I totally agree. It’s absolutely normal for a player to lose a ball at times and that at times it leads to goals or chances for the opposition. It’s football. Not worth moaning about.
17
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 36
- Goals
- 4
- Assists
- 5
- Yellow cards
- 8
- Status
I think the problem is we do not have a better dm than Fred at the moment. Matic is too slow, Mctominay normally turns up whenever he feels like it, Pogba publicly said that he does not like to defend, and VDB somehow does not make the cut.
I think by putting Fred as DM, it shielded our defensive flaws(maguire). Now we are able to see that Maguire making more mistakes whereas Fred is shining when playing further up the pitch.
Depends entirely on the situation and position on the field. If you're losing the ball in dangerous positions, especially if you had plenty of options that would have been better, then it's absolutely 'worth moaning about'. Maybe not if you do it once where you can just say it's a bit unlucky, but if you make similar mistakes regularly then it's an obvious issue.
I was talking in reference to Fred losing the ball in that situation. Of course it depends on the player and the poster also as to who gets criticised and who doesn’t for practically the same thing.
Think Fred will shine under ten Hag… Fred seems to be a player that his one of our best pressers… since rangnick come in Fred has more goal involvements then under mourinho and ole and that’s because he’s pressing higher up the pitch to win the ball back and that’s leading us to score goals. Fred has always been better further forward then as an holding which is what Solskjær tried to use him as, he’s sloppy sometimes on the ball so playing him as the furthest midfielder back could cost us goals with his passing.
Everton 1:0 Man Utd
Such an enigma of a player.
Can be erratic, but I have a feeling we're going to miss him badly
Big miss today based on his current form….
He played, wasn't very good, contributed heavily to Everton scoring.
Absolute nonsense. Played it to Matic, who controlled it, hesitated and lost the ball. Before people go in on him, take out his goals and assist since RR came, where would we be Including last week.
Nonsense?
- We’re unbalanced after attacking, losing the ball and winning it back again. Our fullbacks are high up the pitch. Look where Lindelof is
- Bruno is signalling for Fred to hold the ball
- There’s no real passing alternatives. If Matic passes it back, Everton will just move their line up and press us even higher
Instead of calming things down, allowing us to position again, Fred passes the ball to Matic, who is surrounded by Everton players and not a single passing alternative as Fred doesn’t even move into position to receive the ball again. Now, obviously, Matic sure as shit should know that this isn’t the time to be clever with a turn and just boot the ball far away Instead, but it hardly changes the fact that a massive problem with Fred is that he doesn’t have the footballing brain to understand that you don’t pass the ball, never ever, to a teammate who is in such a situation, you’re simply asking for trouble.
It’s about taking responsiblity on the ball, don’t pass it to a teammate that is going to instantly lose it because he has opposition players crawling up his ass, you might as well just boot the ball out of play instead.
That was 100% on Matic. Matic could have easily rolled the ball back to Maguire. He moved across to give Matic a better angle. He was completely careless in possession. It's like he thought he was on the pitch alone or it was a training game or something. I can't believe that Matic did what he did with the amount of experience that he has.
Nonsense?
- We’re unbalanced after attacking, losing the ball and winning it back again. Our fullbacks are high up the pitch. Look where Lindelof is
- Bruno is signalling for Fred to hold the ball
- There’s no real passing alternatives. If Matic passes it back, Everton will just move their line up and press us even higher
Instead of calming things down, allowing us to position again, Fred passes the ball to Matic, who is surrounded by Everton players and not a single passing alternative as Fred doesn’t even move into position to receive the ball again. Now, obviously, Matic sure as shit should know that this isn’t the time to be clever with a turn and just boot the ball far away Instead, but it hardly changes the fact that a massive problem with Fred is that he doesn’t have the footballing brain to understand that you don’t pass the ball, never ever, to a teammate who is in such a situation, you’re simply asking for trouble.
It’s about taking responsiblity on the ball, don’t pass it to a teammate that is going to instantly lose it because he has opposition players crawling up his ass, you might as well just boot the ball out of play instead.
