Frank Lampard | Burnley?

[Dancfc]

I'd say that his second season at Chelsea was awful. His inability to train a defence was highlighted and now he's in the same boat again with even worse players.

Actually our defense was reasonably decent once Mendy and Silva arrived.

What done for Lampard in the end was the lack of attacking ideas, we literally had nothing bar crosses come the end. It was bewildering because pre lockdown with a inferior squad we largely played some very good stuff (all be it with very erratic results).

 

[RacingClub]

Actually our defense was reasonably decent once Mendy and Silva arrived.

What done for Lampard in the end was the lack of attacking ideas, we literally had nothing bar crosses come the end. It was bewildering because pre lockdown with a inferior squad we largely played some very good stuff (all be it with very erratic results).

I think it was relatively decent compared to your defence pre Mendy and Silva but they still conceded more than a goal a game and 9 in his final 5 games which is terrible compared to Tuchels defensive unit.

I also agree that you lacked attacking ideas and I think Everton will suffer for that too as the weeks progress.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

I'd say he's got two games to save his Everton career. They're in a terrible position and gambling with Lampard was crazy. Big Sam would've been a much better bet until the end of the season.

 

[SilentWitness]

I maintain my belief that it could have been anyone after Benitez and we would still struggle. We left it far too late to pull the trigger and the atmosphere at and around the club is toxic. We also have the added grief of the Russia situation surrounding the club too now and it’s just yuck. Know when you have those feelings about your club or about things in life? This is one of those times where I just can’t shake the feeling of ‘this is the season we get relegated’.

 

[WeePat]

I don't think many people outside of the Man United fan base felt that way but even so people were also saying at that time that Arteta was better than Ole and were proven correct in time.

So some people are fickle and knee jerk, others are right from the beginning.



I'd say that his second season at Chelsea was awful. His inability to train a defence was highlighted and now he's in the same boat again with even worse players.

Also he takes every opportunity to blame the players for the results instead of his own methods which I really don't think a top manager does.

I don't see the point in using my post to generalize about how managers need more time to implement their style, you won't be able to go through my post history to find evidence of me bashing Arteta because I wasn't registered here and If I was I wouldn't have bashed him.

Lampard had his time at Chelsea and after a significant financial backing was unable to get a tune out of a squad that later went on to win the Champions league.

I don't care if Everton go down or not but they've made a massive mistake with this appointment.

Clearly he wasn't ready for Chelsea but he was still very good until the pressure mounted after the spending spree. In his 18 months at Chelsea, 15 were pretty good pretty and 3 were atrocious.

To say he failed at Derby when he was one game away from promotion is genuinely mental.

 

[McGrathsipan]

I maintain my belief that it could have been anyone after Benitez and we would still struggle. We left it far too late to pull the trigger and the atmosphere at and around the club is toxic. We also have the added grief of the Russia situation surrounding the club too now and it’s just yuck. Know when you have those feelings about your club or about things in life? This is one of those times where I just can’t shake the feeling of ‘this is the season we get relegated’.

I hope not but you're in big trouble.
There are worse teams so you might just get away with it.
You need to play United soon for 3 points

 

[crossy1686]

I maintain my belief that it could have been anyone after Benitez and we would still struggle. We left it far too late to pull the trigger and the atmosphere at and around the club is toxic. We also have the added grief of the Russia situation surrounding the club too now and it’s just yuck. Know when you have those feelings about your club or about things in life? This is one of those times where I just can’t shake the feeling of ‘this is the season we get relegated’.

I don't think Everton are going down, not when Leeds, Watford and Burnley are all worse, but I do think Lampard gets the sack before the end of the season and Big Dunc rescues the situation. You'd have been better off getting Solskjaer...

Edit: Forgot Norwich were still a PL team, that's how shit they are. 100% going down.

 

[Righteous Steps]

Clearly he wasn't ready for Chelsea but he was still very good until the pressure mounted after the spending spree. In his 18 months at Chelsea, 15 were pretty good pretty and 3 were atrocious.

