Books Fantasy Reads

Edgar Allan Pillow said:
I founds ASOIAF very frustrating to read. In all other books, you get a definitive end scenario mentioned at start (Kill some demon, win back kingdom etc etc). After 5 books, I still had no clue on where the story is leading to or when will it end. GRRM could probably drag it on for 25 more books and no one will be the wiser on what the objective it. He keeps killing the lead characters so often that the series can potentially go on and on.
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Isn't the end game defeating the Others and someone ultimately claiming the Iron Throne?

I'd say my top series so far in no order would probably be:

The First Law Trilogy
Night Angel Trilogy
A Song of Ice and Fire
Drenai series
Thrawn Trilogy

I'd probably add Malazan, Wheel of Time and The Expanse, but I've not read enough in each series to throw them in just yet. They could go very wrong.
 
Art Vandelay said:
Isn't the end game defeating the Others and someone ultimately claiming the Iron Throne?

I'd say my top series so far in no order would probably be:

The First Law Trilogy
Night Angel Trilogy
A Song of Ice and Fire
Drenai series
Thrawn Trilogy

I'd probably add Malazan, Wheel of Time and The Expanse, but I've not read enough in each series to throw them in just yet. They could go very wrong.
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How many Malazan books have you read?
 
All I want for Christmas (New Year) is Winds of Winter. GRRM, why art thou forsaken your readers?

Patrick Rothfuss as well.
 
Well just finished The Cold Commands, so gonna start The Dark Defiles now. I'm getting a bit more into the series but I still feel like only one character (Ringil) is interesting in any way.

Also, Im not sure if the third book fixes this, but so far I'm very underwhelmed with the world building. It's intriguing but really lacking any depth in explanation. The "Gods", the Dwenda, The grey places... It all feels like I'm meant to be filling in lots of blanks or just simply accept things are what they are without knowing much more about them.
 
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No love for the Chronicles of Amber by Zelazny in the greatest fantasy series?

Easily in my top 5.
The first 5 books specially.
 
Akash said:
On my kindle but not got around it reading it. What is it about?
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The best way is to just read the first line of the first book ;)

Its a different kind of fantasy to Lord of the Rings or traditional stuff and was very ahead of its time. I could see Jonathan Nolan doing the script for an HBO series.

Kristjan said:
No love for the Chronicles of Amber by Zelazny in the greatest fantasy series?

Easily in my top 5.
The first 5 books specially.
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Hand of Oberon and Sign of the Unicorn are two of my absolute favorite books ever.
 
You're optimistic. I think Winds of Winter is years away and then Dreams of Summer(is that what it's called?) is another decade after that. I don't think I'll live to see the end of it and I'm 30 years younger than GRRM! It's never getting finished.
 
I've already given up on ASOIAF. Realistically, what are the odds that he'll manage a decent conclusion? With the pace of the last few thousand pages and the state of its universe, a conclusions that wouldn't seem rushed feels at least thousands of pages away. I don't even see how he'll manage it within another 5000 pages unless he drastically changes his pace of storytelling. And how long would it take him to write all that stuff? That's assuming he'll manage to finish even one more book in his lifetime. He's stuck and he knows it and I doubt he has the stomach for it anymore.

Main thing I've learned is that I'll never start another epic before the author has finished it. Never again.
 
Art Vandelay said:
You're optimistic. I think Winds of Winter is years away and then Dreams of Summer(is that what it's called?) is another decade after that. I don't think I'll live to see the end of it and I'm 30 years younger than GRRM! It's never getting finished.
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I think that the next book will be released in the next 18 months, but after that it will be difficutl to predict. Providing that Martin is healthy, we might expect the final one to be published within 2025. The biggest problems though are if he can manage to be healthy and if he can manage to finish everything within two book.

Ainu said:
I've already given up on ASOIAF. Realistically, what are the odds that he'll manage a decent conclusion? With the pace of the last few thousand pages and the state of its universe, a conclusions that wouldn't seem rushed feels at least thousands of pages away. I don't even see how he'll manage it within another 5000 pages unless he drastically changes his pace of storytelling. And how long would it take him to write all that stuff? That's assuming he'll manage to finish even one more book in his lifetime. He's stuck and he knows it and I doubt he has the stomach for it anymore.

Main thing I've learned is that I'll never start another epic before the author has finished it. Never again.
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He can cut shit from the book. All the stories which aren't that important can be finished relatively fast (Citadel, Dorne and maybe even Aegon and Euron/Victarion). If he feels that he cannot finish them, I think that the decent thing to do is to leave the books to some other author to finish (my favorite by far would be Joe Abercrombie, but I think that Daniel Abrahams might do a decent job too). Or just to troll the fans, leave the books to Patrick Rothfuss.

The good thing is that we will have an ending from the TV show, which while watered down, should be what Martin wants in the first place for the books. At this point, the books seem more like a bonus if they are ever finished, and with each day it looks more likely that they won't.
 