Like said nonsense and not sure why you are overcomplicating something that happens a million times on a football pitch. It’s a simple ball to Matic which he loses control of and nothing to do with whether Fred has a football brain.
Agree that losing the ball is on Matic with Fred giving him enough on the pass, but his reaction to us losing the ball and him being the man that needed to cover Matic is poor too. Gordon sells him a dummy very easily and is then able to play the ball through to Richarlison. After that Fred comes back and helps cover the overlap with Wan Bisakka so think he's fine there, but Lindelof dropping so deep and being passive meant Matic tracked back to block Iwobi instead of being a bit further out and able to pressure Gordon. Bruno doesn't pressure him like a CM would be expected to and he gets his shot away
Not entirely sure what your logic is here. Again, there’s no balance in the team with our fullbacks high up the pitch, even our cb’s aren’t aligned, Everton are just waiting for the chance to push higher. Losing the ball happens quite a lot, but there’s a pretty big difference between opting for a stupid pass when the team is in balance and opting for the stupid pass when the team is unbalanced and evenly numbered. The pass to Matic is as daft as it gets, just as daft as Matics decision to go for the turn rather than booting the ball the feck away.
By all means, you might not see it and think it’s overcomplicating things, doesn’t really change the problem.
Awareness makes a big difference. Which is why Fred, far too often, cocks up situations and put us under pressure. Like he did against Leicester, when he had time to control the ball and turn, but he panicked and tried to play it back to a teammate on his first touch and it went straight to a Leicester player. Which is why players fail to understand when they can take an extra touch and when the situation dictates it should be booted the feck away. Hopefully ETH will figure out a way to play him so we utilize his strengths and completely remove him from situations where his obvious downsides are going to cause problems. Essentially he should be kept far away from coming deep to collect the ball, use him higher up the pitch to press the opponent.
Like Bissaka yesterday, you’re about to intercept a ball and you have an opponent challenging you, do you:
a) instantly pass it to the teammate that is available so that we can keep the ball moving
b) try to control it, even though you are being challenged for it
There is no benefit whatsoever opting for b, there’s nothing to be gained, at best you manage to control the ball but you’ve slowed things down, at worst the opposition win the ball back which is exactly what Everton did when they won the corner.
Or towards the end when he fouled Richarlison. We’re trying to establish pressure high up the pitch, we’re overloaded up top and trying to move the ball around, he has options to pass to, tries to go past an opponent instead of passing to either teammate that is completely free. Best case scenario he goes past the opponent but there’s no benefit we wouldn’t have had if he’d simply passed the ball. He fails and then fouls Richarlison, well done.
Things like this is what will need to be sorted out, getting the players to understand when they should take risks and when they need to keep the ball moving. Understanding that if a winger is covered by 3 players, there really isn’t any point in sending the ball down that way and if 3 players are covering him it means that there’s space to take advantage of somewhere else. Getting a fullback that understands when it’s ok to run down a blind alley with the ball, and when he should opt for a pass into centre midfield instead. When he should overlap to create space for a teammate, when he should press high and when he really really really shouldn’t leave space open behind him.
With the utmost respect, all of that is not applicable to the original statement that Fred had a part to play in the goal cause Matic got caught on the ball. What your opinion is of Fred as a footballer or his so called ‘football brain’ has zero to do with that circumstance. The forensic view of Fred is becoming boring and it’s becoming very apparent our problems are much more entrenched than going in on one of the few players that give a shite.
It's a sad state we're in when this guy is one of our best players and we miss him when he doesn't play. Totally average footballer but he fecking tries and cares about the badge on the shirt.
Weird people blaming Fred for this. I mean it’s indicative of United in general that no one has moved to give Matic an option and Matic is extremely casual when receiving the pass. But that there is the kind of pass your Xavi’s silva’s, Iniesta’s and the likes would play and deal with no bother and create space somewhere on the pitch by fast passing and movement. Nothing wrong with the pass. It’s the lack of movement to create options for the man receiving the ball. Fred should probably be shaping to take that back and Maguire should have pulled slightly wider and someone probably should have been dropping in.