To say he failed at Derby when he was one game away from promotion is genuinely mental.

He should have got automatic promotion with Derby they had Mount Wilson Tomori and a couple other players who could play at the highest level too.

 

[WeePat]

He should have got automatic promotion with Derby they had Mount Wilson Tomori and a couple other players who could play at the highest level too.

Mount and Tomori were kids with 1 professional season behind them. He himself was a rookie manager in his first ever job. Automatic promotion is a mental expectation to put on him.

 

[Righteous Steps]

Mount and Tomori were kids with 1 professional season behind them. He himself was a rookie manager in his first ever job. Automatic promotion is a mental expectation to put on him.

Mount had done well in Holland, Tomori was a big talent, Wilson had experience in the championship doing well also, they also had a good player at right back who I think came from Chelsea youth academy also, I don’t think it’s a mental expectation at all, Mount went on to have a great season the season after and Derby had a quality of players that other clubs didn’t. He finished 6th in the end which was just about ok.

He was basically about par at Derby, not great, not bad.

 

[WeePat]

Mount had done well in Holland, Tomori was a big talent, Wilson had experience in the championship doing well also, they also had a good player at right back who I think came from Chelsea youth academy also, I don’t think it’s a mental expectation at all, Mount went on to have a great season the season after and Derby had a quality of players that other clubs didn’t. He finished 6th in the end which was just about ok.

He was basically about par at Derby, not great, not bad.

I would agree with that assessment. But the post I responded to called him a failure at Derby.

 

[Hansi Fick]

I would agree with that assessment. But the post I responded to called him a failure at Derby.

He was also objectively good in his first season at Chelsea. He shaped a young and likeable team that played nice and entertaining football. That's not nothing. He got found out when the caliber and variety of players and also expectations jumped up after the transfer ban ended and massive investment was made.
That can happen, but arguably the Everton job might be too ambitious again, from him. He needs to realize that his status as manager is not the same as he was as a player, and check his attitude and privilege.

 

[TwoSheds]

I'm not shitting on him because I think he should have beaten Spurs yesterday. I'm shitting on him because his tactics were clueless and laughable and deserved to get beaten 5-0. Nobody with a passing interest in PL football should set up that Everton team like that against anyone, never mind against a team as deadly on the counter as Spurs.

It's probably even more inept tactics than Rangnick against City. And that's saying something.

 

[DannyCAFC]

I think part of being a good football manager is knowing which job to take, there's not much upside to managing Everton right now. If he takes them down his career is over, and if he keeps them up there isn't much chance of climbing the table or challenging for anything. I think the Villa job Gerrard took has far more upside, just as an example.

Even Rooney seemed to understand that staying at Derby for now was probably a better situation to be in personally than taking over his boyhood club!

 

[youngrell]

I didn't realise how perilous a position Everton were in. I wouldn't be feeling very comfortable with Burnley so close behind, they have a lot of experience of these situations and usually pick up points later in the season.

They do have Leeds as a fallback option, but it remains to be seen how they do with their new manager.

It would actually be a bit mad to see Everton relegated. They were shite for a long time in the 90s, but been fairly stable since.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

I didn't realise how perilous a position Everton were in. I wouldn't be feeling very comfortable with Burnley so close behind, they have a lot of experience of these situations and usually pick up points later in the season.

They do have Leeds as a fallback option, but it remains to be seen how they do with their new manager.

It would actually be a bit mad to see Everton relegated. They were shite for a long time in the 90s, but been fairly stable since.

It would be very mad. No team has been in the top flight for as long as Everton. 118 years!

 

[youngrell]

It would be very mad. No team has been in the top flight for as long as Everton. 118 years!

What a record to break that would be!

I bet the guy who did the 'Sack Benitez Sign Lampard' graffiti is feeling a bit sheepish at the moment.

 

[Reapersoul20]

Time to change thread title to Frank Lampard - sackwatch?

