Has political correctness actually gone mad?

afrocentricity said:
Who gives a feck about an arbitrary line? Look at it case by case. Any time you want to wear an outfit that you aren't sure about, find out. Google is your friend. It's not that hard is it? Sorry to be blunt, but.... ;)
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The line isn't arbitrary though - it is a distinct line drawn by those who are offended by something. The real question can't be "will someone be offended by this", because in today's society, that answer is always going to be yes. The question is "is this acceptable" is really what is being asked.

The line I was speaking about would be more along the lines of - if I wore a Cowboy costume to a party of 500 people and there was a rancher from Montana there who was offended because he thought I was making fun of the way he dresses - is my costume automatically "offensive or unacceptable?" The line I am speaking about is, how do we distinguish levels of "being offended" without creating further offense? The line I am speaking about is, is one persons offense more legitimate than another persons offense? Surely you can see how this may be confusing to the average person.
 
bpet15 said:
The line isn't arbitrary though - it is a distinct line drawn by those who are offended by something. The real question can't be "will someone be offended by this", because in today's society, that answer is always going to be yes. The question is "is this acceptable" is really what is being asked.

The line I was speaking about would be more along the lines of - if I wore a Cowboy costume to a party of 500 people and there was a rancher from Montana there who was offended because he thought I was making fun of the way he dresses - is my costume automatically "offensive or unacceptable?" The line I am speaking about is, how do we distinguish levels of "being offended" without creating further offense? The line I am speaking about is, is one persons offense more legitimate than another persons offense? Surely you can see how this may be confusing to the average person.
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I've gotten this far without causing unwarranted offense, and I haven't been trying particularly hard... So it works for me. If you want to take a different route go for it...
 
Dwazza Gunnar Solskjær said:
Well, I'd like to know their reasons for wearing it but historically, we're a pretty welcoming bunch of cats so as long as it's respectful we're good.
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Which is great but it is something I've seen raised as an issue by indigenous people as most instances are for things like going in fancy dress as the Village People.

In any case my underlying point is that firmly deciding what others should or shouldn't mind is a bit problematic.
 
Carolina Red said:
What if it’s this guy?
Saul-Canelo-Alvarez1_original.jpg
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You can tell him not to ;)
 
shamans said:
You can't even tolerate my opinion (that is to HELP trans people) and preach a tolerant society.

It's not about judging, but of course it's easy to share a few FB memes and bury your head in the sand and just claim "what anything does, has NO impact on you".
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Where didn’t I tolerate your opinion?
I’m just not wasting my time arguing about it - that is tolerance, look up the definition.

Ødegaard said:
I see. I think the kimono part makes me confused. I understand and agree with what you say around the others but I've never myself seen a kimono worn by anyone who aren't in love with it or the culture and treats it as a highly valued piece of clothing.

But then again, maybe you've seen kimonos in costume shops. We don't have costume shops where I am so I'm limited to what I've seen in pictures or read about.
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Kimono are less common in costume shops, but I think the principle still applies - most kimono costumes I see are made to make the wearer look sexier because instead of it being a formal, robe-like attire - the hem will finish above the knee like a short skirt, for example.
But Kimonos are quite commonly worn for any formal occasion, similar to wearing a suit to a wedding, so for that reason it’s much more understandable like you said for a lot of people to wear it because they value and appreciate the culture.

Pogue Mahone said:
I'm still at a bit of a loss as to why wearing stereotypical costumes that represent certain countries/cultures is in any way offensive?

This sort of thing.

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What's the problem here? Why should people from the countries these costumes represent feel offended if they see someone wearing them as fancy dress?
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You’re focusing on one aspect about cultural appropriation - wearing the costume - I outlined 3 different reasons why it’s offensive and that the offence caused isn’t simply because white people wear a costume every now and then. There’s more reasons too.

Also you’ve picked 3 western costumes including one of a character that doesn’t exist - was this intentional or by coincidence?
 
shamans said:
Being trans is a disorder. No one should be mean to trans people or ridicule them but it's a mental disorder and should be treated as such.
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Don't chat shit about things you obviously know nothing about.

Being trans isn't considered a mental disorder, and shouldn't be treated as such. Treating them like they're mentally ill is literally the same as being mean to them, ffs.

