F1 2024 Season

F-Red said:
Once you take into accounts of operational costs and salaries, then it’s a significant value for the cars budget.
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Yeah, but it's also very important. I doubt there is single team apart from Williams that doesn't have reserve chasis. Frankly, I find it ridiculous.
 
Amar__ said:
Yeah, but it's also very important. I doubt there is single team apart from Williams that doesn't have reserve chasis. Frankly, I find it ridiculous.
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It’s been discussed already as to the why…

dinostar77 said:
On what planet are they benefitting? Are Williams allowed to build new infrastructure outside of the cost cap like AM and Mclaren? No.

So they have to compromise between spending money on the race car and spending money on improving the infrastructure under the cost cap. So they will remain towards the lower end of the pack for many many years.

They didnt bring a 3rd chassis because of the cost cap. The same way Mclaren chose to take a hit on straight line speed at Saudi Arabia because of the cost cap. Because teams are limited in the number of rear wings they can produce so are down to low and high downforce designs with adjustable gurneys. Its all about compromise because of the cost cap.
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It has feck all to do with cost cap. It’s been explained why they don’t have a spare tub and it’s to do with modernising Williams factory.

Perhaps Albon shouldn’t be an idiot for two weekends in a row and just take it fecking easy. He was going to achieve feck all being where he was on Sunday.
 
mariachi-19 said:
It has feck all to do with cost cap. It’s been explained why they don’t have a spare tub and it’s to do with modernising Williams factory.

Perhaps Albon shouldn’t be an idiot for two weekends in a row and just take it fecking easy. He was going to achieve feck all being where he was on Sunday.
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Which unlike AMs new facilities or Mclarens new wind tunnel, comes out of Williams cost cap. James Vowles said it was unfair that Williams have to compromise so much on the race car to upgrade facilities.
 
dinostar77 said:
Which unlike AMs new facilities or Mclarens new wind tunnel, comes out of Williams cost cap. James Vowles said it was unfair that Williams have to compromise so much on the race car to upgrade facilities.
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Doesn't Williams operate well below the cost cap though?
 
pauldyson1uk said:
I thought that also, but a post on here said they were updating their factory.
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It's not a straightforward clear cut issue. The bit I've highlighted below is a big part of the issue. CapEx is limited to $45mil a season, so it will take Williams many many years to get their infrastructure up to par as the rest.

What the bigger teams did before the cost cap came in, was to spend like mad on infrastructure so they have a built in advantage that smaller teams will struggle to catch.

The older your facilities are, the slower and less economic the processes are. It costs you more more. Therefore something has to give. So you don't produce spare chassis's and concentrate on other areas.

It ends up being a vicious circle. Which is why I think smaller teams should be allowed to break the cost cap ceiling for CapEx so they can bring their infrastructure up to the same standard as the big boys and not have to spend 10+ years trying to do it within a cost cap.

https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/williams-f1-crash-cost-chassis-albon-sargeant/

"...Williams ended up well behind schedule due to a combination of outdated processes and systems, limited facilities, and a big change in the composition and management of its car build.

That gave it more work to do and far more hassle with a lot of the same infrastructure restrictions, so something had to give.

Williams needed to sacrifice spare parts, performance updates, or the back-up chassis for its pre-season focus. It chose to go ahead with only two chassis, hoping it could deal with any damage on-site, with F1’s ultra-competitive midfield demanding more performance focus...."

"...Unsurprisingly the cost is enormous. The repairs, the replacement floors and wings and suspension components, at least two new gearboxes, the unexpected need to transport the chassis - it all adds up, and the three accidents are likely to cost Williams well over $2million once the full extent of Albon’s Suzuka crash is understood.

Williams is no longer in the financial grave it was in a few years ago, but F1’s a budget-capped world now. And all of these costs will come out of that allowance.

Every team does build a crash allowance into its budget cap projections for the season. But we think Williams is going to be pushing up close to that limit if not past it already. That means, more likely than not, Williams’s development budget will take a hit this season at some point.

It’s problematic given Williams is already behind the curve this year thanks to the winter problems which meant some development items that should have been there for the launch spec still aren’t on the car now. That’s partly why its car is only eight-fastest and yet to score a point this season.

The work is going to be either paused or diluted for the second time in a couple of weeks because the focus at the factory will have to be on repairs..."
 
dinostar77 said:
It's not a straightforward clear cut issue. The bit I've highlighted below is a big part of the issue. CapEx is limited to $45mil a season, so it will take Williams many many years to get their infrastructure up to par as the rest.

What the bigger teams did before the cost cap came in, was to spend like mad on infrastructure so they have a built in advantage that smaller teams will struggle to catch.

