Might be mistaken but I think EAP is reacting to you not rating Malazan.
Books Fantasy Reads
- Thread starter Alock1
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EAP loves both Malazan and TFL, I think he has both of them in top 5.
Yeah, it is a tedious read, but one of the best epic fantasies ever. Like fine wine, it ages well and re-reads make for new connections and understanding that you missed in your first tedious read.
There are few (probably none) fantasy worlds built as big and filled with fascinating characters as Malazan, Memories of Ice & Toll the Hounds are some of the best fantasy novels ever within and outside the Malazan universe.
I rate this ahead of LotR and WoT.
Haven't read Malazan yet but I've heard very good things and I'm looking forward to reading it.
Not sure about my top 3 but I've enjoyed these more than TFL; the Stormlight Archive, Kingkiller Chronicles, the first Old Man's War
Just finished name of the wind.. brilliant book. He's a wonderful writer, really good skill as a storyteller.. keeps you hooked throughout, makes you laugh. The book is incredibly fun and the University just sounds awesome, Ambrose is a brilliant character and I love the musical elements of the story, you really feel that you're there listening to Kvothe play the lute and it blowing you away.
Only criticisms would be his myth/lore-making skills (feels like he's making it up as he goes along, don't expect him to be Tolkienesque, but it just feels weak), Denna (I didn't really get the appeal of her as a character, I wanted to know more about Fela tbh), description of background characters, felt too generic at times and it was hard to distinguish between lesser characters of importance and use of binding/magical stuff, felt inconsistent and incoherent sometimes.
Overall magnificent, have The Silmarillion and Wise mans fear on my shelf staring at me, so they will be next on my list.
Only criticisms would be his myth/lore-making skills (feels like he's making it up as he goes along, don't expect him to be Tolkienesque, but it just feels weak), Denna (I didn't really get the appeal of her as a character, I wanted to know more about Fela tbh), description of background characters, felt too generic at times and it was hard to distinguish between lesser characters of importance and use of binding/magical stuff, felt inconsistent and incoherent sometimes.
Overall magnificent, have The Silmarillion and Wise mans fear on my shelf staring at me, so they will be next on my list.
Revan's list of fantasy sagas from best to worst (note that even the worst one had at least a good to very good book):
1) A Song of Ice and Fire (George R.R. Martin)
2) The Wheel of Time (Robert Jordan)
3) The First Law (Joe Abercrombie)
4) The Kingkiller Chronicles (Patrick Rothfuss)
5) The Black Company (Glen Cook)
6) The Realm of the Elderlings (Robin Hobb) *
7) Gentleman Bastard (Scott Lynch)
8) The Stormlight Archive (Brandon Sanderson)
9) The Lord of the Rings (John R.R. Tolkien)
10) Mistborn (Brandon Sanderson) **
11) Long Price Quartet (Daniel Abraham)
12) The Shattered Sea (Joe Abercrombie)
13) The Broken Empire (Mark Lawrence)
14) The Second Apocalypse (Richard Scott Bakker)
15) Raven's Shadow (Anthony Ryan)
16) The Acts of Caine (Matthew Woodring Stover)
17) Acacia (David Anthony Durham)
* Based on the best trilogy from the entire saga (Liveship Traders)
** Based on Mistborn I, Mistborn II era was a bit shit and would have been outside of top 15
Science-fiction:
1) Hyperion Cantos (Dan Simmons)
2) The Thrawn Trilogy (Timothy Zahn)
3) The Hitchhicker's Guide to the Galaxy (Douglas Adams)
4) The Expanse (James S.A Corey) *
5) Robots (Isaac Asimov)
6) The Bane Trilogy (Drew Karpyshyn)
7) Foundations (Isaac Asimov)
8) Dune (Frank Herbert)
9) Tales of the Ketty Jay (Chriss Wooding)
10) Galactic Empire (Isaac Asimov)
* Pen name for Daniel Abraham and Ty Franck
I didn't include standalones (Tigana being one of the best fantasy books ever, Childhood's End being one of the best sci-fi books ever etc).
Would be interested to see other people lists.
