangnick I would honestly play Garner and Mejbri over Matic and Fred as both of Garner and Mejbri are composed on the ball, have an eye for a pass and would bring a lot more control to the middle of the park.

The obvious rebuttal would be “they’re too young” or “they wouldn’t get time on the ball like they do now” but how does anyone actually know ? Look how Elanga was tonight or how Rashford was when he was promoted or Greenwood as another example.

Right now I’d take youthful exuberance and a fearless approach over the tired and piss poor excuse we keep churning out every single fecking week, Matic and Fred is arguably the worst pairing in the league outside of the relegation places and with one of them playing every week I’d be very surprised if we make top six this season.
 
Criminal amount of money wasted on dross in central midfield since Fergie retired - and indeed a complete lack of awareness of what the team needed to build on after last seasons false dawn of runners up has led to this - matic fred mctominay vdb and of course our good friend in Dubai Pogba.
None of these would get into a team in the top half of the table - and I bet fans of Southampton etc wouldn’t take any of them this January.

I don’t blame the players per se - pogba aside - they are out of their depth at the rarefied heights of United expectation and who wouldn’t want pick up millions in wages for being so mediocre - but for FS why can’t the last 3 coaches we have had see what is staring the rest of football in the face?
Unbelievable….
 
Greck said:
We need to fix the midfield asap but the combined passing capabilities of our team outside attack is atrocious. All our talent is concentrated in attack and after that is a massive drop off in technical passing. We're a dinosaur club that has treated possession talent and football as being undesirable because we once had a manager who played boring possession football.
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Like someone pointed out the other day we should have been at front of the queue for Kante not letting Chelsea beat us to it
 
Even Garner would have saved our Bacon second half… yes…and Rb Ethan laird is better than Darlot.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Thing is they were going to buy Sancho the previous season. When they didn't get the player they promised Ole, they just went back in without assessing if he was what we needed for this season. Not too bothered about them spending on DVB, but think they needed another midfield brought in with him. A DM who can protect the defence, clear up in midfield and dictate the pace of the game. We did not need Sancho and we all know why we got Ronaldo. Buying Sancho without sorting the midfield properly was a pointless signing.
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I thought Sancho was done after we missed out the year before and brought in two right sided forwards. Bizarre that we then bought him AND Ronaldo, instantly rendering him a substitute because he's not as good as Greenwood or Rashford.

Its staggering how bad our recruitment decisons have been since 2013 and it's the main reason we're so poor on the pitch.
 
Why dont they try something different except Mcfred ?
I mean, it doesn't work. They are just not good enough.
Try playing VDB / Bruno / Mctomminay or some other combination. For christ sake, SAF played O'Shea, Rafael, Park, even Jones in midfield, and they still did a better job than our starting midfield.
Every team that we played against, their midfield destroyed ours, playing better by miles. More urgency, more desire, more running.
Is it that hard to see that we need to buy two CM/DMC in order to even have a chance to get top 4.
 
Fred blew it. After our second goal, Matic clearly signals to Fred to start staying back but he carries on pressing high up the field and gets caught out for their second goal.
 
This is precisely the point. We need a few central midfielders over the next couple of windows. Fred or mctominay should be 4th choice behind 3 much better midfielders. It would transform our defence and attack. It's been neglected for so long. Unforgivable
 
If we don't buy a midfielder we are done for the season, fully expect Brentford to pick us apart again. This is the problem when accountants and their cronies are given control of a football club and bring in their talentless cronies like Murtough and Fletcher.

This squad is a mess, makes Mourinho's look like multiple CL winners. Zero pride, zero commitment and zero hunger to prove themselves.
 
davidmichael said:
That’s a name I haven’t heard in years, is he at Benfica now ? I know he was highly rated in the Carrick/Pirlo mould when he was younger at Dortmund.

If I was Rangnick I would honestly play Garner and Mejbri over Matic and Fred as both of Garner and Mejbri are composed on the ball, have an eye for a pass and would bring a lot more control to the middle of the park.

The obvious rebuttal would be “they’re too young” or “they wouldn’t get time on the ball like they do now” but how does anyone actually know ? Look how Elanga was tonight or how Rashford was when he was promoted or Greenwood as another example.

Right now I’d take youthful exuberance and a fearless approach over the tired and piss poor excuse we keep churning out every single fecking week, Matic and Fred is arguably the worst pairing in the league outside of the relegation places and with one of them playing every week I’d be very surprised if we make top six this season.
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I feel the same way, if the defensive stability the more seasoned players are tasked with providing is non-existent, than by all means chuck in the green boys and let them learn on the job.
 