The older your facilities are, the slower and less economic the processes are. It costs you more more. Therefore something has to give. So you don't produce spare chassis's and concentrate on other areas.

It ends up being a vicious circle. Which is why I think smaller teams should be allowed to break the cost cap ceiling for CapEx so they can bring their infrastructure up to the same standard as the big boys and not have to spend 10+ years trying to do it within a cost cap.

https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/williams-f1-crash-cost-chassis-albon-sargeant/

"...Williams ended up well behind schedule due to a combination of outdated processes and systems, limited facilities, and a big change in the composition and management of its car build.

That gave it more work to do and far more hassle with a lot of the same infrastructure restrictions, so something had to give.

Williams needed to sacrifice spare parts, performance updates, or the back-up chassis for its pre-season focus. It chose to go ahead with only two chassis, hoping it could deal with any damage on-site, with F1’s ultra-competitive midfield demanding more performance focus...."

"...Unsurprisingly the cost is enormous. The repairs, the replacement floors and wings and suspension components, at least two new gearboxes, the unexpected need to transport the chassis - it all adds up, and the three accidents are likely to cost Williams well over $2million once the full extent of Albon’s Suzuka crash is understood.

Williams is no longer in the financial grave it was in a few years ago, but F1’s a budget-capped world now. And all of these costs will come out of that allowance.

Every team does build a crash allowance into its budget cap projections for the season. But we think Williams is going to be pushing up close to that limit if not past it already. That means, more likely than not, Williams’s development budget will take a hit this season at some point.

It’s problematic given Williams is already behind the curve this year thanks to the winter problems which meant some development items that should have been there for the launch spec still aren’t on the car now. That’s partly why its car is only eight-fastest and yet to score a point this season.

The work is going to be either paused or diluted for the second time in a couple of weeks because the focus at the factory will have to be on repairs..."
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Cheers for this.
 
mariachi-19 said:
It has feck all to do with cost cap. It’s been explained why they don’t have a spare tub and it’s to do with modernising Williams factory.

Perhaps Albon shouldn’t be an idiot for two weekends in a row and just take it fecking easy. He was going to achieve feck all being where he was on Sunday.
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Think it's widely agreed, even by the stewards, that the incident was more Ricciardo's fault but lap one etc prevented him getting a penalty.
 
When asked about his defense in Suzuka, Alonso replied ...

"I don't know what to say anymore after Australia, let's see if I get disqualified for the rest of the championship,” he smiled.
 
Looks like F1 can't actually do anything right? They've fecked up the 2026 active aero (that no one wanted). Cars are spinning out in straights and need to take corners so slowly that laptimes are slower than F2.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/f...e-after-alarming-simulator-findings/10596701/

How fecking hard is it to do the basics correctly? Or fix what needs fixing instead of creating crap no one wanted?

Here's an idea, make tyres last the entire race so drivers can go flat out all of the time. But introduce rule for using all 3 compounds in a race weekend. Add ballast for current WC for the entire season and top 6 drivers of the current season. Give smaller teams a chance at points and maybe race wins. Add tyre covers to control tyre wake. So and so on. Loads of things they can fix

But no, let's add movable aero, which one team will nail (no prizes for guessing who) and add more cost and complexity to F1 cars.

Sport run by idiots, who are destroying what F1 used to be.
 
Rumours of Alpine sale.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/a...9950.425683886.1712836823-27554265.1680424543

According to Motorsport.com there are multiple parties looking at the possibility of taking over Alpine, including a major car manufacturer

The biggest hurdle would be that Viry would also have to be part of the deal to assure that the engineers there are guaranteed their job till at least 2029.

Funny texts at the end of the article
. However, this constraint of using the Renault engine could reduce the number of potential buyers - since some interested parties want to involve the use of their own power units or those of other manufacturers with which there are already links
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Was re watching some old broadcasts of F1 weekends from the 90s and early 2000s and as was discussed in here a page or two ago: it's wild to see all the talk about quali engines vs race engines being mounted rather than needing to use the same for both like these days. Its funny how quickly you forget some things.

The other thing that stood out to me is how insanely large the gaps were in quali especially compared to today. We literally had people only two or three spots down from pole already being well over a second behind, with gaps increasing to as much as 5 seconds or even more the further down you go(!!). In a way it gave me more appreciation for today as putting in a pole lap these days is so much more about the finest of margins.
 
Redplane said:
Was re watching some old broadcasts of F1 weekends from the 90s and early 2000s and as was discussed in here a page or two ago: it's wild to see all the talk about quali engines vs race engines being mounted rather than needing to use the same for both like these days. Its funny how quickly you forget some things.