"Don't be mean to trans people, they're mentally ill and need treatment". How shitty of a person do you have to be to consider that being nice?
 
Halftrack said:
Don't chat shit about things you obviously know nothing about.

Being trans isn't considered a mental disorder, and shouldn't be treated as such. Treating them like they're mentally ill is literally the same as being mean to them, ffs.

"Don't be mean to trans people, they're mentally ill and need treatment". How shitty of a person do you have to be to consider that being nice?
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So telling a depressed person to get therapy is also being mean then?

Its a form of body dysmorphia.
 
shamans said:
Being trans is a disorder. No one should be mean to trans people or ridicule them but it's a mental disorder and should be treated as such.
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shamans said:
So telling a depressed person to get therapy is also being mean then?

Its a form of body dysmorphia.
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What are you using to justify that opinion, Jordan Peterson/Ben Shaprio?
 
shamans said:
So telling a depressed person to get therapy is also being mean then?
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Telling a person to seek out the appropriate kind of help for what they're struggling with isn't mean. Telling a trans person that they mentally ill is, because they're not.
Its a form of body dysmorphia.
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What? No it isn't, where the feck did you get that from? People with body dysmorphic disorder generally see flaws in their appearance that don't exist, or that no one else would consider flaws. They put on a couple of pounds and they think they're fat, they have a tiny mole that to them looks like a grotesque tumour. Trying to fix these flaws (through surgery, for example) very rarely has any real effect, or the effect is temporary. Because it's a mental disorder.

Gender dysphoria (that many, but not all, trans people suffer from) is almost the exact opposite in many ways. It's being acutely and accurately aware of how you look and how you are perceived, and the stress and anguish this causes you. And, as opposed to BDD, GD can be successfully treated physically, through hormone treatments and possibly surgery. Because it isn't a mental disorder.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
I'm still at a bit of a loss as to why wearing stereotypical costumes that represent certain countries/cultures is in any way offensive?

This sort of thing.

13594537

10_21527200000.jpg

69038

What's the problem here? Why should people from the countries these costumes represent feel offended if they see someone wearing them as fancy dress?
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Yeah it's things like this that I find pretty tragic. This is the point when people choose to be offended - it can't simply be that they don't recognise they can choose not to (and in this case, almost effortlessly). It's incredible how much energy is devoted to that by my generation. I'm sure a lot of it's environmental but I'm just hoping the generation after us skip that fad altogether.
 
Carolina Red said:
I’ll be honest, the only reason I brought him up is because folks were comparing “white people wearing sombreros” vs. “Mexicans wearing sombreros”.

You can be both.
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I'll be honest, too. When I was typing out charros I was thinking of churros and Charo.
 
Wibble said:
Which is great but it is something I've seen raised as an issue by indigenous people as most instances are for things like going in fancy dress as the Village People.

In any case my underlying point is that firmly deciding what others should or shouldn't mind is a bit problematic.
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That's a tricky one, because that dude was apparently half Lakota Sioux and very entitled to wear such a costume. If you're dressing up as him, that's part of who he is.
 
Wibble said:
I'm really thinking of drunk white blokes going to frat partys as one of the village people.
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This brings to mind our Dukes of Hazzard themed frat party from when I was in school. The show is about some moonshiners in 1970s rural Georgia.

Can white people be offended when drunk non-white people come to the Dukes of Hazzard party dressed as rednecks?
 
Zarlak said:
So out of interest what is leading you to your opinion?
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I've read and seen a fair bit about transgenders who are encouraged to get surgeries and change their genders and in the end they say theyre still not happy and its not worth all the money and effort.

In many cases I feel non trans people tell them "yeah its ok be who you are" and go on about their daily lives but they dont realize what the trans person us gonna go through everday

Listen if my son told me hes trans first thing Id do is send him to a psychologist. Not because Id want him to "fix" him back to normsl but becsuse its s situation that needs mental help due to nature of it in our current world. The idea that putting on a wig will fix all problems of trans aint true. Theres not enough awarness regarding mental help needed for trans people.
 
shamans said:
I've read and seen a fair bit about transgenders who are encouraged to get surgeries and change their genders and in the end they say theyre still not happy and its not worth all the money and effort.