 

[MayosNoun]

Frank is a legend as a player and he did come in and steady the ship when there was little expectation on him due to the transfer embargo.

When the pressure mounted though, he simply couldn’t cope. He’s not a great manager at all and his concerning ‘eye for a player’ was evident with his lack of use for someone like Rudiger. His in-game management was horrendous though which was the big turning point for me.

It’s brutal being critical of him though and the change at the time was absolutely necessary. I was kicked off The Shed End by their weird, creepy moderator coco who shouldn’t be allowed internet access let alone moderator rights but that forum is a bunch of happy clapping weirdos.

I’d love Lampard to be successful however I think he will struggle at Everton and their fans are always questioning his treatment of players. He gave their young lad Patterson half the game in the cup and took him off at half time when he reportedly had a decent half yet persists with Coleman and Kenny. Coleman was past his best 5 years ago and Jonjoe Kenny is an absolutely horrific footballer.

 

[Brophs]

Frank is a legend as a player and he did come in and steady the ship when there was little expectation on him due to the transfer embargo.

When the pressure mounted though, he simply couldn’t cope. He’s not a great manager at all and his concerning ‘eye for a player’ was evident with his lack of use for someone like Rudiger. His in-game management was horrendous though which was the big turning point for me.

It’s brutal being critical of him though and the change at the time was absolutely necessary. I was kicked off The Shed End by their weird, creepy moderator coco who shouldn’t be allowed internet access let alone moderator rights but that forum is a bunch of happy clapping weirdos.

I’d love Lampard to be successful however I think he will struggle at Everton and their fans are always questioning his treatment of players. He gave their young lad Patterson half the game in the cup and took him off at half time when he reportedly had a decent half yet persists with Coleman and Kenny. Coleman was past his best 5 years ago and Jonjoe Kenny is an absolutely horrific footballer.

Ffs

 

[MayosNoun]

Ffs

No word of a lie. I said Lampard being replaced by Tuchel would be a good move by Chelsea and the abuse in return was brutal.

If I could only reply to those comments now.

 

[Brophs]

No word of a lie. I said Lampard being replaced by Tuchel would be a good move by Chelsea and the abuse in return was brutal.

If I could only reply to those comments now.

I think you just did, albeit on a different Internet forum.

 

[MayosNoun]

I think you just did, albeit on a different Internet forum.

True.

 

[GMok]

It would be very mad. No team has been in the top flight for as long as Everton. 118 years!

No, 68 years. Everton was last relegated in 1951 and came back up in 1954.
Arsenal is in top flight for more than 100 years though

 

[DWelbz19]

They started the season 4-1-1.

2-3-14 since then.

Same sort of thing (to a much less extent) happened with Ancelotti too, didn't it?

 

[Shipperley]

He’s reminded me of someone for a while but I struggled to work out who. Talks a good game, very eloquent, sticks by his attacking principles…he’s Mark II Alan Pardew. I remember Pards talking about defensive solidity and the importance of a clean sheet ahead of Swansea away a few seasons ago…we were 4-3 up in the 90th minute and lost 5-4

I get the feeling it’ll be Everton’s individual quality in attacking areas that’ll keep them up if they manage it, not LamPards.

 

[flameinthesun]

Everton's demise mirrors ours to a degree. Its clear their entire setup is all over the place, they have a mixture of players from different managers, no clear direction and have hired a very average manager. Lampard did pretty well in the first season at chelsea, not spectacular but well. But in general, in the context of teams he's managed hes not really done well. The complete opposite of a gerrard. I could see them going down. The only thing that would save them is the fact that the likes of Norwich look just as bad.

 

[FootballHQ]

Err he's already underachieved at Derby and Chelsea before this appointment, Arteta is light-years ahead of Frank.

I wouldn't say losing a play off final at Derby was underachieving. Nor getting Chelsea in top 4 when they had that transfer ban.

Ultimately though the defensive record at Chelsea even with likes of Thiago Silva and Chilwell in the backline was very poor for a top level club and then Tuchel comes in and they instantly go to conceding barely a goal a game for six months.

