he he heEnough of the Tevez-Torres discussion in the Hargreaves thread. There are other threads for that or start another Torres vs Tevez thread
Hargreaves vs. Carrick, Feadingseagulls vs. Noodle, Chief (Bayern Fan!) vs. Logic
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So Carrick > Hargreaves.
Just to get things rolling again.
Just to get things rolling again.
Grow up. You're worse than a spoilt toddler.
I'm not the one always asking for more money to be spent. Understand football before you talk about it. It's absolutely stupid to expect us to spend even more money than we did in the summer when we usually spend less money.
Hargreaves, 3rd CB. Just awful. Didn't make himself available for a pass, don't know how to pass, a liability.
Uhm. What?
Hargreaves=useless fecker.
Another chance to whore my crappy MS paint skills...
tbf, I thouoght Scholes was worse than Hargreaves yesterday, and that was quite a shock considering how well the Ginger Prince played last week at Fulham alongside Hargreaves.
The Rossi bit is top class haha
Like it matters. No one else is. & Unlike you they are not the ones swearing every summer the we have nothing to spend. Looking like right clueless fools after wards when United proves otherwise. On top of inventing lies that others want United to spend 84 million and sign Messi.
And for the record, selling Saha and bringing some one in isn't spending more money. It's called replacing a dead weight.
This coming from the person who swore we had little to spend last summer. That Torres is the same player as Rooney Oh the ironyWhat is stupid is for you to constantly claim we have no money to spend or that we can't spend more. When last summer proved you beyond wrong. This January even we brought in Possebon and Manucho. We have the money to spend. The Glazer's have said that repeatedly. We've just chosen how to spend it. Pure and simple.
Besides, it's not just about spending more money. It about doing the right thing. You don't sell Smith and Rossi, have Ole retire and have an injury prone Saha as your only other forward when you add a Tevez. That's dumb. That's going from 5 forwards to 2. Especially when you've decide to not give a chance to youngsters like Campbell, Welbeck or Dong to cover for Saha's constant injuries.
Ignore him. He is a moron
Another chance to whore my crappy MS paint skills...
Like it matters. No one else is. & Unlike you they are not the ones swearing every summer the we have nothing to spend. Looking like right clueless fools after wards when United proves otherwise. On top of inventing lies that others want United to spend 84 million and sign Messi.
And for the record, selling Saha and bringing some one in isn't spending more money. It's called replacing a dead weight.
Where do I swear we have no money to spend each summer?
We spent £54 million. Which is your problem - despite spending so much money, you being the "chief muppet" alway want to spend more so we can have a team that looks like your football manager team.Selling Saha? Letting him go for free isn't selling him, which is what you have suggested.
Yes £54 million is peanuts. How could we possibly win anything this season with such little transfer activity? We only signed 4 players.
Oh I see. The £54 million we spent last summer was nothing, but the 3 million or so we spent on Manucho and Possebon prove we are swimming in an ocean of cashflow.
Did you really just say that?
SAF obviously felt the priority was Owen Hargreaves and the kids we had been scouting. You're right, it was incredibly naive to rely on Saha and just 2 other strikers so don't you think if SAF had £26 million to spare he'd have signed another forward? If not Torres, then someone?
Where do I swear we have no money to spend each summer?
Selling Saha? Letting him go for free isn't selling him, which is what you have suggested.
Yes £54 million is peanuts. How could we possibly win anything this season with such little transfer activity? We only signed 4 players.
Oh I see. The £54 million we spent last summer was nothing, but the 3 million or so we spent on Manucho and Possebon prove we are swimming in an ocean of cashflow.
Did you really just say that?
SAF obviously felt the priority was Owen Hargreaves and the kids we had been scouting. You're right, it was incredibly naive to rely on Saha and just 2 other strikers so don't you think if SAF had £26 million to spare he'd have signed another forward? If not Torres, then someone?
This will happen this summer
Where do I swear we have no money to spend each summer?
You are a joke. You are the only one who has problems with what United does or does not spend! In the summer you day and night told us how we couldn't spend this to that. You were proved wrong but it still hasn't stopped you! Now you want to turn around and claim I have a problem with hwo United spends it's money? Worse still you want to equate my desire for us to have the same number of squad players we had last season as a desire to have a " football manger team" because you are too stupid to realise last season we had Rossi, Ole, Smith, Saha and Rooney on our books as strikers an we have only Tez, Rooney and basla wood Louis. According to the great sage you are wanting us to have that corrected is "wanting to spend 84 million"
No. That's not what I suggested you pathetic excuse for a human. I have never at one point said that during this season Saha should be let go on a free. But you're so busy being a feck witted liar that it keeps escaping you.
