Has political correctness actually gone mad?

[Carolina Red]

They don't compete against men because of hormonal differences which mean that generally, men have more muscle mass and advantageous muscle composition. The science shows that those advantages dwindle pretty quickly once hormone replacement kicks in. I'm assuming here that we're talking about trans-women who have undergone a medical transition rather than all trans-women.

Male athletes like the ones I mentioned with the same build but less muscle/less efficient muscle would be at a significant competitive disadvantage in women's sport if they transitioned. An analogy I've heard used is like having a big car and putting an engine designed for a smaller car in. It won't go as fast or be as maneuveorable as a smaller car with the same engine would because it's lugging around a bunch more dead weight.

Obviously in some sports having a bigger frame is an advantage regardless but in many sports, especially low-contact, high mobility or endurance sports, lugging around a larger bone structure with smaller and less efficient muscles will slow you down more than it helps you. Ultimately I think blanket rules are daft either way, decisions should be on a sport by sport basis.

The biggest for me is female transitioning to male athletes still competing against women.

Texas did that with a wrestler and it resulted in 2 undefeated seasons and a serious gap in competition due to physical changes.

Thing is... if you say, hypothetically, that female to male transition = must compete against males, do you then also have to say male to female transition = must compete against females?

 

[fellaini's barber]

What % of professional sports stars are trans?
I haven’t looked it up but I’m guessing it’s a minuscule number, especially as normal trans people are a single digit percentage as part of society anyway.

I’m not getting into the advantages or disadvantages of it all because this isn’t the thread for it, and the reasoning usually comes from transphobia or a lack of understanding of what being trans actually is.
The point is that they aren’t affecting society and the historia surrounding them is unreasonable.

Yea, not finding it fair that people born as men are dominating women's sport is all down to transphobia and lack of understanding of what being trans is. If we weren't all such unelightened transphobes, we wouldn't see anythin g wrong with it at all. For me it's just common sense. So it's not a problem because trans athletes are miniscule does it then become a problem when the number increases?

The weird thing for me in all this is how no one seems to mention or give a shit about how women in these competitions or in general feel about this in the present climate. Do they think women just watch people born as men beat them in competitions and make historical records and shrug it off and put it down to them having an advantage over them same way Shaq,Phelps and Ronaldo have over men athletes as the likes of @Zarlak have been trying to explain to us?

 

[fellaini's barber]

Who decides what this level is? And then what do you do if a cis woman is naturally above this level? Do we also ban her for competing or make her compete with men?

You mean like some people say about Serena?

 

[afrocentricity]

Y'all invested in this one

Ok so what are the solutions?

 

[Mogget]

You mean like some people say about Serena?

Yep. Do we ban her from participating because she has an "unfair physical advantage"?

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Y'all invested in this one

Ok so what are the solutions?

Bear in mind this is a website where we had a multiple page thread on whether or not left-footed footballers take better penalties!

I’m much less invested in this than I am in, say, whether Ole gets the job for good. That’s for damn sure. It’s an interesting debate, though, especially if you’re interested in competitive sports. Which most of us are.

Anyhoo, there’s another thread for trans sport stuff. We should keep this one for people taking offence at other people wearing sombreros and stuff like that.

 

[afrocentricity]

Bear in mind this is a website where we had a multiple page thread on whether or not left-footed footballers take better penalties!

I’m much less invested in this than I am in, say, whether Ole gets the job for good. That’s for damn sure. It’s an interesting debate, though, especially if you’re interested in competitive sports. Which most of us are.

Anyhoo, there’s another thread for trans sport stuff. We should keep this one for people taking offence at other people wearing sombreros and stuff like that.

I dunno.... This one has kicked off more activity than most of the recent entries. But you know what? You're right, let's keep this on topic. I find the parallels between the opposing sides of PC fascinating.

 

[Adebesi]

I find the parallels between the opposing sides of PC fascinating.

Can you elaborate?

 

[afrocentricity]

Can you elaborate?

I think it's kinda obvious if you take a step back. Do I really need to elaborate? I mean I can, but I don't have the time right now... Remind me later if you still require it.

Edit: I'm talking about the fringe on either side btw...

 

[The Purley King]

What % of professional sports stars are trans?
I haven’t looked it up but I’m guessing it’s a minuscule number, especially as normal trans people are a single digit percentage as part of society anyway.

I’m not getting into the advantages or disadvantages of it all because this isn’t the thread for it, and the reasoning usually comes from transphobia or a lack of understanding of what being trans actually is.
The point is that they aren’t affecting society and the historia surrounding them is unreasonable.