The other thing that stood out to me is how insanely large the gaps were in quali especially compared to today. We literally had people only two or three spots down from pole already being well over a second behind, with gaps increasing to as much as 5 seconds or even more the further down you go(!!). In a way it gave me more appreciation for today as putting in a pole lap these days is so much more about the finest of margins.
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Interesting you mention that. Thierry Boutsen has been quoted in a recent interview.

The shame about Formula 1 today is that it all depends on the technology and the car,” he said, speaking from his office in Monaco.

“The driver, in my days, was responsible for something like 70 to 80 percent of the victory.

“The car was to bring the driver to victory, but it was counting for about 20 to 25 percent. Today, it is totally the opposite. If you don’t have the best car, you can’t win, there’s nothing you can do."

He also said some other stuff. Interesting interview.

https://www.planetf1.com/news/thierry-boutsen-how-modern-f1-differs

What l find most interesting is that Chandok Sainz, Verstappen have all recently spoken out against "moveable aero" and other gimmicks. Smaller, lighter cars with "driver skill" (Verstappen said) making the difference instead. Shame F1/FIA won't listen.
 
Ahmer Baig said:
Rumours of Alpine sale.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/a...9950.425683886.1712836823-27554265.1680424543

According to Motorsport.com there are multiple parties looking at the possibility of taking over Alpine, including a major car manufacturer

The biggest hurdle would be that Viry would also have to be part of the deal to assure that the engineers there are guaranteed their job till at least 2029.

Funny texts at the end of the article
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Funny that this is timed exactly as andretti announced their new Silverstone HQ. But who wants crappy Renault engines till 2029? Who's gonna take that deal?
 
dinostar77 said:
Interesting you mention that. Thierry Boutsen has been quoted in a recent interview.

The shame about Formula 1 today is that it all depends on the technology and the car,” he said, speaking from his office in Monaco.

“The driver, in my days, was responsible for something like 70 to 80 percent of the victory.

“The car was to bring the driver to victory, but it was counting for about 20 to 25 percent. Today, it is totally the opposite. If you don’t have the best car, you can’t win, there’s nothing you can do."

He also said some other stuff. Interesting interview.

https://www.planetf1.com/news/thierry-boutsen-how-modern-f1-differs

What l find most interesting is that Chandok Sainz, Verstappen have all recently spoken out against "moveable aero" and other gimmicks. Smaller, lighter cars with "driver skill" (Verstappen said) making the difference instead. Shame F1/FIA won't listen.
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Yeah it's funny how scary YT recommendations work but I had to pop up on my feed again yesterday - from last year with Max talking about the same things you mentioned:



Just seems like we re too uncomfortably close to 26 now if they re only just now listening to those comments and still have to make some major changes to the regs. Not very encouraging as you basically said.
 
Alonso committing to Honda - there's something I didn't think I'd say ever say again.
 
Italian press claiming that Sainz will join Mercedes on a two year deal. Antonelli will be parked at Williams to learn his trade at F1.

Also Perez will be renewed for RedBull.

How predictably dull ...
 
Its race week and a sprint.

Friday April 19
4.30am Chinese GP Practice One
8.30am: Chinese GP Sprint Qualifying

Saturday April 20
4am: Chinese GP Sprint
8am: Chinese GP Qualifying

Sunday April 21
8am: The CHINESE GRAND PRIX
 
dinostar77 said:
Italian press claiming that Sainz will join Mercedes on a two year deal. Antonelli will be parked at Williams to learn his trade at F1.

Also Perez will be renewed for RedBull.

How predictably dull ...
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The car being a tad bit understeery this year brings it into Cheko's comfort zone. But I agree he seems like he has come to terms with his standing and is happy simply to carry on. Very uninspiring.
 
Adrian Newey criticizes the "strange" engines of 2026: "They will act as generators almost all the time"

"It will be a strange formula. The engines will act as generators almost all the time. We'll have to get used to it,"

“I don't know if we should talk about 'extended range electric', but it seems that the new engines of 2026 will work the other way around a traditional hybrid. The propulsion will be electric, supported by the thermal motor when necessary. The opposite of now, when the electric power is a 'plus' to be used on occasion.”

VIA: [SoyMotor]
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If that turns out to be true, I am done with this mockery after 2025.
 
christy87 said:
Just bring back the v10s and be done with it, all this’s electric motors shit is only a face, the reality is the cars are a tiny percentage of F1s co2 emissions, electric lorry’s and ferry’s would be a bigger change.
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This. If they want electric cars race just have seperate race for them.
 
One of the most entertaining sprit qualifiers in a long while, the rain mixed it up nicely.
 
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