Congratulations, you've spoken like a person who fully deserved his tagline. The only one who said we had no money to spend in the summer was you. You were proved wrong. Yet your still claiming the same bollocks. No one has said 54 million is peanuts. Neither has anyone said United lacks the momney to spend. Lastly unlike you some people don't see why we should spend every summer when if we wanted we could finish our spending for the next 5 years in one swoop.
Oh you you don't see anything.
You are blinder than a bat! You are the one who said we had little money to spend in the summer. We spent 54 million. You = wrong! You said we had zilch to spend after that. In January, we spent 3 million. You = Still wrong!
Instead of admitting you are wrong you are just here acting like a right buffoon and now claiming others want us to over spend. When United has showed they already have cash to spend, but are just choosing when and where to spend it. Hence the only clueless one around is you.
People Like me know Manchester United has the money to spend. However they've only just chosen to hold it back for expensive fellows like Benzema next summer, due to long term plans, not due to a lack of money. Which unfortunately has put our current future in a bit of jeopardy. That has nothing to do with wanting us to spend 84 Million or thinking 54 million was peanuts like the fool called you suggests.
Who did you think posted it. Your momma?Did you really just say that?
No. Because he said he wasn't as interested in chasing Torres again after being turned down 2 time. That's the only reason he didn't go for him. While his other target Berbatov was too over priced. So he chose to wait, sticking to long term goals rather than the immediate ones. Which wasn't because of lack a of money. That is why even in January he was making long term recruits like Rodrigo and Manucho while tracking a fellow like Benzema with interest. While holding on you balsa wood Louis. All part of sorting out long term goals.
Else he could have signed cheaper men like Suazo, Saviola or Anelka in the summer to cover for the departure of Rossi, Smith and Ole's retirement. Because any of them would have cost the combined fee we got from the sell of Rossi and Smith
When wes Brown goes away in the summer for his 65 to 70K salary, and if GN fails to come back, Owen Hargreaves should be a good choice for the RB position.
He is fast and can tackle well.
Actually Ferguson made a tactical error in substituting him. He would have stopped their attack which cost United the game. Even though Scholes is one of my favorite player, I must say that he did not played well at all yesterday. He cannot adapt to the rough and fast tactics of Portsmouth. The early booking and his slowing down due to age, added to his poor performance.
He is fast and can tackle well.
Actually Ferguson made a tactical error in substituting him. He would have stopped their attack which cost United the game. Even though Scholes is one of my favorite player, I must say that he did not played well at all yesterday. He cannot adapt to the rough and fast tactics of Portsmouth. The early booking and his slowing down due to age, added to his poor performance.
The point was we played one midfielder who could pass the ball forward. Scholes was also required to do his fair share of covering. Perhaps he can't do both anymore - at least not consistently throughout a game. If we had played Carrick from the start we may just been able to hit them a bit quicker - always difficult against a massed defence. We were only hit on the break once we were throwing everyone forward in an effort to win the game particularly in the second half.
All Hargreaves did yesterday was hustle in a non productive way, he did not win the ball, he did not force errors amd he did not make one worthwhile pass all game and some think he was good or ok. Most of the Portsmouth team did exactly that, created virtually nothing but got a result, for me that is not the standard required of a United player.
Scholes has been described as the worse of the two by many and he certainly was not good but all he got from his partner is short uninventive passes with little or no movement to give him options, directly Carrick came on we saw the difference straight away as much more pressure was applied, an increase in the speed of our attacks and better movement. Carrick should have probably scored but he got himself in that position, would Hargreaves? on yesterdays performance not in a million years! ......... yes they got lucky with a hopeful punt from James and cock-ups by Anderson and Rooney but as a team we created a lot more when Hargreaves was subbed.
Another bad performance by Moose yesterday.
To say that the Stretford End were uninspired by his 'performance' is an understatement.
To say that the Stretford End were uninspired by his 'performance' is an understatement.
Ah, but can he cross ? Hopefully Simpson will be the answer. If not we'll have to buy.
Like some on here I've been watching United for way too long, and like some on here can recall some of dark days of the 1970's. Yes, it was fun being around then, but footballing wise it wasn't the greatest. We ended that decade with Sexton's tedious football, which did earn us 2nd place, but it was tough watching United. Then came Big Ron, a caviller style of play and a attitude.