Edgar Allan Pillow said:
Good shout. He comes the closest to GRRM of the current generation.
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Abercrombie? He's essentially a more extreme version of Martin but all Martin' elements are in Abercrombie too.

I think that Abrahams lack a bit when it comes to characters (something that Abercrombie shines and Martin is the greatest in the genre), but he could be a very good option. Scott Bakker might be an another interesting option, but he's quite slow himself in addition to over-rambling philosophy on his books. And of course, Mark Lawrence who is essentially a slightly worse version of Abercrombie.

Rothfuss, Lynch and Sanderson while great writers, shouldn't be in discussion because of their very different style (and for being slow when it comes to the first two).
 
Revan said:
Abercrombie? He's essentially a more extreme version of Martin but all Martin' elements are in Abercrombie too.

I think that Abrahams lack a bit when it comes to characters (something that Abercrombie shines and Martin is the greatest in the genre), but he could be a very good option. Scott Bakker might be an another interesting option, but he's quite slow himself in addition to over-rambling philosophy on his books. And of course, Mark Lawrence who is essentially a slightly worse version of Abercrombie.

Rothfuss, Lynch and Sanderson while great writers, shouldn't be in discussion because of their very different style (and for being slow when it comes to the first two).
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Agree with that. I slightly prefer DA as I think his style is better suited to the sweeping drama/saga genre that ASOIAF is more than an all out action/adventure. But then, Nicomo Cosca would smoothly transition into GoT and fit in perfectly. Maybe a collaboration between these two would be perfect!

You do have other options like Issac C Esselmont of the Malazan, who writes decent characters and sweeping sagas, but I don't think he'll write anything outside the Malazan universe.
 
Revan said:
He can cut shit from the book. All the stories which aren't that important can be finished relatively fast (Citadel, Dorne and maybe even Aegon and Euron/Victarion). If he feels that he cannot finish them, I think that the decent thing to do is to leave the books to some other author to finish (my favorite by far would be Joe Abercrombie, but I think that Daniel Abrahams might do a decent job too). Or just to troll the fans, leave the books to Patrick Rothfuss.
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I dunno, Abercrombie is an amazing author and I haven't enjoyed anything as much First Law since the first few reads of LOTR but I just don't think it'll be a good match.
Although there are plenty of similarities between the two, what makes FL a particularly good read is it's humour. The witty, lighter dialogue would need stripping back and the prose to be a far more formal tone. You wouldn't find Martin writing 'six hours later he was drunker than shit' unless it was said by a character. You take that away from Abercrombie and he loses a bit of his magic.
 
ivaldo said:
I dunno, Abercrombie is an amazing author and I haven't enjoyed anything as much First Law since the first few reads of LOTR but I just don't think it'll be a good match.
Although there are plenty of similarities between the two, what makes FL a particularly good read is it's humour. The witty, lighter dialogue would need stripping back and the prose to be a far more formal tone. You wouldn't find Martin writing 'six hours later he was drunker than shit' unless it was said by a character. You take that away from Abercrombie and he loses a bit of his magic.
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You're probably right. However, I think that his writing became a bit better after TFL (standaloes and the Shattered Sea have a better and more formal writing) and also there isn't as much humor in Red Country and The Shattered Sea compared to TFL and the first two standalones (unfortunately though, the books aren't as good as those 5, which makes you probably right).

If Abercrombie cuts some humor, and goes a bit more formal (like he has proven that can do) he's the closest to Martin right there. He has shown that he can handle big stories with a lot of interesting characters, can write good politics, in addition to being very good at writing. I don't see any other (from those I have read) that have these characteristics. Also to be fair, Martin has a lot of dark humor though.

For example:

Abraham: can handle big stories but cannot handle more than 2-3 characters at the same time. Writing is decent but not great. Politics suck.
Rothfuss: cannot write more than a book for a decade, hasn't proven that he can handle big stories. Writing is excellent though, even better than Martin's. No politics.
Sanderson: struggles with characters, stories centered around magic, writing has gone from barely readable to very good, but still not on Martin's level. Politics suck big.
Hobb: old, over simplistic politics, not too many characters in her stories. Writing is excellent though.
GGK: best writing ever in the genre, but don't go for sequels. Hasn't shown to write stories with a lot of characters, though his characters might be closest to Martin's. Also old.
Lawrence: see Abercrombie, remove some points.
Lynch: a less magic-based of Sanderson, more interesting characters but like Sanderson, he hasn't many characters.
Gaiman: old and shit, the sub genre is very different to others.
Bakker: assuming that he can spend only 50% of time writing philosophy on his books, then we might have a good match. But we know that Bakker cannot do it, so please no.
Erikson: haven't read, might be a good match.
Weeks: haven't read, but from the description seems like Lynch.
Cook: good match but he's even older than Martin.
Brooks: old and apparently shit
Goodkind: see Brooks

I think that the list covers all big/promising authors in the genre, and I do not see any better match than Abercrombie. He also has been open to the idea.
 
Who is GGK?

