Big Fred fan but that was a shocker especially the first half. That said, the rest were equally dogshite
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Donny and Scott pairing next week then.
Don’t want to derail the thread, but Fred was awful, yes. However, our issue was a structural one.The way Matic played meant we were never going to be able to play through midfield because we didn’t have one. Fred was in there by himself.
A massive part of our issues. If it's anything more than 5 yards, it becomes a flip of the coin whether he makes the pass or not.
Played like Pogba defensively, but without the offensive output.
Played like Pogba defensively, but without the offensive output.
It is Matic' fault that Fred can't pass, it reads. Always making excuses for these players.
Agree. Always worry when Fred is suppose to be the progressive CM.....
We were worse when he came off 
Far from the required quality.
If he played for Arsenal he’d get pelted on this forum.
If he played for Arsenal he’d get pelted on this forum.
We were worse when he came off
This, he was bad but taking him off killed any urgency in the team.
Spot on.
Insulting another member
Not what I said. Stop imagining shite so you can trigger yourself into faux outrage. Idiot.
It is literally what you said. Matic being a "structural problem" has nothing to do with Fred not being to pass to people next to him. Failing all passes which are forwards and could create something.
I guess he's your pastor, then I could understand it.
Shits himself way too often, and he's supposed to bring the ball forward under pressure. Always looks like he's on the brink of doing something stupid.
Any stats on how many times he was dispossessed and misplaced passes in two games?
Jesus Christ. I said Fred was awful, but for me the bigger problem was how Matic played in midfield.
I did not say Fred played bad because of Matic.
There are podcast out there where players are opening saying that Fred is our weakest link. Opposition players are saying this mind you. They actually have a plan when he gets the ball. It is really sad.
Feel like he passes the ball straight out of play under zero pressure at least once a game.
When he is bad, he is BAD. Truly awful today, so many misplaced passes, the one in the first half where he underhit it to Pogba on the counter summed up his day.
It’s really something that he can play as horrifically as that and we still get worse when he comes off.
Played like a giant fecking idiot, but I guess he can run.
Played like a giant fecking idiot, but I guess he can run.
Because he's fried from having to be a one man midfield. It happens to whoever Matic plays with, every single time. Scott or Fred, they're always awful next to Matic, and great next to each other. Neither of them are the problem.
Fred is good at what he does. Pressing, harrying, being a nuisance and playing quick short passes. When Matic is playing, Fred has to be the complete midfielder and he's not ever going to be that.
Garbage peformance. For some reason he keeps getting heralded as this fanatastic underrated footballer and I have no idea why. He has terrific energy levels and hassles/harries well but that's it. His passing his erratic. He has no composure whatsoever. He's puny. He can't attack.
The fact that we haven't signed a CM since Fred is mind boggling.
The fact that we haven't signed a CM since Fred is mind boggling.
Of course they are. You don't win the league with those two as your main CMs. Heck, it's bloody hard to see truly challenging with that being the case.
Complete bobbins as per usual and yet many on here rate him highly, the mind boggles, it really does.
Sometimes it feels like the ball is his enemy. Same with AWB
The issue I have with Fred is when he decides to be something hes not. Why is he getting the ball and instead of passing it to the better players, hes trying to 'create'. I could understand if Bruno has an off game trying to create, but you know hes doing it cos he can.. But when Fred has the ball and is trying some chip over the top to ut our players through, its annoying
The worst thing about today is how bad he was at what hes meant to be good at. That moment where he was left for dead on our left wing in the second half, was shocking. He was skinned, then beaten and left on the ground.
And then what he was doing for their goal. You cant just half heartedly stick your leg out and hope for the best. You have to anticipate this, get closer and block it completely.
He might not work with Matic next to him, but that doesnt excuse him performing the simple things so badly.
The worst thing about today is how bad he was at what hes meant to be good at. That moment where he was left for dead on our left wing in the second half, was shocking. He was skinned, then beaten and left on the ground.
And then what he was doing for their goal. You cant just half heartedly stick your leg out and hope for the best. You have to anticipate this, get closer and block it completely.
He might not work with Matic next to him, but that doesnt excuse him performing the simple things so badly.
Dont try and lump AWB in along with Fred.
AWB is a solid player, who is developing and at least is top at his primary role (defending).
Fred is useless.
Compare his performance with Bissouma yesterday, my head is getting hot just thinking about it. 
As bad as he’s ever been, and that’s saying something. Doesn’t track runners, can’t tackle and can’t even make a simple 5 yard pass.
Absolutely zero chance of us mounting a challenging for the title if he’s paired with Matic on a regular basis.
Absolutely zero chance of us mounting a challenging for the title if he’s paired with Matic on a regular basis.
Bad performance, it is obvious that we really need an overhaul of the midfield.
I don’t understand what people see in him.
How does this guy not only play but start for both Manchester United and Brazil? Either I'm missing something here or both those teams are pretty poor at the moment.
We were much worse when he came off. The game completely turned. He was shite but he’s still our most important midfielder when it comes to setting a tempo and winning the midfield battle, one way or another. Can or should we upgrade on him? Go for it by all means but Matic should be first on the chopping block. Nothing performance after nothing performance. At least Fred stands up to be counted, good and bad. Matic is invisible and has been for years now.
Yeah not happy with that performance. Some of those passes would have been crucified in championship.
I backed fred the past few seasons because his work rate has been phenomenal and did the gritty work, but today showed we cant rely on this midfield setup
I backed fred the past few seasons because his work rate has been phenomenal and did the gritty work, but today showed we cant rely on this midfield setup
People have convinced themselves that working hard, running a lot & having passion is all that's required of a CM at this level.
Matic absolutely should be the first on the chopping block, that still doesn't mean Fred is good enough to be in the starting XI of a title contending side.
Two things can be true at once.
Ok cool but then imagine Rice and Matic in midfield there today. How would it have been any better? Another 60 million and still not winning the midfield battle. Things didn’t improve when Pogba went back either in fact it got worse
Awful game from him, but for some reason he was paired with Matic who went on to play more as a third CB rather than a midfielder which left him all alone.
Not sure why you keep talking about Matic in a Fred thread, and I don't particularly want Rice for his price tag either.
Fred is good enough to be a squad player, but he shouldn't be our starting CM it's that simple.
I’m not going all in defending Fred today. He was shite but please ole for the love of god stop playing him with Matic. All the space Matic vacates leaves him way too much to do and he nearly always looks terrible. With McT at least they’ve some kind of synergy and they dominate their opposite numbers. With Matic we take ten steps back and let them play.
He’s rotten. I’m fed up watching him. There’s constant mistakes that people forget about because he runs about a lot.
A competition winner at this level.
A competition winner at this level.
Rice is a much better player than Fred. He keeps the ball better, has better range and doesn’t let players go past him as easily.
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