The parallels between Labour's approach to austerity and Brexit are striking.
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The parallels between Labour's approach to austerity and Brexit are striking.
I really don't get how people don't think Laura Kuessenberg is partisan, her questions to T.May at her event were
- PM will you increase or lower taxes, queue Corbyn tax argument
- PM how hard will you work to gain Labour seats??
It's funny because I'm sure she used to be quite critical of Cameron no? Might just be Jezza she dislikes.I really don't get how people don't think Laura Kuessenberg is partisan, her questions to T.May at her event were
fecking biting journalism that that i dont know how May managed to come back from such scrutiny
- PM will you increase or lower taxes, queue Corbyn tax argument
- PM how hard will you work to gain Labour seats??
I don't get your point on taxes. This is a point that's already caused conflict with her government and the rightwing press and looks likely to do so again.I really don't get how people don't think Laura Kuessenberg is partisan, her questions to T.May at her event were
fecking biting journalism that that i dont know how May managed to come back from such scrutiny
- PM will you increase or lower taxes, queue Corbyn tax argument
- PM how hard will you work to gain Labour seats??
Is that Toryism?I love those kind of slip ups, like Corbyn's "strong message here"
No wonder they are trying to keep her locked away.
Preemptive nuclear strikes against tourists.
So the government seems to have ditched, or at least put on ice, a whole bunch of tax measures in Hammond's Budget.
http://www.tax.org.uk/media-centre/blog/media-and-politics/government-drop-majority-finance-bill
http://www.tax.org.uk/media-centre/blog/media-and-politics/government-drop-majority-finance-bill
@ TouristsShe's not wrong though. We'll certainly do that.
I really don't get how people don't think Laura Kuessenberg is partisan, her questions to T.May at her event were
fecking biting journalism that that i dont know how May managed to come back from such scrutiny
- PM will you increase or lower taxes, queue Corbyn tax argument
- PM how hard will you work to gain Labour seats??
The second is daft, but the first isnt. The Sun & The Mail both hammered May over the weekend for failing to rule out tax rises, which she still hasn't done, hence why Kuessenberg is raising it again.
I didn't know that to be fair but even then it was an easy question that May could easily talk away and criticise Labour. The clip they'll show later is her claiming Labour will double multiple taxes. She could have asked about the conflict specifically.
Earlier the BBC called Labours plans vague whilst praising the Tory outlook of being simple. Yeah because its easier to exclude rather than try and negotiate.
Labour's plans are vague. They are trying to appeal to both sides of their divided electorate on the key issue of Brexit. Saying that they are going to be friendly in negotiations doesn't in any way negate for the fact that their plan of remaining in the single market whilst ending FoM is impossible.
It is a pathetic policy frankly given the discourse on our relationship with the EU since the referendum.
You might not like the way in which the Tories go about their business on the matter or the content of their Brexit plans but the core terms are clear.
Are they? Thus far May's offered platitude after platitude (Red, White and Blue Brexit) without full clarity on what we'll be doing. The general idea of leaving the single market is there, but again we regularly see contradictions or disagreements from figures inside her own party, hence why she's quite insecure and feels the need to have an election.
But they don't have such a plan, Starmer explicitly called out that Labour will end freedom of movement and that this is incomplitable with single market membership or EEA membership. He said so repeatedly.
They said they weren't taking a reformed membership off the table. The goal is tarrif free access and alignment, they made the point of not ruling it a reformed membership to achieve this but they never said it was the aim.
The core points are that FoM ends and that parliament regains full sovereignty over all over aspects of British law which are the key things that Brexiteers want. In that regard they are clear which will prove to be clarity enough to win this election easily.
It sounds really vague when you put it like that
So Labour are basically on the fence again.
fecking idiots. People who hate the tories should really be angry at the opposition and their repeated failures rather than blaming all their woes elsewhere. I said it last election, and I'll say it again...I'm convinced Labour don't really want power again, I think they are quite happy to be the shadow party and all that comes with it.
No doubt the staunch supporters will tell me I'm wrong, and explain Corbyn and all the nonsense he comes out with, just like what happened with Milliband last time. Keep making the same mistakes over and over...
fecking idiots. People who hate the tories should really be angry at the opposition and their repeated failures rather than blaming all their woes elsewhere. I said it last election, and I'll say it again...I'm convinced Labour don't really want power again, I think they are quite happy to be the shadow party and all that comes with it.
No doubt the staunch supporters will tell me I'm wrong, and explain Corbyn and all the nonsense he comes out with, just like what happened with Milliband last time. Keep making the same mistakes over and over...
The core points are that FoM ends and that parliament regains full sovereignty over all over aspects of British law which are the key things that Brexiteers want. In that regard they are clear which will prove to be clarity enough to win this election easily.
It sounds really vague when you put it like that
Well your first point is also what Labour have promised so you cant say one vague and one isn't. The tories have ruled out a few things which Labour wont get anyway is how id sum it up.
Im convinced May will go with the easiest and quickest solution in the negotiations so it's no suprise she's ruled the most difficult aspect out.