If you can't organise a defence quickly then you're bang in trouble in a relegation battle unless you have a striker in great form and he's getting found out for that, I assume Michael Keane will be dropped next game as he's one of the worst regular starting CBs in premier league nowadays.

 

[RacingClub]

Clearly he wasn't ready for Chelsea but he was still very good until the pressure mounted after the spending spree. In his 18 months at Chelsea, 15 were pretty good pretty and 3 were atrocious.

To say he failed at Derby when he was one game away from promotion is genuinely mental.

I didn't say he failed at Derby, I said he underachieved. That side had enough quality to be promoted and weren't. He didn't achieve what the squad were capable of therefore he underachieved. I don't think that's a scandalous statement.

You are creating a straw man argument to defend him because I also wasnt critical of his first season at Chelsea, he was exposed in his second season.

I would agree with that assessment. But the post I responded to called him a failure at Derby.

No it didn't.

In fact If you agree with that assessment you agree with my statement which was that he underachieved.

 

[WeePat]

I didn't say he failed at Derby, I said he underachieved. That side had enough quality to be promoted and weren't. He didn't achieve what the squad were capable of therefore he underachieved. I don't think that's a scandalous statement.

You are creating a straw man argument to defend him because I also wasnt critical of his first season at Chelsea, he was exposed in his second season.



No it didn't.

In fact If you agree with that assessment you agree with my statement which was that he underachieved.

Sorry, underachieved. No idea I thought I read failure. Either way, I disagree entirely. He did fine at Derby. He finished 6th which wasnt great nor terrible, but he still guided them all the way to the playoff final. That's a pretty decent attempt in his first ever season as a coach relying on a bunch of inexperienced kids as his most of his main players.

Lampard had a terrible final 3 months at Chelsea. You could say he underachieved. I didn't actually dispute your claim there. I just provided context and painted his time at Chelsea in a better light, so your strawman claim is a bit weird. His first season was good and he started the second season pretty well too. A rough run of form cost him his job.

 

[SilentWitness]

I don’t think people realise how bad the situation is that Lampard has stepped into.

Our top scorer last year was DCL with 16 who has been out for most of this season. The next on that list is Richarlison with 7 who has also been out for most of the season. The next two aren’t at the club anymore Rodriguez/Gylfi (Both with 6). That’s -12 goals. Our top three assisters from last year are Digne, Rodriguez and Gylfi (7, 5 and 4) who again, aren’t at the club anymore.

Benitez decided that it would be a good idea to get rid of all of our creative outlet (Gylfi not his fault). Combine that with losing DCL to injury and it’s absolutely madness that he was allowed to do that.

He replaced DCL with an over the hill striker and the LB with a rookie from Ukraine that had no business coming into the club as a starter and means we are now being forced to play an absolutely shite RB as a LB.

 

[Cnaiür urs Skiötha]

Spurs fans sang "You're just a sh*t Steven Gerrard". And everybody knows that Stevie G. is just a sh*t Ole himself.

Imagine Donny's face if Everton sacked Lampard and out of the tunnel walks Ole as the new interim.

 

[TheGame]

People are saying Leeds will go down but if they played like they played in their last match then they will stand a good chance of staying up. Certainly better than Everton.

 

[Rajiztar]

Sorry last match his Everton side gave city run for their money. Against spurs first two goals were individual errors. Then game opened up.

He is good young manager who need to learn a lot but making him like some one have no clue is just plain stupid.

Of course he isn't pep but pretty good manager try to play attacking football. Will come good at Everton in my opinion.

 

[Rajiztar]

People are saying Leeds will go down but if they played like they played in their last match then they will stand a good chance of staying up. Certainly better than Everton.

Everton played better than United against city. It means nothing. You can't take single instance and predict things.

 

[RacingClub]

I wouldn't say losing a play off final at Derby was underachieving. Nor getting Chelsea in top 4 when they had that transfer ban.

