Television Game of Thrones (TV) • The watch has ended

I don't think you understand how careful some of us are in not revealing anything in regards to books. Hell, it's even harder trying to not discuss things that have happened in the books but the show has missed out to allow you guys to understand things further.

You have my word that nothing mentioned since I've been reading this thread has given information about the books.
 
Think it's been a really lacklustre season so far & it's hard to know what to make of the show overall. It can be really entertaining at times, but for the rest of it it's like some really bad soap opera. That final scene from the last episode deserves to be mocked up as a spanish telenovela, with some dramatic music to accompany the wide eyed expressions.

It suffers from it seeming like a really character driven series which is next to impossible to translate to screen. The pacing of books and the space they give a reader's imagination to work allows for depth television can never reach. I imagine readers are getting a lot more out of the show from having a much fuller picture of each character (or even just a reason to care about them at times). The dialogue in the show only seems to be effective about one in every five scenes. It feels like a bad mix of awkward, colloquial personal interaction & a slicker but badly attempted aping of classical literature that goes on mainly in King's Landing, where every line is treated as if it's the most poignant thing ever said, but is usually just bleh. There still aren't that many convincing characters, though it's hard to know when to blame the acting or the script - I think Daenerys has had a lot of shit to work with.
 
AldoRaine18 said:
Just look how far Raven has gone with Jamie's character portrayal with so much conviction that if at any time in the show a situation arises that shows him as a downright disgraceful cnut, we are bound to believe before hand that it will turn given that someone who knew the whole plot never believed he was someone of that sort of stature. It is not as harmless as you are trying to make it look.
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I apologize if I said more than I should about Jaime last week and will be more reserved in the future (though personally I don't think that I made any spoiler or stuff like that).

About him vs Ned yesterday, it was all from the TV show, there was absolutely no information about the books, and my opinion wasn't based on the books. It was based on the fighting scene I posted and their age mostly.
 
RedSky At Night said:
The problem was (for me anyway), that this episode not a great deal happened to push the story along. It was basically pushing a pawn forward in chess. Plenty of setup for future episodes but nothing else there. We've been introduced to yet another story arc with Stanis' daughter, which is yet more scene time taken away from other arcs.

I thought the pacing of that episode was way off balance frankly. For the first time in a while I was looking at my watch rather than being engrossed. I actually want to see some progression, instead everyone seems to be chilling out, sitting and plotting, to me that doesn't make good television. I don't want/need tits/fighting to make it interesting. I do however want to see the characters progress and move around the world a bit each episode rather than chilling out in some caves, castles, dungeons or the capital.

It felt like the entire storyline stopped for that episode, while we were given dialogue (a lot of it not really required). Hopefully it picks up next episode and the storyline gathers up a bit more pace again and pushes forward. At this point in time, i'm hoping that Sansa dies simply to stop all of this dull plotting. She'd marry a freaking cow if it looked handsome and wore some armor.
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You make some good points.

Arya sends to have been been in some kind of limbo for a while now. Same with Rob and whatever he's supposed to be doing.

I actually couldn't even remember why she wanted the hound dead during that episode. Was he one that gave Ned the chop on Joffreys order?
 
Revan said:
I apologize if I said more than I should about Jaime last week and will be more reserved in the future (though personally I don't think that I made any spoiler or stuff like that).

About him vs Ned yesterday, it was all from the TV show, there was absolutely no information about the books, and my opinion wasn't based on the books. It was based on the fighting scene I posted and their age mostly.
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You don't get it. Of course your opinion of him is influenced by the books, you know his back story better than any of us (tv people) and you know how his character develops. There is no way you can post and remain unbiased when you have all that information.
 
CassiusClaymore said:
You make some good points.

Arya sends to have been been in some kind of limbo for a while now. Same with Rob and whatever he's supposed to be doing.

I actually couldn't even remember why she wanted the hound dead during that episode. Was he one that gave Ned the chop on Joffreys order?
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Sandor was the one who killed her friend, Micah the butchers boy, when Joffrey came and made him duel with him in the first season.
 
PhilipB said:
You don't get it. Of course your opinion of him is influenced by the books, you know his back story better than any of us (tv people) and you know how his character develops. There is no way you can post and remain unbiased when you have all that information.
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My opinion about him being a better swordsman than Ned. You have only to watch that scene and realize that, no need for knowing his back-story or knowing how he will be developed.
 
CassiusClaymore said:
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I actually couldn't even remember why she wanted the hound dead during that episode. Was he one that gave Ned the chop on Joffreys order?
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Ser Ilyn Payne chopped Ned's head.