1) A Song of Ice and Fire (George R.R. Martin)
2) The Wheel of Time (Robert Jordan)
3) The First Law (Joe Abercrombie)
4) The Kingkiller Chronicles (Patrick Rothfuss)
5) The Black Company (Glen Cook)
6) The Realm of the Elderlings (Robin Hobb) *
7) Gentleman Bastard (Scott Lynch)
8) The Stormlight Archive (Brandon Sanderson)
9) The Lord of the Rings (John R.R. Tolkien)
10) Mistborn (Brandon Sanderson) **
11) Long Price Quartet (Daniel Abraham)
12) The Shattered Sea (Joe Abercrombie)
13) The Broken Empire (Mark Lawrence)
14) The Second Apocalypse (Richard Scott Bakker)
15) Raven's Shadow (Anthony Ryan)
16) The Acts of Caine (Matthew Woodring Stover)
17) Acacia (David Anthony Durham)
* Based on the best trilogy from the entire saga (Liveship Traders)
** Based on Mistborn I, Mistborn II era was a bit shit and would have been outside of top 15
Science-fiction:
1) Hyperion Cantos (Dan Simmons)
2) The Thrawn Trilogy (Timothy Zahn)
3) The Hitchhicker's Guide to the Galaxy (Douglas Adams)
4) The Expanse (James S.A Corey) *
5) Robots (Isaac Asimov)
6) The Bane Trilogy (Drew Karpyshyn)
7) Foundations (Isaac Asimov)
8) Dune (Frank Herbert)
9) Tales of the Ketty Jay (Chriss Wooding)
10) Galactic Empire (Isaac Asimov)
* Pen name for Daniel Abraham and Ty Franck
I didn't include standalones (Tigana being one of the best fantasy books ever, Childhood's End being one of the best sci-fi books ever etc).
Would be interested to see other people lists.
Some personal favourites (not necessarily sagas):
Fantasy:
Lord of the Rings (Tolkien)
Song of Ice and Fire (Martin)
The Earthsea Trilogy (Ursula Le Guin)
The First Chronicles of Thomas Covenant (Stephen Donaldson)
The Belgariad (David Eddings)
Tea with the Black Dragon (Roberta McAvoy)
Damiano novels (Roberta McAvoy)
Science Fiction:
Rendezvous with Rama (Arthur C Clarke)
Left Hand of Darkness (Ursula Le Guin)
Canopus in Argos (Doris Lessing)
Daughters of the Sunstone (Sydney J Van Scyoc)
Drowntide (Sydney J Van Scyoc)
Fantasy:
Lord of the Rings (Tolkien)
Song of Ice and Fire (Martin)
The Earthsea Trilogy (Ursula Le Guin)
The First Chronicles of Thomas Covenant (Stephen Donaldson)
The Belgariad (David Eddings)
Tea with the Black Dragon (Roberta McAvoy)
Damiano novels (Roberta McAvoy)
Science Fiction:
Rendezvous with Rama (Arthur C Clarke)
Left Hand of Darkness (Ursula Le Guin)
Canopus in Argos (Doris Lessing)
Daughters of the Sunstone (Sydney J Van Scyoc)
Drowntide (Sydney J Van Scyoc)
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Haven't read too many but from what I've read
1. A Song of Ice and Fire (GRRM)
2. The Wheel of Time (Robert Jordan)
3. Realm of Elderlings (Robin Hobb) - Haven't yet read the last two trilogies.
4. Kingkiller Chronicles (Patrick Rothfuss)
5. Lord of the Rings (JRR Tolkein)
6. Monarchies of God (Paul Kearney)
7. Dagger and the Coin (Daniel Abraham)
8. Mistborn (Brandon Sanderson) - The original trilogy. Not read any of the others
9. Broken Empire (Mark Lawrence)
10. Bartimaeus Trilogy (Jonathan Stroud)
11. Harry Potter (JK Rowling)
12. First Law (Joe Abercrombie)
13. Malazan (Steve Erikson) - Only read 4 books
14. Earthsea (Ursula Le Guin) - Only read the first 3. Not sure if this even qualifies as a series. I actually really liked the 2nd book. A beautifully written LOTR-esque book. The first and third were dull and boring though.
If the 3rd KKC book is anything like the 2nd one, it could drop like a stone in the list.
1. A Song of Ice and Fire (GRRM)
2. The Wheel of Time (Robert Jordan)
3. Realm of Elderlings (Robin Hobb) - Haven't yet read the last two trilogies.
4. Kingkiller Chronicles (Patrick Rothfuss)
5. Lord of the Rings (JRR Tolkein)
6. Monarchies of God (Paul Kearney)
7. Dagger and the Coin (Daniel Abraham)
8. Mistborn (Brandon Sanderson) - The original trilogy. Not read any of the others
9. Broken Empire (Mark Lawrence)
10. Bartimaeus Trilogy (Jonathan Stroud)
11. Harry Potter (JK Rowling)
12. First Law (Joe Abercrombie)
13. Malazan (Steve Erikson) - Only read 4 books
14. Earthsea (Ursula Le Guin) - Only read the first 3. Not sure if this even qualifies as a series. I actually really liked the 2nd book. A beautifully written LOTR-esque book. The first and third were dull and boring though.