In many cases I feel non trans people tell them "yeah its ok be who you are" and go on about their daily lives but they dont realize what the trans person us gonna go through everday

Listen if my son told me hes trans first thing Id do is send him to a psychologist. Not because Id want him to "fix" him back to normsl but becsuse its s situation that needs mental help due to nature of it in our current world. The idea that putting on a wig will fix all problems of trans aint true. Theres not enough awarness regarding mental help needed for trans people.
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A lot of their psychological afflictions would go away in a society that didn't treat them as unnatural freaks or mentally ill people. Their struggles mostly stem from the whole being born in the wrong body thing, and tend to go away when they get to live and be treated as their preferred gender. That's not to say that they shouldn't be talking to professionals, but they should be talking to professionals who can actually help them. They don't need mental help (any more than a depressed person needs it, at any rate), they need understanding and acknowledgement.

As for regrets, this is from the 2015 US Transgender Survey:
"Respondents were asked whether they had ever 'de-transitioned', which was defined as having 'gone back to living as [their] sex assigned at birth, at least for a while.' Eight percent (8%) of respondents reported having de-transitioned at some point. Most of those who de-transitioned did so only temporarily: 62% of those who had de-transitioned reported that they were currently living full time in a gender different than the gender they were thought to be at birth.

Transgender women were more likely to report having de-transitioned (11%), in contrast to transgender men (4%). Rates of de-transitioning also differed by race and ethnicity, with American Indian (14%), Asian (10%), and multiracial (10%) respondents reporting the highest levels of de-transitioning (Figure 7.28).

Respondents who had de-transitioned cited a range of reasons, though only 5% of those who had de-transitioned reported that they had done so because they realized that gender transition was not for them, representing 0.4% of the overall sample. The most common reason cited for de-transitioning was pressure from a parent (36%). Twenty-six percent (26%) reported that they de-transitioned due to pressure from other family members, and 18% reported that they de-transitioned because of pressure from their spouse or partner. Other common reasons included facing too much harassment or discrimination after they began transitioning (31%), and having trouble getting a job (29%) (Table 7.6)."
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As you can see, actually regretting transitioning is fairly uncommon, and of those who de-transition, the vast majority do it because people around them are intolerant dicks.

If we're talking about regretting the surgeries without regretting transitioning, then yeah, some do. For the same reason a lot of people might end up regretting plastic surgery; they didn't actually need it to be comfortable with themselves, the results look bad, reduced function...
 
shamans said:
I've read and seen a fair bit about transgenders who are encouraged to get surgeries and change their genders and in the end they say theyre still not happy and its not worth all the money and effort.

In many cases I feel non trans people tell them "yeah its ok be who you are" and go on about their daily lives but they dont realize what the trans person us gonna go through everday

Listen if my son told me hes trans first thing Id do is send him to a psychologist. Not because Id want him to "fix" him back to normsl but becsuse its s situation that needs mental help due to nature of it in our current world. The idea that putting on a wig will fix all problems of trans aint true. Theres not enough awarness regarding mental help needed for trans people.
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And that's enough for you to form your opinion? Do you have any idea what % that is of those who still feel unhappy? What about all the transgender people who change their gender and are absolutely over the moon, feel completely normal for the first time in their lives and live the rest of their lives in a happy manner?

A few people having fecking buyers remorse doesn't mean you have a mental disorder ffs. You're going to need some actual evidence for that.
 
https://www.thepublicdiscourse.com/2017/04/19080/

Interesting article by a man who went through the change, then spent 8 years as a woman before going back to being a man. He makes some really good points. I agree with @shamans in that people should have some sort of mental assessment before going ahead with such a dramatic, life-changing procedure. The W.H.O might have determined that transgenderism itself is not a mental illness, but that's not to say that some people who opt for gender reassignment might be suffering from a mental condition that might be affecting their state of mind.
 
redman5 said:
https://www.thepublicdiscourse.com/2017/04/19080/

Interesting article by a man who went through the change, then spent 8 years as a woman before going back to being a man. He makes some really good points. I agree with @shamans in that people should have some sort of mental assessment before going ahead with such a dramatic, life-changing procedure. The W.H.O might have determined that transgenderism itself is not a mental illness, but that's not to say that some people who opt for gender reassignment might be suffering from a mental condition that might be affecting their state of mind.
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I though this was the case in the UK?
 
shamans said:
I've read and seen a fair bit about transgenders who are encouraged to get surgeries and change their genders and in the end they say theyre still not happy and its not worth all the money and effort.