Matic just makes a mess of his part but isn’t helped by how poor we are as a team. Think e just have to come to terms with this United team is rubbish and to fix it some big names will probably have to go along with some lesser names.
Matic just makes a mess of his part but isn’t helped by how poor we are as a team. Think e just have to come to terms with this United team is rubbish and to fix it some big names will probably have to go along with some lesser names.
It was a rubbish pass, what can Matic do there even if he takes a good touch. At best play it right back to Fred or Maguire.
But the whole thing is a textbook example of where we go wrong. Everyone static. Maguire gives it to Fred who's practically stood next to him. Pointless pass. Fred should be shouting at those around him to give him a proper option but instead drops Matic in it. Matic on his heels. Everyone else watching also on their heels.
More than workrate it's a lack of intensity that kills us. Everything is so unfocused.
But the whole thing is a textbook example of where we go wrong. Everyone static. Maguire gives it to Fred who's practically stood next to him. Pointless pass. Fred should be shouting at those around him to give him a proper option but instead drops Matic in it. Matic on his heels. Everyone else watching also on their heels.
More than workrate it's a lack of intensity that kills us. Everything is so unfocused.
What Matic should be doing is passing it back to Maguire who now has a good angle to pass to Telles and get us on the attack down the left as the opposition winger has moved infield. In saying that Maguire should be moving across a bit faster and calling for the quick pass back, and incidents like that is exactly what the players should be getting drilled into them on the training field. Watch any well-drilled team and they'll make plays like that all the time.
Fred's pass 'should' have been the correct pass (although should have been played a bit harder), but because all our players just stand and watch until the ball actually gets to the recipient before deciding what to do it ends up making it more difficult than it should be. Matic still did have the right option available to him and messed it up, but his teammates didn't make it as easy as it should have been.
Fred is the one that steps in and takes the ball from Maguire, he doesn't pass it to him. Maguire is on his way forrward with it.
There is no immediate angle to anyone. Best option is trying to pass it into open space for Maguire, but Calvin is positioning himself either to press Maguire if he gets the ball or press Fred if it's passed back.
Fred, who made the shit pass to begin with, is essentially just standing there with his cock in his hands doing feck all. Minimum should be moving forward between Calvin and Iwobi to draw both players closer to him so that atleast Maguire is a better option.
How anyone can look at the clip above and go "yep, that's clever by Fred, nothing wrong at all, happens all the time, all on Matic" is beyond me. They are both absolutely shit in that situation
How you can look at your last pic and say "there is no immediate angle to anyone" is pretty beyond me 
He has been decent recently and is probably a handful of few who are bothered. Still don't think hes good enough but I can tolerate him as a squad player
How you can look at your last pic and say "there is no immediate angle to anyone" is pretty beyond me
Where is it?
He just needs to play it back to Maguire, who can then ping it out wide. It isn't difficult.
What an awful take. Matic cocked up. Not Fred, ffs.
Fred is the one that steps in and takes the ball from Maguire, he doesn't pass it to him. Maguire is on his way forrward with it.
There is no immediate angle to anyone. Best option is trying to pass it into open space for Maguire, but Calvin is positioning himself either to press Maguire if he gets the ball or press Fred if it's passed back.
Fred, who made the shit pass to begin with, is essentially just standing there with his cock in his hands doing feck all. Minimum should be moving forward between Calvin and Iwobi to draw both players closer to him so that atleast Maguire is a better option.
How anyone can look at the clip above and go "yep, that's clever by Fred, nothing wrong at all, happens all the time, all on Matic" is beyond me. They are both absolutely shit in that situation
Yeah:
You see the player in blue, with the 9 on his back, essentially in line with Maguire, he is wearing a different kit than Maguire to clearly show he is playing for the opposition and not on the same team. This becomes a bit of an issue in terms of passing the ball back to Maguire since there is very little space between them. If Maguire was further out wide, then it would've been a obvious choice, but he's quite clearly not in a good position to receive the ball back from Matic.
They both cocked up.