We need a midfielder or 2 in this window if we are to get top 4. Need another one with legs and energy and we need one who can dictate play with passing and control. Toni Kroos type if there is anyone out there like that type.

We are going to get hammered again soon by someone if we don't sort out.
 
) We need a midfielder who can keep the ball. It doesn't have to be a DM.

2) We do need a DM who just breaks the play.

The first goal isn't happening if we had a DM who could defend. Fecking Mings went through our midfield and all we saw was Fred making a half hearted attempt to break the play. It's a defender FFS, go hard on him and see if if you can get a ball.
 
FrankDrebin said:
He wanted one in the summer but United opted for Ronaldo instead.
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He also signed Sancho before a midfielder which is bad on its own. And the summer before when he opted for Van de Beek instead of a Matic replacement. And the summer before when Herrera left for nothing. Shameful.
 
Zoo said:
Until we get someone who can do this we aren’t going to progress as a team and points like tonight will be dropped. Matic can do it for about 15 minutes but that’s it.
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It’s not ”someone” it’s people.

I think we have players that can probably do that job but probably not consistently enough or over the length of a game. Mata, Donny and Matic put on the best midfield display Id seen from any United team in a long time last season but two of them can’t last 90 mins and the other rarely gets a chance.

The way I look at this is there are more elements to this that just the midfield. In defence we have Lindelof, Varane and Shaw that are all pretty good on the ball. Uprfront I’d probably stick with Sancho, Greenwood then flip between Ronaldo and Cavani. Midfield is just a weird combination of misfits.

To me Donny could help control a game with someone like a carrick and another person that appreciates space and movement and not every ball has to be a killer.

Fred is good if we are pressing and on the front foot and has his moments helping out in defence and he will pass and move but he just has too many lapses.

Scott, is big powerful and a runner. Positioning isn’t great, concentration isn’t great but he does have moments but I don’t think he can control a midfield.

Bruno is Obvioulsy a Maverick but I’m not convinced he has the ability or awareness to really control a midfield. Although there has been certain games where he sat more and played it more simple which to me were some of his best if not his best performances.

Matic & Mata are good for a 50 minute spell but after that they become more of a liability.

Then the big one Pogba. Generally believe he could be or do anything he wants on the field as he has that much ability and talent just not able to put it all together but to me he could help control a game. However same old same old with him and as much as I like the guy it’s probably time for him to move on.

So on reflection we probably need at least 2 midfielders probably even 3 whilst still retaining the services of Fred, Donny and McT.
 
We're stuck in a catch 22, where we have either a lack of composure if McFred plays or a lack of energy if Matic replaces one of them.

A player with some legs left that can get on the ball and look up, but can still run around (like Matic could back when he had legs) would be ideal, as then Fred or McTominay can carry the water for them.
 
The board won’t listen to Rangnick and sign CM’s this month. This club genuinely could not be run worse if it tried. I’m done with caring really.
 
We fecked up when we signed Matic over an available Fabinho.

Also signing Fred over an available Rodri.

These feck ups add up over time.

We could've had a midfield squad of:

Fabinho Rodri Pogba Fernandes McTominay

Instead we have:
Matic Fred Pogba Fernandes McTominay

BIG difference.
 
MrSingh2002 said:
We fecked up when we signed Matic over an available Fabinho.

Also signing Fred over an available Rodri.

These feck ups add up over time.

We could've had a midfield squad of:

Fabinho Rodri Pogba Fernandes McTominay

Instead we have:
Matic Fred Pogba Fernandes McTominay

BIG difference.
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Adding to this we have signed Maguire over Ruben DIas and AWB over so many right backs, means we messed up our defence too
 
There is a triumvirate at play, they have been here in position as we spiralled down. Glazers, Woodward and Judge. Owners with no football identity appoint merchant bankers to run the football side of the biggest club in the world, rewarded for organising a purchase with no outlay. What could go wrong ?

Poor managerial appointments and recruitment based largely on media clicks and shirt sales cemented the problem, a few individual performances rescued results but the strategy was friggin awful. Owners who didn't care as long as dividends were forthcoming, and no one at a senior level of admin taking it up with the Incompetent and inexperienced CEO.

Until those personalities are moved on from the club , we may continue to see a disfunctional team with no balance and overpaid average players, can someone suggest that there’s light at the end of a very long tunnel. Glazers and Judge remain, WTF?
 
Signing one or two world class central midfielders is very much needed, but it won't fix our problems on its own.

