Homophobia in football
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Jamie (@Vault Dweller) review both the Everton and Bodø/Glimt victories at Old Trafford. Listen to the guys discuss 2 wins and 7 goals in the last week, analyse of the Amorim formation, focus on Amad and how he is playing, and also take a look at Hojlund, Rashford & Zirkzee – who starts v Arsenal?
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same here. It's a news for me.
It's absolute bollocks. Hide behind 'religious reasons' all you want but those religious reasons basically say they don't believe gay people should be allowed to exist. If your religion excludes part of a population purely because of who they choose to love (which has zero affect on you whatsoever) then it's a pile of crap argument imo but that's a discussion for a non football thread.
I guess a relatable example would be if you worked in the UK and your boss insisted that everyone wore a poppy to work on “Poppy Day” (or whatever the feck it’s called) In that scenario I’d poppy up because I know it might offend people not to, so why cause offence when it’s so easily avoided? It’s only a fecking poppy.
And that’s a much more extreme example. Because one thing it definitely isn’t doing is showing support for a persecuted minority.
I don’t think it’s homophobic to refuse to wear it.
I disagree that Muslims believe gays shouldn’t exists. It’s the act that’s viewed as a sin not the actual feeling/being.
I do think the picking and choosing is odd. And while I’m not speaking about this guy, undoubtedly there are people who would refuse to wear the lgbt badge due to personal feelings / discrimination and just use religion as a reason. For example there are Muslims who drink, have sex before marriage etc don’t really practice their religion but then would use religion to not wear the LGBT badge.
Now that is most likely discrimination. But at the same time there is the concept of it’s easier to oppose the ‘sin’/ forbidden thing that you don’t do. Perfect example who sell drugs and smoke weed and are Muslim but would never ever eat pork yet alone promote it.
I’m not judging it. Just saying humans & religion are very complex.
I disagree that Muslims believe gays shouldn’t exists. It’s the act that’s viewed as a sin not the actual feeling/being.
I do think the picking and choosing is odd. And while I’m not speaking about this guy, undoubtedly there are people who would refuse to wear the lgbt badge due to personal feelings / discrimination and just use religion as a reason. For example there are Muslims who drink, have sex before marriage etc don’t really practice their religion but then would use religion to not wear the LGBT badge.
Now that is most likely discrimination. But at the same time there is the concept of it’s easier to oppose the ‘sin’/ forbidden thing that you don’t do. Perfect example who sell drugs and smoke weed and are Muslim but would never ever eat pork yet alone promote it.
I’m not judging it. Just saying humans & religion are very complex.
He should be free to not wear it, and everyone is free to judge him as a person for it. Companies should also be free to drop him if they want to, based on his actions. Forcing someone like him to wear it just hides bigots.
He's free not to wear it but he should at least explain his reasons for it instead of hiding behind the clubs weak statement and maybe tell us all why he was comfortable promoting betting companies.
This is not true. You are a mod and you've a responsiblity to do better than to post nonsense.
Well they think it's a sin and shouldn't ever happen, and in some countries you get the death penalty. So in what regard to they expect these people to live their lives?
No idea what Jesus has to do with a rainbow armband but at least Guehi actually wore it. The FA are likely going to punish him for that but they are totally fine with a player refusing to wear it and not offering his own explanation for doing so. It's no wonder racism and homophobia is still rife in football. The campaigns are meaningless. There's no real conversations around the issues.
Does he do that for every captain armband he wears?
Why would he face FA action for writing that he loves another man on a pro-gay armband?
Also, his name sounds like gay.
Also, his name sounds like gay.
Christians who work every sabbath can STFU about their old testament anti-gay stuff as well.
He has had "I love Jesus" written on his boots for years as far as I know. Quite a few players do and I don't think they've ever got into trouble.
Obviously a bit different to writing on the rainbow laces armbands.
I imagine it has to do with being *visible* too.
Dearie me.
He's clearly gay for Jesus, no problems there?
Paul Mullin got his wrists slapped for having "F*** The Tories" printed on his boots. If that's the precedent, then religious messages on boots should be a no-no too.
I once had a conversation with an elderly neighbour who thinks homosexuality is unnatural and a choice. When I asked him at what age he had decided that he liked women, he quickly shut up.
Which is why a defender might love him.
Because he's also scared of crosses?
Amen to that.
It's a bit odd that you can get reprimanded for wearing the armband and adding your support for your religion but don't get reprimanded for not wearing the armband due to support of your religion.
The Premier League is run by Kants.
That's exactly the point though. Being morally opposed to homosexuality is undebatably homophobic, it doesn't really matter if it's because of "religious reasons" or any other set of values. He has the right not to show support and we have the right to call a spade a spade.
This is nitpicking. Someone else also said that above; that these religions don't forbid people to be homosexual, just to have actual homosexual relationships. But that's a ridiculous distinction; it basically comes down to the same thing: you can't be homosexual and true to yourself. You can care about this distinction all you want, but the end result is still a repression of homosexual people and thus homophobia.
Yeah, I don't get that. He wears the band, isn't that enough? It's not like he wrote 'just to be clear, I actually do hate gays'.
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"It's fine to be a footballer, but you better not play any football."
That argument is insultingly disingenuous. I don't believe for one second that it's an argument ever made in good faith.
The rainbow originally was a message from god promising never to flood the earth again, that’s what Jesus has to do with it.
Many catholics/christians feel the rainbow has been taken and perverted using something that they generally don’t agree with.
Probably not. Apart that it seems a bit of a niche idea: players from a religious community can be receive a lot of questions/criticism from their family and friends about this. There was an article on a Dutch player last year or so, where they went into the detail of his decision-making (I think because he eventually didn't wear it). So it's not just a personal one-off choice, there's social context and pressure. And therefore I would rather interpret this as saying something like, 'I support/go along with the activity and that doesn't mean I'm not a Christian anymore'.
He walks on water, mate.
It wasn't. It always was a physics phenomenon that predates christianism and doesn't belong to christians or catholics.
It’s also hypocritical to decide for him how he must practice his religion when you also don’t want to be told how to behave in your own life. Personally I don’t care much for any religion but I think freedom of religion or association should be respected as long as it doesn’t affect the next person.
Ganging up on people who don’t want to participate frankly is turning this movements into dictators. The opposite of what their original intention of inclusivity .
He's not facing any charges now apparently.
https://www.thetimes.com/sport/football/article/rainbow-armband-sam-morsy-marc-guehi-0dmjlqz9v
It's fine for him to pick and choose if that's what he wants to do, but he then doesn't have an argument to say he isn't homophobic because there is no other reason other than that due to his picking and choosing of what he does and doesn't follow.
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