It's literally football 101, the pass was into Matic, perfectly weighted and on his left foot, he is supposed to lay it off to Maguire first time, and Maguire moves it out to the wing, which now has no Everton player on it, as they shifted in to try and block Matic from turning with the ball. Instead, he decides to try and do a pirouette without checking his shoulders, the same thing Pogba constantly does, we lose the ball while our whole team is in transition to attack, and we're caught on a counter. Your pictures perfectly illustrate how this was entirely Matic's fault, and they don't even describe the motion of the players, which even further proves it, as Calvert Lewin is moving towards the centre circle, while Maguire is moving into the space where Matic's layoff should have gone.
No they didn’t. Only Matic did. It’s an awful take.
Yeah:
You see the player in blue, with the 9 on his back, essentially in line with Maguire, he is wearing a different kit than Maguire to clearly show he is playing for the opposition and not on the same team. This becomes a bit of an issue in terms of passing the ball back to Maguire since there is very little space between them. If Maguire was further out wide, then it would've been a obvious choice, but he's quite clearly not in a good position to receive the ball back from Matic.
Jesus Christ. Maguire isn’t the quickest but he hasn’t put down roots. He’s capable of moving onto a pass a yard or two to his left. You’re obsessing over static images too much. Let it go. Matic fecked up. You don’t need to draw a million lines to know this.
Calvert-Lewin is not intercepting that ball. He isn't close enough. It would be even less of an issue if Matic was on his toes and not waiting until the last possible moment.Yeah:
You see the player in blue, with the 9 on his back, essentially in line with Maguire, he is wearing a different kit than Maguire to clearly show he is playing for the opposition and not on the same team. This becomes a bit of an issue in terms of passing the ball back to Maguire since there is very little space between them. If Maguire was further out wide, then it would've been a obvious choice, but he's quite clearly not in a good position to receive the ball back from Matic.
Gifs aren't static images, if this helps.
Maguire doesn't move wider until Matic has already turned, video quite clearly shows that.
Clutching at straws blaming him for the goal.
Matic could have found Maguire first time. He could have come toward the ball. He could have held his man off, shielded the the and found a pass a second later. He could have committed a foul. The problem is that he completely lost his bearings and was extremely sloppy. It had little to do with Fred.
What's weird is that Matic was super in the that opening 30 mins aside from the Brainard.
Matic could have found Maguire first time. He could have come toward the ball. He could have held his man off, shielded the the and found a pass a second later. He could have committed a foul. The problem is that he completely lost his bearings and was extremely sloppy. It had little to do with Fred.
What's weird is that Matic was super in the that opening 30 mins aside from the Brainard.
But the move started with Maguire. So you end up with three passes there just to return the ball back to the player who started. Without moving up the pitch. One of those passes being a slightly risky one to Matic.
Ultimately we need our senior midfielders, like Fred, to start orchestrating a bit more.
Yeah:
You see the player in blue, with the 9 on his back, essentially in line with Maguire, he is wearing a different kit than Maguire to clearly show he is playing for the opposition and not on the same team. This becomes a bit of an issue in terms of passing the ball back to Maguire since there is very little space between them. If Maguire was further out wide, then it would've been a obvious choice, but he's quite clearly not in a good position to receive the ball back from Matic.
I'm confused as to why people can't see this. Do they think DCL will stay in that exact spot and not make an attempt to intercept a pass right next to him?
And all this to give it back to Maguire who had it in pretty much that exact same spot 3 passes earlier.
he is partially to blame
Mate, you are just wrong. No amount of images with lines on them is going to change that. I've watched your gif and I watched the game, Maguire is moving into the space like anyone with a brain would, as he knows he is Matic's only and correct option. Calvert Lewin is moving away from Maguire when Matic receives the ball. It seems like you've never played football or something, that situation of drawing players in and then taking advantage of the space left from them moving with 1 touch football is an absolutely basic concept.
Maguire doesn't move wider until Matic has already turned, video quite clearly shows that.
Not really. Watch the City Liverpool game. Players pass to each other in tight spaces all the time. The difference is that they don't brick it and forget what's around them. Matic wasn't wasn't a particularly tight spot. He had many options and chose none of them.
Seen the gif again. The issue is clearly Matic thinking he has loaaads of time. He needed to pass it take his first touch away from danger. Really sloppy play
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