The hound killed Arya's friend, the butcher's boy, after Arya's wolf attacked Joffrey somewhere in the beginning of the show.
 
Waldner said:
Sandor was the one who killed her friend, Micah the butchers boy, when Joffrey came and made him duel with him in the first season.
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Thanks.

Can you refer to him as the hound in future please. I just had to Google that to find out who you were talking about and what that had to do with my question.
 
AldoRaine18 said:
Just look how far Raven has gone with Jamie's character portrayal with so much conviction that if at any time in the show a situation arises that shows him as a downright disgraceful cnut, we are bound to believe before hand that it will turn given that someone who knew the whole plot never believed he was someone of that sort of stature. It is not as harmless as you are trying to make it look.
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Yes, he probably went too far, but it was said to him in the Book thread that he did and there was no malice in it. I really don't see what's wrong with us being here, I think the majority of us are quite sensible and usually only post things (in spoilers) when someone specifically asks.
 
The AV Club dealt with this issue by having two separate reviews and comments sections, one for newbies and one for experts. We could do that here. One thread for people who have read the books and one for people who haven't.
 
Eboue said:
The AV Club dealt with this issue by having two separate reviews and comments sections, one for newbies and one for experts. We could do that here. One thread for people who have read the books and one for people who haven't.
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what about people who have read the first one and about a 3rd of the second, but know some of the major plot points of the later books? Can I have my own thread?
 
Was anybody else quite suprised at the man coming back to life after the fight with the hound?. I thought all this Lord of light stuff was a bit culty, didnt think they could back it up but clearly there is magic around, and this lord of light may well exist.

Seeing that now makes me believe Stannis may have a chance after all.
 
Adam-Utd said:
Was anybody else quite suprised at the man coming back to life after the fight with the hound?. I thought all this Lord of light stuff was a bit culty, didnt think they could back it up but clearly there is magic around, and this lord of light may well exist.

Seeing that now makes me believe Stannis may have a chance after all.
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You're a hard man to please if the shadow demon snatch assassin in season 2 didn't have you convinced!
 
Adam-Utd said:
Was anybody else quite suprised at the man coming back to life after the fight with the hound?. I thought all this Lord of light stuff was a bit culty, didnt think they could back it up but clearly there is magic around, and this lord of light may well exist.

Seeing that now makes me believe Stannis may have a chance after all.
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I was shocked. Then he goes and says it's the 6th time he's done this :eek:

I felt a bit sorry for Stannis. When he went to visit his daughter, he seemed human for a minute and compassionate but then when he started talking about Davos and how he's a traitor, it was like he was a puppet again and under the spell of the red woman.

It's unlikely but I wonder if the Brotherhood without banners will align themselves with Stannis and the red woman seeing as they believe in the same Lord of light?
 
I'm starting the show from the beginning again, it dawned upon me reading through this thread that I seem to know feck all of the characters, so hopefully second time round ill pick up a bit more.
 
Genius Me! said:
I'm starting the show from the beginning again, it dawned upon me reading through this thread that I seem to know feck all of the characters, so hopefully second time round ill pick up a bit more.
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A lot of the questions people asked wouldn't be if this was done. You'll spot things you missed before and it'll help you understand things better.
 
ha_rooney said:
I was shocked. Then he goes and says it's the 6th time he's done this :eek:

I felt a bit sorry for Stannis. When he went to visit his daughter, he seemed human for a minute and compassionate but then when he started talking about Davos and how he's a traitor, it was like he was a puppet again and under the spell of the red woman.

It's unlikely but I wonder if the Brotherhood without banners will align themselves with Stannis and the red woman seeing as they believe in the same Lord of light?
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Nah it's mentioned a few times in the show that Stannis is an ultra strict authoritarian. I remember Renly describing him pretty much as such. Even when Davos smuggled them food all those years ago he cut his fingers off
 
Watched this week's episode last night. Decent episode, if little overall story progression... there was certainly a lot of character building work.

Notes:

Ginger Wilding Las was a bit boney and had too much dirt on her for my liking. If you're going to get someone naked GoT, might as well do it in such a way that they look in top condition... even if it makes no sense plot wise, I'm sure they'd get few complaints.

Rob Stark's a good lad. He has his principals and his beliefs and he sticks to them... regardless of what people around him tell him. The guy betrayed him and kill two children, fully deserved his death, and I'm glad Rob didn't go against who he is by going back on his own convictions.