If the 3rd KKC book is anything like the 2nd one, it could drop like a stone in the list.
Have heard that it becomes shit after the first book, which took me out of it and so never read that series.
It's not a series. Rendezvous with Rama was written in 1973 as a stand alone novel. The subsequent books were authored almost two decades later by Gentry Lee in 'collaboration' with Clarke, with the sole purpose of making both men richer.
Since 'Rama' had revealed almost nothing about the 'Ramans', there was some potential in the idea, but unfortunately Lee was an uninspired writer incapable of reproducing the style of Clarke's original book. They did make a lot of money though.
Rama has a claim to being Clarke's best work. It's a bit like The Martian in being grounded in the accuracy of its science.
I still don't get why people like The Name of the Wind. It starts off good but then quickly descends into someone going on and on about how great they are.
I really enjoyed it but it definitely gets a bit annoying hearing Kvothe suck himself off for hours and hours.
I have a sneaking suspicion though that it's intentional and his unreliable narration leads us into thinking he's a greater hero than he actually was and at some point he's going to have to admit to that.
Yeah but you do have to take that into account while you're reading it, as that is the character of the leading protagonist.. he's audacious and arrogant, but has become a shadow of the man he once was and is happy to just remain in the shadows and be an innkeeper.. so something must have happened for him to want to go completely off the radar.
Hope wise man's fear isn't as bad as you lot think, would be a serious waste of what could have been an epic trilogy.
As to A song of fire and ice, guys I haven't read the books but did read some excerpts of his newer work and found it very difficult to digest. Didn't find his writing style appealing at all and the idea of reading from perspective of many characters, fills me with dread. Am I over-concerned, is it a genuinely great book or is it done better as a tv series?
That might well be the case, but him licking his own asshole in the first book made me not care about how he got there or want to hear any more of it. Maybe I'll give it another try some day but I couldn't even get it finished.
ASOIAF is a genuinely great series done way better as a book than a TV show. It gets a bit heavy at times with hints for stuff happening in later books hidden away in earlier books, some of the finds and theories blew me away when I read them after reading the books as I hadn't even come close to noticing them.
The books are far better than the show, and relatively easy to read.
Okay, going to take your word for it and get them. I love the TV series alot, so if what you are saying is correct.. I will finally find my true replacement for LOTR.
As to NOTW, sometimes you can't gel with a book because what you personally like, is just too at odds with what the author wishes to convey. Its like a personality clash with the book and therefore I think, even if you tried to give it another shot.. you'd still dislike it, nothing wrong with that. I found it a fun book, but it doesn't come close to the majesty of LOTR for me in terms of depth, easier to read granted but LOTR is just mindblowing for me.
Those delicious Frey Pies
It was that people found the hidden Sand Snake that really got me. I had not one single clue that's who that was.
@Raees Be prepared. Unlike the TV show characters occasionally have motivations other than revenge and many of them are entirely different characters altogether.
I have no idea what you talking about. However, there were so many theories which proven to be true. Like:
It was that people found the hidden Sand Snake that really got me. I had not one single clue that's who that was.
@Raees Be prepared. Unlike the TV show characters occasionally have motivations other than revenge and many of them are entirely different characters altogether.
R + L = J
Bloodraven = Brynden Rivers
The Frey pies
I think that someone discovered the 'Hold the Door' a long time ago.
fAegon
Of course, there are some which very likely are not true, like:
Daario Naharris = Euron Greyjoy
Tyrion Targaryan
and some which may yet prove to be true, like:
Bran making the Mad King go mad
The Grand Northern Conspiracy
But still it is incredible how much foreshadowing was on these books. Interestingly, I think that The Kingkiller Chronicles is the closest in this aspect, with so many hidden things being in the books. Of course, it doesn't have as a large community as ASOIAF which would find everything long before 2817 which is widely expected to be the year when the final book comes out.
Or who the bard in Winterfell actually was. It was near the end of DWD that I realised who he was.
It was that people found the hidden Sand Snake that really got me. I had not one single clue that's who that was.
@Raees Be prepared. Unlike the TV show characters occasionally have motivations other than revenge and many of them are entirely different characters altogether.