Whilst I may not be Robson's greatest fan, he was one of the best around at the time, and he was United's. Even when he was out injured we had Big Norm to patrol the midfield. With years and injuries catching up with Robson the fear of who to replace him with was tempered with the arrival of Ince and his subsequent form. Add to that Roy Keane, and for near enough 25 years United had one of the top central midfielders in the world playing for them.
25 years is a long time, and football has changed. However, what right have United of finding another in the mould of Robson, Ince or Keane? Owen Hargreaves is a great player a world class player, but just because he's being asked to follow in the role of the previous 3, and play with the 4th world class midfielder by the name of Scholes, the expectations are a bit unfair. Hargreaves is more a modern defensive midfielder, he patrols in front of the defence whilst prompting those around him to supply the goals. Carrick took some stick for being square and negative in the middle of last year, but now he's seen as our saviour.
It's time to look at Hargreaves as Hargreaves and not a Keane or Ince or Robson for that matter. He is a player who plays differently to those and yesterday he was great. I only recall about 2 bad passes, 1 missed tackle. Defending isn't all about tackling, in fact a good defender shouldn't need to tackle, Harry the opposition into making a bad pass or mistake and win possession back that way. Keep the ball away from your own penalty area and you'll lessen the chance of them scoring, defending can be very easy. Hargreaves does that well, but some on here fail to see that and want an all action midfielder in the mould of Keane. Well that's all well and good, but when the next Roy Keane comes along let's buy him, as he isn't around yet.
Whilst I may not be Robson's greatest fan, he was one of the best around at the time, and he was United's. Even when he was out injured we had Big Norm to patrol the midfield. With years and injuries catching up with Robson the fear of who to replace him with was tempered with the arrival of Ince and his subsequent form. Add to that Roy Keane, and for near enough 25 years United had one of the top central midfielders in the world playing for them.
25 years is a long time, and football has changed. However, what right have United of finding another in the mould of Robson, Ince or Keane? Owen Hargreaves is a great player a world class player, but just because he's being asked to follow in the role of the previous 3, and play with the 4th world class midfielder by the name of Scholes, the expectations are a bit unfair. Hargreaves is more a modern defensive midfielder, he patrols in front of the defence whilst prompting those around him to supply the goals. Carrick took some stick for being square and negative in the middle of last year, but now he's seen as our saviour.
It's time to look at Hargreaves as Hargreaves and not a Keane or Ince or Robson for that matter. He is a player who plays differently to those and yesterday he was great. I only recall about 2 bad passes, 1 missed tackle. Defending isn't all about tackling, in fact a good defender shouldn't need to tackle, Harry the opposition into making a bad pass or mistake and win possession back that way. Keep the ball away from your own penalty area and you'll lessen the chance of them scoring, defending can be very easy. Hargreaves does that well, but some on here fail to see that and want an all action midfielder in the mould of Keane. Well that's all well and good, but when the next Roy Keane comes along let's buy him, as he isn't around yet.
He's not a world class player though.
To be fair to Hargreaves and his time at United, he's not had a consistent run in the team has he? It's only when, like Ronaldo has over the last year or so, shown week in week out how good he is we can say he's truly world class or not. My own opinion for what it's worth is he's on the cusp of being a world class defensive midfielder, I've seen enough of his performances for England and Bayern to know he's got it, just that we've not seen that at United yet.
Top post. Those who actually understand football would realize what Hargreaves brings to the team.
So far he has brought nothing to the team at all in fact imo we have played worse with him than without ............... that is not saying in the future he might not be improtant but so far I can see nothing and looking at our seasons results that opinion seems to be correct
That is the stupidest thing ever written by anyone, anywhere.
We spent all our transfer money on Hargreaves, Nani and Anderson. The Tevez deal was a much cheaper option for the two year loan meaning we can spread the money required around. We couldn't afford Torres if we had wanted him and still have signed the other three.
We dominated Liverpool at Anfield and won the game this season compared to playing like Pompey and robbing them last season. We got a point at the Emirates whereas we got spanked home and away by Arsenal last time. We dominated Lyon at their ground where they had no clear chance but conceded from a brilliant bit of skill. We were being run over by Lyon at OT in the second half and looked like conceding any minute. It was not his fault that we lost yesterday considering that Scholes went missing and we still dominated Pompey with 1 midfielder. It wasnt his fault that we missed a penalty against Westham and conceded from set pieces.