Ultimately though the defensive record at Chelsea even with likes of Thiago Silva and Chilwell in the backline was very poor for a top level club and then Tuchel comes in and they instantly go to conceding barely a goal a game for six months.

If you can't organise a defence quickly then you're bang in trouble in a relegation battle unless you have a striker in great form and he's getting found out for that, I assume Michael Keane will be dropped next game as he's one of the worst regular starting CBs in premier league nowadays.

I would say that he underachieved with that Derby side.

Gary Rowett got sacked after coming 6th and losing in the playoffs (with 75 points)

Frank Lampard came 6th and lost in the play offs ( With 74 points , scoring less goals than Rowetts team and conceding more)

That's without the context of this post.

Mount had done well in Holland, Tomori was a big talent, Wilson had experience in the championship doing well also, they also had a good player at right back who I think came from Chelsea youth academy also, I don’t think it’s a mental expectation at all, Mount went on to have a great season the season after and Derby had a quality of players that other clubs didn’t.

Which I agree with , I just think he should have done better.

 

[RacingClub]

Sorry, underachieved. No idea I thought I read failure. Either way, I disagree entirely. He did fine at Derby. He finished 6th which wasnt great nor terrible, but he still guided them all the way to the playoff final. That's a pretty decent attempt in his first ever season as a coach relying on a bunch of inexperienced kids as his most of his main players.

Lampard had a terrible final 3 months at Chelsea. You could say he underachieved. I didn't actually dispute your claim there. I just provided context and painted his time at Chelsea in a better light, so your strawman claim is a bit weird. His first season was good and he started the second season pretty well too. A rough run of form cost him his job.

It's a straw man argument because I don't think anyone would dispute that he did a fine job in his first year at Chelsea and the team over achieved. (Which is why he was so roundly applauded)

I don't understand why he gets the praise for Over achieving with that group while avoiding the criticism of under achieving with the others.

Also "A rough run of form cost him his job".

Same with every other manager who has been sacked ever.

 

[Dan-Utd]

What I found astonishing was when Everton were looking for a manager and the Portuguese chap was favourite, you had Everton fans spray painting 'Lampard' on the walls at Goodison Park - the insanity of it.

Lampard as a manager:
Derby County... did a good job - not a brilliant job... but had a good source of loanees as well as a few big earners... Premier League loanees are tools that make the job easier.
Chelsea... did an OK job... had money to spend and a brilliant squad of players... money and a brilliant squad were tools that made the job easier but he underachieved.

What about Frank's performance in those two jobs tells an Evertonian that... 1 - he'll be good in a relegation battle... and 2 - when he spends money he'll be successful.

He was linked with Norwich City a month or two before that and even Canaries fans were not spray painting 'Lampard' onto Carrow Road.

 

[FootballHQ]

I would say that he underachieved with that Derby side.

Gary Rowett got sacked after coming 6th and losing in the playoffs (with 75 points)

Frank Lampard came 6th and lost in the play offs ( With 74 points , scoring less goals than Rowetts team and conceding more)

That's without the context of this post.



Which I agree with , I just think he should have done better.

That's true, it's easy to forget he had Mount and Tomori in that 11 while Harry Wilson has proven himself a very good championship player if not in the prem.

Was a top quality championship that year though. They unexpectedly beat Leeds in the SF who were in top 2 for 90% of the season before running out of steam and in the play off final they played the Aston Villa of Grealish, Mings, McGinn and Tammy Abraham and I certainly wanted to play them more than Leeds.

Chelsea first season he did fine but ultimately couldn't push them on when he could make signings so does have OGS feel to him so far.

 

[Pintu]

Same sort of thing (to a much less extent) happened with Ancelotti too, didn't it?

Not comparable at all. They were sitting 4th after 15 games. 2/3 points from the top until the emiratis managed to get that game postponed... And they were in Europe contention right till the end of the season (And one shock home defeat to Sheffield). Benitez f**d them up completely.

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