I don't think the hysteria surrounding them competing in female sports is unreasonable. You may have a point re: wider society, but that isn't what we are discussing.

 

[Ødegaard]

t’s about the fact that other people’s culture are reduced to costumes

Are they?

 

[Borden]

Are they?

Please don’t disturb the virtue-signalling.

 

[fellaini's barber]

Yep. Do we ban her from participating because she has an "unfair physical advantage"?

Ban her why? No one banned Shaq or Ronaldo because of their so called unfair physical advantages so why is there a discussion about her being banned? Unfair by whose standards? Have these advantages stopped other athletes from competing favorably with them, I mean you'd have a point if any of these guys where completely outdoing and blitzing their opponents but that is not happening in any case. Not in tennis, football or basketball. There's less 'advantaged' players with almost equal or better records than them so despite these advantages there's still a competition. I'm sure you couldn't find a single example where someone had such an advantage against their fellow athletes to render competition pointless. But guess what, swap Serena to mens tennis and Shaq and Phelps to women's version of their sport....no competition.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

I imagine Idigenous Americans might have an opinion about that statement

Well, I'd like to know their reasons for wearing it but historically, we're a pretty welcoming bunch of cats so as long as it's respectful we're good.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

What if it’s this guy?

He's clearly a Roberto Duran fan

 

[afrocentricity]

Please don’t disturb the virtue-signalling.

What's so different in what you and the others are doing? If one side is 'virtue signalling' for transgender then the other is 'virtue signalling' for cis women no? What a shite term anyway, virtue signalling, what's the opposite term? Being an overt cnut?

Awaiting clarification...

 

[Eboue]

Please don’t disturb the virtue-signalling.

You people really give yourself away whenever you say virtue signaling. You cant accept that other people might see things differently and have different opinions and instead of criticizing them / their opinions as good / bad you just assume that they are pretending to feel that way in order to get laid whereas yous are just up front about being completely devoid of kindness towards other people.

 

[Ødegaard]

Please don’t disturb the virtue-signalling.

Doubt it has anything to do with virtue signaling from her side.
And I wasn't asking a rhetorical question. I genuinely wonder how she thinks wearing clothes from other cultures reduces their cultures to just their clothes.

 

[shamans]

Oh my god

The problem with cultural appropriation isn’t that white people wear sombrero’s or kimonos now and then - it’s about the fact that other people’s culture are reduced to costumes that are ridiculed as if they are meaningless and unimportant. Also the people of said cultures, which often belong to those of a ethnic minority, are subject to racial and racial stereotyping at every level from individual incidents to systemic discrimination - when they remove their ‘costumes’ they can’t escspe such treatment against them.
Also, certain cultures and cultural traditions used to be the subject of ridicule when worn by a person from said culture, but a white person doing the same invites praise and compliments. This creates an environment of discontent, understandably.

There’s a difference between cultural appropriation and cultural appreciation. Conflating the two is asinine and only shows a lack of nuance and understanding on the issue.

Also on the topic of transgender people, it never fails to amaze me just how many people have a problem with something that simply doesn’t involve or affect their lives in anyway.
People are trans, it’s not a big deal.

Finally, people have always been offended, you just didn’t have access to their opinions or perspective

Sorry but that part is what annoys me the most.

I don't really have a strong take on transexuality but having a say on what is and isn't considered normal in society does affect our lives. If I'm to bring a child to this world, I don't want them growing up in a nudist society for instance.

I couldn't care less what people's takes are on issues but the one thing that pisses me the most is when it's all "it doesn't affect you in any way!" of course it does. Society is a collective effort.

 

[Adebesi]

Im not having any more kids until this issue is resolved, goddamit.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

If I'm to bring a child to this world, I don't want them growing up in a nudist society for instance.

Why? Are you ashamed of your body?

 

[Eboue]

I just want my kids back.

 

[shamans]

Being trans is a disorder. No one should be mean to trans people or ridicule them but it's a mental disorder and should be treated as such.

@villain , I know you mean well when you are defending trans people but what you're doing is incredibly dangerous and feeding off of some lost/confused trans people off social media. This stance you have does not help trans people at all.

What they need is proper medical attention from a young age and scientific help to deal with their mental issues. Read about older transexuals who have gone through full transformations. None of them are happy. This is a body dysmorphia issue and it's unfortunate people will shrug it off as "let people live how they do" -- sad almost.

 

[Adebesi]

Why? Are you ashamed of your body?

I totes am.

 

[shamans]

Why? Are you ashamed of your body?

Well yeah but what's it gotta do with this.