Alleras (The guy who takes Sam to meet Marywn in Old Town at the end of FFC) is Sarella, the Sand Snake sister. She could also be the Sphinx which Dany is cautioned against (?)
I have totally forgot about it, in fact I don't remember that part at all. However:
Didn't Sam met Jagen H'ghar there, after Jagen killed someone unimportant? Of course, Jagen wears some other face now.
Mance or one I'm forgetting?
Yeah. I missed that one too. It's all hidden but now:
Sam is hanging about with a Sand Snake and Jaqen without knowing.
My favourite was way back in book 1 when Varys says
"If one hand can die why not the other"
Until the 3rd book the default view is that he's talking about Ned and Jon which didn't totally make sense given Varys neither wanted to kill Ned and nor did he kill Jon to begin with. Saw a thread on the forum about this and it was the other Jon Varys was talking about. Mind blown literally.
Until the 3rd book the default view is that he's talking about Ned and Jon which didn't totally make sense given Varys neither wanted to kill Ned and nor did he kill Jon to begin with. Saw a thread on the forum about this and it was the other Jon Varys was talking about. Mind blown literally.
Holy shit, an another thing that I missed and which makes totally sense. Varys never ceases to amaze me although I still don't get how he doesn't seem to know the lineage of Jon Snow.
Aye its Pate, whose face he is wearing. The same Pate who turns from an under achiever at the start of FFC to the part of the inner circle of Marwyn at the end of FFC.
Fun fact - Marwyn is most likely the same mage who taught the hedge witch whom Dany saves in GOT and who later fails in curing Khal Drago and is burned alive at the end of GOT.
Who is the other Jon? Arryn?
Connington
Marwyn teaching Mizi Marr Dun or whatever she's called is something I remember. And Daenerys knows Marwyn name, so it would be interesting when they meet.
JonCon which means that likely Varys planned Ned to join Targaryans.
I totally forgot about him! Now it all makes sense. feckin hell.
Ah yes. Was forgetting her name. Actually, except some characters like Strong Belwas, Daario and Illyrio Mopatis, I don't remember the names of any of the characters from Essos
Wish they had simpler names to pronounce like Wun Wun
No Malazan? Or is this something you have already read?
Haven't read it yet (and likely won't do it for some time considering that I don't have as much free time as before when I read WoT in less than three months).
I founds ASOIAF very frustrating to read. In all other books, you get a definitive end scenario mentioned at start (Kill some demon, win back kingdom etc etc). After 5 books, I still had no clue on where the story is leading to or when will it end. GRRM could probably drag it on for 25 more books and no one will be the wiser on what the objective it. He keeps killing the lead characters so often that the series can potentially go on and on.
My list would be something like below. Made it in buckets rather than a straight list as I can't hoose to rank between them.
The Pinnacle of Fantasy
Malazan Book of the Fallen
Rated Awesome:
Wheel of Time
A song of Ice and Fire
Lord of the Rings
Rated Very Good:
First Law trilogy
Kingkiller Chronicles
Stormlight Archive
Mistborn Trilogy
Black Company
Farseer Trilogy
Dresden Files
Long Price Quartet
Other Goodreads:
City of Stairs
Iron Druid Chronicles
Powder Mage trilogy
Night Angel Trilogy
Tales of Ketty Jay
The Cinder Spires series
Thomas Covenant
Young Adult:
Harry Potter
Eragon
Drenai series
Discworld
The Pinnacle of Fantasy
Malazan Book of the Fallen
Rated Awesome:
Wheel of Time
A song of Ice and Fire
Lord of the Rings
Rated Very Good:
First Law trilogy
Kingkiller Chronicles
Stormlight Archive
Mistborn Trilogy
Black Company
Farseer Trilogy
Dresden Files
Long Price Quartet
Other Goodreads:
City of Stairs
Iron Druid Chronicles
Powder Mage trilogy
Night Angel Trilogy
Tales of Ketty Jay
The Cinder Spires series
Thomas Covenant
Young Adult:
Harry Potter
Eragon
Drenai series
Discworld
I've found myself really liking Steampunk recently. Aeronaut's Windlass (Cinder Spires series) was superb and I'll probably explore this genre more in coming months...
1) Are you 12 years old that you need for the series to have a clear simple goal from the very beginning? And to be fair, I think that you can get from the beginning that things will end with an inevitable clash against the Others.
2) He killed the 'main' lead character of the first book in the first book and that's it. The three protagonists of the series are alive in book 6. It has long been mentioned how GRRM kills main characters yadda yadda, but he did it only with Ned. Rob wasn't even a POV, let alone a main character.