I'd prefer Abercrombie to do it. Actually I'd prefer it if they just left it. It feels kind of sullied to me now, like he doesn't know how to finish it and is just doing it for the sake of doing it.
 
Art Vandelay said:
Who is GGK?

I'd prefer Abercrombie to do it. Actually I'd prefer it if they just left it. It feels kind of sullied to me now, like he doesn't know how to finish it and is just doing it for the sake of doing it.
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Guy Gavriel Kay. Check Tigana and The Lions of Al-Rassan (both standalones with Tigana as good as anything in the genre).

I prefer a bad ending to no ending, so I hope that eventually it is finished. Lucky for us though, we'll have an ending either way because of GoT.
 
Haven't read it in quite a while, but know that I was a big fan of this...

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Whole "Book of the New Sun" cycle actually. Wolfe really had a way with words, so it was not an easy read. Very interesting Dying Earth fantasy.
 
Edgar Allan Pillow said:
I know we'll disagree here :D but honestly I consider these two as horrible writing. Apart from the Cosca character, there's nothing I liked in Red Country. Neither the plot nor the writing was as good as TFL imo. And shattered sea is YA at best. I gave up halfway through the 2nd book.
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I think Red Country is some distance behind the other Abercrombie books in terms of quality, but I still enjoyed it. It just lacked the humour and the characters weren't as good compared to his other books.
 
Edgar Allan Pillow said:
I know we'll disagree here :D but honestly I consider these two as horrible writing. Apart from the Cosca character, there's nothing I liked in Red Country. Neither the plot nor the writing was as good as TFL imo. And shattered sea is YA at best. I gave up halfway through the 2nd book.
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Of course we will.

For what is worth, I think that Red Country might be the second worst novel from Abercrombie (after The Blade Itself) but still found it an okay read.

The Shattered Sea is very good, with the first book being better than any book in the First Law (not as good as 'Best Served Cold' or 'The Heroes' though), and despite it was marketed as YA, I don't think that it really was. It is comfortably darker, more violent and just a more grown ups book than the likes of Mistborn for example. I also think that his writing was at his best on The Shattered Sea, but the story was significantly smaller (and so less interesting) than in The First Law.

Finally, Yarvi is one of the best characters Abercrombie ever wrote. He's essentially a young version of Bayaz with the fighting ability of Glokta (after the incident).
 
I loved all six of Joe Abercrombie's books. Thought the heroes one was completely brilliant. Am yet to start the short stories collection but have heard good things.
 
Revan said:
As fast as he is, he won't be able to finish the Cosmere saga, unless he hires other people to write it, with him leading them.

I think that it is supposed to end with Mistoborn 4 though, which will happen after Dragonsteel. So, he will have to write at least another 7 Stormlight books, another 7 Mistborn books, another 2 Elantris books, another 1 Warhammer book, 7 Dragonsteel books and a new trilogy about a kid who realizes he is the Dark One. So there are here around 27 books only in Cosmere (not counting new books which will unexpectedly happen like Mistborn 2, Mistborn Secret History or the new collection of novellas that he just published), in addition to the other books he writes, with the big ones (Stormlight) needing around 3 years for a book.

Sadly, not going to happen.

Regardless, better to discuss it in Fantasy Reads thread.
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That series about the dark one isn't part of the cosmere world right?

Yeah the more I think about it the more I feel it may not conclude in his life time.

The best part of Sanderson is that he answers questions regarding his novels without hesitation. Some he answers some he RAFOs. At least you feel connected with the author.

Also you mean Warbreaker, right?
 
So page 135 into the Silmarillion, it started off slow.. but once it started delving into the history of the elves, the poisoning of the trees.. damn, I really do love it. His world building is just stunning.
 
harshad said:
That series about the dark one isn't part of the cosmere world right?

Yeah the more I think about it the more I feel it may not conclude in his life time.

The best part of Sanderson is that he answers questions regarding his novels without hesitation. Some he answers some he RAFOs. At least you feel connected with the author.

Also you mean Warbreaker, right?
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Yep, warbreaker.

I think that the series with the dark one is a Cosmere story, though not totally sure.

Anyway, it is kind of impossible to write all of what he has planned, there is no way that it is going to happen. Hoping that he concludes Stormlight well, and then shortens the series of Hoid to a trilogy or so (instead of 7 books). Even then, it will be kind of difficult to write all of those books.

Totally agree about him answering questions, and having on his website the bars about in which book he is working (with percentage and all). It makes you feel connected with the author, know when you can expect the new books, and more importantly that the author is trying to keep his end of the contract instead of playing Fallout all day. Rothfuss in particular has too much to learn from Sanderson's relation with the fans.
 
Abercrombie's new book won't be published until at least the end of 2018 (but will probably be published later). He said that he wants to have a draft for the entire trilogy before he finetunes the first book. On the other side, he said that the first draft for the first book will be ready in a short time.

This will be the longest wait for a book of him (2.5 - 3 years).
 
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