In many cases I feel non trans people tell them "yeah its ok be who you are" and go on about their daily lives but they dont realize what the trans person us gonna go through everday

Listen if my son told me hes trans first thing Id do is send him to a psychologist. Not because Id want him to "fix" him back to normsl but becsuse its s situation that needs mental help due to nature of it in our current world. The idea that putting on a wig will fix all problems of trans aint true. Theres not enough awarness regarding mental help needed for trans people.
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This is top notch, grade A, hey I am just playing the devil's advocate, don't shoot the messenger, I am just saying like it is...BS right here.
 
Some individuals just want to show their true collors in this world. They dont want to hide who they really are anymore. But also they expect to be seen as respectable and sane members of the society. However in this case you can't have both things.

At least if they were sophisticated, but as you would expect we are talking about the worse specimens at every country. I find particularly funny how they are predictable. I remember a "human being" named David Irving, a British "historian"/holocaust denier. He once said that his daughter would never have anything to do with apes and blacks because she was an arian baby. Also he claimed this is not racism and those accusing him are driven by the pc culture.
 
Utah Makes Rightwing Conservatives a Protected Class in New Hate Crime Law
https://hillreporter.com/utah-makes...a-protected-class-in-new-hate-crime-law-27541

African-Americans, Native Americans, women, LGBT, conservatives.

Say a prayer for the liberal white man.
State Representative, Karianne Lisonbee (R), spearheaded the addition of conservatives to the hate crime law. She said of her experiences:

“I have had hateful things said about me. I have experienced death threats over the last few days. I have had people tell me, ‘How dare you play the victim card.’ And I ask you, is not having somebody threaten you making you a victim?”

Many of the threats against Lisonbee came after she ferociously fought against a bill that would have banned conversion therapy in the state. She has a history of making comments that point to her supporting the practice.

Representative Angela Romero (D) countered Lisonbee, “Many of us have received threats and people have condemned us for issues that we believe in, but it’s very very different than because of who you are as a person.”

The bill, though, easily passed.
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berbatrick said:
Utah Makes Rightwing Conservatives a Protected Class in New Hate Crime Law
https://hillreporter.com/utah-makes...a-protected-class-in-new-hate-crime-law-27541

African-Americans, Native Americans, women, LGBT, conservatives.

Say a prayer for the liberal white man.
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Haha, where can I donate. People who are regularly discriminated against have a right to protection under the law but being an ignorant dick, or conservative, since this is a PC thread, is not one of them. They are basically looking for people who call them out over their stupid or bigoted opinion to be prosecuted. fecking snowflakes, more balls on my hippy mother in law then any of these assholes.
Well to them I say this, I think conservatism is a mental illness and I think it should be treated the way most Americans with a mental illness are treated, in the county jail.
 
Will Florida legislators make it easier to ban books in schools? We’ll soon find out.

Members of the conservative Florida Citizens Alliance have been appalled with what they’ve seen in the books being handed to students in the public schools.

“Pornographic” scenes in novels. Religious “indoctrination” boosting Islam over others in the social studies books. “Unbalanced propaganda” promoting climate change in science texts.

The group wants to ban much of what it finds objectionable, eliminating titles like Kate Chopin’s The Awakening, Toni Morrison’s The Bluest Eye, Anthony Burgess’ A Clockwork Orange and Frank McCourt’s Angela’s Ashes to textbooks, including Harcourt Publishing’s Modern World History 9th Gradeand Pearson’s Essentials of Oceanography.

With the ear of Gov. Ron DeSantis and several state lawmakers, it’s angling to get that wish codified into law.

“We have documented almost 100 textbooks and novels that violate [Florida] statutes,” said Florida Citizens Alliance managing director Keith Flaugh, who sat on a DeSantis education advisory committee. “What we’re trying to do is get Florida school districts to follow Florida statute.”
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https://www.tampabay.com/blogs/grad...s-in-schools-well-soon-find-out/?template=amp
 
Just noticed at work (accountants) our software provider has removed the mr/mrs/miss etc from the cover page of the accounts
 
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