Point is we all want a certain society. Some of us want a liberal one, some want a conservative one. You can't just say "doesn't affect you bro, I'm gonna walk with my cock sticking out of my speedos"

 

[Adebesi]

Quick question, would sombreros be allowed in a nudist society?

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

Well yeah but what's it gotta do with this.

Point is we all want a certain society. Some of us want a liberal one, some want a conservative one. You can't just say "doesn't affect you bro, I'm gonna walk with my cock sticking out of my speedos"

Well, yeah but if it was a nudist society then there'd be an unspoken, collective agreement that we all go about nude and no one would have to be ashamed of their bodies. It would be good for you, you need to love yourself first and foremost.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

Quick question, would sombreros be allowed in a nudist society?

As long as they weren't used to cover up your junk I'd be fine with it.

 

[Eboue]

Wearing a barrel with suspenders and a straw hat is a disorder. No one should be mean to them or harass them but it is a mental disorder and should be treated at such.

 

[Adebesi]

I find the conflation of nudists with people wearing speedos with their cock poking out rather offensive TBH.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

I find the conflation of nudists with people wearing speedos with their cock poking out rather offensive TBH.

Nudists don't wear speedos. They go nude.

 

[afrocentricity]

Tbh, I'm down for a nude society. Rush hour public transport though.... (shudders)

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

Tbh, I'm down for a nude society. Rush hour public transport though.... (shudders)

I'm not so sure. I'd be very wary of using any chair in a meeting room. Also, I live in Canada. Nude winters would not be fun.

 

[Eboue]

putting a monster energy drink bumper sticker on your chevy impala is only allowed if you're from a certain part of michigan. #myculturenotyourcostume

 

[afrocentricity]

What about boner etiquette? Do we all just pretend we don't see it?

#idontseeboners

 

[villain]

Are they?

Of course, hence why they’re sold in costume shops.

This is why I said there’s a difference between cultural appropriation and cultural appreciation. With appreciation you take the time to engage with the culture and are provided articles of clothing and attire by people from said culture. With appropriation you are usually buying clothes & accessories that rely on stereotypes to achieve the comical effect, e.g. a Mexican costume isn’t just a sombrero but it will come with a moustache and a poncho too.

Sorry but that part is what annoys me the most.

I don't really have a strong take on transexuality but having a say on what is and isn't considered normal in society does affect our lives. If I'm to bring a child to this world, I don't want them growing up in a nudist society for instance.

I couldn't care less what people's takes are on issues but the one thing that pisses me the most is when it's all "it doesn't affect you in any way!" of course it does. Society is a collective effort.

Growing up in a tolerant society that doesn’t judge people based on their sexuality or gender? You’re right, sounds terrible.

Just seen your post about them having a disorder and none of the older ones being happy, but you apparently don’t have a strong take on transexuality - we don’t need to engage further.

 

[shamans]

Growing up in a tolerant society that doesn’t judge people based on their sexuality or gender? You’re right, sounds terrible.

Just seen your post about them having a disorder and none of the older ones being happy, but you apparently don’t have a strong take on transexuality - we don’t need to engage further.

You can't even tolerate my opinion (that is to HELP trans people) and preach a tolerant society.

It's not about judging, but of course it's easy to share a few FB memes and bury your head in the sand and just claim "what anything does, has NO impact on you".

 

[Ødegaard]

Of course, hence why they’re sold in costume shops.

This is why I said there’s a difference between cultural appropriation and cultural appreciation. With appreciation you take the time to engage with the culture and are provided articles of clothing and attire by people from said culture. With appropriation you are usually buying clothes & accessories that rely on stereotypes to achieve the comical effect, e.g. a Mexican costume isn’t just a sombrero but it will come with a moustache and a poncho too.



Growing up in a tolerant society that doesn’t judge people based on their sexuality or gender? You’re right, sounds terrible.

Just seen your post about them having a disorder and none of the older ones being happy, but you apparently don’t have a strong take on transexuality - we don’t need to engage further.

I see. I think the kimono part makes me confused. I understand and agree with what you say around the others but I've never myself seen a kimono worn by anyone who aren't in love with it or the culture and treats it as a highly valued piece of clothing.

But then again, maybe you've seen kimonos in costume shops. We don't have costume shops where I am so I'm limited to what I've seen in pictures or read about.

 

[Eboue]

You can't even tolerate my opinion (that is to HELP trans people) and preach a tolerant society.

It's not about judging, but of course it's easy to share a few FB memes and bury your head in the sand and just claim "what anything does, has NO impact on you".

Your opinion sucks

 

[shamans]

Your opinion sucks

Communism isn't tolerant btw.