Jamie Lannister & Brienne - Good scene in the bath, seems like they're trying this season to make you do a 180 on Jamie, but I'm still in the jumped up, sister-shagging cnut camp. I'll leave it there though, wouldn't want Revan giving anything more away... on that though, obviously Revan is passionate and wants to discuss the show, and fair play to him, but I agree he's gone too far in his defence of Jamie. Ultimately, if you base this purely on what we've seen on TV, the first two seasons were set-up and told in such a way that you were meant to hate Jamie... it'd be daft to think otherwise. Still other than that, you book readers have done a grand job of being spoiler free in this thread from what I've seen.

Papa Lannsiter is a fecking dude. This show constantly portrays Cersei and Tyrion as two very powerful/clever/maipulative/general badass characters... but put them in a room with their dad and they both look like weak kids. It's great stuff... Charles Dance performance in this show are consistent highlights for me. Great actor.

Finally... what noises were coming out of Littlefingers mouth this week!?
 
This show treads a fine line between being awesome and going a bit far.

I wasn't happy when that guy come back from the dead. That and the Shadow Baby just takes me out of the program sometimes, I don't know what it is but it just seems to stretch the plausibility to the limit. (BTW - I know I'm talking about a show with dragons and zombies, but they're more accepted into mainstream culture, I don't mind stuff like that as much as I get put out by magical ressurections or shadow babies.)
 
Oh yeah, thats another note I wanted to make... why doesn't every fecker believe in this fire god?! He's clearly doing more work then any of the other gods going around... and he's constantly proving himself. Seems like a no brainer to me...

Twigginater said:
This show treads a fine line between being awesome and going a bit far.

I wasn't happy when that guy come back from the dead. That and the Shadow Baby just takes me out of the program sometimes, I don't know what it is but it just seems to stretch the plausibility to the limit. (BTW - I know I'm talking about a show with dragons and zombies, but they're more accepted into mainstream culture, I don't mind stuff like that as much as I get put out by magical ressurections or shadow babies.)
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It's not a problem for me as such, but I see why it would take people out of the show. I think the main problem for me in this regard is that we're not told any rules/limitations for what these things can/can't do... and so no boundaries have been set. How powerful are the white walkers? What are the shadow baby rules? Why don't they send one to kill Jeoffery? What are the rules behind resurrection? etc. etc.
 
Is anyone else finding this series all a bit meh? I never read the books and am not really into all this fantasy stuff but found the first series a guilty pleasure.

Nice mix of dark humour, violence and boobies. I even sort of got into the plot. Although fecked if I could remember more than 2 or 3 names of any of the characters.

This season just feels like hard work. Giving less and less of a shit about what's going on and really can't be bothered with the effort entailed in trying to keep on top all the various plot strands. Last season I used to really look forward to the latest episode. This time round, I keep coming up with other stuff I'd rather watch instead. Which is a pity really.

Anyone else going through the same experience?
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Is anyone else finding this series all a bit meh? I never read the books and am not really into all this fantasy stuff but found the first series a guilty pleasure.

Nice mix of dark humour, violence and boobies. I even sort of got into the plot. Although fecked if I could remember more than 2 or 3 names of any of the characters.

This season just feels like hard work. Giving less and less of a shit about what's going on and really can't be bothered with the effort entailed in trying to keep on top all the various plot strands. Last season I used to really look forward to the latest episode. This time round, I keep coming up with other stuff I'd rather watch instead. Which is a pity really.

Anyone else going through the same experience?
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Yes, I do. Too many characters, not enough character development, cardboard characters and too many sub plots . Its saving grace are boobies and booties, which says it all. I've only been watching out of habit, I think I will give it up.
 
The many characters really become a problem for the series I feel.

I had trouble remembering all of them when I read the book and had to look them up quite a few times and I can totally understand how some people will get confused with so many of them.

Of course one could say it increases the rewatchability of the show, as with the books rereading actually increased the quality of it, at least for me and I guess same goes for the show.
 
Annihilate Now! said:
Oh yeah, thats another note I wanted to make... why doesn't every fecker believe in this fire god?! He's clearly doing more work then any of the other gods going around... and he's constantly proving himself. Seems like a no brainer to me...
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Well after all the stuff we have seen I'm not so sure who ever grants these "miracles" is actually a "good" god.

The shadow assassin, the resurrecting that cost a part of the resurrected's "soul" according to Beric Dondarrion and the less than trustworthy red priests, I don't know but that doesn't really look too trustworthy to me.

So I guess no one is really doubting if "he" exists but more or less what "he" actually is, it could be a very powerful demon or something like the devil for all we know.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Is anyone else finding this series all a bit meh? I never read the books and am not really into all this fantasy stuff but found the first series a guilty pleasure.

Nice mix of dark humour, violence and b00bies. I even sort of got into the plot. Although f*cked if I could remember more than 2 or 3 names of any of the characters.