I see Farron has come out the tail between his legs and finally said gay sex isn't a sin. Felt a bit sorry for him, he clearly wasn't comfortable saying such but then he shouldn't be in politics.
It's genuinely ridiculous that Labour hasn't been able to put together something that wins back voters like you.
You two are talking like Labour is some sort of cohesive party working together, it's completely the opposite. The fact that it's still together and the second highest polling party in country is something of miracle.
I like Corbyn, but Labour simply will not get the support of the centre with him in charge. It'll be interesting to see what happens after the election if the Tories increased their majority.
that's fantastic,
This should really be hammered by the opposition. Shows a leadership which is very indecisive and that basically the only thing they done which is not brexit, has ended in failure.
I mean I'm not really sure that the Labour party managing to poll second in the country is really any kind of achievement, let alone miraculous.
Center Left(If we are being kind) parties(Add this the US Democrats) have almost collapse in Europe, just look at the recent elections in France. It's clearly not some achievement that Labour are where they are today but no one should confused or surprised to see Labour in this position.
Labour are incredibly incohesive but if they do intend to remain as one party it should be their job to form a cohesive, well-oiled unit. As it stands, neither side have been able to even remotely compromise for the other. The centre undermined Corbyn from the moment he got on and then presented Owen Smith as the alternative, even though he didn't actually seem to disagree with Corbyn on policy, while the left of the party have damaged the party's chances at being elected by continuing with a leader who is deeply unpopular, who clearly isn't going to get in, and who's done a terrible job at opposing Brexit, failing to come up with a clear position.
If they're not going to split, and it currently looks like they won't, then both sides need to get over there differences and work together. As it stands they seem determined they won't separate...and yet continue to squabble with each other from within.
It seems to have weirdly flown under the radar tbh. Surely undermines Hammond though and to me he is the most credible minister.
The advantage Labour have over pretty much every other western democracy is the electoral system.
And even then you have a strange idea of "collapse". The Socialists in France plummeted in the presidential vote (because of a rampant centrist, it should be noted), but are still more than likely going to finish second in the national assembly elections in June. The SPD in Germany are comfortably second. The PD in Italy are governing, though just about second now in the opinion polls to populists. Scandinavian centre left parties are all first in the polls, even if their overall coalition isn't. In Spain they're still just above Podemos, with centrists also on the rise. They're in the lead in Portugal.
They've collapsed in Greece and the Netherlands. Let's not oversell that to the entirety of Europe just because we don't want to say Corbyn is once in a generation bad.
Didn't the rampant centrist run as a independent ? Also how big is your centre left net, Marcon does not have the same politics as someone like Antonio Costa, Costa formed alliances with the Communist party. Both can't be claimed as a victory for the centre left. I mean feck George Osborne was congratulating Macron for his win, although so did David Milband which pretty much tells us all we need to know.
As for the rest of Europe. In the 2015 Polish elections the centre left won zero seats and a right wing nationalist party won power, Finland the SPD came in fourth, In Italy the PD lost the referendum they put forward and are polling much neck and neck with a party who's founder was a comedian, In Holland their fecked, In Greece it's the same, In Spain the PSOE are polling between 10-15 points behide the conservative government. And the SPD are only starting to make a come back.
This isn't trying to rid Corbyn of blame(I think he's alright but overall a bit rubbish)but to look at the wider context.
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I wasn't even including Macron, I was pointing to the legislative elections for France as the evidence against there, but the context for the Socialists falling to 6% in France was because their 2012 voters largely went for Macron as the best option with a chance of winning. They won't fall to 6% in June.
In Finland the centre-left are currently leading the polls. I also forgot to mention Austria, where although their presidential election featured the far right and a green, the centre-left are leading again for the legislature. I'm not sure the Polish elections add much to the claim that it's collapsing across Europe. It's struggling to win elections yes, struggling to cope with the ramifications from the financial collapse and hostility to immigration yes, as has been discussed in the politics threads here incessantly, but as I demonstrated they're still managing to stay firmly in contention, and finishing second is not something that's unique to the Labour party or even moderately rare.
He's definetely the most credible but he's also used to being undermined at this point. I don't think he's liked within his own party.
Labour wont bring up anything to do with tax or the economy.
What are we arguing over ? The weakest of the Centre Left.
My point is to no one should expect the UK Labour Party to come to any consensus like it's a normal functioning party of the mid 2000's. It wasn't that long ago the party was desperately trying to rid itself of members by any means necessary, including upping the membership cost in a bid to put off people with less money. Honestly what are people expecting.
Blaming the one guy(Someone who is so shite that no body can name a good replacement) seems to miss the context and history that has lead to this situation. Although it is easier.
The rationale of the centrist shift of left parties (based on my understanding of the US and UK) is precisely vote-winning. Get a slicker more professional party with more presentable, palatable, media-friendly politicians who can appeal to conservative voters by being tough on crime/welfare/cutting spending/more muscular. As a long-term political project it's only value is if it wins power, because it is never going to shift the Overton window or be able to respond to challenges like global warming or trade without sacrificing one of the halves of its base.