In the earlier loses against City or Bolton, the whole team was shite, we missed Rooney, Ronaldo or both and the midfield also included Scholes and Carrick who did feck all too. SAF had no choice but to play anyone who was available in the first few games with Rooney injured, Ronaldo suspended and Anderson not fit.
Scholes has had a far worser season than Hargreaves and SAF keeps rotating the midfield pairings and formation which doesnt help anyone. Anderson-Hargreaves has been our best midfield in terms of results.
I originally thought that Hargreaves was a quality signing who'd prove his worth to us massively. The more I see him, though, the less hopeful I get.
He's fookin' shite.
He's fookin' shite.
Brilliant Erics Collar.
We dominated Liverpool at Anfield and won the game this season compared to playing like Pompey and robbing them last season. We got a point at the Emirates whereas we got spanked home and away by Arsenal last time. We dominated Lyon at their ground where they had no clear chance but conceded from a brilliant bit of skill. We were being run over by Lyon at OT in the second half. It was not his fault that we lost yesterday considering that Scholes went missing and we still dominated Pompey with 1 midfielder. It wasnt his fault that we missed a penalty against Westham and conceded from set pieces.
In the earlier loses against City or Bolton, the whole team was shite, we missed Rooney, Ronaldo or both and the midfield also included Scholes and Carrick who did feck all too. SAF had no choice but to play anyone who was available in the first few games with Rooney injured, Ronaldo suspended and Anderson not fit.
Scholes has had a far worser season than Hargreaves and SAF keeps rotating the midfield pairings and formation. Anderson-Hargreaves has been our best midfield in terms of results.
nah. Rubbish that, Scholes contributes to our all round play much better than 'argreaves
We dominated Liverpool at Anfield and won the game this season compared to playing like Pompey and robbing them last season. We got a point at the Emirates whereas we got spanked home and away by Arsenal last time. We dominated Lyon at their ground where they had no clear chance but conceded from a brilliant bit of skill. We were being run over by Lyon at OT in the second half and looked like conceding any minute. It was not his fault that we lost yesterday considering that Scholes went missing and we still dominated Pompey with 1 midfielder. It wasnt his fault that we missed a penalty against Westham and conceded from set pieces.
In the earlier loses against City or Bolton, the whole team was shite, we missed Rooney, Ronaldo or both and the midfield also included Scholes and Carrick who did feck all too. SAF had no choice but to play anyone who was available in the first few games with Rooney injured, Ronaldo suspended and Anderson not fit.
Scholes has had a far worser season than Hargreaves and SAF keeps rotating the midfield pairings and formation which doesnt help anyone. Anderson-Hargreaves has been our best midfield in terms of results.
What complete nonsense. Our two wins at Anfield were very similair. Both games we set up to hit them on the counter attack and scored with the only real opportunity we had in both games. Both coming from set pieces. The difference being this year that Liverpool were even more inept than usual.
As for the Arsenal games. Yes they played us off the park at Old Trafford but we dominated the game at the Emirates before they hit us with two late goals 'Pompey style' as you would say.
We dominated Liverpool at Anfield and won the game this season compared to playing like Pompey and robbing them last season. We got a point at the Emirates whereas we got spanked home and away by Arsenal last time. We dominated Lyon at their ground where they had no clear chance but conceded from a brilliant bit of skill. We were being run over by Lyon at OT in the second half and looked like conceding any minute. It was not his fault that we lost yesterday considering that Scholes went missing and we still dominated Pompey with 1 midfielder. It wasnt his fault that we missed a penalty against Westham and conceded from set pieces.
In the earlier loses against City or Bolton, the whole team was shite, we missed Rooney, Ronaldo or both and the midfield also included Scholes and Carrick who did feck all too. SAF had no choice but to play anyone who was available in the first few games with Rooney injured, Ronaldo suspended and Anderson not fit.
Scholes has had a far worser season than Hargreaves and SAF keeps rotating the midfield pairings and formation which doesnt help anyone. Anderson-Hargreaves has been our best midfield in terms of results.
They had one shot that hit the post and that was that.
To be fair both Nicky Butt and Phil Neville did that job effectively for us. And didn't cost £20m.
This is arguably the most ridiculous thing I've read on this thread. And I include the Chef's claim that Zidane won the UEFA Cup single-handedly with Bordeaux when I say that.
bramble > Zidane
We had lesser possession, lesser number of shots on goal, lesser number of corners and committed more fouls to keep Lyon at bay at our own ground compared to our away performance.
SAF suggested in the post match interview that it was a relief that we managed to hold on to a win.
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