This season just feels like hard work. Giving less and less of a sh*t about what's going on and really can't be bothered with the effort entailed in trying to keep on top all the various plot strands. Last season I used to really look forward to the latest episode. This time round, I keep coming up with other stuff I'd rather watch instead. Which is a pity really.

Anyone else going through the same experience?
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I can sort of see where you are coming from. It hasn't got the 'must see next episode now' quality of something like Breaking Bad but it's well above guff like The Walking Dead (which is what your post made me think of instantly).

I thought the climax to Season 2 was fantastic and kind of hoped that would kick start a great 3rd season but it's kind of gone into a bit of a lull again. A lot of the sub plots are moving at a snails pace and that's slowing the whole thing down. I mean, I can see that it's building to something but are we going to have to wait till the end of the Season again for it all to kick off?
 
Twigginater said:
This show treads a fine line between being awesome and going a bit far.

I wasn't happy when that guy come back from the dead. That and the Shadow Baby just takes me out of the program sometimes, I don't know what it is but it just seems to stretch the plausibility to the limit. (BTW - I know I'm talking about a show with dragons and zombies, but they're more accepted into mainstream culture, I don't mind stuff like that as much as I get put out by magical ressurections or shadow babies.)
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That's quite a peculiar thing to say about a fantasy series....
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Is anyone else finding this series all a bit meh? I never read the books and am not really into all this fantasy stuff but found the first series a guilty pleasure.

Nice mix of dark humour, violence and boobies. I even sort of got into the plot. Although fecked if I could remember more than 2 or 3 names of any of the characters.

This season just feels like hard work. Giving less and less of a shit about what's going on and really can't be bothered with the effort entailed in trying to keep on top all the various plot strands. Last season I used to really look forward to the latest episode. This time round, I keep coming up with other stuff I'd rather watch instead. Which is a pity really.

Anyone else going through the same experience?
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Spoony Kobayashi said:
Yes, I do. Too many characters, not enough character development, cardboard characters and too many sub plots . Its saving grace are boobies and booties, which says it all. I've only been watching out of habit, I think I will give it up.
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As someone who's read the books, I find myself explaining a few things to my gf when we watch it, so I can see your point of view. I would advise you to stick with it for the remainder of the season, as things will pick up.
 
Annihilate Now! said:
I wouldn't say so... The magical/fantastical elements has increased significantly since the first series.
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It's still a fantasy show though, set in a fantasy world, and in the first series we were told about all the mythical shit that has happened in the past, naturally it was going to come to prominence as it went on.

I mean, Dany did walk into fire and come out with three dragons at the end of the first series, if that didn't make people cop on that there's shitloads of mythical and magical stuff involved then feck knows what would.
 
Am I the only one who likes all the characters/story lines then?
It does slow it down, but also kind of speeds it up at the same time. I'm never bored in this program, and after an episode there's certainly plenty to talk about, as opposed to TWD, where the only thing to talk about is how nothing happened.
 
Cina said:
It's still a fantasy show though, set in a fantasy world, and in the first series we were told about all the mythical shit that has happened in the past, naturally it was going to come to prominence as it went on.

I mean, Dany did walk into fire and come out with three dragons at the end of the first series, if that didn't make people cop on that there's shitloads of mythical and magical stuff involved then feck knows what would.
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That was the very last scene to be fair! And what people say happened in the past, makes you think that it's just that.... shit that happened in the past. Unless you see something happen in the present day, you're not going to be expecting/anticipating it (if that makes sense).

Basically, I'd say smoke babies was a massive leap from anything we'd seen prior (though, this could also be due to the fact that Smoke Babies is just something very unfamiliar... as we've seen Zombies/Whitewalkers and Dragons in other things, so we already have an existing familiarity with them) so I can see why it took people out a bit... and coming back from the dead is also quite the extreme too (and like I said, when we don't know the rules for these acts, it makes you wonder what the extent of the power is and how much of an effect it'll have).
 
Smoke assassin baby was probably the most "what the feck" moment in the show, but as you said, it's only because the general TV audience has seen plenty of dragons, zombies and what not before, where as a woman popping a shadow baby out of her fanny is totally unexplored territory. Still, it's no more farfetched than any of the other shit.
 
There's also a tower that Daenerys is magically teleported into and is put into illusions of things that 'might of been' and 'will be'.. the Warlock points out that since the dragons returned, magic has also returned to the world. Hence why Malisandre can make smoke assassin babies, by magic gifted by the Lord of Light- as well as that guy being able to take a sword through his body and revive and heal.

Since the Dragons were born, the world changed.
 
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