Fergie got away with not investing in central midfield for years because the squad were winners.
This squad is weak, full of mercenaries, players with no real ambition to achieve great things, toxic negativity (they must all read these boards each night), and in some cases a talent glass ceiling we hoped wasn't there when signing them (Maguire/AWB/etc).
Just as the rare figures in the squad that are winners (Fernandes/Ronaldo/Cavani) haven't been able to fix the club, neither will a new CDM. Wouldn't be surprised to see wholesale changes with the next manager if there's money to do it.
 
Annihilate Now! said:
Thing is we had control in the first half, lost it totally in the second half, and Ralf didn't do anything about it because... Reasons?
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Yeah we had complete control in the first half, I can't recall when we were last so dominant in midfield. It was balanced with Matic holding, Fred's energy and Bruno was a lot deeper than usual which helped. However, Matic physically just can't last, there are times where we don't need Fred bombing around we need him to slow it down, recycle possession, and Bruno whilst he could contribute from deeper is still never going to be someone who orchestrates possession.

Football is often over complicated these days, I wish we had a midfielder with the simplicity and common sense of Paul Scholes. At first I found his drab recounts of his game frustrating, "I just passed and moved" "if we were under pressure I just dropped deeper and kept it tight", "I just tried not to give the ball away so the gaffer wouldn't shout at me", as I had hoped instead for poetic musings on the art of being a midfielder. But I'm starting to think his simplicity and common sense is what made him the best. We have nobody in midfield now who has the instinct or adaptability to change the tone of the game depending on the situation. As soon as teams are putting pressure on us we have no answer for it, until they eventually equalise or take the lead, at which point the opposition usually become more passive and allow our midfield back into it.
 
sp_107 said:
Adding to this we have signed Maguire over Ruben DIas and AWB over so many right backs, means we messed up our defence too
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I think if Rangnicks around from now on with a few transfer windows he could completely revamp our squad.

Sort the defence by replacing Shaw, Jones and Bailly.

Sort the midfield by replacing Matic, Fred and Pogba if he is leaving too.

Sort the attack by replacing Mata and Ronaldo.

He could do that within 2 years. Get big wages off the books and bring in 8 hungry and talented players.

The below players are enough as a base plus the 8 new signings over the next couple of years.

De Gea
AWB
Dalot
Varane
Telles
McTominay
Pogba
Rashford
Sancho
Greenwood
Elanga

Add the most talented youth players:
McNeill
Garnacho
Shoretire
Hannibal

I'm optimistic but only if Rangnick is given the chance to use his experience.

If we go back to the old model and just ask Pochettino to come and go through the whole dance again we've well and truly fecked it.

Let this man control the next set of incoming and outgoings.
 
Ever since mourinho left we have constantly crumbled when we are stuck on the back foot.

It's amazin how even bloody villa show more ambition by signing two players that would get into our team in this window by actually backing their new manager like any logic CEO would do but not ours and the whole interim thing is no excuse seeing as the whole point of bringing ragnick is to surely do what he did at other clubs as a director so let him start doing it now rather than pointlessly at the end of the season or is hiring of ragnick all just an empty gesture yet again from those higher up at the club.
 
Trequarista10 said:
Yeah we had complete control in the first half, I can't recall when we were last so dominant in midfield. It was balanced with Matic holding, Fred's energy and Bruno was a lot deeper than usual which helped. However, Matic physically just can't last, there are times where we don't need Fred bombing around we need him to slow it down, recycle possession, and Bruno whilst he could contribute from deeper is still never going to be someone who orchestrates possession.

Football is often over complicated these days, I wish we had a midfielder with the simplicity and common sense of Paul Scholes. At first I found his drab recounts of his game frustrating, "I just passed and moved" "if we were under pressure I just dropped deeper and kept it tight", "I just tried not to give the ball away so the gaffer wouldn't shout at me", as I had hoped instead for poetic musings on the art of being a midfielder. But I'm starting to think his simplicity and common sense is what made him the best. We have nobody in midfield now who has the instinct or adaptability to change the tone of the game depending on the situation. As soon as teams are putting pressure on us we have no answer for it, until they eventually equalise or take the lead, at which point the opposition usually become more passive and allow our midfield back into it.
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I wouldn't exactly word it that way. Villa wrestled initiative from us for a period in that first half however when we had the ball we were very tidy in possession. Reason I would stay away from the control word is we're often just switching between phases of pushing the other team back and getting pushed back ourselves, it doesn't feel like true control. We don't maintain control when opponents put us under intense pressure and that second half was where it was most obvious.
 
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